This Is Just For Those Who Oppose The OWS Protest!!

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posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 03:09 AM
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So by some of the logic on here i should be lead to believe that just because there are groups of people that you don't necessarily agree with that makes OWS not worth fighting? Even though you agree with the principal that corporate America is out of control? By this logic America should not have been allies with the Soviet Union during WW2 because we didn't agree with Communism? Even though we had the same enemy? THIS MAKES NO SENSE!! WAKE UP!! Before its too late, put aside your stupid differences. Camaraderie is formed in battle, lets all get together and flush this crap down the toilet together, after its over we can work out the details.




posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 03:11 AM
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"the oldest trick in the book"



so dont fall for it!

edit on 27-10-2011 by ignant because: /



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 04:36 AM
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socialism

capitalism


government+economy=

government involved in the economy....
government+freedom=

government allowing freedom....
economy+freedom=

freedom of economy...(free market...)

----------(notice a balance here)-----------

economy - government=

government not involved with economy...
government-freedom=

government with out freedom....
(uh oh, can you guess what the next one is?)
economy-freedom=


and this is based on history, read up people....

now lets see,

when things are put together, HENCE (+) bad one is government+economy...
when we separate things, HENCE "-", bad one is economy-freedom....

so now, we can equate them, becasue they both equal bad, right?

government+economy=economy-freedom
ahhh the dualism of it all.....

shall we have some fun?

lets... subtract government from both sides....
and we get....

economy=economy-freedom-government

government with out freedom, and with out influence on economy= bad economy....


now...., lets add freedom to both sides....
government+economy+freedom=economy

government involved in economy, even though we still have freedom still = bad economy.....

No matter how you flip it, always bad...

----------------------------------------------------------------------------
now here's the BEST PART!!!!
the same can be done to the good

and what you'll see is clear as day...

GOVERNMENT + FREEDOM = GOVERNMENT - ECONOMY +


lets subtract freedom from both sides....

Government = Government - Economy - Freedom =




omg, what does that mean!?!?!?!?!

o wait,
A good government is one where Government stays out of economy, and economy stays out of freedom....

why doesn't freedom get placed in front of government?

Because, we're taking away from 'government-economy', so, government and economy come first, they were already on the table, on that side of the equation, anything added or subtracted to it later get's placed on the right...

Ok, even i admit this is hogwash, what can i say, i was bored lol


edit on 27-10-2011 by MESSAGEFROMTHESTARS because: used wrong symbol



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 04:38 AM
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There is actually nothing wrong with ANY "ism" out there.
They all can be lived by happily, it's the people who manipulate them and deform them to their liking that give them a bad name (literally).

I love Capitalism and Socialism, but I hate what they have been turned into.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 04:40 AM
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Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 
I've always been against corruption in government.
Just not against capitalism.


These two statements cannot both be true, Beezzer. Pick one.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 05:04 AM
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reply to post by beezzer
 

Then you should know healthcare in the US lacks quality, compared to other countries.
Despite the delusion you all cherish about how good your healthcare system works.


Americans spend twice as much as residents of other developed countries on healthcare, but get lower quality, less efficiency and have the least equitable system

US scores last in healthcare study



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 06:14 AM
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Does it really matter what side of the political fence you sit on? Surely we can all agree that the financial sectors in the USA, UK & Europe are a mess and corrupt, who then in turn interfere too much in the politics of said nations. I'm a lefty but sometimes I agree with right leaning thinking, if it makes sense. Stop being so bloody partisan, it's what THEY want, they want to divide us all so any movement like this stumbles before it gets going. You only have to look at the way this has all been reported in the News, especially the outlets owned by Murdoch, how they portray these protestors in a negative light. If you really want to know what is going on at these protests, TURN OFF YOUR TV, go down to them and ask the people there, protestors, Police, Bankers whoever, find out for yourselves, gather the facts and then form an opinion :-)



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:15 AM
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reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 


Your post is the PRECISE reason I oppose OWS. It's a rant. Yes, like most Americans, I am sick of WS being bailed out, sick of government ineptitude, and corruption. However, you don't replace one set of tyrannical half-wits with another group of tyrannical half-wits.

