Why Vets Hate Kerry, by Vet Oliver North

If you are like me, you believe John Kerry never should of used his Vietnam Service as a center piece to his campaign but i am glad he did. It seems to be the worst thing he could of done.

This was e-mailed to me so i don't have a link but it is good to hear how other Vietnam Vets feel about Kerry and why.

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Bring it on, John
Oliver North

August 27, 2004

"Of course, the president keeps telling people he would never question my service to our country. Instead, he watches as a Republican-funded attack group does just that. Well, if he wants to have a debate about our service in Vietnam, here is my answer: 'Bring it on.'" -- Sen. John Kerry
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Dear John,

As usual, you have it wrong. You don't have a beef with President George Bush about your war record. He's been exceedingly generous about your military service. Your complaint is with the 2.5 million of us who served honorably in a war that ended 29 years ago and which you, not the president, made the centerpiece of this campaign.

I talk to a lot of vets, John, and this really isn't about your medals or how you got them. Like you, I have a Silver Star and a Bronze Star. I only have two Purple Hearts, though. I turned down the others so that I could stay with the Marines in my rifle platoon. But I think you might agree with me, though I've never heard you say it, that the officers always got more medals than they earned and the youngsters we led never got as many medals as they deserved.

This really isn't about how early you came home from that war, either, John. There have always been guys in every war who want to go home. There are also lots of guys, like those in my rifle platoon in Vietnam, who did a full 13 months in the field. And there are, thankfully, lots of young Americans today in Iraq and Afghanistan who volunteered to return to war because, as one of them told me in Ramadi a few weeks ago, "the job isn't finished."

Nor is this about whether you were in Cambodia on Christmas Eve, 1968. Heck John, people get lost going on vacation. If you got lost, just say so. Your campaign has admitted that you now know that you really weren't in Cambodia that night and that Richard Nixon wasn't really president when you thought he was. Now would be a good time to explain to us how you could have all that bogus stuff "seared" into your memory -- especially since you want to have your finger on our nation's nuclear trigger.

But that's not really the problem, either. The trouble you're having, John, isn't about your medals or coming home early or getting lost -- or even Richard Nixon. The issue is what you did to us when you came home, John.

When you got home, you co-founded Vietnam Veterans Against the War and wrote "The New Soldier," which denounced those of us who served -- and were still serving -- on the battlefields of a thankless war. Worst of all, John, you then accused me -- and all of us who served in Vietnam -- of committing terrible crimes and atrocities.

On April 22, 1971, under oath, you told the Senate Foreign Relations Committee that you had knowledge that American troops "had personally raped, cut off ears, cut off heads, taped wires from portable telephones to human genitals and turned up the power, cut off limbs, blown up bodies, randomly shot at civilians, razed villages in fashion reminiscent of Genghis Khan, shot cattle and dogs for fun, poisoned food stocks, and generally ravaged the country side of South Vietnam."

And you admitted on television that "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed." And for good measure you stated, "(America is) more guilty than any other body, of violations of (the) Geneva Conventions ... the torture of prisoners, the killing of prisoners."

Your "antiwar" statements and activities were painful for those of us carrying the scars of Vietnam and trying to move on with our lives. And for those who were still there, it was even more hurtful. But those who suffered the most from what you said and did were the hundreds of American prisoners of war being held by Hanoi. Here's what some of them endured because of you, John:

Capt. James Warner had already spent four years in Vietnamese custody when he was handed a copy of your testimony by his captors. Warner
says that for his captors, your statements "were proof I deserved to be punished." He wasn't released until March 14, 1973.

Maj. Kenneth Cordier, an Air Force pilot who was in Vietnamese custody for 2,284 days, says his captors "repeated incessantly" your
one-liner about being "the last man to die" for a lost cause. Cordier was released March 4, 1973.

Navy Lt. Paul Galanti says your accusations "were as demoralizing as solitary (confinement) ... and a prime reason the war dragged on." He remained in North Vietnamese hands until February 12, 1973.

John, did you think they would forget? When Tim Russert asked about your claim that you and others in Vietnam committed "atrocities," instead of standing by your sworn testimony, you confessed that your words "were a bit over the top." Does that mean you lied under oath? Or does it mean you are a war criminal? You can't have this one both
ways, John. Either way, you're not fit to be a prison guard at Abu Ghraib, much less commander in chief.

One last thing, John. In 1988, Jane Fonda said: "I would like to say something ... to men who were in Vietnam, who I hurt, or whose pain I caused to deepen because of things that I said or did. I was trying to help end the killing and the war, but there were times when I was thoughtless and careless about it and I'm ... very sorry that I hurt them. And I want to apologize to them and their families."

