To my brothers and sisters on ATS

well said, we are ALL Equal, have valid Points, and Color, age, religions,Gender, and Political views are all just effects to maintain Illusion of separateness.

A lot of what you wrote made no sense and things like race and religion are not the divide and conquer tools you may think they are but ''bringing us together as one'' IS the divide and conquer tool(it may sound odd) that you speak of.
Take a look at the agenda that they have for the west.

Originally posted by OutKast Searcher

Originally posted by crazydaisy
I was thinking last nite before going
to sleep that the next best step would
be to go to the White House in the
1000's. I see someone else had
the same thought so we are on
the same page!

Really?

You are going to march on the guy that gave the "99%" tax breaks?

You are going to march on the guy that eliminated pre-existing conditions and lifetime/annual caps on insurance policies?

You are going to march on the guy that gave millions of children insurance coverage?

You are going to march on the guy that extended unemployment benefits for millions of the "99%"?

You are going to march on the guy that provide jobs (even if it wasn't as many as he hoped) to people with the ARRA legislation?

You are going to march on the guy that just made it easier for the "99%" to re-finance their home with lower fees, even if they are underwater in their payments?

You are going to march on the guy that just capped student loan payments?


OWS needs to realize who their allies are in all of this.

Must agree with you about this. I don't like anything that smacks of communism. I believe the Marxist Manifesto is built on jealousy. Marxism is a revolting concept. It makes for a stagnant, Godless society.

These people are marching because of what exactly? Is it because they see others having more than they do and are jealous and angry about that? I like diversity, even economic diversity.

You are right. Obama has tried to ease the burden of this economic down turn and it was not him who made it happen. He just had to pick up the little pieces of what was broken before he came into office.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


Well said my friend. I think there are a lot of members on this site that want to see this world change for the better of mankind. Everyday someone creates a thread complaining or voicing their frustrations about world events and how the people are being manipulated and controlled by a corrupt system.

Unfortunately, we have members who are defending the same system the majority of us realize are one of the same. There are some members who consistently create threads to support their naive view of the current political system. They defend the abuse of human rights in the name of "law" but fail to realize these laws were created and are being manipulated by the same system that created them.

It's exactly how you described it, some members see only black or white or us vs them. They have taken political sides in a system that has stacked the deck against them. They refuse to accept any concept or idea if it doesn't originate from their affiliation of the right or left side of the political spectrum. Unknowingly, they're actually creating threads to do the systems bidding by dividing us and creating conflict within these forums.

To ridicule people who are trying to create change for the betterment of the human race, and to justify wars and violent abuse by those in control is just plain mind boggling! A civilized and caring race of people shouldn't even entertain these negative and destructive thoughts.

We have members here who think they have awaken, yet are still brainwashed by the same system that wants to control and in-slave them.

Being an "older" person... having lived through the 60's and some of the 70's, even into the 80's, I kind of wonder what Brother Robert Anton Wilson would say if he were still among us?

I wonder if OWS, etc, is going to come up with speakers like we did "way back in the day? Or, as I'm sort of gathering (with absolutely no offense intended) that it is really not a well defined, well led, or well aimed drive? And really... I MOST wonder if the original 1700s movement in this country began in such a random fashion to go on and successfully become what, today, appears to be allowing the common folks to attempt to start over.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine
You can't just forget about the left/right,color,religion and your beliefs and think like one,humans are not like that except in a catastrophic event where all are in a situation together.We all have different beliefs when it comes to freedoms,money and politices and thats all this circus is about.There is no one direction,there are people from all walks of political life and then there are the ones that come for hand outs and to camp in the middle of the city and get away with it,these types ruin it for all concerned.

That really is the only message I can see is that we can brake all the rules(permits,sanitation and the rule of law) and get away with it................how does this prove anything?At the very least it takes the people that are really out there tring to do something worth while and makes them either un-noticeable or look like the "no direction" fools that they are while the rest are partying in the park.

reply to post by Battleline


Humanity may not be able to forget about race, but political party affiliation? That is something that can change on a dime, and really is not as important as people think because at this point in time, a democrat will oppose abortion and a republican will support gay marriage - as long as the price is right.

reply to post by followtheevidence

This isn't about party warfare - so so so many people don't seem to get that. Really not sure what could make this any more clear besides what has already transpired and continues to transpire. It IS about class warfare - the social elite against everyone else. As long as we the people remain staunchly fixated on extraneous differences within our collective, we will never ever spot the Grecian horse. They're insidious agenda is totally and irrevocably contingent on our division. Let us pull back the curtain, peer into the hallways of power, and expose the true culprits for what they are.

