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Originally posted by samsamm9
reply to post by BO XIAN
And what happened to you ?
Your girlfriend left you for a Muslim ?
You got beat up by Muslims ?
Lost your job to a Muslim ?
Why the great hostility to Islam?
What does the
Religion of Peace
Teach About...
Violence
Question:
Does the Quran really contain dozens of verses promoting violence?
Summary Answer:
The Quran contains at least 109 verses that call Muslims to war with nonbelievers. Some are quite graphic, with commands to chop off heads and fingers and kill infidels wherever they may be hiding. Muslims who do not join the fight are called 'hypocrites' and warned that Allah will send them to Hell if they do not join the slaughter.
Unlike nearly all of the Old Testament verses of violence, most of the verses of violence in the Quran are open-ended, meaning that they are not restrained by the historical context of the surrounding text. They are part of the eternal, unchanging word of Allah, and just as relevant or subjective as anything else in the Quran.
Unfortunately, there are very few verses of tolerance and peace to abrogate or even balance out the many that call for nonbelievers to be fought and subdued until they either accept humiliation, convert to Islam, or are killed. Muhammad's own martial legacy and the remarkable stress on violence found in the Quran have resulted in a trail of blood and tears across world history.
The Quran:
Quran (2:191-193) - "And slay them wherever ye find them, and drive them out of the places whence they drove you out, for persecution [of Muslims] is worse than slaughter [of non-believers]... but if they desist, then lo! Allah is forgiving and merciful. And fight them until persecution is no more, and religion is for Allah." The historical context of this passage is not defensive warfare, since Muhammad and his Muslims had just relocated to Medina and were not under attack by their Meccan adversaries. In fact, the verses urge offensive warfare, in that Muslims are to drive Meccans out of their own city (which they later did).
The use of the word "persecution" by some Muslim translators is thus disingenuous (the actual Muslim words for persecution - "idtihad" - and oppression - a variation of "z-l-m" - do not appear in the verse). The actual Arabic comes from "fitna" which can mean disbelief, or the disorder that results from unbelief or temptation. Taken as a whole, the context makes clear that violence is being authorized until "religion is for Allah" - ie. unbelievers desist in their unbelief.
. . .
Quran (2:216) - "Fighting is prescribed for you, and ye dislike it. But it is possible that ye dislike a thing which is good for you, and that ye love a thing which is bad for you. But Allah knoweth, and ye know not." Not only does this verse establish that violence can be virtuous, but it also contradicts the myth that fighting is intended only in self-defense, since the audience was obviously not under attack at the time. From the Hadith, we know that this verse was narrated at a time that Muhammad was actually trying to motivate his people into raiding merchant caravans for loot. (emphases added)
Quran (3:56) - "As to those who reject faith, I will punish them with terrible agony in this world and in the Hereafter, nor will they have anyone to help."
Originally posted by BO XIAN
They matter to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and to me.
The slipping and sliding, shucking and jiving, so authorized . . .and expressly, specifically including LYING . . . in the service of Islam is a stench in the nostrils of God and of all informed thinking, morally congruent individuals everywhere.
The conquest by birth-rate is not all that admirable either. However, that's a lot more honorable than the blood-lust sort so inherent and so valued in Islam.
Originally posted by boony
When God came down to earth, he chose to reveal himself as Jesus the " Imago Dei" The image of God.
These silly arguments are pointless, Christianity teaches that Jesus is God. Christians are to see God through Jesus as revealed by the father in heaven.
We call God Jesus
1) Jesus was not divine. He never claimed to be God, and he never intended to start a new religion. 2) The Bible is not an inspired book and is riddled with contradictions. None of the Bible, except possibly the book of James, was written by anyone who knew Jesus. There are fragments of Jesus’ teachings in the Gospels, but it is difficult to discern what he really said. 3) Paul was never a Pharisee and was not highly educated. His “conversion” was either a personal hallucinogenic experience or an outright fraud. His claims to be an apostle were attempts to further his own authority in the church. 4) Pauline theological “inventions” include a) the deity of Jesus; b) salvation by grace through faith; c) salvation through the blood of Jesus; d) the sinless nature of Jesus; e) the concept of original sin; and f) the Holy Spirit. None of these “new doctrines” were accepted by Jesus’ true followers. 5) The Gnostic Gospels are closer to the truth about Jesus than are the traditional four Gospels of the Bible.
Originally posted by megabytz
reply to post by samsamm9
Mainly because the word for god in Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek is not Allah.
Allah is simply god in Arabic.
Even Jesus said Allah. According to an Aramaic dictionary, ( www.pe.../lexicon/ ) the word for God in Aramaic (The language which Jesus spoke) is "Aalah", which is the exact same thing as the Arabic "Allah"
Abraham PBUH called him El shaddai Moses PBUH called him Elohim (see Genesis) Jesus PBUH called him Allah Muhammad PBUH called him Allah
When God came down to earth, he chose to reveal himself as Jesus the " Imago Dei" The image of God.
Originally posted by ChristianJihad
reply to post by lonewolf19792000
It wasn't until we learned english that we were able to make the connection between the Great Spirit and the God of the white men.
The god of the white men was yahweh, you know the one that told them it was ok to capture and enslave other humans, steal their lands kill all the males rape their virgins and so on. Are you really saying that the native Americans' "Great Spirit" was this nut job ?
Where does jesus come into this and which jesus for that matter ? You are aware that there is no contemporaneous evidence for the bible jesus even existing let alone being a god ?
Please bear in mind that the jesus character that papers in the new testament like yahwhe also condoned slavery and if, as claimed by xtians is in fact one and the same being as yahwhe also condoned every other repugnant act and order of yahwhe ?
Originally posted by samsamm9
Originally posted by megabytz
reply to post by samsamm9
Mainly because the word for god in Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek is not Allah.
