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Restricting Human Reproduction. Should it happen?

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posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 01:58 AM
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While population control is desired and useful in most circumstances, this should be voluntary and done thru education that it is needed and useful.

For anyone to advocate governmental enforcement over someones body and its natural functions seems very fascist to me.

ANY talk of choosing which genetic material is/is not usable or desirable sounds like the rise of nazi's...who is to say that any handicapped person has less of a right to reproduce? Where is this line drawn?



XL5

posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 03:58 AM
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How ever then you have to question of does it impose on HIV's rights to have children. Just because the nazi's wanted a perfect race does not mean we will kill a certain race.

Parents should only have children if they intend and can bring them up properly, if not you are hurting the child, no matter how much they want one. What would happen if one of the parents found out his/her parents knowingly made them disabled in some way?

Some times its not about freedom, its about respect and morals and facts.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 04:10 AM
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Originally posted by XL5
Sometimes its not about freedom, its about respect and morals and facts.


Well, with freedom comes responsibility... and where to draw the line between the two is one of democracy's oldest questions.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 04:50 AM
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Yes, everyone has the right to reproduce. However, you should not have a child if YOU cannot support the child yourself. If you are unemployed you should NOT have children, or if you are very low paid you should not have children.

Others should not have to pay or support YOUR children. State benefits are good, but I do not support the fact that I am paying through tax etc for your children. Why should I?



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 10:33 AM
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Originally posted by XL5
What would happen if one of the parents found out his/her parents knowingly made them disabled in some way?


What defines disabled? Some feel circumcision disables them. There was a recent thread on that. Should parents who circumcise be prosecuted? The deaf mothers thread - they obviously didn't consider being deaf a disability, and hoped for a child that could share their world. If a child was raised thinking he was normal and optimal and desirable, would he resent his parents for giving what they thought was a gift?


XL5

posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 03:19 PM
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Hmmm thats a might fine line. I think that any time a child cannot be raised properly or has trouble forced on him self that really effects his life in a negative way. Though I have no idea on circ, if "doin it" still feels good then sure, but I never really wanted to learn more about that subject- ack.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 03:50 PM
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The society is best served by people having whatever number of children they can provide for. The irresponsible procreation by those who have no intention of providing for their children is another story altogether and I'm not talking about welfare here, either. I'm not opening that can of worms.

But, having worked in Child Protective Services for over five years and continuing to work with these children in a educational capacity, I can say that something needs to be done about the circumstances that bring so many children into custody.

I have seen women who have had multiple children brought into custody because they never had any intention of caring for their children and they continue to have them and the state takes custody at the hospital. In some cases the family members stand ready to foster or adopt these children, but in too many cases they wind up in an endless cycle of foster homes, in-patient psychiatric facilities, treatment foster homes, residential treatment centers, group homes, and shelters.

By the time these children become teenagers, they are so hopelessly screwed up that they do not have an honest shot at ever living a normal life. What their genetic inheritance doesn't do to them, the system does. It is a tragedy of monumental proportions.

And lest, some think I am too hard on the women, something needs to be done about the men who father multiple children by mulitple women with no intention of caring for them.

In the extreme cases, involuntary sterilization should be an option of the courts, but by the time the courts can act, children's live will have already been placed in jeopardy. The problem must be met at the very earliest stages. We must return to a time when the right to sexual activity was not divorced from the responsibility of pregancy.

We need to be socializing children to become responsible adults who do not procreate senselessly, not so much to take the burden off society, but to save the childern. And don't tell me aborting babies is the answer. Abortion as a means of birth control is the worst of all atrocities.

I have lived fifty-five years and I have seen first hand what the liberal agenda has done to our society and our children who are the future of our nation. So when those of you who are wont to disparage my conservatism, just bear in mind the misery I have witnessed first hand and take my word that things have not always been this way and that things can change if we just start taking responsibilty for our own actions and stop relying on the state to fix our indiscretions. A child is not a choice. A child is a living, breathing human being of limitless potential. The state is a pathetic substitute for a family.

[edit on 04/9/6 by GradyPhilpott]



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 05:05 PM
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This is beyond liberal vs conservative and beyond the issue of social services and population control. It's being suggested that we control the types of people that can reproduce period. Are we willing to prevent people with certain diseases or genes from choosing a mate or having children. Should the government and law have a say in who can reproduce with who, and prosecute those that do not fit the definition of an acceptable pair.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 05:18 PM
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Originally posted by RedBalloon
This is beyond liberal vs conservative and beyond the issue of social services and population control.


My first sentence summed up my feeling on procreation, in general. The rest was lagniappe.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 05:23 PM
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Originally posted by GradyPhilpott
My first sentence summed up my feeling on procreation, in general. The rest was lagniappe.


Ohh Grady as much as you drive me nuts with the liberal/conservative black and white and with some of your points, I do so like the way you make those points, and cannot help but like you.


