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The ULTIMATE expression of ignorance -- "Pics or it didn't happen"

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posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:26 PM
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OK, so get this. I have NEVER believed that UFOs are ET-controlled craft. I've heard the stories and just figured people were seeing Chinese lanterns & such. But over the weekend, I let the dog out and was waiting for her to do her business and started looking around the skies as I always do. It was a really clear night and visibility was quite good. Then I noticed something just didn't look right, and suddenly I realized I was not seeing stars in an area I should have. As I looked at that spot of sky I realized I was seeing some kind of object that was obcuring my view of the sky, and it was definitely triangular in shape. As I watched, it slowly rotated and after several minutes lights suddenly flashed on at each corner. Two were solid white, one was blinking red. Another brighter light suddenly flashed on in the center of the triangle, then an orange ball that looked like circular fire (I don't know how to describe it beyond that, it looked like flames but it was perfectly circular) slowly lowered from the center light and moved off in another direction. Then the center light winked off, then the 3 tip lights also went off and once again I was staring at a black silhouette. It moved off slowly at first, then zipped away so impossibly fast that I knew for a fact it couldn't be anything from this planet. It has changed my life forever, I now know that we're not alone!! No I don't have pictures, and before you tell me I need them let me just say that I KNOW what I saw, and nothing anyone here says will dissuade me from it!! We ARE being visited, I am an eyewitness to it!!


There you go, took me all of 2 minutes to type that. THIS is why people demand pics or other evidence, because anyone can make this crap up. Drop in just enough of the common elements such as the triangular shape and the tip lights and the ET believers will buy into it without question. It is just far too easy to make this stuff up and there is no way to verify the credibility of anonymous forum posters, so this is why skeptics demand solid evidence, and they are absolutely justified in doing so. The Internet is chock full of liars and trolls, there is no reason to believe anything that anyone posts without evidence to back it up.




posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by horseplay
reply to post by Visiting ESB
 


by the way, S & F
very eloquently put.


Thanks!



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:34 PM
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reply to post by SavedOne
 

Even if an eyewitness account isn't just a made-up story, it could still be an honest mis-identification.

Mis-identifications happen all the time, and for a number of reasons. A picture would be very helpful in some of those situations.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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In a court of law, you can view the person giving the testimony. You can observe eye movement, body movements, and other signs a person gives off while they are speaking. You can tell a lot by watching someone as they are talking. We do not have that luxury here online. We have only the typed words of the observers. I'm not saying they are lying, or not credible, it's just that we can't see them and listen to their voice and watch them. That puts us online at a disadvantage.Just my observation.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:39 PM
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Originally posted by Six6Six
I have not seen ONE credible person on here.


edit on 5-12-2011 by Six6Six because: (no reason given)


I presume that would include you? As you and many just can't understand, to say "pics or IT DIDN'T HAPPEN" is absolutely the height of ignorance because you've concluded that "it didn't happen" ONLY on the basis that photos are not provided. People like you don't even ask further questions before concluding that the person telling the story is lying. And again, if people did provide photos, you'd be the first to claim they're fake.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:43 PM
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The real issue is this ... You're on the Internet.

I'll bullet point my response, for brevity:


  1. It takes an authority figure to convince someone of life-altering information.
  2. The testimony argument is weak. High profile cases DO NOT and CANNOT rely on testimony. They rely on evidence, testimony, and logic.
  3. People lie constantly. Con-men exist, everywhere. Cons are just as, or even more, prevalent in the "conspiracy" or "alternative news" circles.
  4. You can watch movies like Lord of the Rings. No visual evidence can be good enough to not be fake.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:43 PM
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Originally posted by ipofaon
Your analogy of comparing witness of say a murder to UFO witness is fallacious at best. Witness in Court is under Oath, lying under Oath can result in prison time. Consequence of lying about a UFO encounter? Uhh.. nothing? You'll probably destroy an username at worst. ATS is not a Court. Your analogy does not work. When we sign up here we agreed to the TOS. Breaking the TOS will only result in account termination or IP ban in extreme cases.

On topic, most people who say that phrase had already made up their mind that the story presented is fake. It is just a way to troll the OP.


