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How did the 'Estonia' sink 1994?

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posted on Nov, 9 2009 @ 03:56 AM
It seams that after the agreement not to disturb the wreak someones has done just that. who was it and what were they trying to recover.

Or do we have underwater pirates looking for valuables to recover.

posted on Dec, 2 2009 @ 05:29 PM
Estonian press has just picked up the news about the trial. Media is apparently very silent about this trial.

MS Estonia Case Lands in a French Court

Nov 30th, 2009

A French court will take up Estonia case again


Beyond the official version of the accident, there have been some others conspiracy theories saying that the Estonia was carrying forbidden cargo and somebody deliberately made the ship sink.

Öhlén also opined on these various theories saying that “concerning the theory of secret transport of weapons between Estonia and Sweden, it is definitely not impossible.

For some reason, Öhlén mention only transports of (Swedish) weapons from Sweden to Estonia, and not the other way around. Even though Swedish journalists found out (and confirmed) that there were secret transports of (non-Swedish) weapons from Estonia to Sweden (on the ferry Estonia!) on the 14 and 20 September 1994. Whether there were also a transport on the 28 September (a week later), is not confirmed. This is no secret in Sweden and it was on Swedish television too, so I find it strange that he pretends to not know this. Anyway...

Regarding the trial, keep in mind that France never signed the Estonia agreement, so they can order a new examination of the wreck.

posted on Dec, 2 2009 @ 05:41 PM
I remember hearing about a science experiment gone wrong. A teacher threw a block of Potassium something or other into water and the resulting explosion killed some children.

posted on Mar, 13 2010 @ 02:58 PM
Here's a French documentary (video) :

ESTONIA - Les mysteres d'un naufrage (France 3 - 091016)

posted on Oct, 24 2010 @ 01:12 PM
I knew that there were at least two weapons transfers taking place within the last two weeks before the disaster, but I didn't know this.


Immediately before Estonia left Tallinn on its final voyage, Carl Övberg, a survivor and frequent passenger who had arrived at the last minute, reported that the harbor had been sealed off and that a military convoy had escorted two large trucks to the waiting ferry. As soon as the trucks were loaded, the ship's car ramp and bow visor were closed and the delayed ferry sailed for Stockholm.

Also note that the company that was hired to cover the ferry Estonia with concrete, was spezialized in neutralizing underwater nuclear waste.

Instead of retrieving the bodies, the government of Sweden hired a Dutch marine salvage firm, Smit Tak BV, that specializes in neutralizing underwater nuclear waste, spending $350 million in a failed attempt to cover the ship in concrete.

posted on Dec, 1 2010 @ 08:19 PM

Originally posted by Hellmutt
...the government of Sweden hired a Dutch marine salvage firm, Smit Tak BV, that specializes in neutralizing underwater nuclear waste, spending $350 million in a failed attempt to cover the ship in concrete.

You don't spend that kind of money merely to discourage salvagers. By now their "hot" cargo has spread all over the bottom of the Baltic. It might not be a good idea to eat the local catch-of-the-day. Helmut you seem to be a local to that area. Is there awareness of this sinking as being some kind of covert op as opposed to being merely an accident?
edit on 1-12-2010 by starviego because: (no reason given)

posted on Apr, 23 2011 @ 02:52 PM
The answers are down there...

History Channel - Estonia Ferry disaster

posted on Apr, 25 2011 @ 12:10 AM
Why didn't they rescue the bodies from the wreck? A: If there were no longer any bodies there, the wreck would lose its status as a burial ground. They would no longer have an excuse to prevent "outsiders" from examining the wreck, and possibly find the real cause of its sinking.

posted on Jul, 13 2011 @ 09:08 AM
Hi all, it seems most of what could have been said on the subject has been said in a very long and highly interesting thread - well done everybody for contributing, it really helps having such a detailed log of the history of this event when researching.

When i look at so called conspiracies it helps to work backwards and usually beneficiaries start to appear, for example in this case the party obtaining raw materials smuggled from the east - however in the case of the estonia it appears to be entirely a cover up operation wherein every international body involved has something to lose or more importantly something on another countries involvement which keeps the status quo.

