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Christmas tree origins?

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posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:37 PM
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Xmas is a christian holiday which is supposed to be celebrating the birth of Jesus...

As most of us know Jesus was clearly not born on Dec 25... This is the date of the birth of the sun God, among other things of course...

Sol Invictus

The question is, where did the Christmas tree come from?

Is this passage where the tradition began in Christian mythology?


Jeremiah 10

1Hear ye the word which the LORD speaketh unto you, O house of Israel:

2Thus saith the LORD, Learn not the way of the heathen, and be not dismayed at the signs of heaven; for the heathen are dismayed at them.

3For the customs of the people are vain: for one cutteth a tree out of the forest, the work of the hands of the workman, with the axe.

4They deck it with silver and with gold; they fasten it with nails and with hammers, that it move not.

5They are upright as the palm tree, but speak not: they must needs be borne, because they cannot go. Be not afraid of them; for they cannot do evil, neither also is it in them to do good.

6Forasmuch as there is none like unto thee, O LORD; thou art great, and thy name is great in might.

7Who would not fear thee, O King of nations? for to thee doth it appertain: forasmuch as among all the wise men of the nations, and in all their kingdoms, there is none like unto thee.

8But they are altogether brutish and foolish: the stock is a doctrine of vanities.

9Silver spread into plates is brought from Tarshish, and gold from Uphaz, the work of the workman, and of the hands of the founder: blue and purple is their clothing: they are all the work of cunning men.


Considering how comercialized and focused on "materialism" the media has made Xmas, do you think this Xmas tree has been taken from a "heathan" tradition?


edit on 7-12-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:41 PM
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Xmas tree's are a tradition from Victorian Britain. They used to keep a tree in the living room of the house to keep evil spirits at bay.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:44 PM
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I love my little tree. A tree has been in our tradition for all the years of my life and I aint giving it up now. heathen or not. If you want to honor the birth of Christ, put a manger and whatever.
edit on 7-12-2011 by Night Star because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:44 PM
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so are you blaming the materialism of christmas on the the "heathen" traditions christians borrowed the xmas tree from?



as a heathen, i take offence!



i'd blame consumerism first.
edit on 7-12-2011 by mythos because: spelling.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:48 PM
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reply to post by mythos
 


Im not blaming anyone for anything... its a simple discussion.

Why does every religious thread have to be an arguement?

I have a Xmas tree up right now, as a matter of fact im sitting beside it... And im not even Christian... its more of a family tradition...


edit on 7-12-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:55 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 

Long before the advent of Christianity, plants and trees that remained green all year had a special meaning for people in the winter. Just as people today decorate their homes during the festive season with pine, spruce, and fir trees, ancient peoples hung evergreen boughs over their doors and windows. In many countries it was believed that evergreens would keep away witches, ghosts, evil spirits, and illness. www.history.com...



n the Northern hemisphere, the shortest day and longest night of the year falls on December 21 or December 22 and is called the winter solstice. Many ancient people believed that the sun was a god and that winter came every year because the sun god had become sick and weak. They celebrated the solstice because it meant that at last the sun god would begin to get well. Evergreen boughs reminded them of all the green plants that would grow again when the sun god was strong and summer would return.



The ancient Egyptians worshipped a god called Ra, who had the head of a hawk and wore the sun as a blazing disk in his crown. At the solstice, when Ra began to recover from the illness, the Egyptians filled their homes with green palm rushes which symbolized for them the triumph of life over death.

Early Romans marked the solstice with a feast called the Saturnalia in honor of Saturn, the god of agriculture. The Romans knew that the solstice meant that soon farms and orchards would be green and fruitful. To mark the occasion, they decorated their homes and temples with evergreen boughs. In Northern Europe the mysterious Druids, the priests of the ancient Celts, also decorated their temples with evergreen boughs as a symbol of everlasting life. The fierce Vikings in Scandinavia thought that evergreens were the special plant of the sun god, Balder.
How It All Got Started

finding the origin of the Christmas tree wasn't difficult and it took me less than a minute to google it then find an article at history.com on the subject.
the commercialization of Christmas has nothing to do with the ancient traditions. in point of fact it is the way it is primarily due to Christians preying on Christians in a commercial world run amok.

edit on 7-12-2011 by CaDreamer because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:56 PM
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Originally posted by Akragon


Considering how comercialized and focused on "materialism" the media has made Xmas, do you think this Xmas tree has been taken from a "heathan" tradition?



the Christmas Tree is derived from pagan yule traditions (there was a recent thread regarding this).

you have implied that an xmas tree's roots (pun intended) in pagan tradition has led to the current commercialization of Xmas.

correct me if i am misinterpretting things.

otherwise... as a "pagan", of course i take offense. the commercialization of Xmas has nothing to do with the 'old ways', that you have described as heathen.


