Eve of Destruction?

reply to post by seagull

All of which is very changeable, if we're prepared as a whole, to do something about it. Good grief, don't you all get it?

Seagull, I don't know where to start...

I think that being slaves is more complicated than just getting it. The system we live in has us chained. If there ever was one veil of deception over the population, it is this one. We are controlled, assimilated, individualized, constantly bombarded by waves of propaganda to make us believe that we should aim to be law abiding citizens and responsible adults. Starts at a very young age. Early education already sets us up to fit in the mold in which we shall spend the rest of our lives. Be a good citizen, be responsible, follow the rules. Make a family and continue the tradition in which you were raised. But do it all in accordance to the laws, rules and values that the government has put in place...just for you.

All nice and dandy but double edged. The government, the system of law, the system of education, has become corrupt. Is it changeable?

Slavery? Bull. No one is a slave to anything, or anyone.

True. Freedom of choice, yes?

Yes, one can get out of the system and become homeless. One can become a rebel and be jailed. One can start a revolution and be shot. This isn't really what I would call freedom.

Now it could be changeable if we're prepared as a whole, to do something about it...

Look at manifestations throughout history. Nah. Look at present events. The OWS movement. The MSM (the government holding the strings) always applaud such a new effort when it comes out. And the population cheers. Then very slowly, very subtly starts showing the bad grains and willingly puts aside the majority of good grains that are still there for the right reasons. And the population starts to question the legitimacy of the movement. And finally, will show just how bad such a movement is and stops it. Enough is enough they always claim, and the population will agree. Masters of deception.

So what are the solutions Seagull?

With all due respect, if you could expand on your thoughts, perhaps, that would help me get it...

Originally posted by seagull
All the Doomsday scenarios are possible. True. But likely? No, I don't think so... Of course, only time will tell.

Most doomsday scenarios don't even have anything to do with man. If you believe mankind won't destroy themselves, I'm fine by that. But ATS are always talking about a lot of doomsday events that man has little to no control of. If mankind fails to master space travel, survival of the human species is far from certain. The longer it's stuck on earth, the worse it gets.

Those harking on about slavery really should have been born 200 years ago. Then maybe they'd understand what slavery means. Today, most of us are slaves only to our own paranoias. (though sadly elsewhere in the world it's not always the case.)

But I'm quite certain those born today in India have a much brighter future than their grandparents did - they will live longer, be healthier, eat more and have much more material possessions. They will see great things.

Sometimes I think Americans forget the other 99%


Oh, and if the very worse thing imaginable ever happens, and a mutant star goat does eat the sun, then there's still time to book your seats on the 'B' Ark

There are different ideologies and there are weapons on a finite planet. There is only so much space and so many resources. Did humanity ever have 1 day of worldwide peace in it's history or will it have such a day in the future I sometimes wonder, not 1 conflict anywhere?

The only way mankind will live peacefully forever on this planet and eventually make it to outer space is to have 1 ideology, a strict child policy (like no more than 2 to prevent overpopulation) and an absence of weapons. Until then it is only a matter of time before another war develops. The difference this time is that there are nukes which were not made to be decoration.

I could just as easily convince myself everything will be fine but I believe it's better to be aware of the possibility and prepare for it whether or not it will happen, so not be surprised when it comes knocking at the door.

reply to post by SonoftheSun

So what are the solutions Seagull?

Solutions? I don't have any. If I did, I'd be running for elected office, or writing best selling books.

But they're out there. Waiting for you, or me, to stumble across them. I do know this though, it'll take work to implement. It'll take making those choices. Not all those choices we have are necessarily good ones, or painless. It's been my experience that most of the ones we need to make the most are the most painful, one way or another.

I'm not omniscient, nor omnipotent, so I can't claim to have the answers we all seek. It's up to all of us to find the answers together. A conductor can start the symphony, but it takes a group of musicians to make the music.

This has gone a bit off tangent, but I'm talking about having faith, however misguided it may seem, that we as individuals working together can and will stave off our "Eve". It won't be easy, it'll be hard, maybe heartrendingly so, but we've come to the realization that its necessary. Haven't we? If we allow ourselves to be defeated before even attempting the changes, then indeed maybe we are "slaves".