If believed, acting through Nordic agencies, m16 agents acquired Russian 'materials', either experimental metals or nuclear materials, which were smuggled out of the east through Tallinn on board the estonia. Waiting to ensure a safe collection was a nato 'search and rescue' team whose presence in the area at that time is as suspect as their silence in the rescue and the communications black out in the area surrounding the estonia.
On route for stockholm the ship is sunk, supposedly by russian agents who learnt of the operation and set out to ensure their tech did not fall into the hands of their enemies in the west

First of all you can see how an operation was jeopardised and that any involvement, save that of a normal search and rescue would have been construed as suspicious given the circumstances. But why then run with the search and rescue line*

It is possible that non of the ships in the nato exercise were actually designed for any type of search and rescue and had any of the ships in question gotten involved been seen and any descriptions of possible contamination suits, containers etc been seen a media **** storm could be at the door step of every nato member.

At any rate a distress signal would have been read and at some point orders would have been given for the nato search and rescue operation to do nothing - even though they were in the area for just such an occasion. Given that nato refuses to comment on their activities in the area does not fight their corner either.

But what about the communications black out reported in the area? At the exact same time as the 'disaster', in that area - circumstantial does not begin to come close to explaining that - yet here we have a nato task force reasonably close by, who undoubtedly knew what was happening as a distress signal would have been sent via the estonia

Communication breakdowns and military presence are hallmarks of what people refer to as 'conspiracies' - look over any conspiracy and in the context of the event will be a communications failure or government/military presence on hand .... what comes to mind immediately is the July 7th London bombings where on the exact day of the 'attacks' the ambulance/fire brigade and police forces were undertaking a mock terror run and preparing staff to cope with an attack.

posted on Dec, 7 2012 @ 08:27 PM
Zero Hour documentary. Many details, statements and conclusions in this film are controversial and might be based on faulty/missing/misinterpreted/altered data. So, keep that in mind when watching this. I don't agree with many of the claims made in this documentary. But it's still interesting to watch, especially if you're interested in this topic.

posted on Dec, 7 2012 @ 09:17 PM
I remember this tradegy very well, I lived in Germany at that time and it was all over the news, but I never realized that it was possibly anything other than an accident...back then my German was not so good, so there was a lot I did not "pick up on" you could say.

I remember when it happened all I could think of were the sheer numbers of people who died and how strange it was that an accident of this magnitude could happen in this day and age.

Now that I have went through this thread, it seems there might be a whole lot more to this "accident". Thanks for putting this thread together, I am going to take my time and study this information more closely now.

posted on Jun, 1 2017 @ 11:31 PM
Mr. Skylight...

Somehow, I've missed this detail. A coded fire alarm was apparently sounded to the crew over Estonia's PA-system.

Safety organisation

Without alarming the passengers, the crew could be alerted over the public address system with the coded message "Mr. Skylight". This message could also be used with a suffix. Depending on which suffix, viz.

in case of fire:

"Mr. Skylight to No. 1", means for the fire groups to proceed immediately to "Fire Station No. 1".
"Mr. Skylight to No. 2", means for the fire groups to proceed immediately to "Fire Station No. 2".

Fire Station 1 is forward on deck 8.
Fire Station 2 is aft on the car deck.

Note: Several crew members have testified to having heard "Mr. Skylight to No. 1 and 2" over the loud speaker after the excessive heel at 01.02 hours and thus assumed that there was a fire and tried to reach their respective fire stations at the beginning (e.g. see statement of 2nd engineer Peeter Tüür - Enclosure

posted on Jun, 22 2017 @ 10:58 AM
New Book

There's a new book out, called: “The Sinking of the Estonia: The CIA Knew”. For some reason, they say "over nine hundred people" died. I don't know how many died on the ferry Estonia, but I believe the official number is 852. One german died later at the hospital, causing the death toll to rise to 853. There are rumours of some Kurds being smuggled on board, not being included in the official numbers. Also, some of the surviving crew apparently went missing afterwards...

