Top 5 Misconceptions About People Struggling Economically Today

As a person in his sixties I recognize that things are different now, than when I graduated from college with no debt by working in a grocery store. I got a good job with the degree. Here in Southern California back in the 70's McDonald Douglas was building airplanes. The Federal Government was constructing Interstate 5, and paying Rockwell to build the Space Shuttles in Downey. The many military bases that have now been closed, used to hire civilians and pump cash into the local economy. Those military personnel at El Toro Marine Base and George Air Force Base in San Bernadino used to spent their paychecks locally at restaurants and retail shops.

Back then fire departments, police departments, school systems, aerospace, home construction contractors were hiring, but not anymore. Many of my friends sons who have college degrees in business, finance, and biology are stuck in the same minimum wage job that they have had for years. These are ambitious young people with educated, professional parents, who usually have connections.

The Federal Government, led by Dick Cheney, decided to blow up and rebuild Iraq and Afghanistan, while borrowing money from China to pay for the bombs. The billions that used to be spent here building our highways and Space Shuttles is now being spent to hire Korean construction firms to build roads in Afghanistan, and bribing the Taliban to let the fuel convoys pass without being destroyed. We didn't even get the oil from Iraq, it's going to China!

Our politicians have sold us out to trans-national corporations that fund their campaigns. They said "Don't worry if those manufacturing jobs leave to China, we'll have the financial services industry." and if there aren't any jobs locally, then join the military. Our politicians are supporting over 600 military bases spread all over the world, putting cash into the pockets of business in Germany, Korea, Japan,and Australia too. We should demand that our tax dollars be spent here in the States as a top priority.

BUT our politicians don't care, because the world they see around Washington DC is flush with cash and jobs due to the thousands of lobbyists making hundreds of thousands per year. Do some research and find out what kind of jobs your congressman's children got. Their kids get cushy jobs due to their corporate sponsors doing them favors that aren't directly in cash. Even the politicians spouses are lobbyists, adding a couple of hundred thousand to the $175,000 they make, so they do not feel our pain.

Start making you congressman or senator sweat, knowing that we won't buy their excuses any more.

reply to post by peck420


tell that to the companies we bailed out with our tax dollars. socialism. we are already a socialist country pretending we are capitalist, so anything bad we do can be blamed on capitalism

A four year moratorium on college and trade school fees, with an equal opportunity to receive food and shelter and clothing is exactly what we need. Educate, feed, clothe and shelter everyone for four years, with education in manufacturing radiant energy technologies, infrastructure engineering, and the Arts being heavily promoted. The money we will save letting the banks fail will more than pay to provide all of this for every American. And, after four years, watch the innovation and advancement thrive...

Originally posted by Propulsion
I call it living to ones means. People want their cake and eat it too. Can’t have everything in life because someone else has it. If you want something, than do what it takes to obtain it. Don’t expect anyone to give it to you for free. I so dislike the pity trips! Stand up and take control of your life! I went from an I.S. position that paid me 90k a year to a warehouse position unloading trailers for close to nothing. I don’t run around pouting like a baby! I had 130k in student loans. Paid them all off! There was a time in my life where I was down and out living on streets! I chose not to be there and made changes! In my opinion, some people are just too lazy! And then they cry about it when things don’t work out the way they want them too! I know everyone is not the same, but I also know everyone can do or be anything they want in life! My grandmother made a career change when she turned 62 years old. She hated her prior work and wanted to find happiness. She has no regrets…

Yes, this is genius!


Great Scott, Marty, I believe we solved the reason for societies problems: It's laziness!!

If these no good lazy socialists would just start working, and stop getting bailouts from the government our problems would be solved!

reply to post by undo


So it is everybody else's fault but yours?

Second.

reply to post by undo


That is the line the sell. And the sad part is people actually buy it.

You would be better off as a true capitalist society or a true socialist society...but the buyers want socialism (welfare, safety nets, etc.) and they want capitalism (competition, lower prices, etc)...yet the fault is solely that of the government and corporations....amazing.

Originally posted by peck420
reply to post by undo

 

So it is everybody else's fault but yours?

