The ULTIMATE expression of ignorance -- "Pics or it didn't happen"

The "pics or gtfo" crowd are basically saying they have a threshold that needs to be met to be believable. Since there is a large variety of data they won't accept, it indicates they need validation from people they deem credible to make it real to them.

This could be a respected ATS member, the MSM, or their Uncle Jerry. Either way they are not the "believer" type and won't make the decision for themselves. They will, however, throw in one-liners that add no value to anything and cause conflict. The sound of one hand clapping.

Originally posted by JohnWorfin

Originally posted by Visiting ESB

Originally posted by Dystopiaphiliac
Is it bonkers in here or what? Is it some sort of evil now to provide at least the most basic form of evidence? Where would the scientific method be right now if it followed the OP's logic?

Your beloved scientific method has proven itself a colossal failure and subject to incredible error. In the last few months, for example, the scientific method, which had previously been used to state with utter confidence that nothing can exceed the speed of light, FAILED to predict that outcome. Pompous adherence to THAT fairy tale is amazing. And yet no one had a picture of any of it.

The scientific method got us PICS of the surface of mars, the moon, titan, and venus. what have you done? The scientific method was the basis for the opera experiments that showed that particles can travel faster than the speed of light. What have you done other than complaining on the Internet, on a computer, looking at a monitor, all of which require a fair manipulation of physics, understood from experimentation using the scientific method. I suppose we can go back to divining the future from goat entrails, or judge a person by the lumps on their head, or convict a person based on weather they float, or can stand a hot burning piece of metal on their tongue. There are several communities that reject modern life, like al queda, or the flat earth society. But complaining about the scientific method on the ultimate expression of human technology, the Internet is the ultimate expression of Blind Ignorance.

No, your scientific method FAILED and continues to FAIL. Because of this alleged "science", we were led astray for decades, never questioning Einstein, for example. Only a few who dared test his theories, which were supposedly proven by your scientific method, were able to set science straight. Had they accepted the conclusions the scientific method dictated, we'd still be wallowing in scientific stupidity and embarassing arrogance at what we THINK we know. Only divergence from the norm, from the conclusions the scientific method reaches, will ever get us anywhere. Until then, we will still wonder how to cure cancer, how to travel to other galaxies, how to explore other universes.

I don't think its the ultimate sign of ignorance. The ultimate sign of ignorance is when someone just goes and completely tries to discredit everything - even if it is fake they will make it out to be even faker! Pictures are important because they are worth a lot more than someones testimony unless that persons testimony can be investigated and it adds-up. It doesn't mean to say when someone does say "pics or didn't happen" they are being ignorant, it just means they are looking for a bit more proof of what took place.

I understand pictures are not the be all and end all of any debate concerning this subject but you can't make everyone believe - only those who are open-minded.

After a LONG and CAREFUL observation, the ULTIMATE expression of ignorance is: "Disinfo agent!"
Only people who are ...
Why bother, anyone even with a half a mind understands what i mean.

I completely agree with this thread and the OP
I mean, I wonder, how many actual photographs, or vids or true descriptive and well thought out testimonies are actually looked over immediately, pushed to the side and considered fake. I know for a fact that we are all missing out on invaluable evidence and documentation of things that are abnormal all over the world. I think its wrong to immediately think something is fake. True, until proven fake. That is my moddo. The demanding of better quality video /or pics or anything of the such is just completely missing the point. The point is there is some point to be discussed, theorized and processed.
The point is something in itself, something is being documented that at the time was felt to not be of the norm
There should be no demand, for anything in the beginning when there already exists the point to be discussed.

What a shame that incredible finds get flushed away so quickly.
tre trajic

Click here for more information.

reply to post by Lookingsky11


Well we have a report of a UFO on here by one member driving a van with his brother with him, both saw the object both gave a different description thats the problem with an eyewitness report with nothing to back it up!

www.abovetopsecret.com...

reply to post by Visiting ESB


While what you say makes some sense what you left out is that we are dealing with fleeting moments. Some occupations such as police officers require that the person pay more attention to scene details. Your average Joe, walking down the street is not trained to be detail minded so when an unusual event takes place the participant zeroes in on the main activity and may not consider that a wider view, taking in points of reference for a more accurate report, will help with the credibility.

I can't blame people for wanting pics for definite proof before they take a story seriously.. they're not implying it didn't happen


think of it more as them saying "pics or i dont believe you"

reply to post by Visiting ESB


Cases aren't won on testimony alone, in fact most lawyers and courts find testimony alone not 100% credible.

While the phrase "pics or it didn't happen" is insulting to the witness you can't fault people for wanting evidence.

I'm a scientist to me what is more important is empirical evidence.
That's not to say testimony doesn't go a long way, but for me testimony can only get you 48%-51% of the way to making a claim.
I hold everyone to that standard even myself.
I've experienced things I can't provide evidence for and as such I don't mind if someone claims bollocks on what I'm saying.

In my experience the majority of "pics or it didn't happen" occurs when the OP is dodging direct questions, or whining that no one is taking them seriously.
I'm not counting the knee jerk "pics or it didn't happen" annoying posts before the OP even has a chance to respond to the first line of questions, I'm talking after that when they become evasive.

Telling people they can't ask for empirical evidence is even more insulting than not trusting someones testimony alone.
Everyone should be held to the same standard and if you can't provide empirical evidence your claims are only conjecture or anecdotal.
Posters shouldn't be insulted for not being believed on their testimony alone.
People lie, they see things that aren't there, their minds fill in gaps.

You mention courts and the credibility of witnesses and than bash people questioning their rights to have doubts in testimony.
The fact is credibility can't be established just from one anecdote.
It needs to be built up, and when an OP dodges questions or whines their credibility goes down plain and simple.

There is nothing wrong with questioning an OP and making them back up their claims with more explanations or evidence.
A court won't take pure evidence alone it's weighed with all the other testimony and all the evidence.
Singular testimony holds very little weight in court, it's cumulative.

All that said I'm willing to give posters the benefit of the doubt and some can convince me of even more, but one anecdote alone will only get me to around the 50% belief.
That will go up or down based on further questioning.

I think every topic should be approached with the goal to put as many holes in the account as possible and then if the OP can fill those holes back up their case as it were gains more credibility.
Questioning each other with a critical mind isn't insulting, but asking us not to question them and claiming that said questioning is ignorance is insulting.

I apply this same rubric to myself, I don't have evidence for some of my experiences that I have related here, and if someone questions them that's fine with me.
If you are going to post on ATS you should welcome questions and people trying to prove you wrong, because in the scientific world the same thing is done.
Any thing that stands up to questions and survives even just a little bit is that much stronger for it.