Somebody explain property tax and how it is American.

Originally posted by steveknows

Originally posted by theovermensch

Originally posted by steveknows
In Australia it's called council rates but it's the same thing. It's supposed to go toward Infostructure and the weekly rubbish removal and stuff like that but the rates have been climbing, at least where I live, and people aren't happy.

You could pay a guy to remove your rubbish and mow your nature strip for less than the cost of the rates. Councils are the mafia.

Of course if that's all that was needed. Anyway general weely rubbish removal is the reponsibility of council as it comes under the health act or something so you'd still be paying for it even if you put an empty bin out.

I want Rubbish Collectors like on that Simpsons episode for how much the rates have increased.

Originally posted by theovermensch

Originally posted by steveknows

Originally posted by theovermensch

Originally posted by steveknows
In Australia it's called council rates but it's the same thing. It's supposed to go toward Infostructure and the weekly rubbish removal and stuff like that but the rates have been climbing, at least where I live, and people aren't happy.

You could pay a guy to remove your rubbish and mow your nature strip for less than the cost of the rates. Councils are the mafia.

Of course if that's all that was needed. Anyway general weely rubbish removal is the reponsibility of council as it comes under the health act or something so you'd still be paying for it even if you put an empty bin out.

I want Rubbish Collectors like on that Simpsons episode for how much the rates have increased.

I wonder, does property tax in some states in the U.S include rubbish removal? I know it doesn't in SoCal.

Obviously not in Springfield either

Originally posted by AnIntellectualRedneck
We pay property taxes because we don't actually own anything. The government owns it all, and that is our renters' fee.

Actually, this is true. People get so excited when they pay off their mortagage, finally. They are celebrating, dancing around "I own my house! I own my house!"

Yeah, think so? Don't pay your taxes on it for a couple of years and see what happens to it. You'll see who owns it then.

Of course I believe in taxes and know they are necessary, but when I hear stories of the elderly getting moved out of their homes they took thirty years to pay off, because they couldn't afford the property taxes, it really makes me sick.

reply to post by Helious




I've said the very same many times. I don't own my property. If I stop paying taxes the law will be used against me. T'aint right. Ownership should be absolute. There are surely other ways for local governments to raise money for the infrastructure and services that support a population.

Sheesh... I guess I'll write my congressman, again. Maybe I should avoid the middle man and write my lobbyist?

reply to post by Helious


Here in Virginia you have to pay the taxes on your car every year. Not just when you buy it.

Originally posted by theovermensch
reply to post by SLAYER69

 

Text Meanwhile reality comes crashing in. There are Firemen and Police just a phone call away if you ever needed them. The Roads and city parks [If not occupied and being ruined with Human Fecal matter by protesters] are for your enjoyment and pleasure.

Are you wearing an Obama t-shirt right now?

Do you have an Obama bumper sticker?

Do you own Obama commemorative collector plates?

Obama commemorative coins?

What the HELL does Obama have to do with local property taxes, either the taxation or the distribution of them?

I realize he's been trying to Federalize tho police - at least around here - but he doesn't have anything to do with the local taxation structure.

Originally posted by SLAYER69
reply to post by theovermensch

 

Yeah....

In my opinion our present Chief Executive is only marginally better than the last one which isnt really saying much considering I didn't hold him very high at all either.

Nice try though

I can't say that either one is better than the other IMO - not even "marginally". They're both guilty of yanking the same rope on the exact same outboard motor, trying to run the same boat onto the same rocks.

Stars & Flag for my biggest pet peeve, property taxes!

I live in NH, our real motto is - Live Free (If You Pay On Time) Or Die (In Prison If You Don't).
I stopped celebrating July 4th a long time ago, I live in "New England", we never won our independence, we are still a British colony with British court systems & laws.

I own my home, paid for 100%. My taxes on the other hand are somewhere in the area of $4000+ per year, for less than 1/2 acre, in a small town of less than 2000 people most of which are collecting SS Disability, with no public services AT ALL... maybe 2 buses for the kids, and only in select areas of town.