Even Jane Fonda apologized. Will you, John?
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He has gone too far to turn back now, Kerry is done. G.W. 2004

Oliver North. *snicker*. The man convicted of lying to congress finds a problem with Kerry telling the truth. No surprises there.

-koji K.

Originally posted by koji_K
Oliver North. *snicker*. The man convicted of lying to congress finds a problem with Kerry telling the truth. No surprises there.

-koji K.

Hmm, lying to Congress...1971...hmmm

Couldn't find any "original" source but it is reposted all over the net.

Here's one for reference: www.townhall.com...

My question is, isn't this guy a Fox News correspondent?

I do wonder how the right would feel if say Cokie Roberts sent out a "Why do you hate women Mr. Bush" letter for chain mails, but whatever.

We're used to the politrix from the right by now. :shk:

Koji_K, you laugh at one man who lied and claim that Kerry told the truth. Kerry has been proven to be a liar also. don't you think that's like the pot calling the kettle black?

Originally posted by jrsdls
Koji_K, you laugh at one man who lied and claim that Kerry told the truth. Kerry has been proven to be a liar also. don't you think that's like the pot calling the kettle black?

OR is it the kettle calling the pot black? I am sure there is a way they can spin it so their followers say "see we were right, Bush bad".

Originally posted by jrsdls
Koji_K, you laugh at one man who lied and claim that Kerry told the truth. Kerry has been proven to be a liar also. don't you think that's like the pot calling the kettle black?

Show us the conviction of John Kerry, and you'll be right.

Would you like to review the Walsh report's finding of guilt for North (and Reagen ) while you search for the concrete goods on Kerry?

You guys just have no shame whatsoever on this issue. Arnold invokes the name of NIXON at the RNC and you guys cheer like school girls. Yet, some people disagree with Kerry and he's a liar, a traitor, a treasonous criminal!

No. He's not. You may think he's a liar. But I know Mr. Oliver North is. When you get the goods on Kerry, I suggest pressing charges.

Until then, it's just more right wing mania.

Originally posted by jrsdls
Koji_K, you laugh at one man who lied and claim that Kerry told the truth. Kerry has been proven to be a liar also. don't you think that's like the pot calling the kettle black?

well, i don't laugh at one man who lied, i laugh at one man who, like RANT says, was convicted of lying, accepting bribes, and destroying documents. a man also complicit in selling drugs to raise money for arms to sell to iran. and finally, a man with a glaringly obvious axe to grind against Kerry for exposing it.

you just can't compare North to Kerry. try again. all he's been "proven" of lying about is that he wasn't in cambodia in 68. and frankly, no one really cares, because a.) the funadmental point- that he was in a godforsaken swamp somewhere with a rifle when he didn't have to be, for his country- remains, and b.) ops in cambodia were classified and operationally listed as occuring in vietnam, so any "proof" is somewhat dubious.

-koji K.

[edit on 1-9-2004 by koji_K]

You can question the credibility of Oliver North all you want. It does not change the fact that his letter DOES represent the thoughts and feelings of many Vietnam Vets as well as many of our fine young soldiers that have in the past and are currently risking their lives for our Country.
Rather than trash the author of the letter, why not address the content of the letter. If Kerry (and his followers) would start to address some of the issues that come up rather than just whine about how people are trying to smear his name it would be much more effective.
If the only defense Kerry has is returning fire and pointing out the faults of the other guys it doesn't make him look any better than the other guy and in fact, it makes him look much worse.

Originally posted by Jemison
You can question the credibility of Oliver North all you want. It does not change the fact that his letter DOES represent the thoughts and feelings of many Vietnam Vets as well as many of our fine young soldiers that have in the past and are currently risking their lives for our Country.
Rather than trash the author of the letter, why not address the content of the letter. If Kerry (and his followers) would start to address some of the issues that come up rather than just whine about how people are trying to smear his name it would be much more effective.
If the only defense Kerry has is returning fire and pointing out the faults of the other guys it doesn't make him look any better than the other guy and in fact, it makes him look much worse.

they don't like him cause he spoke out against the war. and unlike many war protestors, he actually fought in it! he had every right to speak out against the vietnam war, more so than the average citizen, and the swift boat vets get upset because he pointed out the simple truth that all was not sunshine and roses in vietnam? they are upset at the american people for not supporting an unjust and foolish war, and they're venting their frustration with kerry, one of their own. "Prison guards would quote Kerry at us!" Well, shucks, I guess that makes Kerry far worse than the prison guards themselves, right? I guess that makes Kerry far worse than the whole god-awful mess of a situation that war was, right? Sorry, Swift Boat Vets, but if you have that much of a beef with Kerry, take it up in a court of law, not a political ad.