Originally posted by seagull
reply to post by rebellender

 

Slave to the daily grind..working harder for the daily bread.
Slave to a tyrant government, 435 house of representatives 100 Senators reduced to a 12 man committee reduced to a 6 man committee. 535 positions there by law and should be held to productive accountability.

All of which is very changeable, if we're prepared as a whole, to do something about it. Good grief, don't you all get it? Nothing is immutable. Nothing exists that isn't changeable.

Too many of us look at a situation and say, "That's impossible to fix...", or "That's beyond our control..." Or words to that effect.

Slavery? Bull. No one is a slave to anything, or anyone. Now you may not be willing to change, for a whole host of reasons, and not all of them are bad ones. Kids. Family. That's why so many of us have jobs we hate, and can't break away. That doesn't make us slaves, that makes us responsible adults...

You're only a slave if you allow yourself to be tied down when there is an opportunity presented. One can only be a willing slave.

ok I am stupid ....in my 50 yrs and world exposure, you are correct I DONT GET IT...They have won to make me believe a lie..How ever could I be so disillusioned .....here I will fix it ...I will read a bunch of prosperity Self help books, then I will be a good Zionist Capitalist

seriously if you still believe in "The Dream" you are not spending your own money

reply to post by rebellender


I've been out in the world too, and for just about as long. I see people succeeding in finding their dreams on a fairly constant basis. Why? Because they damned well work for it. I've a friend in Alaska who owns his own fishing boat now. A very nice 45' purse seiner. How? By working his ass off on other peoples boats. In the process he's raised a couple of great kids, and a marriage going on nearly thirty years. He's only one amongst millions.

Don't for a moment try to convince me it can't be done. Because it can be done.

As for spending others money? I don't think so. Everything I have, I've earned. To allude otherwise is... Well you go ahead and think of a word.

reply to post by seagull


the biggest illusion for young people these days is that the life of the world starts when each of them comes to age. with that comes a complete lack of respect for what an elder has to say.....by this i mean that when my son was 25 I lived 25 yrs of life + 25yrs of life = i will always have 25 yrs of life on him. Life experiance, idealism, experience of religion, fulfilling dreams, loosing everything, realization of truth, realization of illusion. its not just a game of chicken and knowing when to flinch

we will catch up in 20 yrs and compare notes..bye now


referencing the later post: isnt illumination wonderful....when you know you have a secret....when you are in the know and someone else is struggling and you have the answer if they only see the world through your glasses.. gotcha

reply to post by seagull

This has gone a bit off tangent, but I'm talking about having faith

I do understand your point of view. This is why I like ATS so much. The diversity.

I do not see the world as you do but I'll respect your take on it. Apologies for having taking this off topic a bit.

And thank you for sharing your thoughts.

Originally posted by SonoftheSun
reply to post by seagull

 

All of which is very changeable, if we're prepared as a whole, to do something about it. Good grief, don't you all get it?

Seagull, I don't know where to start...

I think that being slaves is more complicated than just getting it. The system we live in has us chained. If there ever was one veil of deception over the population, it is this one. We are controlled, assimilated, individualized, constantly bombarded by waves of propaganda to make us believe that we should aim to be law abiding citizens and responsible adults. Starts at a very young age. Early education already sets us up to fit in the mold in which we shall spend the rest of our lives. Be a good citizen, be responsible, follow the rules. Make a family and continue the tradition in which you were raised. But do it all in accordance to the laws, rules and values that the government has put in place...just for you.

All nice and dandy but double edged. The government, the system of law, the system of education, has become corrupt. Is it changeable?

Slavery? Bull. No one is a slave to anything, or anyone.

True. Freedom of choice, yes?

Yes, one can get out of the system and become homeless. One can become a rebel and be jailed. One can start a revolution and be shot. This isn't really what I would call freedom.

Now it could be changeable if we're prepared as a whole, to do something about it...