Allah is simply god in Arabic.
Did you read the opening post ?!
Did you hear the video of the Yemeni Jew ??
Impressive !!
Even Jesus said Allah. According to an Aramaic dictionary, ( www.pe.../lexicon/ ) the word for God in Aramaic (The language which Jesus spoke) is "Aalah", which is the exact same thing as the Arabic "Allah"
“The Arabs, before the time of Mohammed, accepted and worshipped, after a fashion, a supreme god called Allah” – (Encyclopedia off Islam, I:302, Leiden: E.J. Brill, 1913, Houtsma)
“The name Allah, as the Quran itself is witness, was well known in pre-Islamic Arabia. Indeed, both it and its feminine form, Allat, are found not infrequently among the theophorous names in inscriptions from North Africa” – (Islam: Muhammad, and His Religion, New York: The Liberal Arts Press, 1958, p. 85)
The word “Allah” comes from the compound Arabic word, al-ilah. Al is the definite article “the” and ilah is an Arabic word for “god.” It is not a foreign word. It is not even the Syriac word for God. It is pure Arabic. – (There is an interesting discussion of the origins of Allah, in “Arabic Lexicographical Miscellanies” by J. Blau in the Journal of Semitic Studies, Vol. XVII, #2, 1972, pp. 173-190)
Neither is Allah a Hebrew or Greek word for God as found in the Bible. Allah is a purely Arabic term used in reference to an Arabian deity. Hastings’ Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics I:326, T & T Clark, states:
‘”Allah” is a proper name, applicable only to their [Arabs'] peculiar God.’
According to the Encyclopedia of Religion:
‘”Allah” is a pre-Islamic name . . . corresponding to the Babylonian Bel’ – (Encyclopedia of Religion, I:117 Washington DC, Corpus Pub., 1979)
Originally posted by BO XIAN
reply to post by IAMIAM
Again, that's your reality, not mine.
The references are accurate.
The history is accurate.
"Allah" was a demonic moon god before Muhammad was born.
Facts are still facts.
They matter to the God of Abraham, Isaac and Jacob and to me.
The slipping and sliding, shucking and jiving, so authorized . . .and expressly, specifically including LYING . . . in the service of Islam is a stench in the nostrils of God and of all informed thinking, morally congruent individuals everywhere.
The conquest by birth-rate is not all that admirable either. However, that's a lot more honorable than the blood-lust sort so inherent and so valued in Islam.
Originally posted by samsamm9
Originally posted by boony
When God came down to earth, he chose to reveal himself as Jesus the " Imago Dei" The image of God.
These silly arguments are pointless, Christianity teaches that Jesus is God. Christians are to see God through Jesus as revealed by the father in heaven.
We call God Jesus
Wrong !
What is Pauline Christianity?
1) Jesus was not divine. He never claimed to be God, and he never intended to start a new religion. 2) The Bible is not an inspired book and is riddled with contradictions. None of the Bible, except possibly the book of James, was written by anyone who knew Jesus. There are fragments of Jesus’ teachings in the Gospels, but it is difficult to discern what he really said. 3) Paul was never a Pharisee and was not highly educated. His “conversion” was either a personal hallucinogenic experience or an outright fraud. His claims to be an apostle were attempts to further his own authority in the church. 4) Pauline theological “inventions” include a) the deity of Jesus; b) salvation by grace through faith; c) salvation through the blood of Jesus; d) the sinless nature of Jesus; e) the concept of original sin; and f) the Holy Spirit. None of these “new doctrines” were accepted by Jesus’ true followers. 5) The Gnostic Gospels are closer to the truth about Jesus than are the traditional four Gospels of the Bible.
Originally posted by Lemon.Fresh
Originally posted by samsamm9
Originally posted by megabytz
reply to post by samsamm9
Mainly because the word for god in Aramaic, Hebrew, and Greek is not Allah.
Allah is simply god in Arabic.
Did you read the opening post ?!
Did you hear the video of the Yemeni Jew ??
Impressive !!
Perhaps you should study up on the Yemeni Jews.
I am sure after living isolated from their homeland for so long, that they would pick up the language of the natives.
Even Jesus said Allah. According to an Aramaic dictionary, ( www.pe.../lexicon/ ) the word for God in Aramaic (The language which Jesus spoke) is "Aalah", which is the exact same thing as the Arabic "Allah"
Except that it has been proven that Aramaic was not so wide spread in Judea as Hebrew was, and that anything every related to spirituality was spoken of in Mishnaic Hebrew.
Source
Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
Originally posted by FurvusRexCaeli
Originally posted by samsamm9
If Jesus(PBUH) called his god "Allah", then why would "Christians" use other words when talking to or about
their Creator?
There aren't many Christians that speak Aramaic. The religion itself values greatly the ability to translate speech into other languages and speak to diverse populations, so there's no special value attached to Aramaic.
Aramaic is a dead language, you mean arabic.
Originally posted by BO XIAN
Originally posted by lonewolf19792000
Lolwut? No "christian" would ever call the Lord Allah. Our Lord is Jesus the Christ, the Lord of All, the Son of God, the Son of Man. Jesus was equal to the Father in power and in nature and it as through Jesus that the earth and the heavens were created.
I think it depends on their level of education/information about the facts of Muhammad's/Islam's history.
Authentic informed ones don't, usually.
What's really exciting are the 100's--thousands of cases at this point--of individuals, families and even villages in every Islamic country where many individuals have a dream/vision/visitation of Jesus presenting Himself as their Savior. They welcome Him into their hearts in the experience and then afterwards they have to secretly find a Bible to find out WHO THIS JESUS IS THAT IS THEIR NEW GOD AND SAVIOR!
PRAISE GOD.