Well said, and agree. Thank you.

reply to post by OutKast Searcher


well maybe he wants to march on the guy who supports the corrupt federal reserve!

Or who bailed out the corrupt banking institutions instead of putting them in jail!

Or who lied about repealing the unconstatutional Patriot act and not extending the Bush Tax cuts for the rich!

Or who lies most of the time and fails to keep 90% of his campaign promises IMO!

IMO all he is doing is making Americans dependent on government and turning this country into a Fascist regime!

Originally posted by Michelle129th

Originally posted by My.mind.is.mine


Our government has gambled with our lives, our children's lives, and further. To take it further, they got you hooked on stupid tv shows, fast food with mad MSG, aspartame tainted food and soft drinks, and fluoridated water. Now we live in a country where the majority are like "ohh well, I think I live a great life!" and "ohhh well, the American dream is pretty nice. And the french fries are good too!" Have you ever tried to tell somebody that their motivation has been purposely depleted by the government adding fluoride to their water? I have, and the response was "noooo, they just want to protect us from cavities!"

So....the government made McDonalds...and Burger King and KFC and tv dinners and canned raviolis and squeeze cheez and diet coke...oh and also forced us all to continue eating there? I don't believe for a minute the govt is responsible for the fast food we eat or the rest of the crap we put into our bodies. Come on at some point we have to be accountable for our actions. To blame the govt for people eating msg and crappy filled foods is ridiculous.

And if you're saying the govt should ban or pull these foods from the shelves....wouldn't that be taking our rights away!!! As we all loudly decree they are doing each and every day....that's quite the contradiction

Michelle

Have you heard of Aspertame, sodium fluoride or thiomersal? Do the research before making ignorant comments!

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine
I had not noticed anything about race,but when you have progressive socialist and communist mixed in with Americans that are fed up with there government and the the corruption of Wall Street mixed together each preaching there own agenda then there is no demonstration worth participating in.Mix in the handout people and the pay my college debt because Im to lazy to "really" look for a job and all you have is a circus of people going in all directions while the Wall streeters and political clones sit back and laugh at the fact that these people are so easy to manipulate.

This is not true America demonstrating agenst something we all belive in,this is Obama's community organizing at its worst and will not end well...................this has nothing to do with Wall Street and everything to do with a failing president and the people that support "there" agenda through him.

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


First off, I want to commend the OP for your beliefs, as i too believe the same but unfortunatly I don't think we will ever unite because of our petty differences! Though this does not mean that we can't change things cause we can! We need to stop concentrating on those things we find oppressive to the few and consider what most would find oppressive! Like say the federal reserve, I think most people get the fact that a private bank controlling our monies, lending it to us and charging us intreast not once but twice is redicules. Then we are charged intreast on the monies we make from jobs that we work hard for! Right there those are 2 issues that are the most oppressive but yet are talked about the least by us and the media! The Corporate media and it's lies and manipulation of truth is yet another issue which is just as important as the money changers! If we start from these issues i'm sure we would see the rest fade away! Though i believe we all need to educate ourselves about these issues because alot of the information we were given in our heydays in say public schools is lies! I know the public school system taught that the federal reserve and the IRS is a government entity! At least it did 30 years ago when i went to school! So what i'm trying to say that there are things our government is doing to us to oppress us that we all realize and agree somewhat about, at least for the informed Americans! I realize it's difficult to agree on anything for most people but is'nt it time we do before we pay a price that cost us more then anyone realizes but i fear this cost will come to pass before the majority find a need to unite against the state! God help us when that day comes!

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine


This is my first post, and I created an account just to respond. I am in earnest, and don't want to stir up any trouble. I agree 100% that people need a serious big dose of "Let's get along and work our problems without focusing on our differences." I'm SOO tired of division, bickering, and fighting. It won't solve anything, but only make matters worse.

