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Iran shoots down US drone – state TV

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posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 04:55 PM
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Originally posted by spy66
Population growth tells you a lot about a nations capabilities,


No, it doesn't. By that notion then, China is going to grow old before it grows rich. Their population is rapidly aging, and this will have a negative impact on their work force. The US is the only nation in the world (industrialized) that has a growing workforce. China is due to peak in human capitol by 2015, then a slow precipitous drop will occur.


intelligence and discipline. China is surpassing the western economy. That should tell you a lot about their intelligence, capabilities and discipline.


Chinas economy is far from impressive by western standards. Even President Hu Jintao has said that Chinas economy is unbalanced, unstable, and unsustainable. This is because 65% of Chinas GDP is based upon fixed investment. The "Ghost cities" that china is known for is where all Chinas economic "growth" comes from. And before you mention their "growing" middle class, note that Chinese consumption represents about 30% of GDP today...this is less than the year 2000. Chinas economy is a centrally planned disaster bubble economy. I hardly consider that surpassing western economies. The only nation in Americas way is America.

If you want to see where China is going, look no further than 1980's Japan. Smart? No, not really. As 15 of the worlds top 20 universities are located in the US. Anyways, following tried and failed policies is not smart, its stupid.


You dont want to live according to the Chinese because you are propped with western pro propaganda. Chine is probably being fed their propaganda as well. It show the political system works.


There are tens of thousands of protests (And growing) in china every year. If 7% growth is not maintained, China very possibly could see riots and chaos all over.


edit on 5-12-2011 by xlb40 because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 05:53 PM
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reply to post by xlb40
 


Sorry, but you are trying to predict China's future without having any ground to do so. I dont agree.

I am going to stay on topic so i wont answer more on this issue.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 06:02 PM
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Fly an unauthorized drone over a foreign countries air space and you should EXPECT it to be shot down...



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 06:07 PM
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reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
 


They shot it down, but it was essentially undamaged?

I bet there are a lot of people that wish the Iranians were telling the truth when they clam to have shot it down!



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 06:56 PM
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Originally posted by Gorman91
reply to post by NiNjABackflip
 


That's what I'm saying. This is like Roswell for them. If any technology is recovered, it's far more advanced than what they know.


How is this?

I never understood this argument, that countries who don't have top of the line military industries are somehow equipped with primitive technology. There is this thing called "generational warfare". Why would they be armed with weapons that can't protect them from actual threats?

Iran also has domestically-built stealth aircraft. Stealth technology in this day and age is not some big secret compared to like, 30 years ago. In fact, even the Nazis were developing radar-avoiding aircraft designs that look a lot like modern stealth aircraft. I fail to see how American technology is somehow on a whole different league considering the whole world is in the year 2011.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 07:19 PM
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reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
 



A tell-tale glimpse of China’s stealth technology

U.S. Intelligence officials aren’t exactly sure what to make of China’s new stealth fighter, now that the prototype is no longer just a rumor.

Not too long after photos of a mysterious aircraft surfaced on the internet, Defense Secretary Robert Gates said that Chinese president Hu Jintao openly acknowledged to him to that the Chinese military had just completed a 15-minute test flight of the J-20 fighter jet.


www.smartplanet.com...


edit on 5-12-2011 by cerebralassassins because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 08:22 PM
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Originally posted by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi

Originally posted by rubbertramp
source is rt news in this thread and presstv in the other.
man, somebody wake me up if it hits a more reliable source.


...You don't find Iranian state media reliable in reporting Iranian matters?...



Nooooooooo. Of course PRESS TV is not a trust-able source. Get your facts right about Iran. I happen to know everything about it, and you sound like a basiji to me.

Iran's language is not persian, it is farsi and for sure completely different than arabic. Persia is just a name that the greeks invented.

Regarding the drone: Nothing unusual about it what so ever, US always has drones flying over middle-east, and various countries have shot it down or hacked it down as in this case. No act of war at all. Iranian revolutionary guards have infiltrated US agencies to spy, would u call it an act of war? If so then you are alone on this. It's only a big deal because the MI6 last week predicted that Israel will attack iranian nuclear bases by the end of this year. The iranian answer was to close down the english embassy in Iran, which followed by No.10 to do the same.

Will Israel attack iran? Highly possible.
Will we have a WW3? For sure not.
Will China and Russia get involved? Absolutely not.
Will the regime in Iran collapse? I hope everyday.

A world without the isamic republic will be a peaceful one. Palestine and Israel would at last come to an accord, Afghanistan will at last be free from their bully neighbour (current afghanian regime, not taliban), Iraq will calm down and everyone would go about their own business. The single biggest problem of at least middle-east is in fact IRAN.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 08:32 PM
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reply to post by EngineerGuY
 


If you're willing to give the Russians, American technology for cash....I'm sorry, but that's dumb for a government to do. Russia has just as much interest in keeping Iran in the stone age as America does.

I wouldn't be surprised to find those explosions the results of Russian work.