I am not in opposition of what OWS is opposing. I'm in opposition of their solutions. It's communism. Which in turn will create bureaucracy. Which rewards sloth (unions), laziness (liberal Ivy League brats), and tyranny (the rise of radical Islam in America).

What people need to do is rise up against the 99% and show them who the real working class are!

BTW, does anyone else find it ironic that actors earning millions of dollars to play pretend time are criticizing brokers for making millions for doing 'nothing'?



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:34 AM
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Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 
I've always been against corruption in government.
Just not against capitalism.



You understand those 2 are inter-connected due to nature of capitalistic system ?



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:40 AM
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Originally posted by Fromabove


Let me explain. America is the land of opportunity, even under the socialist regime of Obama. The protesters are demanding a piece of other peoples wealth, and that is just wrong. When I was young I too was envious of those who had wealth because I did not. I was very poor and I mean really poor, and I was upset because others had things and I had nothing. I sought help from the government, food stamps, housing aid, etc, but they always made me feel like I was nothing, like dirt. They cared nothing for me or my condition. Then I said to myself, I will do it myself. Surely I could do something for others so that they would give me their money, hence an entrepreneurial mind took hold of me. So I created my own business. Today I own a large home. I have tenants that pay me rent. I have two businesses and do quite well at six figures. I do not need government, nor to desire someone else's money. I have my own. I found the secret to success. It is God's blessing in this land if you want it.

Let me explain the benefits of capitalism. The concept is to gain wealth by transferring it from others to yourself. To do that you need to provide a product, service, idea, etc. The more people that want it, the more you make, and the wealth is redistributed from them to you. It is that easy. Bill gates, Steve Jobs, are two examples of this.

You don't have to be poor, protesting in the park, demanding other peoples money. Make your own. It isn't that hard if you would just try. You can do it, but you have to make the effort. Instead of despising those who have things, say to yourself, "why do they have things" and learn from them.



Thank you for your story. It illustrates beautifully why mainstream America will not sympathize with OWS. Even those of us who have seen our on-paper "net worth" nosedive thanks to the housing crash and the economy slowdown believe that America is still the land of opportunity.

All of the gloom and doom, we are all ruined, the elite bankers have taken over, TPTB control us all...if it is true, then we all have to admit that it's too late, and the time for change has passed us by...I happen to think that we are having an economic correction that has shined the light on errors of the past couple of decades, and we will see movement in the right direction going forward. Either that, or we're screwed.

So instead of being all upset, let's work hard to rebuild this nation that we love. Work. Hard. Make opportunities for yourself.

Socialism, Communism, Government-ism are NOT the answer. The only thing that will work is giving people an incentive to strive. And by that, I don't mean the government artificially picking the winners and losers by giving to one group by taking from another group...
edit on 27-10-2011 by GeorgiaGirl because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:41 AM
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reply to post by beezzer
 


I agree. Capitalism in itself is a good thing. When it gets out of hand and monopolies form, it's not a good thing. For example, 5-6 years ago, there used to be close to a dozen national cell phone carriers and their rates were all competitive. Now we just have Verizon, AT&T, T-Mobile, & Sprint. Their rates are somewhat competitive, but not that much. In another couple years it could just be Verizon & AT&T, in which rates would probably be very high.

The free market is a good thing, monopolies are not.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:45 AM
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reply to post by discharged77
 


Your analogies are absolute hogwash. Your logic is flawed. The heart of OWS protest is as much the enemy of man like me, a small business owner with a spouse who has a professional degree, as is the WS '1%'.

