No love or desire in Eden without the knowledge of good and evil.

No love or desire in Eden without the knowledge of good and evil.

being.publicradio.org...

Love that is returned is true and good love.
Love, like faith, if not expressed in works and deeds, is dead.

Love that is not returned we do not call evil but it is certainly not as good as love that is returned and shared. Let me call it evil then as compared to good. It misses the mark.

Love then is subject to the qualifiers of good and evil and without any knowledge of good and evil, love cannot exist.

An example of this lack of emotion is shown in this clip.

www.bing.com...#

I see life without the knowledge of good and evil, a moral sense in other words, as mankind just being like any other animal on this earth.

Is it possible that the myth of Eden was initially invented to indicate the birth of mankind’s emotional awakening to love, hate, and all of our other emotions?

God is spirit.
Is it possible that without eating of the tree of knowledge, developing a moral sense and the emotions that drive it, becoming spiritual the way God is, as confirmed by God himself who said that mankind had become as Gods, A & E would have just remained as blissfully dumb as other animals?

Did they and we have to eat of it to become fully human?

Would any of us be silly enough to NOT have done exactly what A & E did and reject this great accomplishment and gift for mankind?

Would you reject the ability to love?

Regards
DL

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I think of all that as allegory to be faithful to the official religion of those who live on the hill.

I don't think there was literally anything like Eden and that it is a literary device to explain where the gods lived while they were creating the earth.

Originally posted by Greatest I am
No love or desire in Eden without the knowledge of good and evil.

being.publicradio.org...

Love that is returned is true and good love.
Love, like faith, if not expressed in works and deeds, is dead.

Love that is not returned we do not call evil but it is certainly not as good as love that is returned and shared. Let me call it evil then as compared to good. It misses the mark.

Love then is subject to the qualifiers of good and evil and without any knowledge of good and evil, love cannot exist.

An example of this lack of emotion is shown in this clip.

www.bing.com...#

I see life without the knowledge of good and evil, a moral sense in other words, as mankind just being like any other animal on this earth.

Is it possible that the myth of Eden was initially invented to indicate the birth of mankind’s emotional awakening to love, hate, and all of our other emotions?

God is spirit.
Is it possible that without eating of the tree of knowledge, developing a moral sense and the emotions that drive it, becoming spiritual the way God is, as confirmed by God himself who said that mankind had become as Gods, A & E would have just remained as blissfully dumb as other animals?

Did they and we have to eat of it to become fully human?

Would any of us be silly enough to NOT have done exactly what A & E did and reject this great accomplishment and gift for mankind?

Would you reject the ability to love?

Regards
DL

Prove it. Were you there? No. So how do you know? You don't. Youre presenting your theory as if it is fact. It is not.

Obviously there was love. The Adama walked with God in the cool of the day before he fell and he was God's companion and friend. Friendship is born from love, as is the pain of loss and sorrow as you are cast away from the one whose friend you once were after you betrayed them.

You have a pretty shallow view of love. Thread rejected.

This is how I see it. So much of the Bible was meant to be taken metaphorically, yet this book, Genesis, is, for some reason, always taken as literal. As a literal story it makes very little sense, but metaphorically, it begins to make sense, at least to me.

In the beginning there was nothing, is how it begins. What is nothing? A lack of consciousness(thought)? Absolutely incomprehensible nothing? As I see it, the nothing refers to our world, not Gods, and it means that there was no comprehension of this reality. It did not exist because the imagination of God had yet to create it. As in example, If I said there are blue oranges, you may believe it or not, but without the thought, they may never have existed as a possibility within your mind. Prior to this point we were pure non thinking, non logical, animal.

And God said, "Let there be light" and there was light. I see this as a thought, an idea. The creation of an alternate existence to that of God within his own mind or consciousness. The rest of the creation story was an expansion of this thought, by way of imagination and the story began. This "reality" was wholly within the imagination of God within the higher frequencies of thought. This is a sudden awareness of existence, ie. we became aware of ourselves and the things around us or the bi-cameral mind. The bi-cameral mind is a blend of logical thought and animal instincts guiding our actions. The animal instincts acting like an internal voice telling us to react or the voice of God. Gods laws being the laws of nature and balance.

