Welcome to the Equator!! Everywhere on Earth !! USA-UK-Canada

If you have seen a "Boat/ SmileyFace / Cheshire Moon you need to look at the link below and read the first short paragraph..

www.people.vcu.edu...

Any questions?


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I've seen the "bowl shaped crescent Moon" here in Ann Arbor. Ann Arbor is not on the equator. According to the link, the only place to see the moon this way is to be on the equator. So what the deuce?

You see a Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl. Where on Earth are you?
You would be on the equator where the Sun goes straight up from the eastern horizon and straight downward toward the western horizon. The Moon phases then lie on their side.
www.people.vcu.edu...

reply to post by this_is_who_we_are



I can only say we can't have it both ways right? So something is definately wrong. !!!

I don't understand what this post is about? The moon looked exactly like it should've here in Washington state...I even used my handy dandy 'Astronomy' magazine night-sky fold out! As a matter of fact, were due for a total eclipse Saturday...only if its not raining

reply to post by NuminousCosmos


Haven't you run across a number of threads purporting that "The Moon is Wrong/Off/Upside Down/Wrong Phase" and the like?

That link is not exactly a scientific paper.

How many more threads are you going to start thinking there is something wrong with how we see the moon, which means something grater would be wrong with earth, which means there would be notice of this in the scientific community which there is not, exclamation point! *BANG*

reply to post by CherubBaby

You see a Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl. Where on Earth are you?

We have pounded this one to death in your other thread, "The Moon Is Upsidedown Tonight!". The "Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl" can be on the equator or at either 28.5° north or south depending on the Moon's position on its orbital plane of 5.1° and the position of the Earth's orbit around the Sun of 23.4°. Any variation of the above positions will match a variation of an observed horizontal bowl Moon.

You should not expect to see an exact horizontal bowl moon unless you are standing on the Earth where the Moon is directly over head. If the Moon's position or yours changes then it will reflect the observed horizontal bowl form 0°.

reply to post by CherubBaby

You see a Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl. Where on Earth are you?

You would be on the equator where the Sun goes straight up from the eastern horizon and straight downward toward the western horizon. The Moon phases then lie on their side.

www.people.vcu.edu...

Sort of true. But the pictures you've shown us do not show the Moon looking "looking exactly like a horizontal bowl". It's been tilted.

Did your really need to start a new thread?
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by CherubBaby
reply to post by this_is_who_we_are

 

I can only say we can't have it both ways right? So something is definately wrong. !!!

Or someone.

From: Ask an astronomer at Cornell University: curious.astro.cornell.edu...

Is the Moon seen as a crescent (and not a "boat") all over the world? Is the same phase of the moon visible from the Northern and Southern hemispheres?

Recently a friend of mine visited the country of Bali in Africa. She claims that because that country is south of the equator, the Moon, instead of having a crescent shape during certain phases, will actually have a "boat" shape. Is she pulling my leg ?? Isn't the crescent shape seen the whole world over ??

Sabrina: The appearance of the crescent moon will also change depending on the season for an observer staying at a single location on the Earth. We know the Earth does not sit right-side-up in its orbit - instead the Earth's axis is tilted and this tilt is what causes the seasons. Just as the Sun's path is different across the sky depending on the season (the path is longer during the summer giving us more direct sunlight and hotter days), the Moon's path will be different as well. What part of the Moon gets illuminated (i.e. whether it looks like a crescent or a boat) depends on how high the Moon is in the sky. During summer in the northern hemisphere, we are tipped away from the Moon's orbit, putting the Moon lower in the sky and creating more of a crescent. During winter in the north, we are tipped toward the Moon's orbit, putting the Moon higher in the sky and creating more of a boat.

reply to post by Illustronic

That link is not exactly a scientific paper.

Not only that but they also made a mistake on the linked page.

You see a Waxing Crescent Moon that looks like our drawing of a Waning Moon,

Link
The drawing on that page clearly shows a waxing Moon since they have designated Earth's north and south poles, not a waning Moon.

Here is one of their drawings of a waning crescent Moon. Link

The equator is moving, slowly, due to a process known as axial precession. Meaning, the sun, this same time next year, won't rise or set in the same place.



Each revolving "wobble" takes about 26,000 years or so.

I remember seeing a before and after picture that was posted on reddit but I couldn't find it. This guy took two pictures of a sunrise in his backyard precisely 9 months apart. They were off by 20 degrees or so.
Maybe the closer we get to the "galaxial equator" the more unstable our gravitation field with the sun becomes.
It is my understanding the we are practically smack dab in the middle of it.

Read the text.

You see a Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl. Where on Earth are you?

You would be on the equator where the Sun goes straight up from the eastern horizon and straight downward toward the western horizon. The Moon phases then lie on their side.

www.people.vcu.edu...

Originally posted by CherubBaby
Any questions?

Yes:

What would it take to convince you that you are wrong about this? Who could we hypothetically bring into the discussion to change your view as incorrect?

I suspect that it is nothing and no one that could accomplish either of those things. You'll simply say "It's just their opinion...no one can ever know for sure" or somesuch.

Can one troll their own OP?

reply to post by Illustronic


The links to a .edu ..which is education supported (either by a school or education foundation..)

plus that info is right, I live in GA, and just the other day I witness a boat shaped moon..which uh last time I checked isn't normal.

reply to post by Devino


This site is for Virginia Commonwealth University

so if you are saying that a University is supplying wrong information, than please explain.