Look at manifestations throughout history. Nah. Look at present events. The OWS movement. The MSM (the government holding the strings) always applaud such a new effort when it comes out. And the population cheers. Then very slowly, very subtly starts showing the bad grains and willingly puts aside the majority of good grains that are still there for the right reasons. And the population starts to question the legitimacy of the movement. And finally, will show just how bad such a movement is and stops it. Enough is enough they always claim, and the population will agree. Masters of deception.

So what are the solutions Seagull?

With all due respect, if you could expand on your thoughts, perhaps, that would help me get it...

edit on 16-11-2011 by SonoftheSun because: added quote

hey man. I know what you are saying...the Moderators have to push this Super Positive Persona ...they dont realize that they are the ones that have "Given In To IT" ...us by seeing the chains that bind can be free from the bondage. I am not defeated by no means. here is an outside quote:

When I meet people who think they know what they are talking about, and state it as fact, when it is plain and clear that they barely scratch the surface of the subject matter - That's when I tend to exit the conversation. Because people like that can't "talk" about these subjects. They "KNOW" about it already.. Please sir, wake up and smell the mythological overlay!

Originally posted by rebellender
hey man. I know what you are saying...the Moderators have to push this Super Positive Persona ...they dont realize that they are the ones that have "Given In To IT"

how, by the grace of whomever, does that seabird guy's personal views have a tinker's damn to do with their being a site admin here? ??

oh. i get it. "the Moderators have to push this Super Positive Persona"

this place just gets funnier all the time.

...us by seeing the chains that bind can be free from the bondage. I am not defeated by no means. here is an outside quote:

When I meet people who think they know what they are talking about, and state it as fact, when it is plain and clear that they barely scratch the surface of the subject matter - That's when I tend to exit the conversation. Because people like that can't "talk" about these subjects. They "KNOW" about it already.. Please sir, wake up and smell the mythological overlay!

how about... instead of, "...us by seeing the chains that bind can be free from the bondage"

free yourself from bondage by freeing your mind from thinking that you are bound - by anyone.

as for the 'outside quote'...

it is wiser to learn from the experience of others than it is to hinder and burden one's self with having to endure the same

???

Originally posted by Annie Mossity

Originally posted by rebellender
hey man. I know what you are saying...the Moderators have to push this Super Positive Persona ...they dont realize that they are the ones that have "Given In To IT"

how, by the grace of whomever, does that seabird guy's personal views have a tinker's damn to do with their being a site admin here? ?

?

oh. i get it. "the Moderators have to push this Super Positive Persona"

this place just gets funnier all the time.

...us by seeing the chains that bind can be free from the bondage. I am not defeated by no means. here is an outside quote:

When I meet people who think they know what they are talking about, and state it as fact, when it is plain and clear that they barely scratch the surface of the subject matter - That's when I tend to exit the conversation. Because people like that can't "talk" about these subjects. They "KNOW" about it already.. Please sir, wake up and smell the mythological overlay!

how about... instead of, "...us by seeing the chains that bind can be free from the bondage"

free yourself from bondage by freeing your mind from thinking that you are bound - by anyone.

as for the 'outside quote'...

it is wiser to learn from the experience of others than it is to hinder and burden one's self with having to endure the same

???

right on top of that, Rose!!

campfire
guitar strum
kumbayah my lord, kumbayah

reply to post by rebellender



Rebellender,

With all due respect.

First, one moderator giving his honest opinion doesn't mean at no time that ALL moderators have the same opinion.

Second, a moderator and/or moderators do NOT have to push anything. Except T&C, which I might be breaking here, by giving you this reply, not sure.

Third, you do realize that a moderator and/or moderators are people like you and me, right?

Finally, I do not enjoy having words put in my mouth. Never did, never will.

Just to be clear on my previous replies. And, honestly, I don't think I can be any clearer than that.

my apologies to the thread, Moderators, and to You SonoftheSon please I will post no further here

reply to post by seagull


For me, "doom" is split unilaterally into two categories --- subjective and objective doom. Subjective -- that which I create or otherwise influence unto myself or those within my sphere and objective -- that which I cannot control or influence ........ yet.