To paraphrase, And then God created Man and Woman. I paraphrase to avoid going into the stories of Lilith(the first woman ie. the shift from male dominated sexual desire) and all that leads up to the story of Adam and Eve. I see this as the first duality, the first separation of the whole or the one. It is the separation of the imaginative mind and the logical mind and as the story continues into the eating from the "Tree of Life".

This story is a representation of Eves first logical decision to release the bi-cameral mind and enter strictly into logical consciousness or total logical control over the logical and reactive minds thus casting humanity from the voice of God or natural instincts. This "disease" became known as Eves-ill or evil. This evolution led us to the comprehension of time, aging and death(the shift in consciousness into the 4th dimension). Death then became revered as a return to the state of One or the Whole ie God. With this logical thought came judgement(emotion), both of self and others, which created the concept of right and wrong. These ideas, created by emotion(our last connection to the bi-cameral mind), began to be seen as a good and evil concept. This ideal caused two things, the destruction of the bi-cameral mind(the casting from Edin), thus the separation from God, and the development of law, which sparked the beginnings of civilization.

Adam and Eve represent the forerunners of logical thought, the first "Humans" of the race of homo-sapiens. By looking at it this way you begin to see the possibility of other "people" that were taught by Adam and Eve to become "Human". People throughout history were born with varying degrees of connection to the bi-cameral mind and the natural desire to return to the whole. This variable created the desire/belief in the gods/goddesses/God and sparked a need to gain favor with them/her/him and religious ritual or practices were born.

This is how I see the origins of thought and religion. Does this dismiss the realness or truth of gods/goddesses/God? No. Personally I believe that a balance of Imagination(Father), Logic(Mother/Son), and Emotion(Child/Spirit) is the true goal of the "Human" in their Next Evolution of the Human Mind.

continued next post-

I understand you and most others look at the concept with modern eyes, but to truly understand its concept one should return to its roots. In order to achieve this, one must return to the beliefs and practices of ancient Egypt, more specifically the 18th dynasty and the Amun Priesthood. In doing so, a better understanding of the current prayer worship and its connection to the Sun comes to light(no pun intended).

First a little history before I get into what the breakdown actually was:




Amen, meaning “hidden”, was the main deity of the city of Thebes(Karnak and Luxor) from Pre-Dynastic Egypt and was seen as the creation Deity by the priests of Hemopolis. He was depicted as ram-headed, more specifically a woolly ram with curved horns. When the Thebians established their sovereignty in Egypt during the Middle Kingdom, Amen became a dominant deity and by the 8th Dynasty he had became the king of the gods. His name was spelled, at this time, in different ways, for example Amen, Amon, Amun, Ammon, Amoun and Imen. By the the 11th Dynasty his name was settled on the spelling of Amun and in the 18th dynasty he had been merged with Ra, thus, Amun-Ra, making him half man and half ram. Later he was associated with Horus and was shown as half man and half Hawk which he is better known today, but I digress.

The priests of Amun-Ra, known as the Amun Priesthood began to gain strength and power and in the early 18th dynasty of Egypt and had amassed great wealth by charging for the use of its oracle from both the Pharaoh and the people. This wealth included land, other than the Temple areas. The belief of Amun-Ra included the aspects of the Sun but also the aspects of the Moon god, Sin, and the underworld which was guarded by the 7 children of the god Anu (aka 7 fates, aka the 7 Judges of Hell, represented in the Bible as the 7 deadly SINs) known as the Annunaki(Ananki in Greek).



I would like to pause here and throw in My personal thoughts on the Annunaki. It is said that the Annunaki were/are a reptilian race of humanoids that ruled/rule over man that lived/live underground. So lets put this into perceptive as I see it. The Annunaki were also known as Titans or giants. So, IF they found the bones of dinosaurs like say a t-rex(underground, dead, ie: the underworld) or the stories of dinosaurs were handed down, then add a basic understanding of evolution ie: they came before us, or dinosaurs and man co existed, I think we can assume the mythology of the Annunaki originated here.



