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Torture in Guantanamo !

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posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 04:35 AM
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Has the CIA held for several months two children old of 7 and 9 years of Khalid Sheik Mohammed, the supposed brain of the events from September-11, to take for agent counts the charges states and thinks of using them to make pressure on him, when necessary, if it would resist the "chain". The chan ? Russian konveer, a method of interrogation invented, in its versions modernen, by Tchka (ancestor of the Soviet KGB) which consists in questioning the prisoner during hours, days without letting it sleep nor to even lengthen, at the end of a certain time, the legs swell, of the furoncles appear, the victim have hallucinations, believe to see smoke rising in front of it.

In general, at the end of 7 to 8 days the prisoner speaks, but one knows the case of 55 years a Russian anarchist who held 31 days. For the end of this history, one supposes that it was then sent in an asylum of insane.

In this precise case, the United States has the concentration camp of Guantanomo Bay where, already, one? suicide? much?

But, as a person in charge for the CIA said it in a register which was useful much in front of a certain Court of Nuremberg :

"we do not torture them, one simply prevents them from sleeping and one says to them that if they speak they will be able to lengthen".

Let us point out what the "chain" was used against the witches in Scotland and which it then served at the time of famous the businesses of the witches of Salem.

How what, the United States is a "civilized" country but with however of the barbarians traditions !

[Edited on 9-4-2003 by Nans DESMICHELS]




posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 05:26 AM
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I wonder how pro-war americans can complain about Saddam's torture chambers when they are running one of the biggest torture chambers in existence in Guantanamo.

Any pro-war has an answer to that ? I'd be really interested !



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:18 AM
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torture of terrorests and torture of a civilian populace, whitch arre you more likely to be upset about? do you feel sorry for the terrorests? then why dont you feel sorry for the civilan population of iraq? This is how it is from an expat Iraqi, My father was tortured, why you ask? cause we lived in Basra, and our nieghbours were suporters of the Anti Saddam movement, so we were guilty beacause of them, we got our father back in a sack, not a body bag a fricken sack, i love my country of birth i always will, but Saddam must go. He tortures the populace for fun. now as for the US torture of terrorests, they kill civilians and threaten more attacks say they where going to blow up a building in your city where you live and work, but you dont know when or how but your intelligence says there will be one, you capture a suspected terrorest, he says i will not tell or remains quiet, do you A: give him a cup of tea and say thats alright you dont have to tell us but we would prefer you did, B: lock him in jail for the rest of his life but not get any information and thousands die beacause of it, or C: tourture him for any information that leads you to finding more information and stopping the attacks. i would go with C my self but im sure a lot of people will go with A beacause even though its a terrorest they have feelings too



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:18 AM
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I would like some proof from Moku or Nans.

[Edited on 9-4-2003 by Tetsuo-51]



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:20 AM
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you want proof from me? or the guy above me??



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:21 AM
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Both of the people above you but preferably Moku.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:23 AM
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since no direct, verifiable evidence is presented for these charges, and
i don't see how any sane person could stomach the charge of
'concentration camp', the only feeling we are left with is pity.

you pathetic people must have spent lives filled with endless solitude
to be stoking the flames on public forums. so enjoy. if there are cases of
possible abuse that could constitute a pattern on the part of institutional
authorities, where is it ?


foreign and native press reports have highlighted a case or two in afghanistan.
the detainess in guatanamo were unwelcome agents of destruction in afghanistan
BEFORE the u.s. declared war against them.

the taliban formed an illegitimate gov't that was recognized
by 3 countries in the world - 4 if you count the 'republic of chechnya' an actual
independent country, which no one in the world does. the taliban provided a home
to al-qaeda, who became pariahs in every other arab and muslim regime, including
that bastion of human rights, the islamic republic of sudan, and then proceeded
to coddle and engage in nefarious activities with them against the people of
afghanistan, including, most notoriously, the murder of mashood, fearless leader
of the northern alliance who the taliban could not defeat alone.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:23 AM
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Moku, Saddam tortures civilians and innocents who have done no wrong. How could you even compare the alleged torturing of terrorists to the torture of innocent people?