I have to rent a dumpster because there's no garbage pick up,
no taxis or public transportation services,
only 1 convenience store in town,
only 1 volunteer fire dept.,
less than 10 cops at annex station,
we do get our streets snow plowed, and repaired about once a decade. I live in the woods with practically NO SERVICES, why are my property taxes so high, and rising big time next year??????

The land taxes here are about 20% of people's "gross" income, per single person not married and both working. They also value my home at $110,000 MORE than I paid for it so they can tax me more on the make believe value!

I'll go Little House On The Prairie on my house before I let these bastards take it from me!!

Originally posted by steveknows

I wonder, does property tax in some states in the U.S include rubbish removal? I know it doesn't in SoCal.

Obviously not in Springfield either

Not in NC, either. Here we pay for it separately, but bound together with the water bill. No water bill means no trash removal, and you deal with both on your own. As near as I can tell, property taxes just cover police, fire, and county road upkeep.

Originally posted by karen61057
reply to post by Helious

 

Here in Virginia you have to pay the taxes on your car every year. Not just when you buy it.

When I moved from VA to NC, I went to register my car at the DMV. They had a "sales" tax listed, so I asked "What's that for?"

The lady behind the counter says "sales tax, You buy a car, you pay a sales tax."

I said "OK, take that off then, I didn't buy it in NC, I bought it in VA."

She says "Oh. I meant 'Road Use Tax'. "

So I said "You call a 'Road Use Tax' a 'Sales Tax' around here? OK, fine. How much is the 'Road Use Tax'?"

"It's the same thing" she says.

I quit driving eventually.

The property tax pays for:

Elementary through high school
State universities and colleges
Your local Fire Department
Part of state government
Your 911 service
Your EMT guys
Your local public library
Your municipal government including
-roads
-the court system
-police and sheriff
a hospital district (sometimes)
a port district (sometimes)
A parks District (if not part of a city)

In my district we also pay extra property tax for
-a swimming pool
-forested land so it won't be developed

Some of these entities have other revenue. the state, city, and county get sales tax revenue. Some, such as the library get little other revenue at all.

The question is: If you don't want to pay property taxes, then many of these entities will have no funding at all. So if you want to get rid of the list, go ahead and close all that stuff down. Who needs elementary and high schools? Your parents can home school you. Close the state universities. let em go to a private school. Who needs a library? I got duh Internets! Screw the parks. Squirrels go pooh on them anyway. Disband the fire department. A Hook & Ladder costs a million bucks. Let those houses burn! Who needs police? When seconds count, they are minutes away. Buy a Glock instead! EMT or 911? Hey, if it's your time to go, it's your time to go. Ask a relative to drive you. Forested land? You gotta be kiddin' me. Sell it to a developer and put up some condos. No more open space!

As for your mortgage, as has been shown, this has NOTHING to do with property taxes. Whether you owe money to th ebank or not is totally irrelevant.

P.S. I'm sorry you live in such a corrupt place. So move.

Originally posted by Manhater
If I'm paying street light tax, I'm betting, I'm paying for your' kids education.

I have NO KIDS!

Why, should I, have too pay a school tax?

My sister has a kid. Let her pay the school tax.

Only, if goes towards my tuition, then I agree to pay it.

And, why should I, have to pay a street lamp??

I have my own. Literally. When, I say my own.

It's mine own street lamp and it's solar powered.

If it's that much trouble... Then shut it off.

