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The big thread about being gay.

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posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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Greetings,

In a small attempt to convince you I am not trolling, I will try to be as clear and concise as possible concerning my points, goals and intention with this thread. I have no wish for there to be any hateful or disrespectful posts from one side or the other, ATS is a place for everyone to share there ideas in a constructive, informative and hopefully enlightening way with one another and I hope this happens within this thread.

Firstly, let me start by stating my position as it would seem that some here see me as "hating" gay people, some see me as being a "religious zealot" and some people just think I am homophobic. I am in point of fact, none of those things. I don't hate anyone, if I did, I can promise you that gay people would be last on my list. I am religious but I don't claim to know who or what God is, just that he exists and I don't think that "he" hates gay people either. I am definitely not homophobic, I have a very good friend of 12 years who is very much openly gay and we get drunk together and hang out all the time, one of many as I am in the restaurant industry.

Now, to the meat of the thread, I think there are three main points I want to get across here, they are simple points but seemingly incredibly difficult for anyone to agree upon and I think the reason why is because there are so many factors that are involved, those being, morality, religion and point of view. Those three factors combined can make for very compelling feelings either for or against any topic being discussed. Lets get too it.

1.) Gay marriage - Should it be allowed or should it not be allowed?

1.) My answer: At first I thought that it slapped organized religion in the face just to do it. Upon further contemplation I realized that we are all slaves of the state and on an every increasing basis, terms do not matter, it is without question another means of government control and more revenue into the machine. Furthermore, I see no reason at all why people should not be able to be married or to have unions with each other if they wish too. Adults in my country, America should be able to decide this for themselves and there choice should be exactly that without infringement. That is what any free society should afford and with that said, I will retract my previous arguments about gay marriage and happily say I was wrong.

2.) Gay rights - Is that even a real thing?

2.) My answer: Gay rights are not legitimate. Gay people have existed since the dawn of man and are in the class of "sub culture". Being gay is and will always be a sexual preference and that said there is no such thing as separate rights per say. There is the argument about gay marriage being a gay right but that is a misconception. A right by rule of natural law would assume that it is your right as a human being and not derived from the state. Marriage is nothing but a license granted by the state not a civil right. Gays should have the same human and civil rights as any other American, there is no clause for sexual preference. There are no gay rights, there are just........ Rights as afforded to us by our Constitution.

3.) Gay adoption - Seriously?

3.) My answer: The world in it's present state is chaotic at best and while I will fully state that I believe that two people of the same sex can raise a child, love them and be "good" parents, I honestly don't feel like that is healthy for the child, either in the early or the latter years. The cold, hard fact of the matter is, the coupling of two people of the same sex is not natural and children should not be subjected too it, that is why men can not have children with men and women can not conceive with a women. A little thing called "propagation of the species" defines this point of view. We can't very well let our children be pre disposed to a lifestyle while they are impressionable that is not "normal" and by normal I mean it in the sense of propagation of the species, that is not the way and is not in the best interests of our children.

Lets look at a couple facts, take from this what you will and even if you need to be plugged into the new age idea of love, acceptance and we are all one, or... whatever, here are some cold hard numbers that say your just plain wrong.



The average ratio from several studies are that 9.56% of men are homosexual and 4.75% of women are homosexual.

SOURCE

Does that seem like a large percentage of the population too you? I can tell you that it is the vocal majority but that percentage of people do not a new gay revolution make. The numbers can be plus or minus %5 percent and those people have nothing to be ashamed of or be sorry for, I applaud difference in the population, I would just argue that they stopped acting like it's totally normal or 50/50, it is not.

What happens when you apply this stat, what you must understand about this is that it is very subjective but the science behind it is very sound, thus you must take into account the above polls of "occasional" homosexual activity.



The results of these two studies suggested that in any given year up to 30% of Americans complain of mental health disorder symptoms, and that up to 50% of Americans would experience mental health symptoms at some point in their lives.

SOURCE

Be gay, be gay all you want, enter into contracts with your rogue government to achieve "marriage". Hold hands, kiss in public, spread your all is love and love is all message and be happy! The one thing I ask is that you keep our kids out of it, they don't belong too you and they never will.

edit on 1-12-2011 by Helious because: (no reason given)


 

MOD NOTE, PLEASE READ THIS BEFORE POSTING: Hot Issues, Cool Heads (click here)


edit on 12/2/2011 by Majic because: link to moderator note on thread.




posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:01 PM
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Be gay, be gay all you want, enter into contracts with your rogue government to achieve "marriage". Hold hands, kiss in public, spread your all is love and love is all message and be happy! The one thing I ask is that you keep our kids out of it, they don't belong too you and they never will.
reply to post by Helious
 


...or, for my sake, don't.
(kiss in public I mean...I can do without all of that)


+1 more 
posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:04 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


The fictional character Homer Simpson said it best "If gays want marry let them be miserable like the rest of us"



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:05 PM
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reply to post by lambs to lions
 


I personally don't find it offensive to see men kissing men or women kissing women, but in truth, I would rather see a girl kissing another girl lol. I don't care to be honest, that doesn't bother me in the least.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:05 PM
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Who cares if someone is gay?

Their sexual orientation doesn't affect me unless they make advances on me at which point I tell them to stop their behavior because I'm not gay.

Other than that though who cares. What is that saying that some gay people say? They have the right to be miserable too?



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:09 PM
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Originally posted by Timing
Who cares if someone is gay?

Their sexual orientation doesn't affect me unless they make advances on me at which point I tell them to stop their behavior because I'm not gay.

Other than that though who cares. What is that saying that some gay people say? They have the right to be miserable too?