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:48 AM
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Thats simple because he doesn't have to live it!! These supporters of terror will make allegations without any foundation at all. they say it like its true whether they have evidence or not. Contrary to that, I've seen footage of the camp ..and yes its a prisoner camp. Guess what? These people are criminals, not soldiers fighting for a nation. They get three squares and a copy of the Koran and time to pray. The are being restrained from killing innocent people so I guess we are taking away their "right" to feed their bloodthirsty desires. So sue us.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:49 AM
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There's a difference between torturing your own civilians, and torturing those not even fit to deem "human" (terrorists).

Personally, I have no trouble with them torturing terrorists....I know that I probably should...but I just can't find any pity for them....



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 07:57 AM
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Im not a supporter of terror, what a bizarre idea


People actually supporting terror are people supporting the concept of "preemptive warfare" and invasion without any means of evidence on potential danger emanating from a disarmed regime like Saddam's.

The sources on Guantanamo are from some fugitives who actually managed to get out. I remember reading it a couple of weeks ago.

Remember, these "terrorists" that are being interviewed in Guantanamo are _alleged_ terrorists, so the detention it is a cruel infringement on human rights. What makes you think the people allegedly tortured by Saddam's regime weren't plotting military action against Saddam ?

Where is the hell of a big difference in Saddam's and Bush's regime ? I dont get it !!



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 08:16 AM
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If you want to gain some data and infos from a prisonner, physical torture is not very usefull.

Drugs or intimidation is far much better than physical torture. OTH, deprivation of sleeping is a usefull method. There is just one " problem ". It's not very quick and you have to wait.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 08:21 AM
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The people of Iraq were too scared to do anything to Saddam. They would have been shot dead for even mentioning something like that, Moku. You still dont know the definition of "regime"? That makes me laugh.


dom

posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 08:24 AM
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Governments torturing people really shouldn't be allowed to happen in a progressive Western democracy. Apply pressure, sure, play games with them by telling them that so-and-so in the cell 2 doors down said that you did this, etc., but don't go bloody torturing people.

And it'd be interesting to know exactly how many of the detainees really are terrorists. How many people did the US accidentally detain? 12 at the moment, but what will that number reach? Is it fair to have tortured these people, just because we picked up the wrong ones?

You lose the moral high ground when you lower yourself to the level of the people you're fighting.

And the Taliban were at least partially recognised by the US, because they were talking about oil pipelines with them in the late 90's. Besides, the Geneva conventions apply to anyone caught during war, and the conflict in Afghanistan was indeed a war. So immediately, the US are breaking the Geneva conventions by not establishing the prisoners status through the routes described in the conventions...



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 08:26 AM
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Moku, I can't even begin to start to take all that apart but just knowing that that sentiment is out there and backed up so strongly is enough for me to hear. Saddam is not threat!!? or I should say was not a threat?? Do I even have to answer that? I mean come on. Ya know what? ....just have a nice day. i can't waste time like this anymore.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 09:45 AM
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I wonder why America blocked a U.N plan to ratify a worldwide anti-torture bill that took ten years to draft, and against the wishes of its closest allies. Funnily, the U.S was backed by.
Fundamentalist Muslim countries that shun any outside attention! Lol.

Its really hard to understand why the U.S. is working against human rights and against so many of its allies

www.globalpolicy.org/intljustice/icc/2002/0724block.htm

The official number of captives that have attempted suicide in the camp is put at 19. Some that tried to hang themselves are still hospitalised.

19 prisoners where released recently, seemingly having satisfied the U.S. that they were not terrorists. Some were in their 70s.

Anyone remember the unexplained murder in the camp last year? Hard to get my head round that one, what with the shackles, blindfolds, escorts and heavy security

The ones that might have any useful information arent even questioned at the camp. They are shipped off to countries where the laws on torture are more lax for questioning.

Not saying any of this is proof of anything, just some food for thought.
Its not hard to see why people are asking questions.

Dont have time to gather all the links; Im just leaving work. Theyre not hard to find.



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 11:03 AM
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Here's frickin' torture....(warning: graphic descriptions)

www.cnn.com...



dom

posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 11:23 AM
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Yes, we know Iraq tortures people. Iraq's a third world dictatorship.

Why does the US torture people?



posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 11:43 AM
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being chained to having your fingernails and toenails ripped off, and being dipped in chemical vats?

Bah, I suppose that inmates who get their tv priveleges yanked are likewise "tortured"....


dom

posted on Apr, 9 2003 @ 11:48 AM
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Are you trying to say that really nasty countries use really nasty torture, therefore the US should be allowed to use milder forms of torture?

I'm not dicussing the removal of TV's.



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