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POLITICS: AP FOIA Suit Reveals Bush's National Guard File Missing Records Explaining Absence

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posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 12:41 AM

Originally posted by GradyPhilpott

On the one hand we have youthful indiscretion. On the other, we have, well you can call it what you like. I like to call it treason.

Well as we all know the definition of a word has nothing to do with what you would like to call it.


Violation of allegiance toward one's country or sovereign, especially the betrayal of one's country by waging war against it or by consciously and purposely acting to aid its enemies.

Kerry testified before Congress that the US military took part in war crimes. He did not attack US forces, or provide the enemy with aid or intelligence. It is a fact that war crimes were committed in Vietnam by US forces.

Guilty of treason? You decide.


The act of deserting or forsaking; abandonment of a service, a cause, a party, a friend, or any post of duty; the quitting of one's duties willfully and without right; esp., an absconding from military or naval service.

George Bush did not show up for his last year of service with the National Guard after the US Government paid approximately $1 Million for his fighter pilot training. He did not have permission to avoid duty.

Guilty of Desertion? Sounds it.

posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 01:33 AM
John Kerry's testimony is riddled with so many lies and distortions that it would take me a week to track down refutations to all of them, just so the impenetrable could deny them. So, I will take one of the most vicious and enduring lies that really exposes the marxist imperative behind Kerry's testimony, class conflict.

We saw that many people in this country had a one-sided idea of who was kept free by our flag, as blacks provided the highest percentage of casualties.

A disproportionate number of blacks were killed in the Vietnam War.

86% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasians, 12.5% were black, 1.2% were other races.

Sociologists Charles C. Moskos and John Sibley Butler, in their recently published book "All That We Can Be," said they analyzed the claim that blacks were used like cannon fodder during Vietnam "and can report definitely that this charge is untrue.

Black fatalities amounted to 12 percent of all Americans killed in Southeast Asia - a figure proportional to the number of blacks in the U.S. population at the time and slightly lower than the proportion of blacks in the Army at the close of the war."


* 88.4% of the men who actually served in Vietnam were Caucasian, 10.6% (275,000) were black; 1% listed as others.
* 86.3% of the men who died in Vietnam were Caucasian (includes Hispanics); 12.5% (7,241) were black; 1.2% belonged to other races.
* 170,000 Hispanics served in Vietnam; 3,070 (5.2% of total) died there.
* 86.8% of the men who were killed as a result of hostile action were Caucasian; 12.1% (5,711)were black; 1.1% belonged to other races

* 14.6% (1.530) of non-combat deaths were among blacks.
* 34% of blacks who enlisted volunteered for the combat arms.
* Overall, blacks suffered 12.5% of the deaths in Vietnam at a time when the percentage of blacks of military age was 13.5% of the total population.
* Religion of Dead: Protestant--64.4%; Catholic--28.9%; other/none--6.7%.

[edit on 04/9/6 by GradyPhilpott]

posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 08:33 PM
If it was a myth, then it was a wide spread myth with very real basis in fact.

to quote David Coffey:

African Americans often did supply a disproportionate number of combat troops, a high percentage of whom had voluntarily enlisted. Although they made up less than 10 percent of American men in arms and about 13 percent of the U.S. population between 1961 and 1966, they accounted for almost 20 percent of all combat-related deaths in Vietnam during that period. In 1965 alone African Americans represented almost one-fourth of the Army's killed in action. In 1968 African Americans, who made up roughly 12 percent of Army and Marine total strengths, frequently contributed half the men in front-line combat units, especially in rifle squads and fire teams. Under heavy criticism, Army and Marine commanders worked to lessen black casualties after 1966, and by the end of the conflict, African American combat deaths amounted to approximately 12 percentómore in line with national population figures. Final casualty estimates do not support the assertion that African Americans suffered disproportionate losses in Vietnam, but this in no way diminishes the fact that they bore a heavy share of the fighting burden, especially early in the conflict.

Certainly it is not myth that racism was prevalent in the military during this time. Furthermore, when you look at the breakdown of who served in what capacity, you see that the number of officers, senior NCOs, chopper pilots, FACs, etc. were white. If these positions are representative of the the bulk of the white casualties, then the black soldier must have made up in the percentages somewhere else.

Rather than look at the total casualty percentages, It would be more instructive to see the breakdown of percentages in various combat roles.

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