Second.

i'm trying to figure out where you got that idea from. we worked, we paid our taxes to support the various programs the system demanded it needed. what have i done wrong now?

reply to post by apacheman


I left college to take my first job doing home loans for a larger scale mortgage broker in SD that was split into 2 separate companies in the same office and they where on the level but its about closing deals and getting payed

my 2nd job my boss is serving only 2 years in federal prison for 129 counts of fraud to which i had no clue about until the feds came in and if i see that fool ima beat him to death
When your making 6Gs a month to sell and nothing if you don't

Ive done things less then legally to make money in the past but nothing Ive done in my life was less ethical and morally wrong then the legal job i did and was well paid for, but truly is the greatest regret i have.

Only silver lining is that i learned more about the real world in 1 year then 6 years of school could ever have.

GPs words "you got a keep the people hungry"



Two quotes you should know to understand this world and the people thinking within it

“Nevertheless, the argument indicates this, if we would be happy, to be the path along which we should proceed. With a view to concealment we will establish secret brotherhoods and political clubs. And there are professors of rhetoric who teach the art of persuading courts and assemblies; and so, partly by persuasion and partly by force, I shall make unlawful gains and not be punished. Still I hear a voice saying that the gods cannot be deceived, neither can they be compelled. But what if there are no gods? or, suppose them to have no care of human things --why in either case should we mind about concealment? And even if there are gods, and they do care about us, yet we know of them only from tradition and the genealogies of the poets; and these are the very persons who say that they may be influenced and turned by ‘sacrifices and soothing entreaties and by offerings.’ Let us be consistent then, and believe both or neither. If the poets speak truly, why then we had better be unjust, and offer of the fruits of injustice; for if we are just, although we may escape the vengeance of heaven, we shall lose the gains of injustice; but, if we are unjust, we shall keep the gains, and by our sinning and praying, and praying and sinning, the gods will be propitiated, and we shall not be punished.” -Plato, The Republic, Book II

"I am a most unhappy man. I have unwittingly ruined my country. A great industrial nation is controlled by its system of credit. Our system of credit is concentrated. The growth of the nation, therefore, and all our activities are in the hands of a few men. We have come to be one of the worst ruled, one of the most completely controlled and dominated Governments in the civilized world no longer a Government by free opinion, no longer a Government by conviction and the vote of the majority, but a Government by the opinion and duress of a small group of dominant men." -Woodrow Wilson, after signing the Federal Reserve into existence

Originally posted by peck420

Originally posted by whaaa




What part of this do people not get. If a business has no buyers it is no longer a business.

The sellers and the government can play whatever games they want, if people buy they are condoning the game. If people stop buying they are out of business.

And what you fail to get is that ordinary people can't boycott and stop buying. They are dependent on the basic necessities of life. Food, fuel, shelter. The businesses can wait a lot longer than you think they can. I throw up the false shortages as proof. ex. oil shortage to drive up prices.

www.jimbernard.org...

price fixing is a reality you seem unaware of.

www.marketmanipulation.com...

In today business world...information is power and academics is BS.

edit on 19-11-2011 by whaaa because: (no reason given)

reply to post by undo


I apologize for that. I should have been clearer.

My 'you' was in reference to buyers as a whole.

I have accepted the fact that I have helped create the current paradigm as both a buyer and seller. Have you accepted the part you have personally played?

reply to post by whaaa


You are parroting the paradigm that they want you to believe.

It doesn't make it true.

You may want to go ask an oil executive how much money it would cost an oil company to halt production for a day. As they don't have the storage facilities to stock pile more than a day or two worth of production.

I will give you a hint, start in the billions and move upwards.

They are 100% dependent on the buyers buying. The entire system, right now, is based on a continuous flow of product. Any interruptions hurt and hurt badly. They chose this system, as when it runs smoothly, they profit immensely. However, if it stops they will suffer an inverse to the profit gain, basically they will hurt immensely.

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus

Originally posted by Equidae

Originally posted by ThirdEyeofHorus
reply to post by Equidae

 

especially when all a business degree gives you are people/manipulation skills.

