Originally posted by PublicGadfly

Who decides which laws theron? Sure I've heard of “Jim Crow” laws. They were oppressive laws passed by masons to keep masons in power. Lots of whites erroneously believe they were 'white laws.' it wasn't that grand of a scheme. The laws have been linked to [urkl=http://www.pbs.org/itvs/fromswastikatojimcrow/] racial-nazism[/url] in America. White immigrants helped ameliorate the effects of the laws to some extent. None the less, they are a stain upon the American fabric- a masonic stain.

So you keep saying, but it is only your unsupported word. Would you mind proving that MASONS passed Jim Crow laws?

As for deciding which laws to obey and which laws are illegal and immoral, that is, as always, an INDIVIDUAL decision. I decide, and I alone suffer the punishment for breaking any law. NOT masonry.

Nothing new here- non-masons fought and walked streets and marched and got beaten, the masons sat back with their klucker bretheren and laughed.

Hmmm, interesting assertion. I would be very interested in seeing any evidence you have that masons did not march in support of the civil rights acts... and as for klucker brethren, you better put away that sharp stick sonny, before you hurt yourself... you keep poking in ignorance, and all you are doing is showing what a racist YOU are.

Not the brightest example you could have used. Bro. theron. Does not make masonry look good. Who was president and who was in the house and senate when these laws were passed? Come on- come on- - let's see a loooong role of MASONRY on display!

So, you interested in proving masons had anything to do with this nonsense, or are you just going to bluster around for a while? Innuendo and bluster are NOT proof. YOU, sirrah, are a racist.

*theron as a note- please reformat that tome you posted above- I can't tell who said what to who- is that the idea?

If you can't figure it out, I am not going to take you by the hand and lead you to knowldge... read it and stop playing the fool.

Oh, and I still like the italics... I am not sure if you are doing to highlight my name, or to infer that it is not my name... however, if you do a search on my name, you will find NUMEROUS posts and references...

But then, it is not me hiding behind a fake moniker, is is Michael?

Nice playing with you again...


[edit on 4/9/04 by theron dunn]

Originally posted by PublicGadfly
None the less, they are a stain upon the American fabric- a masonic stain.

The stain of Freemasonry forms the words of the Declaration of Independence, The Constitution of the United States, The Bill of Rights, the composition of the "Star Spangled Banner". The leadership of the Founding Fathers were Masons, their blood made fertile the ground that this great nation sprung from. Roosevelt, and Churchill were Masons; they lead the free world against the greatest threat to freedom the world had ever seen. Yes, the stain is there, and the stain will remain despite the detractors who wish to pervert the historical significance of Freemasonry.

Yes, Grandpa Gadfly owes alot to Masonry. All Americans do.

Originally posted by LTD602
Yes, Grandpa Gadfly owes alot to Masonry. All Americans do.

Yuk, yuk good one!

Mirthful next you're going to claim what? King James was really a mason in drag-
or let's see, I know- Columbus was on a voyage of masonic enlightenment!

Some masons crack me up.
According to some of YOU man would still be having wars, and killing each other and there would be gangs and things if there were no masons. No one believes that- not even yourselves. How silly.

Truth- many masons are O.K. guys. The ones that are 'superior' would be superior anyway except in an extremely rare case. Visit your lodge- get off the Internet. Ask the first three masons you come to what do they think about:

a mason letting a known butcher (mass murderer) go free if the murderer was a mason?
a mason lying in court to protect a brother mason accused of child molestation?
a mason subverting his fellows for personal gain?
a mason helping terrorists if the terrorists are also masons and their cause needs help?

I will provide case in point on each of these within a few days- when's lodge? Tuesday night?

Fine- Wednesday give me a post and I'll GIVE you a little masonic education!

Better yet- I will start a thread now- then wednesday we can share


theron don't be so, uh petulant, O.K.?

so, lets see, this is two threads you have posted this on... as I noted in the other, when, on the rare occasion a mason is bad, he is ejected from masonry. If you want to play numbers, I can show you ten good masons, no, a hundred good masons for every possible bad one you can possibly find.

you cannot tar all of us for the actions of a very few, even if you can find proof of what you claim...

as for petulence, my my my, I wouldn't have thought you could spell it, much less know what it means... from a racist like you, being called names after the manner of a child is actually a badge of honor.

keep up the name calling. i have not done so, and you doing so makes you look... foolish and childish. Are you sure your mommy knows you are playing on her computer?