Thats the problem exactly. I never cared before. I believe a persons sexual preference is their own choice. Involving a child though changes that dynamic and I don't agree with it.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:10 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


I can respect that, completely. To each is own. Personally, it makes my stomach turn.


+25 more 
posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:12 PM
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Hateful homophobic gibberish. The majority of ATS will see your tired rant as such. They would be correct in doing so. Please evolve.

The only "big" thing about this thread is your bigotry to those who are different to you. Sad veiled rants like these come and go on ATS on a fortnightly basis. By majority they fail time and time again. The squashing of these hateful threads is exponential as more and more members catch on. Mind your own God damned business and stop treating others as second rate citizens because they're not identical to you. It's pathetic.
edit on 1/12/2011 by rexusdiablos because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:14 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


Agreed. We are meant to be heterosexual, IMO. Also, I believe it takes a balance between mother and father to provide our children the best parenting possible. It is our responsiblity as parents to equip our children with the tools needed to succeed. To me, that means a stable mother/father dynamic. Homosexual couples raising a child? Geez, what a circus for that kid to have to deal with.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:15 PM
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what the heck? are you saying that the presence of gay parents causes depression in our country? i can't see any evidence of your claims other than you don't agree with homosexuals rearing children.

this seems like a drawn-out attempt to veil some homophobia. just sayin.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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I used to think along your lines in regards to homosexuals raising a child, mainly because the child is the one who has no 'choice' in this. I realized later that my attitude was rooted in 'tolerating' homosexuality, rather than validating it as just and real. Today, after having many relationships with homosexuals, I can say I accept it, not just tolerate it, but completely opened to it. I am not gay, but I am also not not gay. I believe that adults often have kids to actualize themselves, not for the sake of giving love to a child in need, I am not saying all parents do this, or homosexuals are perfect, but if this were not the case I believe many more children would be adopted. So yeah, I think there if one has the ability to provide love and shelter, they should be able to share that for the sake of the child, not for their own fulfillment.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 



Being gay is and will always be a sexual preference

You obviously don't know any gay people because all those I know say they would never in a million years choose to be gay. It's not an easy life - especially when you are born into a family or community that has trouble with the concept.

And as far as children go - I guess you missed this thread:

www.abovetopsecret.com...

Now, let me see if I can find some examples of heterosexual families with messed up children - oh, never mind - just read your local newspapers.

edit on 2-12-2011 by Maluhia because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:17 PM
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Originally posted by lambs to lions
reply to post by Helious
 


I can respect that, completely. To each is own. Personally, it makes my stomach turn.


Personally, the ramifications of homophobia (or any other fear-based hate) makes my stomach turn.

You should read Freud. He has a commentary to offer on your emotional response when witnessing homosexuals physically embrace. A straight person without sexually suppressed desires would simply look at the embrace and think "Fair enough but it's not for me". You're reaction on the other hand, is something else entirely, according to Freud that is. Just saying.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:17 PM
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reply to post by rexusdiablos
 





Hateful homophobic gibberish. The majority of ATS will see your tired rant as such. They would be correct in doing so. Please evolve.


Please evolve. I'm sorry, I didn't realize we had 'evolved' biologically to have sex with like genders. Square peg, round hole...brilliant. That sure sounds like an advanced species to me. How could I have been so ignorant?


+11 more 
posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:19 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


Be gay, be gay all you want, enter into contracts with your rogue government to achieve "marriage". Hold hands, kiss in public, spread your all is love and love is all message and be happy! The one thing I ask is that you keep our kids out of it, they don't belong too you and they never will.





You're so full of double standards that one might come to the conclusion that you have a chemical imbalance, but that's it...so continue to sleep well.





posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:21 PM
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reply to post by Maluhia
 





You obviously don't know any gay people because all those I know say they would never in a million years choose to be gay. It's not an easy life - especially when you are born into a family or community that has trouble with the concept.


You are absolutely right. It is more than a sexual preference...its a mental disorder. We don't just go with it when talking about other disorders such as manic depression, or social anxiety disorder. There is something wrong with homosexuals. I know, I know...I'm an ignorant hateful bigot. Actually, not the case. I don't hate anyone, but I'm comfortable enough with myself to be honest with myself also, and I believe it is a major malfunction.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:21 PM
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reply to post by Helious
 


Could you imagine if a person ended up getting a divorce because of the realization of that person being gay? Or even worse having two young children going through not only one parents sexual preference change, but also a divorce?



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:22 PM
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reply to post by lambs to lions
 

My mother was not like every other mother, nor was my father like every other. At a deeper level, and yes this is offtopic in its 'perspective' each human is a combination of male and female attributes (or energies if you will). A child needs a balance of these attributes, of these energies, the gender really doesnt matter.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:23 PM
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reply to post by facelift
 


Pretty sure your reply has nothing to do with the OP. His opinion concerns gay people attempting to raise a child, and how he disagrees with it.



posted on Dec, 1 2011 @ 11:25 PM
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Problem is, they segregate themselves, they want to feel special for being gay, warm in the inside or something. I dont go around bragging about my heterosexuality (sp?) nor do I ask for "special" privileges, see adoptions and such.

Gay marriage: why do you have to meddle in whatever other people does?

Gay rights: why do they have to be special as to have "gay rights"?

Gay adoption: Now dont get me wrong, but my childhood in a heterosexual family, with divorce and all...
I may have preferred a couple of people caring for me that actually loved each other, and then did not run away for 20 years, as opposite to my actual family...

Now, dont get me wrong, I have worked with people who was openly gay and never had a single issue, oddly enough some of the best chefs I know are gay. On the other hand, all those "GAY RIGHTS" people should get a grip and start acting as part of the society, not as some special kind of people.





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