Occupy Oakland Protester admits bottles were thrown at Police BEFORE police responded , page 18

reply to post by NoHierarchy

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I've never stuck my head in the ground on anything NH.

I just don't think trashing America, capitalism, and following a group of lemmings off a cliff because Adbusters says so is the best thing for me.

You seem to believe that if I don't think like you that somehow I'm for the very things you hate.

In some cases that maybe true. But your hyperbolic accusations of being for corruption and predatory practices, being a "paid shill" and whatever other nonsensical garbage you wanna spew at me is simply ridiculous and delusional.

Sorry you don't like the fact that I'm not a leftist. You're gonna have to deal with that. People have views of the world that are far stranger and more offensive by far. And voicing opinion on a discussion board open to all isn't "propaganda" "shilling" or anything else you wish to ascribe as a moniker to those you disagree with.

Maybe, JUST MAYBE, it's just someone who disagrees.

reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Why are you so much for violence?

Why is it that you feel that you can't win on the merits of your ideas but only on the ferocity of your animalistic tendencies?

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Why are you so much for violence?

Why is it that you feel that you can't win on the merits of your ideas but only on the ferocity of your animalistic tendencies?

So says the solider of the US military...

reply to post by projectvxn

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If adbusters had a hand in starting this it doesn't matter because the grassroots protests that have spawned from OWS and adopted it's name aren't following that agenda and are on the right track.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by NoHierarchy

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I've never stuck my head in the ground on anything NH.

I just don't think trashing America, capitalism, and following a group of lemmings off a cliff because Adbusters says so is the best thing for me.

You seem to believe that if I don't think like you that somehow I'm for the very things you hate.

In some cases that maybe true. But your hyperbolic accusations of being for corruption and predatory practices, being a "paid shill" and whatever other nonsensical garbage you wanna spew at me is simply ridiculous and delusional.

Sorry you don't like the fact that I'm not a leftist. You're gonna have to deal with that. People have views of the world that are far stranger and more offensive by far. And voicing opinion on a discussion board open to all isn't "propaganda" "shilling" or anything else you wish to ascribe as a moniker to those you disagree with.

Maybe, JUST MAYBE, it's just someone who disagrees.

edit on 30-10-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

No... what you said is "I stopped being angry at the world". Which I read as the typical false-argument against radical "youth" and a form of willful ignorance/cowardice/surrender to a system which you know is wrong.

I've stated this time and time again, but I'll say it again...
The frequency with which you troll these boards and find a way to post on the first page of seemingly EVERY OWS thread with blatant disinformation leads me NATURALLY and UNDERSTANDABLY to wonder if you are paid or encouraged in some outside manner to do so. If not... then I really have to wonder WHY you would do such a thing when you've been proven wrong time and time again. We can disagree all we want, but facts are facts, and like global warming deniers, you prefer to stick your head in the sands of blissful ignorance rather than embrace the truth, no matter how it makes you feel.

Trashing certain American actions, policies, behaviors, and so on is ABSOLUTELY FINE if you are intellectually/philosophically honest. NO COUNTRY IN THE WORLD gets a pass from me on scrutiny. I am extremely wary of patriotism/nationalist/jingoism... except only in the most extreme circumstances (Russia/China invades us)... in which case I'd take up arms right alongside you Red Dawn style. Also, in case you don't remember, I AM AN ANARCHIST. I see absolutely NO taboos in criticizing, even aggressively, my country, other countries, Capitalism, Communism, past/present/future, etc. Once again, if you actually researched/visited the various OWS movements, or followed the websites/videos, you'd find that they're composed of VERY INTELLIGENT/AWARE PEOPLE with some undeniable grievances and undeniably thoughtful solutions. But god forbid you agree with a Leftist on anything...

Originally posted by areyouserious2010
reply to post by OUTofSTEPwithTHEworld

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im guessing you didn't correctly read what he said " the flash-bang used afterwards was clearly aimed at people trying to help him". i hope you know what the word riot means.
dictionary.reference.com...
"violent or wild disorder".

Would you consider throwing bottles violent? At the least it would be considered disorderly.

please tell me at what moment HELPING an injured man is considered VIOLENT OR WILD DISORDER. at that moment none of the protesters attentions was focused on violence or directly at the officers. i agree that some guys MIGHT (which i haven't seen in any video) have sparked it, just not at that moment, it was unnecessary.

First, prove that the police knew the man was seriously injured. I understand that you have ample time to watch the video and read what other people say about it but that does not mean that the police were afforded such a luxury as watching it in the comfort of their home with the ability to rewind it and watch it again before making the decision to act.

If the police were aware that the man was seriously injured it may have changed the way they handled the situation.

