Real Police? Or Hired Thugs?

In watching the videos posted in the last few weeks showing police brutality, I had a thought and that thought turned into a theory.

Are these real policemen who are terrorizing, beating, pepper spraying, and shooting rubber bullets at protesters or are they hired thugs?

Does anyone know any of these "cops" personally who can tell us about them?

Not that it really matters - they are doing a disservice to humanity either way - but would anybody really put it past our "government" (whomever that may be) to pay these men who have no credentials in real police work to scare the heck out of these protesters?

On a side note, I think they are just fueling the fire anyway.

www.youtube.com...
Hired thugs.
There is no difference between our governments then a gang or cartel, except they are bigger.

Real police are hired thugs.

Originally posted by PinkAndBlack
Real police are hired thugs.

yup the only difference they dont learn there trade in prison and can get away with alot more crap.

Wow, thanks for the reality check.

In all the threads posted and everything in the news and online, I have never seen anyone say that they actually KNOW one of these guys.

Things that make you go "Hmmmmm......"

reply to post by angellicview


I wonder about that too.

many years ago I worked with a bloke who knew another bloke who had a son the Australian Special Air Services (SAS) and according to this bloke, this SAS solider, as part of their extra cericular SAS duites sometime put on police uniforms and was part of a police contingient used to break up strikes by unionists etc.

I know this story is third hand but it gives rise to the concern that when it comes to proteters dealing people in police unforms at protests, how can any protester or member of the public have complete confidence that they are dealing with real police officers and not the secret services (SS) and paramilitarly organsitions.

I have also heard that sometimes such soldiers are used in SWAT teams as they are called in the US, to give them real situation expereince.

Take away the uniform or riot gear and what do you have? Just other human beings, but with an authority to use violence. Hired thugs? It depends who's paying them.

reply to post by angellicview

reply to post by PinkAndBlack


You claim to be a vampire (no, seriously, you claim to be a vampire). Get mad at the police for enforcing laws that the people have enacted yet you apparently run around sucking blood...

OP your logic is laughable. If they were hired goons (assuming your question wasn't a retarded metaphor) why would people not claim to know them? I am so tired of the ATS f the police bandwagon. Go on a ride along and see if you still hate cops. They are (for the most part) good men and women that legitimately want to help and do good. They get put in these crap situations trying to fight for the public by fighting the public and all you idiots can do is belittle them. I really think everyone that whines about police has a criminal record and is unable to accept blame. Or they are 15.

There are bad cops. I HATE bad cops. They are the reason idiots hate all cops. Grow up ATS. Go talk to a cop.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by PinkAndBlack

 

You claim to be a vampire (no, seriously, you claim to be a vampire). Get mad at the police for enforcing laws that the people have enacted yet you apparently run around sucking blood...

OP your logic is laughable. If they were hired goons (assuming your question wasn't a retarded metaphor) why would people not claim to know them? I am so tired of the ATS f the police bandwagon. Go on a ride along and see if you still hate cops. They are (for the most part) good men and women that legitimately want to help and do good. They get put in these crap situations trying to fight for the public by fighting the public and all you idiots can do is belittle them. I really think everyone that whines about police has a criminal record and is unable to accept blame. Or they are 15.

There are bad cops. I HATE bad cops. They are the reason idiots hate all cops. Grow up ATS. Go talk to a cop.

I'm 27 and I don't have a criminal record, in fact not even a speeding or parking ticket. Totally 100% goody two-shoes. I won't even kill a mosquito until it bites me first, a bee unless it stings me, and I let spiders go outside.

"They try to fight for the public by fighting the public"

There's your problem right there...

tis a scary world when you first start realising the utter disdain the people who enforce the laws upon us have for the very laws they tout. When a doctors job is dependent on how many prescriptions he fills we're in trouble.

reply to post by The_Phantom

"They try to fight for the public by fighting the public" There's your problem right there...

Agreed. I just am going to assume we see that differently. So goody-two-shoes do you actually hate police on sight? ou rally think every cop responding to the OWS is a 'thug'? If there were no police presence I guarantee that things would get out of hand, and quick.

Honestly I'm done now. I get that on this site there is a very anti authority vibe and general feeling. I actually feel the same way for the most part. I just don't want to lump all cops together. I've had nothing but bad experiences with a few people of certain professions, races, socioeconomic status but letting a few bad apples sour me on everyone just seems... dumb. I wanted to be a cop, I got a 4 year degree in Criminal Justice (never used it though). I've known a ton of law enforcement. I've dealt with a ton of law enforcement. I had some real bad experiences with cops, but the vast majority were decent, caring people that only wanted to do right by their fellow man.