So, here we have the duality of the Light and Dark/Sun and Moon/Day and Night/Above and Below/Good and Evil/Life and Death/Amen and Sin. Yes they are dualities, but in reality simply a cycle of progression or the balance of nature. Today we still see this influence within the major Religions, as prayer is ended in homage to Amen and Sin being his opposite. This concept of the duality is actually a balance of natures cycles shown in the Eastern teachings of the Yin and Yang. The Yin or night is never completely dark as the Moon(Sin) illuminates and the Yang or day is never completely light as the shadows darken. It was the split of this cycle that has shifted us from the balance.

Here is a fun little way of showing all things are balance. Please gather a piece of paper(standard computer size). Then fold along the black dotted lines and tear along the red dotted lines in the order shown below.



Then unfold the pieces and place in the order below.



The paper began as neutral, balance, both positive and negative in potential. By folding and or tearing the balance is a perception of positive and negative, and by arranging them the balance, neutral is returned.

By returning to the origin and putting the cycle back together you have a flow of balance or neutrality. God is Loving AND Spiteful/Light and Dark/Sun and Moon/Good and Evil/Amen and Sin as seen throughout the Bible. The eyes of a child only see wonder and amazement with neutral understanding UNTIL told otherwise by the adult.

The knowledge of the dualities has given the idea of judgement and thus emotion, but in true neutrality, one can love unconditionally without the knowledge of a difference.

reply to post by Agarta

(Ananki in Greek)

You should post something about that on my thread about Anankē.
www.abovetopsecret.com...

Originally posted by jmdewey60
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I think of all that as allegory to be faithful to the official religion of those who live on the hill.

I don't think there was literally anything like Eden and that it is a literary device to explain where the gods lived while they were creating the earth.

edit on 2-12-2011 by jmdewey60 because: (no reason given)

Not to the Jews who wrote it.

They just thought it a good myth to show the rite of passage from childhood to adulthood.
An elevation and not the fall that Christians called it when they usurped the Jewish scriptures.

Regards
DL

reply to post by Greatest I am

Not to the Jews who wrote it.

They just thought it a good myth to show the rite of passage from childhood to adulthood.
An elevation and not the fall that Christians called it when they usurped the Jewish scriptures.

Regards
DL

Who wrote it were the people calling themselves "the remnant", who were the people who returned from the Babylonian exile of the aristocracy (including the higher echelons of priests). They came back to reclaim the land as its rightful owners, where they are YHWH and the people who were not deported to Babylon but had stayed on the land, were the Adam and Eve characters. The high priesthood created the metaphorical garden, which was the kingdom of Israel, and the people (Adam and Eve) were the Israelites who would not have been Israelites if not for the work of the priests, and would have been the common folk, or the dust of the earth. So they were god, in other words. They made everything nice and then they went away and came back to find how the people have ruined everything they made. Then the people are supposed to be ashamed and feel guilty and know they are even worse, that they are now Cain, and need to bow down to the superiority of the sons of Seth, who know the name of God. Plus they (the returning priest and ruler class) could claim they were in fact Able, the righteous who were spirit filled and did what was pleasing to God, and was unjustly stuck down on account of the evil of Cain, the people who now must submit to the authority of their betters.
The idea being, that these people saw themselves as martyrs who paid for the sins of the people, though they themselves were without sin. They bore the punishment due others, and now it was time to make amends.

Originally posted by lonewolf19792000

Prove it. Were you there? No. So how do you know? You don't. Youre presenting your theory as if it is fact. It is not.

Obviously there was love. The Adama walked with God in the cool of the day before he fell and he was God's companion and friend. Friendship is born from love, as is the pain of loss and sorrow as you are cast away from the one whose friend you once were after you betrayed them.

You have a pretty shallow view of love. Thread rejected.

Prove anything in scripture is real.
You cannot.

As to my premise, if you think that love can be recognized as good without any knowledge of good then by all the self-decptives moves you can make, believe your B S.

Regards
DL