Gadfly,

"Truth- many masons are O.K. guys. The ones that are 'superior' would be superior anyway except in an extremely rare case. Visit your lodge- get off the Internet. Ask the first three masons you come to what do they think about:

a mason letting a known butcher (mass murderer) go free if the murderer was a mason?
a mason lying in court to protect a brother mason accused of child molestation?
a mason subverting his fellows for personal gain?
a mason helping terrorists if the terrorists are also masons and their cause needs help?"



Actually, there were a few people like you at both of the Lodge open houses, and these topics were covered. Answer to all three: those things are incompatible with Masonic ideals. Remember, application states "good moral standing" As a requirement. Like I said, you should attend a Ldoge meeting, some of them are open to guests and the public. Noam Chomsky (who has ne real opinion of Masons since he doesn't know much about them), the GOD of Libertarianism, is not afraid to go out and get in people's faces in public. You should, too.

Which Lodge open houses did you attend, by the way? Have any sponsors yet?

America . . . . built by Masons.

Oh, unless I am mistaken, and he has yet to deny it, our little PublicGadfly is none other than Michael Gentry, he of the Order of Former Freemasons (or as we so lovingly refer to it, the O.F.F.ensive group). He is a former Prince Hall mason, who has abrogated his oaths, and now lies and slanders masons and freemasonry on any board he can get on... until he is kicked off. Most recently, he was removed from the Baptist board for... over the top and unchristian behaviors.

He has been a mason, but for some reason he has yet to adequately explain, he is no longer... oh, he will give you the "I found Jesus" routine, but it hardly explains the vituperation and nastiness that he displays, along with the patent racism he carries like Atlas on his shoulder...

He loves inference, but has a dearth of facts to support his opinions... just like our little buddy here...

Interesting . . . . time to doa bit of searching . . .

Originally posted by theron dunn

He has been a mason, but for some reason he has yet to adequately explain, he is no longer...

Actually, Mr. Gentry has never demitted (or at least made that claim on Bro. DeFoe's The Lodge Room forum). He maintains his Masonic membership, yet proudly calls himself an "Anti-Mason" (which Necros claims doesn't exist), and is one of the five members of "Ex-Masons For Jesus".

These guys are nothing if not entertaining.

Fiat Lvx.

Originally posted by PublicGadfly
Masonic Light you need a name change to “l i t e” less filling or dim-blub whichever works best for you.

Wow, that was a great line...you learn that one in seminary?

M-lite you say that Gentry claims to be “anti-mason. Have I said as much?

That depends upon who are (you still haven't denied Theron's charge that you are Mike).
If you are Mike, then yes, you've stated your anti-Masonic stance a billion times over on The Lodge Room, Ephesians 5:11, and other places; not only to me, but also Theron, Stephen, Tom, Penns, and everybody else. If you're not Mike, then my comments don't concern you anyway, sincr I was addressing the person of Mike Gentry.

Fiat Lvx.

Originally posted by Masonic Light
I was addressing the person of Mike Gentry.

My mistake, I was unclear on this (apparently)

So, gadfly, are you this gentry person, or are you just another masonic critic with a lack of facts and a surfeit of opinions?

Fair question. Are you Gentry, Gadfly? Since you despise liars I assume you'll tell the truth. I think Theron's question is a reasonable one.

I don't think this cat is Gentry because:

1. Mike is an African-American, and Gadfly wrote something earlier about being of European descent.

2. Even though Mike is pretty spaced out with his Bible stuff these days, he is in fact a former Mason, with personal Masonic experience. He would not have written that stuff about the 33° being secret and invisible or whatever, because he knows better. Mike's criticism of Masonry is that the Fraternity is unitarian, i.e., does not sponsor his brand of religious megalomania which he believes you have to have in order to get heaven. But as a former Mason, he is well aware that Masonry isn't really secretive, much less satanic.

Fiat Lvx.

True, but Masonic Light, he HAS made those claims... and this person, this "gadfly" is coming across as if he were a Prince Hall mason... and I notice that when I posted the true history of the Prince Hall Grand Lodges he shut up on the subject pretty fast, and he likes to call Wr. Br. Pike a Klukker, which is a Gentryism, and a craven personal attack in contravention of the established facts.

More telling, this person refuses to state, simply, whether or not he is Gentry, which is ALSO a tactic of Gentry's, to use a sock puppet... he has been caught at it twice that I know of, one of which was detailed at the link I provided above.