Neither have my best interests at heart, you are the person that needs to 'wake up'. You need to look at who is driving your little 'protest'. George Soros, labor unions like the AFL/CIO, CAIR these people are not my friend. At least the WS '1%' just want to screw me by default rather than by design.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 07:51 AM
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I'm against them being likened to the Tea Party. The similarities stop at being a group of people in a public area.

You can't say they are out fighting for a common cause, as I have yet to see a cohesive message, unlike the Tea Party who stand for liberty and against government intervention.

Hypocrisy of some of the OWS supporters. How many "one percenters" are out there endorsing OWS, advocating for higher taxes, yet not voluntarily paying extra? The IRS allows them to pay any percentage of their income in taxes.

Violence.. Its rampant at OWS, non-existent at the Tea Party.

Littering.. Look at the mess these people are making! Again, Ive seen Tea Party rallies after the attendants have left, predominantly clean. These OWS pigs are pissing and $#!tting in the street. I would think the "left wing tea party" would care about the environment more.

Racism.. I haven't seen the amount of racism in the Tea Party as the OWS. On camera, some OWS will shout epitaph after epitaph. I have yet to see a documented case of racism at the Tea Party rallies, and you know it would be out there used by the media if there was some cases.

One thing I do take away from OWS, is they think that some people should pay a higher percentage of their income than others. I believe in equal protection of the law for everyone (equality) afforded by the constitution.
This point of theirs is anti-constitution.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:20 AM
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It never ceases to amaze me that some people can find a fly in every single bowl of soup set in front of them. They are so busy finding fault that they can not see any type of benefit. The simple fact is that NO form of government is fair and equitable. Human nature being what it is, even the most benign systems are slowly perverted over time to benefit a select few to the detriment of the rest of us. ALL of them without exception. There is a reason God commanded Noah to have no human governments, but to obey His laws and have minor disputes settled by Elders akin to a weregild system. Though such a system may, on the surface, seem brutal, it is fair and effective and recidivism rates are negligible or non existent. Is that not what we are all seeking?
Many shudder at the thought of no government, calling it chaos and anarchy, while, in the very next breath, rail at the unfairness of this or that system and demand justice. Define justice for me. Not rule of law, but justice. They are vastly different. Most laws are made to protect the privileged and their assets, activities, etc. You will, if you look, see this happening in ALL types of governments.
The OWS does have some damn good ideas that most of us can abide. Yet, hypocrisy abounds when the metal meets the meat and individuals are faced with the prospect of personal long term sacrifice for the good of the whole. Case in point, the recent complaints from OWS about homeless people eating their food and not giving anything in return. I thought the whole idea was to care for the whole.
Human Nature.
The real enemy.
Somebody earlier on said "Wake up, wake up."
I agree.
Now if somebody can figure out how we do that, let me know.
I am but a little fish in a big ocean and I can not figure out the answer. Can you?



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:22 AM
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I'm not against protests. Protests are a powerful and necessary part of a society with free people being able to freely voice their opinions. My problem is that their message seems to be a bit misguided for several reasons.

a) They are protesting against the banks and corruption (which is good) but then they are calling for the re-election of Obama--supposedly to continue ushering in socialism--all the while forgetting that the Obama administration gave BILLIONS of tax payer dollars to the very banks they are protesting against, AND Obama's cabinet is FULL of former bankers. it makes no sense. You can't logically oppose the banks, but support the guy who gave the banks billions of YOUR dollars.

b) They are protesting against capitalism, and I don't understand it at all. They might as well be protesting against Santa Claus or Leprechauns because capitalism does not exist in America. Where does a "free market" have room for government regulation of any kind, bail-outs, tax incentives, federal loans, federal grants, OSHA, corporate taxes, zoning laws, labor laws, minimum wage laws, union laws, affirmative action laws, government inspection, the FDA, government registration, government licensing, age restrictions, permits...etc...etc...etc... We have a government that dictates to businesses what they can sell, who they can/can't sell their products to, where they are allowed to operate, who they must hire, how much they must pay their employees, how they treat their employees, quality standards for products, and then we call it a "free market". It's bull# and protesting against our "free market" makes no sense at all.

c) The mere idea that "anarchists" are protesting in favor of "socialism" is laughable to me. In very simple terms: an anarchist is someone who wants NO government AT ALL. A socialist is someone who wants a VERY interventionist government to divvy up all the wealth equally to all the people. You simply can't be both without being a giant hypocrite. I don't consider myself to be a full-on anarchist--but I'm damn close. I'm infinitely closer than someone who supports socialism (or any real ism for that matter).

