Strange dream about the speed of light., page 1

For a dream, the statement that space curves light is accurate enough. Gravity curves spacetime, and light follows a straight line along that curvature, so, essentially, the curvature of space does curve light along with it.

As for calculating the effect on neutrinos assuming they're exempt from this curvature, and the possibility that this could explain the OPERA results, I started working on it as soon as I read your post. The hardest part is taking variables such as altitude and location to enough accuracy to get usable data. I'm not sure if that's possible for anyone other than the scientists, themselves, to do, as they're the ones who had to account for such details in the first place.

edit on 20-11-2011 by CLPrime because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:02 AM by wWizard

reply to post by Foxy1

Why is your underwear green?

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:05 AM by Biigs

why would curved light be any slower than a nuetrino or slower than the speed of light that is not curved?

Just because they dont travel in the straightest line, with respect, has nothing to do with the speed of the particle itself.

Two photons leave a star, one just managed to catch the edge of a black hole while the other did not, the two photons arrive at a detector with different times. Was the second particle really slower? No, it just took a different path.

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:15 AM by CLPrime

reply to post by Biigs

The speed of the neutrinos in the OPERA experiment was found by a simple distance-over-time calculation. What's being suggested by the OP is that, instead of following the curvature of spacetime like photons, neutrinos follow straight lines independent of that curvature. That would be akin to photons travelling over a hill while neutrinos tunnel through it. The neutrinos wouldn't truly be travelling faster than the photons, they just took a shorter route.

A similar solution has been presented by the neutrinos-entered-an-alternate-dimension crowd, but I'm not sure anyone has actually presented this exact solution.

Now, the legitimacy of the solution, itself... we may ask why the neutrinos we detect coming from supernovae aren't also found to be faster than light. This may be because such an effect is cancelled over vast distances, especially when the source is a different gravitational potential from that in which the neutrinos are detected.

The actual math would have to be done with precision that those of us who aren't the actual experimenters don't have access to.

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:24 AM by F4guy

Originally posted by definity
im pretty sure space dont bend light, gravity and blackholes do. but im no physist

Gravity and the gravitational effects of a black hole bend space and therefore the curved space (actually spacetime) therefore acts to bend light. And I am a physicist. For more details, read about Eddington's 1919 solar eclipse experment.
And for the person above who suggested a neutron is too "small" to bend, a neutron actually has more mass than a proton. I think maybe someone is confusing neutrons with neutrinos, which are "almost" massless, but do have some mass. Otherwise it wouldn't undergo neutrino oscillation.

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:34 AM by Gridrebel

reply to post by Foxy1

Cool, there have been proven scientific discoveries and other ideas which came about due to dreams:

www.brilliantdreams.com...

The tune for "Yesterday" came to Paul McCartney in a dream...

Mary Shelley's Frankenstein Inspired By a Dream

Otto Loewi (1873-1961), a German born physiologist, won the Nobel Prize for medicine in 1936 for his work on the chemical transmission of nerve impulses. "....the result of his initial dream induced experiment became the foundation for the theory of chemical transmission of the nervous impulse and led to a Nobel Prize!"

Kekulé - Dreams of Molecules & Benzene Structure. Friedrich August Kekulé von Stradonitz is a remarkable figure in the history of chemistry, specifically organic chemistry. Twice Kekulé had dreams that led to major discoveries! He had a dream that helped him discover that the Benzene molecule, unlike other known organic compounds, had a circular structure rather than a linear one... solving a problem that had been confounding chemists.

Madame C.J. Walker (1867-1919) is cited by the Guinness Book of Records as the first female American self-made millionaire. She created a mixture of herbs and other ingredients to stop her hair loss and it worked.

Elias Howe and the sewing machine. When he woke up he realized that the dream had brought the solution to his problem. By locating a hole at the tip of the needle, the thread could be caught after it went through cloth thus making his machine operable. He changed his design to incorporate the dream idea and found it worked!

**************************

My questions are:

Are you already involved in this type of science?

Did you know what neutrinos were before the dream?

edit on 20-11-2011 by Gridrebel because:

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:35 AM by CLPrime

reply to post by F4guy

So far, you're the only one who's mentioned neutrons.

Neutrinos do have mass, so, yes, the statement that neutrinos are too "small" to bend is silly. Photons are massless, and they are just as subject to the curvature of spacetime as everything else. In fact, more so.
But, when we see that neutrinos are, overall, weakly interacting (they have negligible gravitational potential, no electromagnetism, and, obviously, no strong or weak nuclear interaction), the "too small to bend" statement may have a little more significance.

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 11:52 AM by Foxy1

reply to post by Gridrebel

Im not involved in this type of work and didnt know what a neutrino was until I heard about the Experiment going on at cern on npr radio. but ive allways thought physics were really cool and that made me usually know more about them than my neighbors.

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 12:01 PM by Foxy1

I had this dream after reading a thread on here somewhere about light manifesting out of nowhere in a vacuum. So Im wondering if that had something to do with it. or perhaps suggesting that there is no true vacuum changes the way we see the boundaries of the curvature of space. But its still strange of me to have a dream like this because I dont think I would have thought of something like that while awake.

edit on 20-11-2011 by Foxy1 because: spelling

reply posted on 20-11-2011 @ 02:44 PM by Druid42

I read the same thread, very interesting. I'd suggest you don't read ATS before bedtime, as your subconscious will process information while you sleep.