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 08:35 PM
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reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
 


Dude you've got to look into it more. It seems easy to do, but it is flipping difficult. Why do you think it took 40 years to take what the Nazis did and actually make it efficient?

Countries protect themselves with primitive technology all the time. Just look at the Iraq War.

Iran is no different. They have hand-me-downs. Yes they have these things, but they are derivatives of 1970-1980 variants. Sure you can make them look modern, but that doesn't actually make them capable of the same things. The Russians had quite a number of just such equipment that looked the same as American cutting edge technology, and indeed had similar technology, but the performance was piss poor.

Having and knowing technology are too very different things.

xkcd.com...
edit on 5-12-2011 by Gorman91 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 09:32 PM
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Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by xlb40
 


Sorry, but you are trying to predict China's future without having any ground to do so. I dont agree.

I am going to stay on topic so i wont answer more on this issue.



Predict Chinas future? I dont have any ground to do so? LOL

Those who dont learn from history, are bound to repeat it. Mark my words, China is Japan all over again.

I know a bubble economy when I see one, and China has BUBBLE written all over it.
edit on 5-12-2011 by
edit on 5-12-2011 by xlb40 because: (no reason given)
extra DIV



posted on Dec, 5 2011 @ 09:37 PM
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reply to post by Dimitri Dzengalshlevi
 


Iran does not have stealth aircraft.

Additionally, this is like Roswell for them. This UCAV is incredibly advanced. So advanced, that it likely landed itself because it "knew" it had a malfunction and it wanted to "live". The UCAVs like this have highly advanced outer stealth coatings as well as advanced AI on board that makes it quite remarkable.

This is not your typical run of the mill UAV.
edit on 5-12-2011 by xlb40 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 6 2011 @ 03:00 AM
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Originally posted by StringTh
Iran's language is not persian, it is farsi and for sure completely different than arabic. Persia is just a name that the greeks invented.


The Iranian people are of Persian ethnicity, not Arabic. And Farsi is their language



Gorman91-
Dude you've got to look into it more. It seems easy to do, but it is flipping difficult. Why do you think it took 40 years to take what the Nazis did and actually make it efficient?


The thing about WWII was that it was a total, all or nothing war. In such a scenerio, military technology progresses at an insane rate.

The cold war simply wasn't combat intensive enough to inspire the same rate of combat technology- the focus was primarily on WMD proliferation and the MAD doctrine instead since that was what the Cold War was really all about (and proxy conflict too).

And who says the Nazi technology was inefficient? It was efficient for that military generation. Britain had radar stations, and the Nazis built a radar-penetrating bomber.


Countries protect themselves with primitive technology all the time. Just look at the Iraq War.


That is a whole other ballgame in itself. For one, the US was arming Iraq for fighting Iran, so Iraq ended up with the largest military force in the middle east by Desert Storm. They weren't exactly expecting to be scrapping with the US over Kuwait, but it happened.

And the 2003 Iraq War is yet another story. The Iraqi army didn't do much to rebuild during the last war, a lot of their air defenses were already bombed for several months in advance by US and UK aircraft, their best surface to surface missiles were dismantled because of US threats to invade if they didn't do it, etc etc... hell, the Iraqi airforce had orders to bury their planes instead of even deploying them.

The whole "countries are armed with primitive equipment" argument is usually carried on by people without much perception into the complexities of the actual tactical, strategic and political situation. From what I have seen, the argument is usually used as some prideful remark to describe a country who couldn't stand up to another nation's military. The fact of the matter is that the quality of weapons mean little in terms of the factors of victory in such an imperialist invasion- the main goal is to disorient the population into such a chaotic state as to allow you to take over their assets while they are preoccupied with internal matters.


Having and knowing technology are too very different things.


Honestly, I have little sympathy for people who think that technology wins wars. By your type of logic, the US would be victorious if they used nothing but drones armed with chemical lasers to blow up Iran from the ground. In reality, what is the point of war if it is not fought human against human, and even more to the point, face to face? A lot more would get solved faster if we still fought with swords or fists, not with bombs or stealth fighters.



posted on Dec, 6 2011 @ 03:11 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


I did see that Iran was showing off thier UAVs in a article looking for it now. Yah they do I read it couple times in a week.

www.dailytech.com...
edit on 6-12-2011 by chapterhouse because: this was 1st article I saw when researching Gates history.



posted on Dec, 6 2011 @ 05:42 AM
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Originally posted by xlb40

Originally posted by spy66
reply to post by xlb40
 


Sorry, but you are trying to predict China's future without having any ground to do so. I dont agree.

I am going to stay on topic so i wont answer more on this issue.



Predict Chinas future? I dont have any ground to do so? LOL

Those who dont learn from history, are bound to repeat it. Mark my words, China is Japan all over again.

I know a bubble economy when I see one, and China has BUBBLE written all over it.
edit on 5-12-2011 by
edit on 5-12-2011 by xlb40 because: (no reason given)


I dont see it that way at all. China is probably the only nation who have learned from prior mistakes and western mistakes. And they surly understand their own ball game a lot better than you do.