We have supported the OWS in various ways, and in spirit, we feel we are "there." But, your post subtly implies that because we don't leave our job(s), we are complicit and part of the reason why nothing will ever get "done." We are as detached from the mainstream as just about anyone. We don't listen to television MSM, opting for a good dose of AJ and NoAgenda on a routine basis. We try to eat right, exercise, and advocate for Non-GMO, organic, free-health-choice, and the right to bear arms. We are ardent, financial supporters of RP.

Would you have a family of four give up a single income just to protest? We have already sacrificed so much just to home-educate our children. I look back at history and see all the times minority groups have fought the establishment (and lost). In particular, I tend to look at Jewish history (because, after all, they are one group of people who have managed to survive expulsions, genocides, dispersion, and persecution; so they must know a thing or two about survival.) The Maccabees managed a miraculous victory over the Greeks after gruesome persecutions (let's talk baby-killing in front of mothers). When later the Jews tried to do the same thing with the Romans, they lost. The last of those who fought, sought refuge on Masada, and tradition has it they committed suicide rather than submit to the Romans. We beat the Brits, but they had a whole ocean against them. The Tienanmen example is nice, but what was the ultimate result? Was there change?

According to Wikipedia: "Despite early expectations in the West that PRC government would soon collapse and be replaced by the democratic governance, the Communist Party of China maintained its grip on power, and the student movement which started at Tiananmen was in complete disarray."

I don't know what it will take to get people to the point where they will sacrifice "everything." One problem is lack of production and connection to land. You think about the early revolutionaries that had productive farms -- they could in theory, sustain themselves, or at least return to sustaining their families when the war was over. If "the populace" did that now, what would they have to go back to? Bring down the corrupt, and return to what? No land, no work, no factories, next to nothing. There is almost "nothing" now, so it's like "why fight for nothing?" At least the 1776 folks knew they were fighting for their land and freedom to work productively for themselves.

Fighting for "liberty" is vague, intangible, and not really very motivating until it "hurts" (i.e. I can't travel to see my family, I can't buy food, I can't drive my car, I can't worship where I choose, etc.) So, my earnest question is, "What more could/should we be doing?" Because preservation of life has become so valuable in the Jewish psyche, that is almost the only thing worthy of fighting for. For me, I'm not at the point where the fight is about life-preservation. Maybe it should be. I guess it's just that slow-boil effect. Thoughts?

reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

Deadman's Advocate

"In times of desperation, people will believe what they want to believe. And so, we gave them what they wanted to believe. A trick in the form of signal the Resistance thought would win the war. And they were right, it will end this war. Except that it is the Resistance that will be destroyed. Not, Skynet. Our best machines have failed time again to complete a mission. Something was missing. We had to think, radically. And so we made you. We created the perfect infiltration unit. You, Marcus. You did what Skynet has failed to do for so many years. You killed John Connor. Don't fight, Marcus. Remember what you are." ~ Dr. Serena Kogan; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

"You and me, we've been at war before either of us existed. You tried to kill my mother. You killed my father. But you will not kill me." ~ John Connor; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

We are in a war of ideologies. Since Democrats and 'OWS' are now feeling the pinch, they post threads like this to stave off the coming fight. Why? They fear consequences.

I will not back down.

Its all or none.

No more compromises.

No more speeches.

"I am not here to tell you how it ends, I am hear to tell you how it begins." ~ Neo; Matrix; 1999

Democrats and 'OWS' declared war. We were only fighting to preserve the Constitution, Bill of Rights, Unity, and Declaration of Independents. But... You wanted regulations, anarchy, and entitlements. You wanted universal healthcare, free education, and the end of capitalism.

No.

We end this like men on the field of ideological hell.