This has nothing to do with swearing under oath. People can lie under oath. The important thing here is that we should judge a person's credibility by who they are, what they've said, how they respond to questions, their history, etc. We don't need photos to judge them.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:45 PM
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Originally posted by Captain Beyond
In a court of law, you can view the person giving the testimony. You can observe eye movement, body movements, and other signs a person gives off while they are speaking. You can tell a lot by watching someone as they are talking. We do not have that luxury here online. We have only the typed words of the observers. I'm not saying they are lying, or not credible, it's just that we can't see them and listen to their voice and watch them. That puts us online at a disadvantage.Just my observation.


There are times when you can testify by phone, so you don't always get to observe them.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:49 PM
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Originally posted by Six6Six


I've seen credible members ridiculed, mocked, called a liar for not having pictures of their UFO, ET, or paranormal experience. Such demand for photographic evidence is ignorant and displays intellectual dishonesty by the one demanding such evidence.



Yeah, credible to YOU!! I have not seen ONE credible person on here.

Have you met any of these credible people? Have you looked into their backgrounds? Have you investigated their education, family and working lives to form this title of "credible".....What's that? You reply "no".

Well then you whole post is void and just opinion based on nothing but asking people to believe or listen to people they have never met and take it at face value.

people NEED proof. With out it their is no way to test the evidence.

NO ones word on here is worth anything more than a fart from a bear!!

Pointless thread.
edit on 5-12-2011 by Six6Six because: (no reason given)


Couldn't agree more. Perhaps the "pics" cry is a collective exasperation at all the purple prose, "interdimensional beings" guffery and overexcited shaky camera operators.

edit on 5-12-2011 by jamdan because: shpelling



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:50 PM
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Originally posted by Visiting ESB

Originally posted by Six6Six
I have not seen ONE credible person on here.


edit on 5-12-2011 by Six6Six because: (no reason given)


I presume that would include you? As you and many just can't understand, to say "pics or IT DIDN'T HAPPEN" is absolutely the height of ignorance because you've concluded that "it didn't happen" ONLY on the basis that photos are not provided. People like you don't even ask further questions before concluding that the person telling the story is lying. And again, if people did provide photos, you'd be the first to claim they're fake.


It is not ingnorant to ask for evidence.. without evidence something did not happen. I can fabricate something and I can make up the answer to whatever questions you have. it is not hard. A picture is harder to fabricate and even if you could someone would debunk it if it was al lie.

Testimony, and stories are not evidence of anything other than you can be mistaken about something you perceived or you made up...



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 03:50 PM
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Wether you have a photo thats crisp, or a video thats not blurred, it makes no difference to the ignorant or to the masses, i never use to believe in UFO's until i saw one myself recently and luckily had my mobile on me to record, posted the video on youtube aswell. HOW IRONIC! no one believes me or my video.

I am 100% positive that the UFO i saw was the real deal, as it made me go from non-believer to believer in 3 minutes.

Infact i have seen them twice, i guess people dont really look up at the sky that much anymore, everyones pre-occupied with 'something' these days, they dont notice even if they are in the same place.

But most people arent going to believe, its one of those things where you HAD to be there to believe it.

So the skeptic will continue to mock, the ignorant will continue to troll, but at the end of the day those who have 'seen' know the truth. Its simply a question of when the global masses will see it collectively and irrefutably, perhaps in a major event.........


edit on 5-12-2011 by ISeekTruth101 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:03 PM
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Originally posted by Phage
reply to post by FidelityMusic
 

Growing up I believed that UFOs were most likely ET visitors.
I don't believe that so much any more.


You know what that is Phage? That's your/our ego encapsulating our belief system. Coupled with years of 'worldly' negative standpoints creating cynicism. Even though three friends and myself included saw an "ET" driving object, years later when asked about it, they aren't so sure they saw anything anymore. Strange, considering there was no denying it at the time.

Don't trust your ego



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:04 PM
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reply to post by Visiting ESB
 


The phrase itself (pics or it didnt happen) is a longstanding internet joke.

Perhaps you're taking it too seriously, or someone really pushed your buttons and you fell for it.