I do have to disagree with you there. My minor was Business Management, and you have to take econ and accounting as basic courses, then there is at least one course in management style learning about Taylor etc, types of corporations and how they operate, branding of product, making up business plans, etc. Project Management could also be considered people skills to some degree, but it's really maintaining a project of production start to finish with timelines etc. It's even offered as a complete area of concentration all by itself.

You're right. I'm a science major, and we tend to get a bit snobby about so called "soft" degrees

Yes, I am also a science major, but my minor is Bus Management. There is nothing "soft" about accounting techniques and many people do not pass the CPA exam first time around.
I do think, however, that many Universities build in "soft" courses to all their degrees to make everyone a bit more well rounded(or maybe it's social engineering).
IT people are notorious for not being people-oriented, and a good network manager is now expected to have at least some soft skills. (otherwise, how could they be expected to talk the CFO into building the new VoIP upgrade into the annual budget)

edit on 19-11-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

edit on 19-11-2011 by ThirdEyeofHorus because: (no reason given)

At my school in particular the people in the science/engineering department see business and marketing as fall back degrees because they're usually the number one major picked when people realize they either can't hack it, or just don't like a COSAM major (not to mention our athletes and MRS seekers really gravitate towards those degrees.)

The OP has points that are mostly true. I might add some other ideas that I believe in.
1. Perhaps school loans and / or college is not for everybody. Although I made it from a child on food stamps to grad school ( my brother made it through medical school) the thought has crossed my mind that college may not be the best bet for my kids. They have college savings accounts that are being funded but I think perhaps they would be better off opening a non union plumbing or landscaping company. They charge a lot of money, don't require a lot of training (certainly not as much as going to university would). And you can move places and be competitive.
2. this point is an extension of #1. It seems as though the timing of this recession coincides a little bit with the dying off of the great depression generation. Their wisdom died with them apparently. So, all of these things you see today, if it is really important to you, should be passed on with detail to our children. Certainly these days will pass, and my belief is that my child will be better off that I experienced this, rather than him having to go through it blindly. Just don't forget these lessons, or your children will have to take another series of unexpected blows too. These days have happened in the past, have happened recently and will happen again.

reply to post by Epirus


There has been some really well written posts so far on this thread. I am a person who rarely attained an educational establishment. I received an up bringing by a single mum on social security ( welfare) and the place i called home was a deprived council estate (the projects). I never thought of bettering my self at that time because i never thought past the day i was on. I educated myself at a late age like 21 or so and i am now thirty and have an IQ of around 126. All i wish is that my past could of been different. An my mum could have afforded to provide a good education for me and my 5 siblings. It boils down to money in the end if i had grown up in a different area. Then my out look for life at that time would be different. Even if we were still a single mum family on social security we would have had a different type of environment. This effects a lot of aspects of up bringing such as,caliber of friends, fear,self worth. I could list a lot of things in the form of scenarios that would differ from some to people like me and are every day life. It would all sound like excuses to most who have not experienced life as some of us know. Just the other day less than 20 feet from my house a young man was stabbed ten times this sort of thing is common here. Know if you think i do not want nor care for giving my kids a better life away from here you are mistaken. I try for private renting of a home every week to move from this environment.The problem i get is i can not get a home owner guarantor due to no one in my family own there own home. An if i find a place where they do not want a guarantor then they want one becouse of where i come from . I could go on and on with this so i will stop here and just end it with im an idealist and thing the best eduction should be free to all as to better us as i race. The young man who works at petrol station could have been the one to cure cancer if given the right education .

If your going to argue with OP's points, let me help you out...


Basically you need to suggest that poor people are lazy, or college grads with debt are lazy, or OWS protestors are lazy. Also note that rich people are very busy important people.

