Watch A Bunch Of Dogs Experience Sunlight And Grass For The First Time

Originally posted by DeepThoughtCriminal
reply to post by Gridrebel

 

You people truly infuriate me. I said I am opposed to animal testing for cosmetic purposes. Yet I understand its important for science and medicine. And yeah they animals should be given better conditions. And I am being attacked for this, and no-one has valid argument? All I said was that scientific testing is actually necessary, unpleasant though it may be. Please learn to read before replying.

But I suppose this is ATS. I hope for a good discussion, get nothing but asininity. Must be a difference of culture.

I wish I could give you a million stars

I love animals (I used to have a Beagle actually) but I have absolutely no problem with animals being used for ESSENTIAL medical testing, and only if they're treated as humanely as possible during that process.

I do NOT need educating, thanks. I had the displeasure of hanging around a bunch of hardcore animal rights people (my wife and I tried to help them out with some promotional work due to a family member being involved) and in the end we told them to take a hike. I have never met such a bunch of narrow-minded, self-righteous idiots in my whole life. They seemed to think that anybody who didn't share their beliefs was just ignorant and needed educating, and would then jump on board and become one of them. They couldn't accept that people (not ALL people obviously...) might actually be aware of the issues and (gasp!) have their own beliefs and opinions on the subject. No, anybody who wasn't outraged was clearly in the dark on what goes on in the world, and needed showing by having brochures (featuring monkeys with test equipment sticking out of their head and LOTS of pretty graphs showing how useless animal testing was) waved around in front of them

Yes, there's a lot of cruel and unnecessary testing that goes on and it should be stopped. But, as far as I'm concerned, a million monkeys or beagles can be tested on - and die - if it only increases the chances of finding a cure for cancer, AIDS, etc, by a fraction of 1%. Sorry, I'm a rational and realistic human being....I've weighted the pros and cons.....the moral ifs and buts......and that's my belief.

If you don't like it then fine. I assume that if you (or a loved one) ever gets some awful disease you will boycott any treatments that may have been developed using animal testing?

reply to post by popsmayhem

The cages are NOT laboratory cages. Those are travel cages you can buy at a local pet store, sticker included. Thus why you don't see dirty feces covered cages.

Also, know the cages have metal on the bottom, these travel cages do not originally contain the metal on the bottom. Perhaps they were placed there because the dog is only familiar with living in wire cage bottoms


They are underweight, note the visible ribs.
They are having trouble walking.
They HAVE walked before presumably in cages and penned areas(see video), to experimentation tables, etc.
Forelegs are shaved(in this case) for ease of IV catheter and blood draw.
Scars
Drool or urine present in clean cages are from travel nervousness.
Curious(typical of the breed) but scared.

This video shows similar cages and area that the dogs lived in:

Originally posted by BohemianBrim
reply to post by Amanda5

 

technology allows us to share, but why not share something real?
everything about this video feels staged for the cameras.
what is the point of faking this moment when it could have been done genuinely?

to me it feels like things like this only allow people to sit back and feel satisfied about the good being done in the world without having to participate themselves.

I had never heard of a puppy mill until I saw a television report on one a little over a decade ago. Does showing it on television make it fake? Yet another person watches the video without getting the message.

/TOA

Originally posted by OneEleven

I'd like to know which laboratory, and in turn which corporations such a laboratory would have contracts with...

The Lab in spain where these ones where released well there is not much info ... as of yet.

One of the main & biggest testing companies is "Huntingdon Life Sciences" with huge installations in The UK & USA.
These lot test anything & I mean anything, paint, petrochemicals, Splenda was tested there, The list is to long ....
I won't post vids about these scum as they are very very upsetting and would just makle people violently angry, they have been caught out nearly every year by undercover workers beating, not using pain relief etc, please click on my signature regarding contracts etc ...

Originally posted by L00kingGlass
I think we should be developing technology to move beyond these primitive methods.

They are & have, Check out "The Dr Hadwen Trust"

reply to post by DeepThoughtCriminal


It's so easy to justify the use of animals to advance our medical knowledge, but is this just because they can't volunteer, object, or digest the basic understanding of what it is they are going through? One can say that since they don't know anything else, their misery isn't necessarily misery, because they have no joy to which they can compare it, but does this make it right? Would you raise a child in a basement, with no sunlight or interaction with the outside world, justifying that since they don't know there is anything else in existence, their ignorance of a possible giddy, beautiful childhood isn't really suffering? This delves into philosophy, more than anything, but so long as the question is raised, and pondered, I'm fine with that.

The whole idea of "sacrificing" animals to help us study and understand medicine seems so Machiavellian to me - doesn't matter who I hurt, kill, or destroy on the way up, so long as I get my meds in the end....

I used to volunteer for small studies in college for money, and the studies were TOUGH to get into, due to the overwhelming interest in participation. I say, you want the benefits for your medical and pharmaceutical care, you do the work and sacrifice your time and body. You have the ability to make the decision, and we have a responsibility to take care of the furry ones that have no choice, and can easily be taken advantage of by people who will ultimately decide their future and lifestyle.

Sorry for the long post - just think about it.
(steps off soapbox)

I teared up, these beagles are too sweet.

I normally find dogs extremely irritating but I would adopt any of these little guys in a heartbeat.

Originally posted by soaringhawk
reply to post by lupodigubbio

 

You need to reevaluate your feeling on freedom. I tell you this, if you don't believe in a Creator which has given man certain inalienable rights just for being here, you really can't say what is right or wrong. There is no ultimate accountability and your whole world revolves around situational ethics. It's not up to me to prove that God exist. Don't take anything I say or anything anyone says and go with it. Go research for yourself. Go do some serious searching.