Second, if they knew the man was seriously injured then they are responsible for the man's safety and could not allow him to be dragged away by the crowd. Being in a position of authority, it is the responsibility of the police to ensure the man is PROPERLY treated for his injuries. Failing to do so, resulting in death, could open the department to serious legal ramnifications.

If they knew the man was seriously injured then I agree a flashbang was a poor choice of tool. Still though, it does not warrant this entire situation being blown way out of proportion like it is by people who disagree with it.

It warrants the officer to be reprimanded and all attempts should be made to make sure it does not happen again but that is all.

here it is slow motion for you.

Yes, I understand that you can slow the video down and make full use of your 20/20 hindsight.

i never said throwing bottles was non-violent, i have seen not ONE video of the protesters throwing bottles at the officers. "if they knew the man was seriously injured"? dude the man was clearly laying on they floor after flash bangs were thrown, i mean what would you assume the guy was doing on the floor? slow motion or not you can see the officers are just a few feet away, not as if protesters were blocking the officers view. you would think the protesters would go and literally DRAG a guy away that's supporting the same movement they're supporting? THAT flash bang was COMPLETELY UNNECESSARY, no direct attention was clearly made towards the officers at any time of that moment. IMO

reply to post by NoHierarchy

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So says the solider of the US military...

Indeed, I do.

I recognize the value of life and death, and if you think killing Americans in the name of whatever is tantamount to serving your country in a time of war then...

reply to post by NoHierarchy

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The only thing I agree with OWS on is that there ought to be controls on banks and that the power of the Fed needs to either be reigned in, or simply abolished.

After that we part ways and this is why:
A well sourced article on who backs and supports OWS

Why do I feel this way? Because the philosophy of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" doesn't work. Historically speaking, the enemy of your enemy is the enemy you'll fight with later on. Why would I run head on into that?

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Why are you so much for violence?

Why is it that you feel that you can't win on the merits of your ideas but only on the ferocity of your animalistic tendencies?

They are just following the George Soros playbook.
It won't work.
There is a formula. Just watch them closely and take notes.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Why are you so much for violence?

Why is it that you feel that you can't win on the merits of your ideas but only on the ferocity of your animalistic tendencies?

Why do you depend solely on rhetoric and not debate the points I have made? Sounds to me like you are the one afraid you can't win on the merits of your ideas, amigo.

You asked: "Why are you so much for violence?"

That's a loaded statement disguised as a question. You are making an effort to avoid the truth by creating this "straw man" argument.

How did the Germans get kicked out of France? Can you answer that question TRUTHFULLY, HONESTLY, and DIRECTLY?

How did Saddam Hussein get kicked out of Iraq?
How did Vietnam successfully force the USA out of their country? (I will LAUGH at you if you claim "peaceful protests")
How did Japan switch from an empirical war like nation to a docile peaceful nation?

ANSWER those if you have the brains or the guts to answer it. Anything less will just prove you to be full of crap.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by NoHierarchy

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So says the solider of the US military...

Indeed, I do.

I recognize the value of life and death, and if you think killing Americans in the name of whatever is tantamount to serving your country in a time of war then...

A US military soldier spouting on about "peaceful resolution". What a joke.

We get it, don't worry, we get it. Only "special" people like yourself are allowed to do the violence thing because you've been "authorized" to do so. Violence is a dangerous occupation that only professionals should be allowed to do.

Talk about mind control.

I'd like to see you go give a lecture to the mother of a dead child in Iraq/Afghanistan who was the victim of "collateral damage" by the US Mililtary. Tell that mother that "peace" is the only answer for her.

reply to post by unkown142

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The cops would think twice about escalating the situation if everyone of the protesters were practicing their 2nd Amendment rights.

No better way to ensure "peace" than when both sides are armed to the teeth. Mutually Assured Destruction.

Why is it that every single peaceful protest ends up turning violent by the Police? Because they know there is NO THREAT of retaliation by the people they are beating up.

There's a reason why you never see protests involving citizens with AR-15's get violent: The Police want NONE of that.

reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Edit: I sounded dumb with this post so i might as well delete it

reply to post by Cryptonomicon

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Indeed. I never said war doesn't solve anything.

I just don't believe that Americans should be killing one another because they have disagreements.
If you do, that's fine.

I find it interesting that because I chose to serve my country that is constantly thrown in my face by you OWS people just because I don't agree with murdering my fellow Americans over disagreements.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by NoHierarchy

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The only thing I agree with OWS on is that there ought to be controls on banks and that the power of the Fed needs to either be reigned in, or simply abolished.

After that we part ways and this is why:
A well sourced article on who backs and supports OWS

Why do I feel this way? Because the philosophy of "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" doesn't work. Historically speaking, the enemy of your enemy is the enemy you'll fight with later on. Why would I run head on into that?

edit on 2-11-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

You DO realize that website is propaganda right??

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