You are allowed to have your opinion, but i dont have to share it. So live with it. extra DIV



posted on Dec, 6 2011 @ 10:54 AM
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reply to post by chapterhouse
 


This

3.bp.blogspot.com...

Is not This.

outofcentralasianow.files.wordpress.com... ded-bombs.jpg


Though it very well could have stolen knowledge from the later.



All the same, it's clear that their drones are about 15-10 years behind our drones, and this gap is getting larger.



posted on Dec, 6 2011 @ 12:04 PM
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Originally posted by spy66

I dont see it that way at all. China is probably the only nation who have learned from prior mistakes and western mistakes. And they surly understand their own ball game a lot better than you do.

You are allowed to have your opinion, but i dont have to share it. So live with it.


You pit too much belief in the Chinese government. So, China doing what Japan did, South Korea, Dubai, etc. but on a grander scale, is China "learning" from prior mistakes? LOL You clearly do not understand basic economics.

Debate these facts. As of 2009 (the latest numbers available) 65% of Chinas GDP was based on fixed investment (this was before their massive stimulus was enacted.) 33% of Chinas economy was based upon internal consumption (this is less than it was in the year 2000).

Chinas President himself has said that Chinas economy is unstable, unbalanced and unsustainable. Are you calling the premier leader of China a liar as well? China has become overly reliant on fixed investment to achieve growth. Thus chinas economic growth is unsustainable. This is something that the Chinese premier has acknowledged. Additionally, because of all this fixed investment, china suffers from a massive amount of overcapacity. Just google "Chinas Ghost Cities" to see where this is going. +90% of these cities are uninhabited. There are 66 million vacant apartment complexes in China today. The problem is, prices are too high for average chinese consumers...the prices in China are suprisingly similar to what we would find in the US. Yet the typical chinese makes roughly $2,000 per year. Inflation is a HUGE problem in China today. Wages cant keep up, and we see that the typical chinese spends most of their income on food, rather than other household consumer items. Its another big reason why we have seen chinese consumerism go down over the past 10 years. It also explains why China faces a massive non performing loan problem.

With exports flat lining in both the EU and US (Chinas two largest trading partners) it looks like China is going to have to boost stimulus in fixed investment to cover the economic losses in exports. The problem is, the first round of stimulus didnt work. It just created a massive amount of debt that china does a very good job of hiding. Chinas debt is par with portugals...they're actually in worse shape, debt wise, than the US. They just do a much better job at hiding it.

China could make the coming correction less painful IF China starts rebalancing their economy more towards consumerism. However, this doesnt look like it is being considered in China. Why? Because it would make the Yuan appreciate too fast for the CCPs comfort (knocking of the export advantage china has) It would also mean that the chinese government would have to act more democratically. Neither one is happening in China, suggesting a hard landing is around the corner in china.

Everything I said can be validated by a quick google search on your part. If your feeling lazy, just look up my previous posts on this subject, all the sources are there.
edit on 6-12-2011 by xlb40 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 01:53 AM
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reply to post by rubbertramp
 


And what is a reliable news source to you, FOX? CNN? Don't be so glib. It's pretty much common knowledge that all mainstream media are controlled by the same shadowy powers that control governments and corporations.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 01:58 AM
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reply to post by Gorman91
 


Are you for real? Iran is not stuck in the stone age. Iran is a modern and extremely proud country. Make no mistake, Iran is not Iraq. Iran is more than capable of defending themselves if the need arises. I suggest you educate yourself and do some research before writing comments that make you look like an ignorant fool.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 02:23 AM
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If Iran does indeed have the asset, and it is mostly intact, it will be the SECOND time in a years time we have lost black project assets to another Country... (OBL stealth refit rear section) and now, if intact, full computer codes, the encryption types, bandwidth signals it uses... its avionics... massive blow to our NS.

Pakistan shared the OBL raid helo with China.
Iran will share this LM RQ-170 with Russia and China...

It will be of more use to those other Countries mainly due to Iran's sanctions... China will replicate it very quickly.



posted on Dec, 7 2011 @ 02:46 AM
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reply to post by 1RedBuddha
 


I did. Iran has no real military strength in the face of other nations, their economy would be in shambles at the slightest hand, apparently they have to import Oil like everyone else, and it's taken the over 30 years to progress technological in nuclear power to a level that it took us a brief few years to get to.


All data says that the only reason that Iran still exists as a nation is by the say of superpowers that look upon them and see them as either a money scheme or a scapegoat.

Think About it. The US scares Iran, Iran buys stuff from Russia, Russia makes money and thanks the US for it's job. It's military industrial complex at its finest. Profiteering for a war that will never happen.

Iran is simply an experiment in how far you can abuse a country before it collapses. The only thing impressive about Iran, besides its rich culture and history, is that it hasn't collapsed in the face of certain destruction.



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