Besides, it's not even really an argumentative reply. Why would you let it so bother you, that someone could try and refute a claim of yours with such a simple response?





posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:11 PM
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Trust me...Even with credible pics...the song remains the same from many.
www.abovetopsecret.com...



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:12 PM
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When someone posts a comment that says "pics or it didn't happen" you are basically calling the poster a liar and it's rude. I think that people just post "pics or it didn't happen" to be a troll 99% of the time. Not everyone can provide a picture for their experiences and we often go through life not being able to photograph our experiences unless you already come prepared with a camera.

Maybe when someone says "pics or it didn't happen" they can explain why it's so important to have a picture? Or maybe why they will believe 1 persons thread without pics and not another persons without pics? Most of the experiences on Above Top Secret don't have pictures to go along with them and people should not expect things to be captured by a camera all the time. Especially if all you're going to do is say how horrible the picture is.

It's so important to ask for pictures until the people who ask for pics so often post something they can't provide pictures for....



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:16 PM
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reply to post by Visiting ESB
 


If I were a juror, I could not make a decision based on testimony by phone. They would have a hung jury. Once again, I'm not saying these people are not credible, or lying, it's just hard to make a decision based on viewed text.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:18 PM
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I seriously don't understand where this thread is going. It's just devolving into senseless arguments.

The fact is, asking for more proof when a claim is sketchy and you don't believe it is a perfectly normal and intelligent thing to do. If I don't believe your claim and you can't substantiate it, then that's it for your claim in my book.

The whole "it's hard to take pictures" argument is absolutely absurd. There are people who study how to take pictures in any situation - they're called photographers. Any long exposure of the night sky on a tripod will reveal streaks of light that showed some moving activity. You can see by the movement of the streaks in the sky whether the object is UFO and unexplainable, or a plane. Very simple process; you just have to be prepared and know what to look for. Sorry some troll didn't believe you once about your encounters.

The rate of paranoid schizophrenia on this web site had got to be up there way beyond average. Personally, I reserve my right to question insane people's stories and use my best judgment to believe what i know to be true. So many people simply want attention and power over people. The temptation to lie is palpable.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:18 PM
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reply to post by Visiting ESB
 


What a great post; thanks. I have said the same thing many times that if it's good enough for a court of law, then eye witness accounts should be admissible. I think it's safe to say that the credibility of each witness should be tested at some point as should their claims/testimony. This can be done of course without assassinating their character or being openly hostile or bias.

If we simply trust what everyone tells us is the gospel truth, we would all be "up *hit creek in a barbed wire canoe" very quickly. It's not difficult to ascertain whether the witness is a sandwich short of a picnic. Nor to point out glaring inconsistencies (although in the case of the paranormal or anything ufo related it's often the consistencies that are more telling).

I find that generally people who are clear, concise, and sincere can generally be a good witness to an event. You will know a good witness when they answer to a question they don't know with "I don't know " or "I have never seen anything Like that before so it is difficult to describe."

People who tend to fill in those blanks with long drawn out conclusions or embellishments are pretty easy to spot. These days almost any photographic evidence can be debunked as cgi and the only people who really know for sure are the people who took the picture/s in the first place. Ie: the person who witnessed the event. If the photographic evidence is not accepted, what is left but eyewitness accounts?



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:26 PM
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reply to post by UnivoxSuperfuzz
 


How many average people carry a tripod with them at all times ?
You are completely missing the point of the thread .



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:27 PM
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reply to post by SavedOne
 


A good reason eyewitness accounts are valuable is because we can compare with other eyewitnesses and share our stories to figure out what we have seen.

For example if several long time ATS members posted on ATS telling us that they saw an UFO at around 7 am in the same city, all with similar descriptions and feeling about the UFO. Then that would be pretty good evidence in my opinion.

But if people keep ridiculing or trying to debunk people in a rude disrespecting way, then you might only see one of those 7 people logging in and sharing their story.

Basically sharing your eyewitness accounts is a great thing to do if you want to find out if anyone else has seen the same thing. In many cases the OP isn't even out to prove to people about what they've seen but they are more interested in seeing if anyone else saw what they saw, which is fine in my opinion.
edit on 5-12-2011 by _Phoenix_ because: (no reason given)




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