Hilarious, a person who has a "Lord" owning their soul suggests I should reevaluate my feelings on freedom, of all things. As believer you probably think like most Jews and Christians that there are "chosen" races and God has "favorites" .You base your superiority on God's words in Genesis. You believe that man alone is created in God's image, and man alone is given dominion over all the animals on earth. Basically, you treat animals the way God treats humans, except you, the favorites, who enjoy his full blessing to rape the earth, of course.

Do you know what Speciesism is?

"Speciesism is practiced by the scientists of today who lock up chimpanzees in research centers, sometimes under horrendous conditions, to be used in experimentation. These same scientists, however, would never consider doing that to any human being, even one whose intelligence level was below that of the chimpanzee. The only reason for this difference is that the chimpanzee is not human, no matter how smart it is; but a human, no matter how unintelligent, is still a human. The concept of speciesism is considered by Singer to be as indefensible as racism (Defense p6).

"Speciesism - the word is not an attractive one, but I can think of no better term - is a prejudice or attitude of bias in favor of the interests of members of one's own species and against those of members of other species" (Liberation p6). Singer bases part of his argument on the utilitarian philosophy of Jeremy Bentham, who stated, "The question is not `Can they reason?' nor `Can they talk?' but `Can they suffer?'" All animals feel anger and fear, pleasure and pain, just like humans, and their equality comes from their ability to feel pain (New York Jan.15 p30). The animal liberation movement, however, does not say all beings are of equal worth, or that the interests of all animals and humans should be given equal weight. It is stating that "where animals and humans have similar interests - we might take the interest in avoiding physical pain as an example, for it is an interest that humans clearly share with other animals - those interests are to be counted equally, with no automatic discount just because one of the beings is not human" (Defense p9).

And I do believe in a creator or great spirit, just not one that is literal, tangible and has human flaws.

reply to post by DeepThoughtCriminal


A dogs physiology and a humans physiology are very very different, actually very little other than toxicity studies on organs removed from canine cadavers are anything like applicable.
Even those can only be regarded in general and broad terms, the heart and lungs and eyes are fairly similar but everything else is very different.
Poisoning them with chemicals then euthanising them, removing tissues and organs to see how badly they are affected, shows only how badly they affect dogs, everything else is still guesswork.
I pray you do not get re-incarnated into the body of a lab animal, absolutely nothing should be put through that, killing anything to save your own life is wrong.
Killing something after torturing it with prolonged exposures to pain and suffering is probably a blessing for the animal, and something that should not be happening, at all, to any animal.

reply to post by Burgo1010


I remember protesting there back around 98-99, we tore the fence down on one occassion.
Despicable that companies make money on the misery of so many animals, scumbags.

that was just uuuubbbbeer gay, im sure the dogs prefered being in the lab tested on cause thats what they are made for to be our little test subjects cause we humans are the best woop woop, we are so superiour in many ways that we should do this to all kinds of animals even dulphins and shurks.

reply to post by The Old American


We have a company here in Mattawan Mich that does drug experimentation on these animals for Big Pharma and it's a shame, there is nothing more loving or devoted on this planet than a dog. Drug Companies Kill over 100,000 people every year with their Crap.

How come the scum who implement the laws can arrest and take my pet away from me if someone says I mistreat them, yet these corporations are never held accountable for ACTUAL crimes. what does it take for the ignorance of people to wake up?

Kinda like the kids getting arrested for the sat cheating scandal. Let's arrest kids for something as petty as cheating and following the example set before them by politicians and corporations on how to succeed, yet multi billion/trillion dollar scandals go unpunished.

Ever wonder why humans don't deserve to inherit this earth?

The animals deserve to eat the flesh of every undeserving human on earth

Originally posted by Revealation
How come the scum who implement the laws can arrest and take my pet away from me if someone says I mistreat them, yet these corporations are never held accountable for ACTUAL crimes. what does it take for the ignorance of people to wake up?

Kinda like the kids getting arrested for the sat cheating scandal. Let's arrest kids for something as petty as cheating and following the example set before them by politicians and corporations on how to succeed, yet multi billion/trillion dollar scandals go unpunished.

Ever wonder why humans don't deserve to inherit this earth?

The animals deserve to eat the flesh of every undeserving human on earth

Two reasons:

1) It's for the "common good". And more atrocities have been committed on animals, the environment, and humans for this tenuous "common good" idea, than for any other reason in the history of this planet.

2) Billions of dollars in profit.

It's an abomination of progressive and corporatist values, spliced together in a lab, then cultivated by the mad scientists called Congress.

/TOA

reply to post by The Old American


That's overstating it just a bit, IMHO. Once upon a time, though no longer, it was a necessary evil. But so many of these tests, according to what I've read/heard, are now just redundant and unnecessary.

There are better ways, and those should be utilized.

reply to post by detachedindividual


thank you so much for this post , I have always felt that if you commit crimes violent enough to get the death penalty then you should also be used to the full extent of serving humanity ...

WHERE is this lab located?

Originally posted by DOADOA
WHERE is this lab located?

We should focus on the hearts and minds of our children rather than focus on how to get revenge. These types are set in their ways and may never change.

Kids must see the truth of things, get away from the "Easter bunnies" and plastic junk.

reply to post by The Old American


That's just cruel, being in prison since you was born then finally be released. If that was a human you guys would see it alot different.