Originally posted by CherubBaby
If you have seen a "Boat/ SmileyFace / Cheshire Moon you need to look at the link below and read the first short paragraph..

www.people.vcu.edu...

Any questions?

OP --

First of all, I assume you are under the impression that only the equator will ever see a perfectly horizontal Moon. That is NOT true.

I understand why you may think this. You probably think this because you are under the assumption that only the Earth's equator is the only part of the Earth ever aligned with the Sun's ecliptic plane. The ecliptic plane is like the solar system's "equator" and basically slices through the middle of the Earth-Moon system (**actually, the Moon is slightly off the ecliptic plane, but for simplicity's sake, it's good enough to say it is aligned with it).

Therefore, the Earth's equator -- if it was aligned with the Sun's ecliptic plane -- should be more "directly under the Moon" than any other place on Earth.

That's why it's quite understandable that you would think that the Earth's equator is the only part of the Earth aligned with the Sun's ecliptic plane. The plane slices though the middle of the Earth, and the equator is at the middle of the Earth -- Right? Actually, you would be wrong to think this. You are forgetting about the 23.5° tilt of the Earth....

...Due to the earth's tilt, the equator is actually NOT the only place on Earth that can be aligned with the Sun's ecliptic plane, and it is NOT the place on Earth that is most "directly under the Moon".

For an explanation of this, look at the image below:



This image shows the basic configuration of the Earth right now (in December). Because of the tilt of the earth, the Northern hemisphere (on this drawing. let's say it's showing "North America", rather than the whole northern hemisphere) is tilted "up" away from the Sun during the day. It is also tilted "up" away from the Sun's ecliptic. This is why North America is approaching winter.

However, as the Earth rotates and North America heads into night, you can see that due to the tilt of the Earth, North America in December is actually tilted "downward" at night much closer to the Sun's ecliptic plane and more directly under the Moon.

In fact, because of the tilt of the Earth, southern parts of North America are more aligned with the Sun's ecliptic than the equator is. Right now, the "boat Moon" is more perfectly horizontal in Mexico City (at 20° N latitude) that at the equator. Today at the equator, the Moon should look NOT as horizontal as it would from Mexico City.

In fact, due to the tilt of the Earth, there are places in the United States that should see the moon as being more horizontal than it would look from the equator.

I certainly understand that because the equator is generally close to the Sun's ecliptic all the time that the tilted moon would be more prevalent all year round. However, that does NOT mean that a heavily tilted Moon can NEVER be seen from anywhere but the equator.

I thought the 'ecliptic' was a circular plane of the earth's orbit around the sun and not the solar system ecliptic, which was pointed out to me. I don't believe the earth's orbit is exactly aligned with the suns rotational 'angle'. Other planets are further off the sun's rotational angle than the earth so we use our orbit to define 'the ecliptic'.

Originally posted by Illustronic
I thought the 'ecliptic' was a circular plane of the earth's orbit around the sun and not the solar system ecliptic, which was pointed out to me. I don't believe the earth's orbit is exactly aligned with the suns rotational 'angle'. Other planets are further off the sun's rotational angle than the earth so we use our orbit to define 'the ecliptic'.

edit on 7-12-2011 by Illustronic because: (no reason given)

You are correct.

The Earth is off the Sun's equatorial/ecliptic plane a bit, and the Moon's orbital plane is of the Earth's equatorial plane a bit...

...But I was just trying to simplify things to make the concept clear. If I tried to show all the true variables, the point I am trying to make would get lost in the details.

The point is that parts of North America, and even parts of the U.S. [can at times be more directly beneath the moon than the equator. One of those times is right now (on December nights). Like I said, right now the Moon should look more like a boat (more horizontal) when it is near the horizon as seen from Mexico City than it should from when seen from the equator.

Right.. This is Las Vegas's moon below.

You see a Crescent Moon looking exactly like a horizontal bowl. Where on Earth are you?
You would be on the equator where the Sun goes straight up from the eastern horizon and straight downward toward the western horizon. The Moon phases then lie on their side

Read the opening post..Her is the link.

www.people.vcu.edu...

Originally posted by Nobama
reply to post by Devino

 

This site is for Virginia Commonwealth University

so if you are saying that a University is supplying wrong information, than please explain.

It's not wrong. It's just over-simplified and incomplete.

The Moon will look more horizontal all year-round from the equator when compared to the higher latitudes. That is completely true. However, there are times that the moon will also look horizontal from other places on Earth. Right now, that's at about 20° or so North latitude. That's the part of the Earth that is most aligned with the ecliptic at night right now.

A greatly tilted Moon can be seen at higher latitudes -- with the degree of tilt getting smaller with each degree North a person goes. Therefore, someone at 50° North latitude (in Canada) would have seen the Moon tilted about 30° away from being horizontal -- but still noticeably tilted.

It all makes perfect sense mathematically when you understand the mechanics of it all. I'm not just making this stuff up as I go along just because the Moon looked tilted for the past few days. The crescent Moon is supposed to look tilted on the horizon at night in the northern hemisphere this time of the year. If it wasn't tilted, then something would be wrong.