Lagniappe. Heh. I like it.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 05:39 PM
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Why, thank you, Red Balloon. The feeling is mutual.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 06:43 PM
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Quite frankly, if it would rid the world of nazi-like organizations such as CPS I would push enforced sterilization across the board
I've heard some serious horror stories about the jobsworths who work in these places and the havoc they cause in innocent peoples lives.

Back to topic,

I think breeding needs to be limited across the board. Whether or not the parents have the money to raise the child makes little difference in the overall overcrowding that we are experiencing in the world today. And I'm only talking about countries like the UK and US. Other people can wax rhapsodic over the third world countries if they like, but I'm sticking with what I'm forced to endure every day. That being a stinky, polluted, overpopulated country where, because there are so many people, simply going out to the store for some groceries becomes a stressful event where you literally have to elbow people out of your way, from the drive there to the experience of shopping itself, in order to finish, and get home to some measure of peace and quiet.

I cringe inwardly whenever I hear about another person my mother or my friends knows expecting a(nother) baby. I'm like "great....another minivan on the road in a few years to get in front of me and slow me down".

And besides the overcrowding aspect, I have to wonder what the breeders THINK in the first place. Bringing a kid into a world that is rapidly descending into a police state.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 06:56 PM
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Just a thought

How about offering cash to those in the starving countries that will agree to be sterilized? No one would be forced to do anything and those that agree would have a step up

Just a thought



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 06:59 PM
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Originally posted by Amuk
How about offering cash to those in the starving countries that will agree to be sterilized? No one would be forced to do anything and those that agree would have a step up


You payin'?

Who pays for the proceedure?
Who pays for the followup care?
Who pays for the reward?



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 07:02 PM
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Originally posted by RedBalloon
You payin'?

Who pays for the proceedure?
Who pays for the followup care?
Who pays for the reward?



Whose paying to feed them now?

Some of that money could be redirected.

Also a group could be set up to take donations for it.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 07:04 PM
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You payin'?



Private contributions. Where's the till?



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 07:21 PM
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Originally posted by KayEm

I cringe inwardly whenever I hear about another person my mother or my friends knows expecting a(nother) baby. I'm like "great....another minivan on the road in a few years to get in front of me and slow me down".

And besides the overcrowding aspect, I have to wonder what the breeders THINK in the first place. Bringing a kid into a world that is rapidly descending into a police state.


Gee, if you feel that strongly about it feel free to remove yourself from the equation.


Actually, what this breeder thought was to have a child would be a logical extention of the love he felt for his wife. To have and to love and to raise a child that was a combination of both I and her, but so much more in addition.

To be honest, I had no idea how good of a parent I would be. No one does until the time comes. Anyone who says different is either crazy or very good at lying to themselves.

Who among us can say where the next genious is going to come from? Can you pick the prospective parents from a lineup? Does hair, skin or eye color make a difference?

But one thing IS an undeniable fact. Without us breeders there wouldn't BE a human race.

Oh, and the people who seem to slow me down when I drive aren't the minivans, those soccer moms rarely have the time to drive slow. No, it's the elderly drivers in their cadillacs driving 15 mph below the limit. How 'bout we solve the population problem by euthanizing everyone over the age of 40? (no i am not serious) Think of all the money we would save!!

I'm sorry to go on a rant, not usually my style. But that breeder thing really got my goat.



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 07:28 PM
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i think 3rd world countries should be manditory for this as they cant look after what they have got so why let them breed to large proportions like 15 kids with no money nor anything for that matter , all they have is 1 massive beging bowel and we have to suffer minor cuts just for them to exsist and grow up feeling us civilised mugs owe them when we dont



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 08:39 PM
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Yes, of course human reproduction should be controlled.
Improving the human gene pool and understanding the
importance of genetic heredity was well understood until
politically correct nonsense of biological equality became
the norm. Selective breeding with proven consequences
every rancher and farmer understands would greatly
benefit the human animal. In a few short generations
having a 20% increase in intelligence, the elimination of
genetic disease, a more physically fit species, and life
prolongation with excellent health into old age could be a
freedom enjoyed by all people. A reduction in the planets
population to a few hundred million (yes, million not
billion) on widely scattered "estates" with automated
industries supplying all the necessities and having a
standard of living for all families much above the upper
class US norm (think each family living in the equivalent of
home like Hearst Castle), with the real humanoid "robot"
replacing the human drones of today just struggling to
survive should be a goal aspired to by all. Instead the
politics and conflicts over the petty differences of mostly
"dumb" superstitious primates has resulted in a
degenerating gene pool with all consequences obvious to
any student of the world today.

This is not a "NAZI" or Humanist view, and certainly
not a strictly NWO viewpoint, but the
philosophy of Transhumanism. More can be learned at:
www.extropy.org...

Population reduction and control WILL happen, either by
design, or disaster. I prefer design.


[edit on 6-9-2004 by mockan]



posted on Sep, 6 2004 @ 09:49 PM
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Judging from the past history of projects designed by humans, I prefer to take my chances thank you.



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