Its so easy to judge everyone in blue when you see a police beating, but remember that same cop has probably held someone while they sobbed over a loved one, and bitten there lip to seem strong.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by The_Phantom

 

"They try to fight for the public by fighting the public" There's your problem right there...

Agreed. I just am going to assume we see that differently. So goody-two-shoes do you actually hate police on sight? ou rally think every cop responding to the OWS is a 'thug'? If there were no police presence I guarantee that things would get out of hand, and quick.

Honestly I'm done now. I get that on this site there is a very anti authority vibe and general feeling. I actually feel the same way for the most part. I just don't want to lump all cops together. I've had nothing but bad experiences with a few people of certain professions, races, socioeconomic status but letting a few bad apples sour me on everyone just seems... dumb. I wanted to be a cop, I got a 4 year degree in Criminal Justice (never used it though). I've known a ton of law enforcement. I've dealt with a ton of law enforcement. I had some real bad experiences with cops, but the vast majority were decent, caring people that only wanted to do right by their fellow man.

Its so easy to judge everyone in blue when you see a police beating, but remember that same cop has probably held someone while they sobbed over a loved one, and bitten there lip to seem strong.

Police by nature view violence as a solution to even non violent acts. It is always the nature of police to escalate situations so that they are in control. If their job is simply to track down a real violent Criminal, fine, do it. If they believe that their job is to be in control every where they happen to be, then I have a problem with them.

reply to post by The_Phantom

Police by nature view violence as a solution to even non violent acts. It is always the nature of police to escalate situations so that they are in control.

In my experience the goal is to deescalate. Most cops see it this way; I want to go home at the end of the day and ratcheting up the violence puts me in more danger. Your second statement is true, but only because it is important to use more force than someone who is resisting. That may seem to contradict with my first two sentences, but I think you're smart enough to realize it doesnt.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by The_Phantom

 

Police by nature view violence as a solution to even non violent acts. It is always the nature of police to escalate situations so that they are in control.

In my experience the goal is to deescalate. Most cops see it this way; I want to go home at the end of the day and ratcheting up the violence puts me in more danger. Your second statement is true, but only because it is important to use more force than someone who is resisting. That may seem to contradict with my first two sentences, but I think you're smart enough to realize it doesnt.

I really believe that the goal of police is to deescalate...I also really believe that they do this by gaining control over situations by using force...I also believe that society doesn't like to be controlled by force...I also believe that society lashes out at those that try to control them through force...I also believe that at the end of the day, the road to hell is paved with good intentions.

reply to post by The_Phantom


Thank you for being so civil in our discussion. I usually feel very attacked when I discuss my views regarding police. It is true that members of society don't like force, and when force is used become angry. At the same time, society dictates the laws, and dictates the use of force. I should have said verbal deescalation. That is a big one among the LE I know. Verbal Judo.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by The_Phantom

 

Thank you for being so civil in our discussion. I usually feel very attacked when I discuss my views regarding police. It is true that members of society don't like force, and when force is used become angry. At the same time, society dictates the laws, and dictates the use of force. I should have said verbal deescalation. That is a big one among the LE I know. Verbal Judo.

Society gives the police the right to use force to take on violent criminals. Hey man, if your out there and somebody is trying to hurt you, I would vote to give you the right to defend yourself. All people have the right to defend themselves. Just because I believe in peace in all situations doesn't mean I would take away your right to defense. But what we are talking about is how police throughout the country have taken it upon themselves to expand that power to take control over situations by using force, extra power not granted to them by the people, but taken. But let's talk about that path, voted for or not, where does it lead? Let's create a scenario that doesn't include me or you, let's take two men, one will be Bob and the other will be John. Bob is the aggressor, he pokes John in the chest. John reacts by punching Bob, that is not self defense, the situation escalates. Who is "more" wrong, Bob or John? By law, I believe both would be held accountable. But if a man has a piece of metal on his shirt and society says it's alright, who is "more" wrong? Now how will the person that is always in the wrong come to view the situation? Society acts a certain way, police may try to do their best, but how will society come to view the situation when they are always in the wrong? Eventually, they won't like it, it's heading in that direction, give it time, it will happen.

reply to post by The_Phantom


I get what you're saying. You feel disenfranchised because a police officer holds more clout in court than a regular citizen. In regard to the scenario you presented, I would in no way support punching someone in the face for a chest poke. This is a bad example that you can easily throw back in my face but imagine if a student poked a teacher in the chest. Student gets in trouble. When you poke a peace officer (I'm sure that will come back to haunt me with a one liner post from someone) expect to be informed that you are being arrested. If you don't follow directions, expect to have force used, in accordance with the departments use of force policies (approved by citizens through voting).