Originally posted by Section31
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

 

Deadman's Advocate

"In times of desperation, people will believe what they want to believe. And so, we gave them what they wanted to believe. A trick in the form of signal the Resistance thought would win the war. And they were right, it will end this war. Except that it is the Resistance that will be destroyed. Not, Skynet. Our best machines have failed time again to complete a mission. Something was missing. We had to think, radically. And so we made you. We created the perfect infiltration unit. You, Marcus. You did what Skynet has failed to do for so many years. You killed John Connor. Don't fight, Marcus. Remember what you are." ~ Dr. Serena Kogan; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

"You and me, we've been at war before either of us existed. You tried to kill my mother. You killed my father. But you will not kill me." ~ John Connor; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

We are in a war of ideologies. Since Democrats and 'OWS' are now feeling the pinch, they post threads like this to stave off the coming fight. Why? They fear consequences.

I will not back down.

Its all or none.

No more compromises.

No more speeches.

"I am not here to tell you how it ends, I am hear to tell you how it begins." ~ Neo; Matrix; 1999

Democrats and 'OWS' declared war. We were only fighting to preserve the Constitution, Bill of Rights, Unity, and Declaration of Independents. But... You wanted regulations, anarchy, and entitlements. You wanted universal healthcare, free education, and the end of capitalism.

No.

We end this like men on the field of ideological hell.

edit on 10/28/2011 by Section31 because: (no reason given)

you're proving the point of my OP like some other posters. Though I am in support of OWS, this thread isn't about OWS. And I'm not a democrat, nor am I a republican, nor am I an Obama supporter. So please, fall back with all that pseudo 1970's political warfare crap.

Originally posted by 2serious
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

 

This is my first post, and I created an account just to respond. I am in earnest, and don't want to stir up any trouble. I agree 100% that people need a serious big dose of "Let's get along and work our problems without focusing on our differences." I'm SOO tired of division, bickering, and fighting. It won't solve anything, but only make matters worse.

We have supported the OWS in various ways, and in spirit, we feel we are "there." But, your post subtly implies that because we don't leave our job(s), we are complicit and part of the reason why nothing will ever get "done." We are as detached from the mainstream as just about anyone. We don't listen to television MSM, opting for a good dose of AJ and NoAgenda on a routine basis. We try to eat right, exercise, and advocate for Non-GMO, organic, free-health-choice, and the right to bear arms. We are ardent, financial supporters of RP.

Would you have a family of four give up a single income just to protest? We have already sacrificed so much just to home-educate our children. I look back at history and see all the times minority groups have fought the establishment (and lost). In particular, I tend to look at Jewish history (because, after all, they are one group of people who have managed to survive expulsions, genocides, dispersion, and persecution; so they must know a thing or two about survival.) The Maccabees managed a miraculous victory over the Greeks after gruesome persecutions (let's talk baby-killing in front of mothers). When later the Jews tried to do the same thing with the Romans, they lost. The last of those who fought, sought refuge on Masada, and tradition has it they committed suicide rather than submit to the Romans. We beat the Brits, but they had a whole ocean against them. The Tienanmen example is nice, but what was the ultimate result? Was there change?

According to Wikipedia: "Despite early expectations in the West that PRC government would soon collapse and be replaced by the democratic governance, the Communist Party of China maintained its grip on power, and the student movement which started at Tiananmen was in complete disarray."

I don't know what it will take to get people to the point where they will sacrifice "everything." One problem is lack of production and connection to land. You think about the early revolutionaries that had productive farms -- they could in theory, sustain themselves, or at least return to sustaining their families when the war was over. If "the populace" did that now, what would they have to go back to? Bring down the corrupt, and return to what? No land, no work, no factories, next to nothing. There is almost "nothing" now, so it's like "why fight for nothing?" At least the 1776 folks knew they were fighting for their land and freedom to work productively for themselves.

Fighting for "liberty" is vague, intangible, and not really very motivating until it "hurts" (i.e. I can't travel to see my family, I can't buy food, I can't drive my car, I can't worship where I choose, etc.) So, my earnest question is, "What more could/should we be doing?" Because preservation of life has become so valuable in the Jewish psyche, that is almost the only thing worthy of fighting for. For me, I'm not at the point where the fight is about life-preservation. Maybe it should be. I guess it's just that slow-boil effect. Thoughts?

