OWS now heckeling, following, threatening children???, page 16

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reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 09:47 PM by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

no, i don't own my home. if i stop paying taxes on it,
the IRS takes it away in conjunction with federal law. that means even if i paid off the original mortgage, it would still not be mine. it's an illusion that i own this property.

That is because your house and property is used as collaterol by the irs/fed/imf! The problem is we have the fed which is a private central bank in america(like the ecb in europe) and every dollar that gets issued comes with an interest rate payment attached to it.

The irs collects for the fed and the parent imf. Whatever doesn't get wasted by our enormous government goes to pay interest. Please read this very informative and long article. It explains everything in more detail than I or anyone else could!

reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 09:47 PM by undo

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

no, it requires absolute control in order for it to work, and to have absolute control it ends up having to kill alot of dissenters or people who just don't fit the program. and i don't buy that it was to keep the capitalists out. lol sorry not buying it. not after reading that he deliberately starved milions of Ukrainians to death by first stealing all their food, then all their seeds (in the name of collectivization) so they couldn't plant more food. and then surrounding their areas with troops and blocked roads so they couldn't escape and were literally starved to death in their own homes. millions of them. then the gov's scientists and atheists had this morbid thing about wondering if the "good christian people" would start eating each other, and used it as evidence when it did happen, that man is indeed an animal. it was the biggest concentration camp in history. AND HERE'S THE BIG CLUE. we didn't hear a thing about it till very recently. entirely too late to make people aware of just how bad communism is.

reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 09:57 PM by undo

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

no, i don't own my home. if i stop paying taxes on it,
the IRS takes it away in conjunction with federal law. that means even if i paid off the original mortgage, it would still not be mine. it's an illusion that i own this property.

That is because your house and property is used as collaterol by the irs/fed/imf! The problem is we have the fed which is a private central bank in america(like the ecb in europe) and every dollar that gets issued comes with an interest rate payment attached to it.

The irs collects for the fed and the parent imf. Whatever doesn't get wasted by our enormous government goes to pay interest. Please read this very informative and long article. It explains everything in more detail than I or anyone else could!

doesn't matter what they do with it afterwards, it's not mine. nobody owns anything that requires you pay yearlyo taxes for it, and that would include your motor vehicle and business. your savings. your labor. why do they need more ? in communism, they want it all, even control of your brain, 24/7/365

reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 10:08 PM by EarthCitizen07

reply to post by undo

I agree communism is evil for the same reasons you mentioned, but I still think the wall was INITIALLY built to keep capitalists out. What later happened is a different story and YES IT IS IMPORTANT! I am not a supporter of communism, but people keep insisting that socialism and communism are nearly identical and that pisses me off.

There needs to be a balance between private initiative and national collectivism. Some things should be public while others should be private. Further I believe in spiritualism(NOT religion), I am pro-abortion with conditions, pro gay rights, pro gun ownership with restrictions, pro freedom of speech, PRO BALANCE!

Neither capitalism nor communism satisfies my taste buds. Capitalism had its chance and failed due to human weakness of regulating big business and banks. I refuse to sit idlely and watch the world degrade into a corporate dictatorship run out of washington and london.

We as humans are capable of much more!!

reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 10:22 PM by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by undo

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Originally posted by undo
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

no, i don't own my home. if i stop paying taxes on it,
the IRS takes it away in conjunction with federal law. that means even if i paid off the original mortgage, it would still not be mine. it's an illusion that i own this property.

That is because your house and property is used as collaterol by the irs/fed/imf! The problem is we have the fed which is a private central bank in america(like the ecb in europe) and every dollar that gets issued comes with an interest rate payment attached to it.

The irs collects for the fed and the parent imf. Whatever doesn't get wasted by our enormous government goes to pay interest. Please read this very informative and long article. It explains everything in more detail than I or anyone else could!

doesn't matter what they do with it afterwards, it's not mine. nobody owns anything that requires you pay yearlyo taxes for it, and that would include your motor vehicle and business. your savings. your labor. why do they need more ? in communism, they want it all, even control of your brain, 24/7/365

Ok. Lets forget communism for a while! Do you think people should pay taxes at all? What should be the rate? What detterents or incentives should be used instead? I think we need not only a smaller government(which the republicans are clearly against) but we also need public loyalty. We keep getting short changed immensely in favor of big business.