Just because you listen to punk rock music, give yourself a mohawk, dress in tattered clothes, and act rebellious doesn't make you an anarchist--it makes you a jerk. A big part of being a REAL anarchist is believing that government rule is unnecessary because you are capable of ruling your self (which entails acting civilized, respecting others, being responsible for your own successes/failures, having self reliance, having common sense, etc).

I'm against these protesters because, in my personal opinion, they have it backwards. A free market (or freedom of any kind whatsoever) is not the cause of the financial problems in this country. Freedom--REAL FREEDOM--is the one and only solution to the problems. The problems are not big business OR big government. The problem is big business AND big government. Live and let live.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:23 AM
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Originally posted by TheWalkingFox

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 
I've always been against corruption in government.
Just not against capitalism.


These two statements cannot both be true, Beezzer. Pick one.
You're right.
*sigh*
I am for capitalism.
Just against corruption and snide posters

Thanks for the heads up, Faux!



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:25 AM
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Originally posted by shogu666

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 
I've always been against corruption in government.
Just not against capitalism.



You understand those 2 are inter-connected due to nature of capitalistic system ?

Those two are interconnected because of weak-willed cowards who chose to cheat rather than work.



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:28 AM
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Originally posted by TheWalkingFox

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by SpeakerofTruth
 
I've always been against corruption in government.
Just not against capitalism.


These two statements cannot both be true, Beezzer. Pick one.


You are absolutely wrong. Those statements make perfect sense and lie in perfect accord with one another. In capitalism, otherwise known as a FREE market, the government is not intertwined with business and the economy. The only reason businesses CAN pay off politicians is because the government is intertwined with the businesses to begin with. If our market was truly free of government control, and only subject to free market forces--no level of corruption in the government would effect the market at all.

Think about capitalism like a fist fight. The combatants succeed and/or fail based on their own skills, talents, attributes, etc (free market forces). When you introduce a referee into the mix (aka the government)...the dynamics of the fight get changed--it's no longer pure capitalism. You no longer have a fist fight, but a boxing match with rules--and an enforcer of those rules. Although the fight could still be largely determined by those same free market forces--it can be greatly influenced by the referee. The ref can scold, deduct points, limit your tactics, etc... and...if that ref is corrupt...he can rig the game.

My point is... you can support letting the best man win (capitalism) and still oppose corrupt refs (the government)... in fact, if you really want to let the best man win... you can simply not put a ref in the ring. Then, no matter how corrupt the refs are, they will have no bearing on the fight.
edit on 10/27/2011 by MiloNickels because: further thoughts
edit on 10/27/2011 by MiloNickels because: typo



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:36 AM
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I'm neither for nor against the protest. I just don't think they're going to have any long term effects.
If OWS makes it into my future children's history books and they ask me about it I'm going to say:
"Yeah I remember that....didn't do much."



posted on Oct, 27 2011 @ 08:42 AM
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reply to post by thehoneycomb
 


First there is no such thing as a free market, it is not possible, never has never will. What your describing is the problem with republics, at a certain point groups of people gain too much power and use their power to effect politics. The problem with pointing the finger at unions is they are the lesser of the evils when compared to big pharma, wall st, and oil companies. By your logic all these groups are serving a socialist purpose since they effect innovation, along with supply and demand. However there are a lot more things needed to be a socialist society





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