I'm all for saving energy.

edit on 10-12-2011 by Manhater because: (no reason given)

Oh my, you haven't seen anything to be really mad about if you don't have kids. Try paying the annual property tax on the house you're already paying the legitimate mortgage on and the see the start of the year list of mandated supplies for YOU to buy. Those supplies aren't just for your own kid now, the lists we got for my son in 5th grade specifically differentiated what was for his personal supplies and what was expected to be brought by him for the 'community' supply of the rest of the class. His list this year ran into a second page...and WELL beyond the logical pen/pencil/protractor...etc etc

I agree it makes little sense that someone who has no kids and will never have kids, has to pay what is sometimes a very high hit on property tax. The pain is all relative and perspective I guess, but you only pay once. Parents pay the whole friggen support the school with our wallet game twice these days and the list gets worse every year.

reply to post by schuyler


I'm thinking that a number of cities would find paying the taxes a little more palatable if we weren't also being hit by scandal after scandal relating to pension funds, bugdetary funny business and flat out missing money. My city has had this, REPEATEDLY, as hard as that is to believe...and we've yet to get a large scale shake up, let alone replacement of the city administration and department management that made it all possible.

When they can learn to spend without being criminal with it, I'll feel much more....tolerant..(would be the word) of paying my property taxes. I have to pay either way...but it doesn't HAVE to be something people come to deeply resent.

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by steveknows

I wonder, does property tax in some states in the U.S include rubbish removal? I know it doesn't in SoCal.

Obviously not in Springfield either

Not in NC, either. Here we pay for it separately, but bound together with the water bill. No water bill means no trash removal, and you deal with both on your own. As near as I can tell, property taxes just cover police, fire, and county road upkeep.

I think that every developed country has a different way of doing it but it all works out the same pretty much. I think the only external fee to a utility here in Australia, and I think it's the same in every state, is the ambulance levy which is added to the quarterly electricity bill and it's about 25 bucks. so about $100 per year add to our light bills.

Originally posted by Wrabbit2000

Originally posted by Manhater
If I'm paying street light tax, I'm betting, I'm paying for your' kids education.

I have NO KIDS!

Why, should I, have too pay a school tax?

My sister has a kid. Let her pay the school tax.

Only, if goes towards my tuition, then I agree to pay it.

And, why should I, have to pay a street lamp??

I have my own. Literally. When, I say my own.

It's mine own street lamp and it's solar powered.

If it's that much trouble... Then shut it off.

I'm all for saving energy.

edit on 10-12-2011 by Manhater because: (no reason given)

Oh my, you haven't seen anything to be really mad about if you don't have kids. Try paying the annual property tax on the house you're already paying the legitimate mortgage on and the see the start of the year list of mandated supplies for YOU to buy. Those supplies aren't just for your own kid now, the lists we got for my son in 5th grade specifically differentiated what was for his personal supplies and what was expected to be brought by him for the 'community' supply of the rest of the class. His list this year ran into a second page...and WELL beyond the logical pen/pencil/protractor...etc etc

I agree it makes little sense that someone who has no kids and will never have kids, has to pay what is sometimes a very high hit on property tax. The pain is all relative and perspective I guess, but you only pay once. Parents pay the whole friggen support the school with our wallet game twice these days and the list gets worse every year.

edit on 10-12-2011 by Wrabbit2000 because: typo

Perhaps the concept is that education is in the interest of a nation so every one must wear it. I don't know of course because where I come form education is state funded, unless it's a private school. Well people funded via the states but you know what I mean.

Originally posted by Helious
The thing about it is, there are just some taxes in America that seem funny too me.

There's a whole lot of them that seem "Funny" to me too.

Here is a good example... Somebody buys a new car, they pay a hefty sum of taxes buying that car and 8 years later they sell that car. Why then is the person buying the used item that has already been taxed liable to pay taxes again? Does any purchase in America warrant a tax? Even if that tax has ALREADY been paid?

That's the one I've always wondered about myself. Why is it that way for cars, but not other items, say like anything you'd find at a garage sale or pretty much anything someone decides to sell? What makes cars special???

I can understand paying real estate tax while you are paying a mortgage on your home, you consider them installment tax payments that go hand and hand with your mortgage payment. I would like one person to explain to me why after you pay your house off you have to keep paying these taxes...... Please explain it.

To me it would seem that the government demands taxes just for being a living breathing citizen who owns land. Does this seem right by any American standard? Why should we pay taxes for existing? Very simply, you NEVER own any land here in America, you are simply from your time of purchase until you die, renting it from the government because the second you don't pay tax even on land or property you already "own" they will take it from you in a heartbeat.