-koji K.

Oliver North? I wouldn't trust him if my life depended on it. I don't care what he says. He was behind Iran-Contra and responsible for the CIA drug trafficking here in the U.S.

www.fromthewilderness.com...

Originally posted by mrmulder
Oliver North? I wouldn't trust him if my life depended on it. I don't care what he says. He was behind Iran-Contra and responsible for the CIA drug trafficking here in the U.S.

www.fromthewilderness.com...

- Yeah, Oliver North, proven liar and traitor to (the due law and constitution of) his country, the guy who first trained bin Laden and his group in the 'art' of terrorism expects us to give him any credibility!? LMFAO



[edit on 1-9-2004 by sminkeypinkey]

Ollie North was a CIA drug dealer. Yeah let's listen to him.

Originally posted by RANT
When you get the goods on Kerry, I suggest pressing charges.

Thats just it Rant, when you find the "goods" on Bush, i suggest you press charges. It goes both ways when you TRY to trash Bush.

Originally posted by koji_K

they don't like him cause he spoke out against the war
-koji K.

But he is proud of his service because he "defended his country". Well i have to ask, if there was not an enemy, then who did he defend America from?

Originally posted by AntiPolitrix

Originally posted by koji_K

they don't like him cause he spoke out against the war
-koji K.

But he is proud of his service because he "defended his country". Well i have to ask, if there was not an enemy, then who did he defend America from?

what? i'm not sure i understand the question.

-koji K.

As usual, all liberals do here is try to discredit a conservative.

Please answere me this liberals: If he personally admits to "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed" how IN GODS GREEN EARTH CAN YOU CALL BUSH A WAR CRIMINAL AND AT THE SAME TIME PRESENT KERRY AS SOME KIND OF RIGHTOUS LEADER???

Originally posted by American Mad Man
As usual, all liberals do here is try to discredit a conservative.

Please answere me this liberals: If he personally admits to "yes, yes, I committed the same kind of atrocities as thousands of other soldiers have committed" how IN GODS GREEN EARTH CAN YOU CALL BUSH A WAR CRIMINAL AND AT THE SAME TIME PRESENT KERRY AS SOME KIND OF RIGHTOUS LEADER???

lol... oliver north needs no discrediting. how old are you? i ask because you seem not to be aware of the nature of the vietnam war. the sorts of the things kerry describes were committed by many troops, but we only prosecuted the most egregious of the lot. our troops, including kerry, were not generally to blame, but rather the conditions and the political climate which sent them to war in the first place. it's the same today. speaking as a liberal, i hold ashcroft and rummy and the lot responsible for what happened at abu ghraib, not our men in uniform who were undertrained and ill-prepared for the stressful conditions of war.

-koji K.

[edit on 1-9-2004 by koji_K]

Listen bud, I'm old enough to know what went on in 'nam, and i'm also old enough to understand the BLATENT double talk of liberals like you.

What happened to accountability? You don't blame Kerry for any war crimes WHEN HE ADMITS TO THEM. Instead, like you said, you blame it on the war, the training. the political climet - ANYTHING BUT HIM! What total horse #!

By your logic, no one is EVER accountable for ANYTHING because of the conditions. Kill some one? Oh, well that person grew up in a poor house hold, his parents made him go to school, and because of the president making classes smaller, he didn't have the friends he needed. Thus, he went out and killed someone not because that person was a bad apple, but because someone else made him do it.

This mentality is pathetic. The fact is, no one ever made Kerry do ANY of his warcrimes - HE ACTED UPON HIS OWN FREE WILL - or did you forget that humans have this? Why don't you admit that Kerry isn't exactly a shining example of humanity?

Originally posted by American Mad Man
As usual, all liberals do here is try to discredit a conservative.

- we learned that from you 'conservative' types, why should you lot have all the 'fun'!?.

What goes around and all that, huh?

BTW when are you lot going to start demanding answers about Ollie North and exactly what he taught bin Laden & Co.?

For instance, is there a record of the terrorist tactics he 'educated' bin Laden and his group in?

It might just help if the world knew what those guys had been schooled in, exactly......or does your political slant get in the way and obstruct the sense and usefulness such information might be to the world?

Anyhoo.......you just carry on about Kerry and Vietnam, cos that's the most relevant (and stops anyone discussing Bush) right?