Author Hugh Hammond’s new book “The Sinking of the Estonia: The CIA Knew” is a Fictionalized Account of the 1994 Sinking of the Car Ferry “Estonia” by the Russian Mafia

June 08, 2017

Hammond shares, “Authorities in Estonia, Finland, and Sweden all participated in the investigation. They suggested a number of illogical explanations for the sinking, including excessive speed of the ship prior to sinking.

posted on Jun, 22 2017 @ 11:11 AM
a reply to: Hellmutt

So we took or bought something defense related off a Russian shelf somewhere, and the Russians sank the ship so we couldnt study it.

Thats what I will think.

edit on 6 22 2017 by tadaman because: (no reason given)

posted on Jun, 22 2017 @ 11:29 AM
Kurds and plutonium

Here are some more details regarding the Kurds mentioned, and also plutonium apparently hidden in one of the trucks.

Chapter 17 - Loading & Securing of Cargo

According to the customs list the 40th truck, missing on the cargo manifest although the consecutive number on the manifest - 43 744 - had been left open, was a Scania truck with the registration no. AG 565 and with the Latvian driver Gunnar Gobins ((). Since the customs list does not state dimen-sions, weight or type of cargo, no more details are known. The 39th truck added to the cargo manifest in handwriting under the consecutive no. 43 749 was also a Scania truck with the registration no. NRY 806 and with the Swedish driver Leo Sillanpää ((). In the freight manifest - Enclosure 17.1.212 - which is the cargo manifest with added freight figures, both trucks are missing although the consecutive numbers 43 744 and 43 749 were left open. It is unknown whether this means that these trucks were carried free of charge and whether this could mean that these are the two trucks escorted into the port and on board by military personnel. (See Subchapter 17.3.)

Note: According to information received from a prisoner in the jail of Vaasa/ Finland (after the Luttunen interview) his friend Leo Sillanpää was the driver of a truck which had plutonium hidden between the regular cargo.

It is also evident from the customs list that the truck or trailer no. 46 with the number plate 417 EEE had no driver registered. It is thus possible that this was the truck or trailer which had been shipped on board the ESTONIA on the basis of incorrect documents and which contained between 148 and 174 Iraqi Kurds according to information from the files of the public prosecutor Tomas Lindstrand, Stockholm.

posted on Jun, 22 2017 @ 02:47 PM
There's one thing I don't understand about this Kurds-story. How do you hide 148-174 Kurds inside a truck?

posted on Jun, 22 2017 @ 03:23 PM

originally posted by: Hellmutt
There's one thing I don't understand about this Kurds-story. How do you hide 148-174 Kurds inside a truck?

you tell them that if they make a sound and found out the deportation awaits.

they'll sit tight .

posted on Jun, 28 2017 @ 08:12 PM
An interesting eyewitness statement from Carl-Erik Reintamm - cabin 1094 - 1st deck:

- he ran out into the alleyway, but he didn't look at his watch, in the alleyway he saw water in the angle between the wall and the floor streaming along the wall with considerable speed,
- it was a considerable quantity of water, about 40 centimetres high, which was not running down the stairs from the above car deck, but was rushing very quickly through the centre alleyway in the angle between wall and floor, which made him run even faster into the stairway and up;
- he did not note any water coming through the car deck doors but heard an alarm signal which sounded like an old fashioned alarm clock which was ringing all the time without interruption,

Lots of water below the car deck, but maybe not coming from the car deck?

Also interesting:
Summary of Observations and Noises Heard Before the Abrupt Heel

posted on Apr, 7 2018 @ 10:04 AM
Has this thread now disappeared into the ether?

posted on Apr, 9 2018 @ 07:43 PM
a reply to: Fermy

Since the truth for some reason is classified for 70 years, I guess all we can do now is to speculate. The official story highly likely is not true. And as long as the bodies have not yet been salvaged, no one is allowed to examine the wreck.

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