American dream......? More like American nightmare. Before anyone is so quick to say.... You live in the community and they need money to fix street lights and repair potholes, save it! I live in Chicago and if you call the number to report a pothole you would be lucky if you didn't get hung up on or laughed at. They don't need the money for that and as proof I submit a commercial I seen on TV 20 minutes ago that probably cost the city 250,000 dollars on the conservative side to advertise a local curfew for minors..... WHAT? Not to mention the millions in advertising seat belt laws, click it or ticket.... And a host of other worthless propaganda they spew.

You said save the excuse of "You live in the community and they need money to fix street lights and repair potholes.", but that one I happen to agree with and can't let slide. You forgot to mention paying the firefighters who will try to save your house and anyone in it while you're out at work/shopping/on vacation, should it one day decide it needs a bit of attention.

Some services you're paying for are good to have. In the case that it happens to you, you'll be glad for it. On the flip side, you may not ever need it, but others will. It's something that you can feel good about since it helps others as well as yourself. That's just one example of the good things your money is going towards.

As for the advertisements, the seatbelt laws are good. A seatbelt may not always save someones life when accidents happen, but they do save lives. Anything else, I'll have to leave to you as I don't live there and don't know what's important to you. If you have a problem with it, find another way to voice your opinion. Doing it here won't do a damn bit of good.


I guess what I'm trying to say here is that, yes, there are some taxes that seem stupid to me and I wonder why I pay them, yet there are some that are good and I will pay without question. Reading your post, I gather that you were a bit pissed at the time. Just take a minute, look at the big picture, stop thinking about just yourself, and think about what's good for everyone.


When everyone does that, we'll have the country everyone here wants.
Until that happens, all we'll have is what we have now.

Originally posted by steveknows
Perhaps the concept is that education is in the interest of a nation so every one must wear it. I don't know of course because where I come form education is state funded, unless it's a private school. Well people funded via the states but you know what I mean.

I understand the concept and I don't necessarily have issues with it, despite my comment about people without kids. That is impossible to verify in a real world way which could work so it'll never happen anyway. Given that I think it's more a question of value for the money.

My main point is that between the time I was in school in the 80's and now, parents have come to pay for nearly all classroom supplies their own child might use AND what other children may use. Atop this, as parents, we're under pressure to help our kids with fundraisers..not once...but a few times a year. Looking at the PTA budget those fund raisers are being run FOR....the highest line items are for faculty benefits like complimentary beverages/soft drinks in the break room and similar things.

All this, while a number of schools in my Southern Missouri district don't have so much as an window unit for air conditioning. September and late spring/early summer class rooms can be brutal on heat. It'd be a few hundred per unit from Sam's Club to make a serious difference in the class room square footage and room size.

There are actually a series of reasons why learning more about how the schools take in money, yet still leave parents paying for almost every supply a physical class room has makes it worse in paying taxes. Whatever they're actually covering...it's sure shrinking fast in the past several years.

Originally posted by JibbyJedi
My taxes on the other hand are somewhere in the area of $4000+ per year, for less than 1/2 acre...

I would trade with you in two seconds. New Jersey is the property tax-raping capital of the world.

Originally posted by schuyler
The property tax pays for:

Elementary through high school
State universities and colleges
Your local Fire Department
Part of state government
Your 911 service
Your EMT guys
Your local public library
Your municipal government including
-roads
-the court system
-police and sheriff
a hospital district (sometimes)
a port district (sometimes)
A parks District (if not part of a city)

In New Jersey we pay all of those plus we contribute to other school systems in the county. This is thanks to our radically progressive state supreme court.

When I was little I asked my dad why does he pay taxes when he owns the ranch. He said everybody pays taxes. I said but the ranch is paid for, you don't owe nothing on it. That means you won't have to pay taxes. He said I still have to pay taxes on it. I said that means you dont really own it. Pops put is palms up, as in this is what it is. Even then when I was a little kid this didn't make sense about taxes.