PS i will bow out of this debate, however, as not to derail your thread. i don't mean to cause an argument. just looking for healthy debate.

i suppose, when the term 'heathen' is bandied, however, be prepared for some blowback.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 07:56 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


Dear Akragon,

You know the answer to your question. It is an old pagan tradition that symbolized that spring would return and that they would survive the winter. The Catholics used the existing traditions of many and would give the symbolism new Christian meaning. While I don't consider it a Christian holiday, I personally have no problem with Christmas as a secular holiday. Peace.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 08:00 PM
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I also wanted everyone to realize i only used the word "heathen" because it was used in the scripture i posted...

I have no issues with any personal tradition be it pagan, Christian or otherwise...

What you do is your business and no one elses... All the power to you...

This is just a discussion on the topic...

No offence to anyone is intended...

Have a merry Xmas


edit on 7-12-2011 by Akragon because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 08:12 PM
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reply to post by Akragon
 


cheers and happy holidays right back at ya'.


ps... that is an impressive tree! i'm inspired to get one myself, though my tiny house probably couldn't handle anything bigger than the charlie brown xmas tree.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 08:15 PM
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reply to post by mythos
 


Thank you my friend...

Xmas isn't a religious thing for me, though it can be quite spiritual...

Its a time for giving, family and friends... laughter and joy...

The passing of another year on its way...

Its an example of how we should treat each other every day of our lives... Not just a time of year...

Be love everyone!




posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 08:22 AM
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I am a Christian. I have a Christmas Tree.

We do not worship the tree, it does not tempt us to worship an ancient Babylonian-Summerian- Mesapotamian god, We do not sacrifice little babies under it nor do we have orgies around it to bring in the new fertile year.

We do put peresents under it and we drink egg nog and tell stories and laugh and sing...and eat lots of Xmas cookies and cakes and pies and drink maybe a little too much Xmas Cider.

And we tell both Xmas stories...Nativity and Yes, Virginia, there is a Santa Claus.

I think Jesus is cool with that.



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 08:56 AM
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Well, glad to see you have a tree yourself. I thought this was another one of those Christmas bashing threads. LOL There are so many who are disgusted with the holiday altogether. No one says they have to spend a fortune on gifts that will leave them in debt for God knows how long.



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 09:04 AM
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Just because we have easter eggs and easter bunnies does not mean easter itself is necessarily pagan. Same with christmas.
edit on 8-12-2011 by 547000 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 03:33 PM
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Personally I think Christmas trees were invented by cats so they can have fun knocking them over after they are decorated, but here is what I found on the internet:



King Tut never saw a Christmas tree, but he would have understood the tradition which traces back long before the first Christmas, says David Robson, Extension Educator, Horticulture with the Springfield Extension Center.

The Egyptians were part of a long line of cultures that treasured and worshipped evergreens. When the winter solstice arrive, they brought green date palm leaves into their homes to symbolize life's triumph over death.

The Romans celebrated the winter solstice with a fest called Saturnalia in honor of Saturnus, the god of agriculture. They decorated their houses with greens and lights and exchanged gifts. They gave coins for prosperity, pastries for happiness, and lamps to light one's journey through life.

Centuries ago in Great Britain, woods priests called Druids used evergreens during mysterious winter solstice rituals. The Druids used holly and mistletoe as symbols of eternal life, and place evergreen branches over doors to keep away evil spirits.

Late in the Middle Ages, Germans and Scandinavians placed evergreen trees inside their homes or just outside their doors to show their hope in the forthcoming spring. Our modern Christmas tree evolved from these early traditions.

Christmas tree history



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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reply to post by cloudyday
 


Thanks for your reply!

Though since Jeremiah was dated approx. 686 - 586bc... if this passage was refering to these people decorating a tree (Xmas tree?)... this would predate those german origins.




posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 04:18 PM
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reply to post by CaDreamer
 



Oh history buff


Isn't the tree and the gift giving separate?

Doesn't the gift giving come from St Nick?

I'd say the gift giving is the most commercial thing about Christmas - - - however - I've seen some pretty damned expensive decorations.



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 04:22 PM
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Originally posted by mythos
reply to post by Akragon
 


cheers and happy holidays right back at ya'.


ps... that is an impressive tree! i'm inspired to get one myself, though my tiny house probably couldn't handle anything bigger than the charlie brown xmas tree.



I think there are places/programs you can buy small live trees - - then donate them back for reforesting.



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 06:16 PM
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Originally posted by Annee
reply to post by CaDreamer
 



Oh history buff


Isn't the tree and the gift giving separate?

Doesn't the gift giving come from St Nick?

I'd say the gift giving is the most commercial thing about Christmas - - - however - I've seen some pretty damned expensive decorations.


you may be correct, the presents though go back again to ancestor worship and leaving trinkets for the spirits.

my post wasn't meant to be all inclusive, i was only commenting on the origin of the tree.

my comment about Christians preying on Christians was a indirect reference to presents BTW



posted on Dec, 8 2011 @ 06:31 PM
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reply to post by CaDreamer
 


I was just kidding.

All of our current holidays/festivals are a combination/accumulation of many different things through out the centuries.



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