Did I say anything about leaving your jobs? That would be stupid considering I DIDN'T LEAVE MINE. This is NOT about OWS, this is not about the TEA PARTY, this is about 300 million people being STRIPPED of their rights to live a life! This is about an entity purposely DUMBING us down, and cutting us off from our potential. What more should we be doing? What ARE we doing is the question? Sitting at home complaining is gonna get less done then anything. Even if we are gonna fail we HAVE TO TRY, and up to this point, I don't feel that we have.

Some of us are actually happy with our lives. We worked hard and at least for the moment we are employed healthy and happy. What some are protesting, the corporations, pay our wages. They are not forceing me to stay, I stay because I want to.
The government provides the rodes I love to ride my bikes on. They provide order so that I can have life, liberty and persue happiness. Schools etc....................

If it all fell apart as some here hope for you have no idea the pain and bloodshed that would follow. Starvation is a horribale way to go. Most of us should be thankful that we woke up this morning and we felt normal.Look past the moment at the big picture because the next rulling class may have you building pyramids the rest of your life.

There has always been divisions in humanity comes with freedom of choice.

Originally posted by nfflhome
Some of us are actually happy with our lives. We worked hard and at least for the moment we are employed healthy and happy. What some are protesting, the corporations, pay our wages. They are not forceing me to stay, I stay because I want to.
The government provides the rodes I love to ride my bikes on. They provide order so that I can have life, liberty and persue happiness. Schools etc....................

If it all fell apart as some here hope for you have no idea the pain and bloodshed that would follow. Starvation is a horribale way to go. Most of us should be thankful that we woke up this morning and we felt normal.Look past the moment at the big picture because the next rulling class may have you building pyramids the rest of your life.

There has always been divisions in humanity comes with freedom of choice.

So you could leave your job with a corporation and continue to put food in the table, without moving on to ANOTHER corporation? hmmm...

And no sir, YOU provide the roads you ride on. That's money that you slave for and never see because of something called an income tax. Yes you have life, but you think you have liberty when your post basically says WITHOUT CORPORATIONS, you wouldn't have the liberty to live as you are accustomed to. Funny because without you, corporate giants are cool. bonuses all around.

I'm amazed that yo acknowledge the existence of a RULING class, but are content living under them.

all spoken in love

You have good points. But happy is happy. Go build a rode by yourself let me know how that goes.
Thanks for the love and good luck to you.

Originally posted by Section31
reply to post by My.mind.is.mine

 

Deadman's Advocate

"In times of desperation, people will believe what they want to believe. And so, we gave them what they wanted to believe. A trick in the form of signal the Resistance thought would win the war. And they were right, it will end this war. Except that it is the Resistance that will be destroyed. Not, Skynet. Our best machines have failed time again to complete a mission. Something was missing. We had to think, radically. And so we made you. We created the perfect infiltration unit. You, Marcus. You did what Skynet has failed to do for so many years. You killed John Connor. Don't fight, Marcus. Remember what you are." ~ Dr. Serena Kogan; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

"You and me, we've been at war before either of us existed. You tried to kill my mother. You killed my father. But you will not kill me." ~ John Connor; "Terminator Salvaton", 2009

We are in a war of ideologies. Since Democrats and 'OWS' are now feeling the pinch, they post threads like this to stave off the coming fight. Why? They fear consequences.

I will not back down.

Its all or none.

No more compromises.

No more speeches.

"I am not here to tell you how it ends, I am hear to tell you how it begins." ~ Neo; Matrix; 1999

Democrats and 'OWS' declared war. We were only fighting to preserve the Constitution, Bill of Rights, Unity, and Declaration of Independents. But... You wanted regulations, anarchy, and entitlements. You wanted universal healthcare, free education, and the end of capitalism.

No.

We end this like men on the field of ideological hell.

edit on 10/28/2011 by Section31 because: (no reason given)

This is a bunch of nonsense, no compromise? Since when, and what do you base it on. Sounds like you want a my way or the highway totalitarianism. This is what is wrong with the USA at this point, no one wants to talk about what we have in common, they are much more content to talk about our differences. Neither the far left or far right will create a government that is effective, however, much like now, the middle is larger than the fringe at either end, just because you scream louder does not make you right. The fringe on both ends wants to establish their freedom by taking it away from others, how is this logical in any way?