I can't concern myself with the unquantified doom (asteroid impact, super-hemmorhagic fever/plague, caldera explosion), because those "natural" functions will always be beyond my influence. The older I get, the less I concern myself with the human-induced doom. Some of my earliest memories are of ducking under our pathetic lil' school desks during a drill, as we were frightened of the [then] imminent Red army nuclear attack. I mean it was a heavy burdon for 5-year-olds who were actually more afraid of those imaginary things that lurked in the darkness than of the fears of their fathers and mothers. The doom was oppressive. A whistle went off downtown every day except Sunday at noon. The noon whistle was a constant reminder that if the whistle was heard anytime other than noon, that doom, real doom, was incoming.

My own self-made doom has been far more injurious to my psyche. My fears, my unquantified free-floating fears of everything and sometimes anything. Listen, these things, the fabric of self-made nightmares are what keep people from LIVING. Several years ago, I chose to live; my situation was and is not far above poverty, and I have everyday life woes, but I'm not going to displace wonder with fear any more.

There will ALWAYS be hot and cold running doom. Doom is sexy for some. Doom is a drug. Doom has its place, but its place is not sitting next to me murmuring in my ear. Its place is on a shelf, next to the Bible, next to the science books and math books and hand-crafted nicknacks and emergency candles.

reply to post by seagull


I don't think s pessimism, nor do I think the world has faced ALL that it currently faces before.

You say this is a walk in the park?!



Sorry, I disagree.

This is global collapse of resources, global climate change, and (soon to come) mass ecosystem collapses, interacting with global abstract systems that are no longer capable of reflecting the reality of the situation at hand, or adequately providing what the people need.

Mass conflict is inevitable, you can call it what you want, but to think that we can peacefully get throughou this mess, after assessing how much ignorance vs awareness is out there ... I think that's insanity. I think if history proves anything, it's that we rarely make it through complex problems without having a lot of blood spilled. Optimists think differently. Whatever. Naivety will continue on, even after the last bomb is launched.

that you equate such to mere...

Originally posted by rebellender
campfire
guitar strum
kumbayah my lord, kumbayah

edit on 11/10/2011 by rebellender because: (no reason given)

... is beyond me. ??

to ignore outright or abject to even pondering or taking into consideration the faults, flaws and failures of those who've long-since gone before you is not just sheer and utter stupidity, it's idiotic. *derp a der*

in other words,
ima pound mah head thru this here brick wall, despite others having been there and done that long before me, and that 'advice' of those who've also tried their level best to inform me of their trials, tribulations and learned experience with the same throughout.

makes no damned sense whatsoever, but...

go ahead be all you can be

reply to post by unityemissions


A walk in the park? Not by any stretch of the imagination. It's a dangerous time, indeed. Oddly enough, I am, in my normal day to day activities more than a bit pessimistic. But on a whole, I know, as an article of faith, that Man is unlikely to destroy himself deliberately. Accidents happen. Situations devolve beyond our abilities to control... All this could indeed happen.

But every day that man refuses, for whatever reason, to destroy Man, it's one day closer to that time when we finally wake to the realization that we're all in this together.

Cockeyed optimist? Maybe.

Meh, I'm a "glass is half empty" type of person these days.

After 43 years of breathing and sharing this planet with my other fellow human beings, I've become jaded and have no faith anymore in the cranial rationale of the masses as a whole.

It seems like a huge percentage of the population worldwide is either scamming, raping, and/or murdering each other.

We're all nuts and, in my humble opinion, we need to devolve back to swinging from the trees until we can get it right.

Society has become cutthroat, greedy, fast-paced, needy of instant gratification, materialistic, co-dependant, arrogant, mentally/physically/emotionally/economically dysfunctional, etc... and most importantly, respect and consideration for each other have all but disappeared.

Seagull, I wish I had your optimistic hope for the future, but I lost it years ago... there are just too many psychopaths running the planet these days. Now I just go with the flow and do everything in my power to try to keep my own little world as happy as can be, while the rest of the world self implodes.

*sigh*
I think I need a stiff drink now...