Lets not argue good cop bad cop. I don't like bad cops. I like good cops and think that when they use appropriate amounts of force, as dictated by the department and the law, they are well within their rights.

Almost 5 AM here and have yet to sleep. Will be back tomorrow.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by The_Phantom

 

I get what you're saying. You feel disenfranchised because a police officer holds more clout in court than a regular citizen. In regard to the scenario you presented, I would in no way support punching someone in the face for a chest poke. This is a bad example that you can easily throw back in my face but imagine if a student poked a teacher in the chest. Student gets in trouble. When you poke a peace officer (I'm sure that will come back to haunt me with a one liner post from someone) expect to be informed that you are being arrested. If you don't follow directions, expect to have force used, in accordance with the departments use of force policies (approved by citizens through voting).

Lets not argue good cop bad cop. I don't like bad cops. I like good cops and think that when they use appropriate amounts of force, as dictated by the department and the law, they are well within their rights.

Almost 5 AM here and have yet to sleep. Will be back tomorrow.

edit on 20-11-2011 by Domo1 because: (no reason given)

When I compare the two, I'm not saying the police necessarily take that specific action, it's just a metaphor for what they can do. It's about a piece of metal meaning that one of the two sides of a conflict is always said to be in the right. It's about what the reaction of the ones that are always said to be in the wrong will be, based on human nature. If anything I'm probably trying to warn the police where their actions are heading more than anything. And sure I don't like the cops that are thugs, I think anybody that jumps to violence or looks for it is a thug. If you are out there just trying to stop dangerous criminals and then go home, I would shake your hand and say good job, keep it up, and thank you. But since we are having a nice conversation, let's have some intellectual honesty to go along with it. That's not the full story of what is going on in this country. That's not what I see every single day on this site alone and in other places as well. You may be a nice guy but way to many aren't. And when power to always be in the right is mixed with violence and the desire for control, I can think of no other direction it can possibly lead but to disastrous consequences.

Originally posted by Domo1
reply to post by The_Phantom

 

Police by nature view violence as a solution to even non violent acts. It is always the nature of police to escalate situations so that they are in control.

In my experience the goal is to deescalate. Most cops see it this way; I want to go home at the end of the day and ratcheting up the violence puts me in more danger. Your second statement is true, but only because it is important to use more force than someone who is resisting. That may seem to contradict with my first two sentences, but I think you're smart enough to realize it doesnt.

that's because you're normal, not a sociopath, or old school
maybe you're secretly Bumper Morgan
i do hope you're good at walking backwards

Occupy Oakland: Iraq war veteran Kayvan Sabehgi beaten by police - video ofgoatsandmen.blogspot.com...
Meanwhile Peace Laureate Obama, Hilary and their think-tank friends are trying to figure out how to overthrow Syria and Iran, they claim in order to 'help the peaceful protestors' over there. The hypocrisy is reaching absurd levels.

how-the-war-on-terror-militarized-the-police
www.readersupportednews.org...

Over the past 10 years, law enforcement officials have begun to look and act more and more like soldiers. Here's why we should be alarmed."

t around 9:00 a.m. on May 5, 2011, officers with the Pima County, Arizona, Sheriff's Department's Special Weapons and Tactics (SWAT) team surrounded the home of 26-year-old José Guerena, a former US Marine and veteran of two tours of duty in Iraq, to serve a search warrant for narcotics. As the officers approached, Guerena lay sleeping in his bedroom after working the graveyard shift at a local mine. When his wife Vanessa woke him up, screaming that she had seen a man outside the window pointing a gun at her, Guerena grabbed his AR-15 rifle, instructed Vanessa to hide in the closet with their four-year-old son, and left the bedroom to investigate.

Within moments, and without Guerena firing a shot - or even switching his rifle off of "safety" - he lay dying, his body riddled with 60 bullets. A subsequent investigation revealed that the initial shot that prompted the SWAT team barrage came from a SWAT team gun, not Guerena's. Guerena, reports later revealed, had no criminal record, and no narcotics were found at his home.

Sadly, the Guerenas are not alone; in recent years we have witnessed a proliferation in incidents of excessive, military-style force by police SWAT teams, which often make national headlines due to their sheer brutality. Why has it become routine for police departments to deploy black-garbed, body-armored SWAT teams for routine domestic police work? The answer to this question requires a closer examination of post-9/11 US foreign policy and the War on Terror.