Taxation without representation should not be acceptable in any republic or democracy imho.

reply posted on 23-11-2011 @ 10:46 PM by undo

reply to post by EarthCitizen07

well out of all the things that i heard/read/watched during my investigation of zeitgeist, i remember clearly a gentleman who suggested building vertical gardens/farms in the cities. think his name was leonard...or similar to that. anyway. i thought that was a good idea. people could work in these gardens and distribute the produce to the members of that city who were without food. problem solved. isn't part of the problem that there's not enough food ? i kept thinking we should be rrunning around planting fruit bearing trees in public grounds in the cities, then you could just walk by, grab a fruit and keep going. but his vertical farming sounds better (cause you get veggies too).

as far as the rest of it, if we could just get a cheaper way to use solar/wind combos for generating power, people struggling with bills, could have a solar/wind installed, no more energy bills (or lower at least) i mean if we're going to generate a population in which free market capitalism is crippled like no tomorrow, and therefore there are millions of people without the means to pay things like energy bills, what better way to take care of that problem in one fell swoop, and help the environment? (i admit things like this go thru my head alot because i don't like to see people suffering when there are solutions).

as far as work is concerned and wages, i still believe capitalism is the answer. it just needs to be available to everyone, but because we as a society are crippled by too many taxes and fees and permits and crap, only some get to enjoy the benefits of capitalism, including the joy of giving to others

reply posted on 24-11-2011 @ 04:02 AM by nenothtu

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

Protest movements do not need leaders because they compromise of like-minded individuals who more-or-less convey the same message. AFAIK the Tea Party did not have leaders either and eventually got swallowed up by the republicans.

EXACTLY!

Without a shepherd, the sheep fall to the wolves.

OWS is an extremely broad movement encompassing protesters from the extreme left all the way to the moderate right, and this is because everyone is fed up with the two party, corporation dominated, war mongering nature of our republic. To be specific, too much money is going to the military-industrial complex for various(and some unknown) reasons and too much money is spent on bailing out big business from their own plunderous mistakes by the FED. Then there are too many tax loopholes for the ultra-rich which means the barely millionares need to pick up the slack for them.

Tax laws are not enacted on Wall Street. The proper place to aim grievances is at those who enact the tax laws.

Things need to change for the better, one way or another. I think it is time for the smaller parties to make their move over the big ones now, but this is my opinion and may not correlate with other OWS protesters.

Effective change starts when you change what is within your own individual reach.. All else is crand schemes, sound bites, and catchy phrases.

edit on 2011/11/24 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)

reply posted on 24-11-2011 @ 02:14 PM by nenothtu

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
It is a pretty sad day in america when socialists get called commies and blamed for free market ideals of reagan and bush gone bad. Reagan was the one who came up with deregulation of the markets and leveraged buyouts, spent trillions on star wars BS and then came bush to repeal the glass steagel act to cause this armageddon of financial catastrophes.

Glass-Steagal was repealed under Klinton. However, we can't be badmouthing the "left" wingers by pointing that out, can we? Let's just blame that on Bush, too, in a partisan rant. After all, it's not like he did enough wrong otherwise, is it?

Then obama takes over and is expected to clean house in just 4 years. Yeah right! That is like asking an olympic swimmer to cross the atlantic ocean by himself, in other words impossible.

He could be expected to live up to his promises, but he gets a pass for being on "your" side of the partisan debate, right?

Yes the democrats are corrupt. We all know that but they don't really create any problems, they simpley stay out of the white house and play golf all day. Trust me that is an accomplishment in that doing nothing is better than doing the wrong things.

Ah. They're corrupt then, but get a pass for that because they're on the proper "side" of corrupt politics, right?

I feel sorry for all the people who have been brainwashed to death...but at the same time it is not my fault either. I am simply telling it like it is so people wake the hell up!

I feel sorry for them, too - especially the ones who have been brainwashed and locked into a partisan worldview, where the "other guys" are corrupt and evil, but "my guys" are corrupt, but good.

You're not "telling it like it is", you're "telling it like you see it".

To use your own words, "wake the hell up!"

reply posted on 24-11-2011 @ 02:32 PM by nenothtu

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

If we had socialism the FED would have been disolved, the government would answer to the people, airlines and auto companies would be public and run by government, but your belongings would be private. Many small and medium business would also be private.

Socialism is predicated on central control of large masses of people by giving them the illusion that they somehow "own in common the means of production", while simultaneously NOT having control of the very things they are alleged to "own". Central banking is part and parcel of that centralized control mechanism.

Giving small and medium businesses "ownership" in private of themselves, but retaining control of them in fact by operating their purse strings via central planning and banking isn't really allowing them control of their lives.

The only thing that I can find that could remotely confuse people is the corporate welfare fraud! In europe however they only bailed out public enterprise. Anything that was private was left to fail, just like it should.

ANY failing business should be left to fail - public or private. "Corporate welfare" is socialism at it's heart - it's an artificial life support for a dying world, which will eventually kill the patient rather than fix it as claimed. It's a basic rule of nature - they dying die, and leave the rest stronger. Can't go against nature itself, no matter how much centralization and how many laws you advocate for. The dying will eventually die, life support or not. It's just a matter of whether the rest are taken along for the ride as well. Socialism insists that we ALL board that boat.

It seems you don't know the basics yet and worst of all you don't even care to learn. Just spouting nonsensical propaganda in the hope that OWS fails and everyone rellects the republicans. Don't worry you are not alone.

One of us doesn't "know the basics" in any more than a cursory, academically sterilized way, that's for sure.

I'd be careful flinging around that "nonsensical propaganda" sword, if I were you.

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