Can someone explain something i saw on tv last night. I caught a part of "children in need", (british charity tv extravaganza and charity). There was a piece on poor families and poverty. Now, as a single mum who works, struggles but survives i am fully aware of how increasingly difficult it is to manage in the current economic climate. There was a family featured, who lived in a poor area of england, in a flat that was damp, apparantly sometimes the children went without supper, and the poor little lad in the family got bullied in school because he only had his sisters old school girl shirts to wear to school. Now i dont understand this, i have seen school shirts in charity shops for a £1, in fact some local authorities give grants to low income families to help with the purchase of uniforms. Secondly, i dont see why a child has to go without a hot meal in the evening. A loaf of bread with 20 plus slices is 50p, a can of beans approx 30p. For 50p theres two evening meals there. A ten kilo bag of spuds is £2 in lidl, thats about 50 jacket potato meals, I dont see how any children should GO WITHOUT an evening meal. And the irony was, as he was telling the camera about what a struggle his families life was, he was playing on his x-box.
I am a socialist, i hope i always will be, but i just dont understand this.
And ridiculously, with regards to poverty, i would be significantly better off if i didnt work, and would get more help (hand outs).

reply to post by indisputable

yeah you are right because its not just what you have its what they will let you have in this society
No ones credit is good now
But 5-6 years ago you could have gotten a loan much more easily then now where only the select can get approved

Everyone else is just on their own in a world where a dime isn't worth a nickel anymore

Originally posted by jimnuggits
A four year moratorium on college and trade school fees, with an equal opportunity to receive food and shelter and clothing is exactly what we need. Educate, feed, clothe and shelter everyone for four years, with education in manufacturing radiant energy technologies, infrastructure engineering, and the Arts being heavily promoted. The money we will save letting the banks fail will more than pay to provide all of this for every American. And, after four years, watch the innovation and advancement thrive...

Mandating that schools report accurate employment and earning rates would also be a big help. Astronomy is a big casualty: America produces yearly more astronomy majors than there are jobs total (not just open jobs, but any astronomy related job) that deal specifically in astronomy. Colleges get around this by saying that the vast majority of astronomy grads are employed and making high wages. What they don't tell you is that in the majority of cases the jobs have nothing to do with astronomy (most grads end up as software engineers or programmers.) It also gives schools many slave labor TAs to save money, and allow tenured professors to spend much less time actually teaching. I love astronomy, and really want to major in it, but after reading those statistics I opted for a pre-health track. I think most people would prefer to actually work in their field that they spent 6 or more years preparing for.

Law school students are another deceived group that has been getting a lot of press lately. A friend of mine went to one of the top law schools in the country, graduated in the top 20% of their class, and was an officer in several student organizations. Despite all of this it took them over a year to finally land a full time job as a lawyer.

Criminal justice is an example of a degree that really isn't worth the paper it's printed on unless you want to go back home to be a deputy in Nowhereville. That's not to say it won't get you hired, but if all things being equal you're up against another candidate with a 'better' major (psychology, foreign language, etc) you will probably get passed over.

Originally posted by thedoctorswife
Can someone explain something i saw on tv last night. I caught a part of "children in need", (british charity tv extravaganza and charity). There was a piece on poor families and poverty. Now, as a single mum who works, struggles but survives i am fully aware of how increasingly difficult it is to manage in the current economic climate. There was a family featured, who lived in a poor area of england, in a flat that was damp, apparantly sometimes the children went without supper, and the poor little lad in the family got bullied in school because he only had his sisters old school girl shirts to wear to school. Now i dont understand this, i have seen school shirts in charity shops for a £1, in fact some local authorities give grants to low income families to help with the purchase of uniforms. Secondly, i dont see why a child has to go without a hot meal in the evening. A loaf of bread with 20 plus slices is 50p, a can of beans approx 30p. For 50p theres two evening meals there. A ten kilo bag of spuds is £2 in lidl, thats about 50 jacket potato meals, I dont see how any children should GO WITHOUT an evening meal. And the irony was, as he was telling the camera about what a struggle his families life was, he was playing on his x-box.
I am a socialist, i hope i always will be, but i just dont understand this.
And ridiculously, with regards to poverty, i would be significantly better off if i didnt work, and would get more help (hand outs).

I can only speak for my country (the US) regarding this, but I recently read a book called Poverty In America which is a study of the realities and attitudes of society and the poor. A particular chapter went in to how living assistance is a double edged sword. Many people are offered temp jobs, but usually refuse them since there won't be long term employment. These jobs are usually offered in a hierarchy based on length of government assistance. When you agree to work somewhere you are automatically taken off of many assistance program rosters, and then have to reapply after you temp job ends. Then you are stuck starting over in seniority on the rosters that determine who are offered jobs first.