However, Gadfly can end the debate about his provenance by making a declaration that he is not Gentry, not who he is, I really don't care, but simply that he is or is not Gentry... pretty simple.

So, Gadfly, are you or are you not Mike Gentry?

Masonic Light
I don't think this cat is Gentry because:

1. Mike is an African-American, and Gadfly wrote something earlier about being of European descent.

2. Even though Mike is pretty spaced out with his Bible stuff these days, he is in fact a former Mason, with personal Masonic experience. He would not have written that stuff about the 33° being secret and invisible or whatever, because he knows better. Mike's criticism of Masonry is that the Fraternity is unitarian, i.e., does not sponsor his brand of religious megalomania which he believes you have to have in order to get heaven. But as a former Mason, he is well aware that Masonry isn't really secretive, much less satanic.

#1 did I not post my ancestors were from europe?
If not, point to the offender and I will surely pluck it out-
At least some of my ancestors were from europe!
Weren't there black-irish?

#2 if that is what this person believes then Masonic Light gets a new light-bulb

theron
True, but Masonic Light, he HAS made those claims... and this person, this "gadfly" is coming across as if he were a Prince Hall mason... and I notice that when I posted the true history of the Prince Hall Grand Lodges he shut up on the subject pretty fast, and he likes to call Wr. Br. Pike a Klukker, which is a Gentryism, and a craven personal attack in contravention of the established facts.

More telling, this person refuses to state, simply, whether or not he is Gentry, which is ALSO a tactic of Gentry's, to use a sock puppet... he has been caught at it twice that I know of, one of which was detailed at the link I provided above.

However, Gadfly can end the debate about his provenance by making a declaration that he is not Gentry, not who he is, I really don't care, but simply that he is or is not Gentry... pretty simple.

So, Gadfly, are you or are you not Mike Gentry?

Prince Hall masonry a lot of bother there theron?
I must confess I must have missed your missive about Prince Hall masonry- which thread?
Pike was a Klucker- it's a fact!
For true I am NO sock-puppet even if you so be.
What matters it to you who I am?
Concern yourself with your own craft and be less concerned about the matters of those you have discourse with else you become as them.
Have I asked who you are not?
Have I asked where you are from?
If it helps you to believe I am or am not someone then so believe. I just want to find out if there is a masonic conspiracy behind some things. This seems fair, is it not?

Originally posted by PublicGadfly
Prince Hall masonry a lot of bother there theron?

Actually, not at all... I have been to many Prince Hall lodges, as well as other lodges that are recognized by my Grand Lodge (Grand Lodge of Free and Accepted Masons of the State of California, in case you missed that)

I must confess I must have missed your missive about Prince Hall masonry- which thread?

Go look. Its the one where you asserted several racist motives to masonry, and asked what Prince Hall Masonry was, noting only white masons should reply. I can repost it for you if you really like, but I think you are being disingenuous again...

Pike was a Klucker- it's a fact!

prove it. History shows he was NOT. Claiming it to be so does NOT make it true.

For true I am NO sock-puppet even if you so be.

Uh huh... is your name Mike Gentry. I am who I say I am, and that is easily verifiable... unlike some, I do not hide behind a contrived moniker. I am who I am, on the internet and in real life.

What matters it to you who I am?

in sooth, as I noted above, it doesn't. I couldn't care less what your real name or age is... I just asked if you were or were not Mike Gentry... you seem to be having difficulty with the question... are you or are you not Mike Gentry. I am not the only one asking, and soon more will ask... it is a simple question... have you this one fact at hand, when nothing else you post is based on factual data?

Concern yourself with your own craft and be less concerned about the matters of those you have discourse with else you become as them.

Ooooohhhh, rebuked by a troll... you just have to love the chutzpah...

Have I asked who you are not?

nope

Have I asked where you are from?

nope

If it helps you to believe I am or am not someone then so believe. I just want to find out if there is a masonic conspiracy behind some things.

No, there isn't. See how simple that was...

This seems fair, is it not?

Only if you deal in honesty, which it is clear to the board that you are NOT... you are dealing in poking with a sharp stick to get reaction, not a true search for knowledge... so one is left with only the inescapable conclusion that you are not interested in truth, but are a variety of troll. the only thing it seems we are left to do here is determine what type of troll you are...

And it seems to me since you will not declare whether or not you are Mike Gentry, that you must be just another sock puppet of his... seeing as he has so thorougly micturated on his own name, he must now resort to sock puppets to avoid detection, and thus continue your assault on masonry...