Some Interesting Hearsay About OWS & Our Military

reply to post by Freetheworld23


I live on the Left Coast, but not in LA...but close enough. And the last time I checked, the LAPD is not known for their diplomacy and kindness. In all fairness, though, I hear reports that the LAPD has handled themselves pretty well, and that they're committed to NOT acting like the NYPD...but, we'll see.....

reply to post by backinblack


Pfft. Protesting at all gets you that label.

Unless you're toting rifles and calling for blood to water the tree of liberty. Then you're a "patriot"

reply to post by TheWalkingFox


I sincerely hope we can transcend violence. there's been enough to go around during the last 10 years.
Our country is nearing a valance point, and I don't think anyone can predict which way the scales will tip.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by backinblack

 

Pfft. Protesting at all gets you that label.

Unless you're toting rifles and calling for blood to water the tree of liberty. Then you're a "patriot"

Well here in Melbourne they were called out for having knives and hammers..
They were butter knives to make lunches and the hammer was for the tent pegs..

reply to post by backinblack


Yeah, that's the kind of BS move that I would expect from the police. Inventing "crime" out of nothing...
They are such poor losers when they don't get their way. Their egos can't stand to have their "authority" challenged, and they hate to be reminded about who ( theoretically ) pays their salaries...

www.youtube.com...

Here's a tid bit to ponder

I still dont get why anyone is supporting that Sham guy

He's exactly that, a SHAM.
It was proven that he's the same guy who led everyone onto the bridge where there was clearly chalk on the ground to tell the police where to stand so that they could make a nice show for the media.

reply to post by moonzoo7


You are correct they have been nothing but kind and graceful, but I have a feeling, that it is only because the turn out in LA has been relatively small compared to OWS in New York. Lets hope this movement grows into the hundreds of thousands every where and then we can see how the good ole' boys play.

reply to post by Fishticon84


Has it? Care to share? 'Cause that sounds like interesting info, and I haven't hard it before.

reply to post by moonzoo7


Nonviolence will hold. I think you'll be surprised by how people who actually have a cause rallying them are willing to take all the licks delivered to them. Force has not dispersed this, and force has not been met with returned violence yet.

The men enacting the violence are only injuring themselves when it is not returned.

Originally posted by TheWalkingFox
reply to post by Fishticon84

 

Has it? Care to share? 'Cause that sounds like interesting info, and I haven't hard it before.

Here ya go..


And another good one...

Those facial comparisons are so far off the mark...that guy is delusional.
Please take a closer look lol.

Originally posted by moonzoo7


I'm sure that the trolls and Tea Baggers are about to pounce all over this thread, but I don't care.

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: punctuation repair

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: spelling correction

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: added to title for clarity

You had me until you regurgitated this crap.

Originally posted by macman

Originally posted by moonzoo7


I'm sure that the trolls and Tea Baggers are about to pounce all over this thread, but I don't care.

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: punctuation repair

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: spelling correction

edit on 24-10-2011 by moonzoo7 because: added to title for clarity

You had me until you regurgitated this crap.

Yep. Nothing divisive or troll like about the OP's last remark. Wow.

But seriously, folks may want to do a little research on the NG before buying into this. Guardsmen may not be rich guys who particularly like the banks or the wall street types, but military personnel, in general, are fairly conservative. Leftist movements and the US military do not mix.

If things got violent, God forbid, the NG would likely be called out to help control the protesters. I doubt any soldier is going to destroy his/her family's benefits, retirement, USAA membership, or get themselves thrown in Leavenworth for performing one of the traditional duties of the Guard/organized militia.

Like it or not, one of the oldest functions of the NG and the state militia (the NG's predecessor), is to quell civil unrest. I'm not saying I'm for or against it. Just that this is one of the things guardsmen are trained to do. And for the above reasons I doubt many will fail to do so when activated (They also get state activation pay).

While I do not doubt that someone may have a buddy in the Guard who might say such things, I doubt it was anything more than a little diarrhea of the mouth and wishful thinking. If anything, Guardsmen are looking into personal protection because of all the training they've been receiving and domestic exercises which may be implemented in the case of mass unrest. I'd want to maximize my family's protection too, if I felt outbreaks of violence may occur in the near future.

The one scenario where NG might be used against local police is if Obama decided to make a play for full on dictatorship. He does have the power to federalize the Guard and take it from the state Governor's control. The act would be an overt and heinous abuse of power and show his hand. Despite his large slate of Constitutional abuses that might make even W Bush blush, I don't think Obama's ready for something that dramatic.

In my opinion same thing that makes US military so effective and consolidated outside country, will make them useless for TPTB to use on protests. I dont believe US forces would oppose common citizens, if a looot of them comes from same social grounds.
Cops are different, they are specifically trained to act against their own on an order.

Originally posted by Ubeen
I am no fan of the police state.
I am a veteran and swore a oath to protect the Constitution from all enemies foreign and domestic.

My Contract with the military has expired by my oath and hell of lot of other veterans oath still stand.

The police are not the enemy and need to be the next group that needs to be assimilated.
The police are scared and need to know who is, and who is not on their side.
The police need to protect the protesters but more important the protesters need to befriend and help the police chose the right side.

The police are part of 99% its time we all remember what side we are on.

I agree. From the footage that I have been watching you can clearly see the fear in many of their eyes. If the OP's described scenario pans out, I believe the fog will be lifted from the perceptions of the police at the first sight of the military standing opposite to them. (I hope anyways.) But above all I agree that we need to remember who we are and assimilate those who deserve the same opportunity.

Remember that I.M.U:
Intelligence; the ability to communicate ideas.
Mind; to memorize, to think.
Unity; to harmonize, to be of one mind.


P.S. This is my first post and I would like to give "props" to ATS and its' members for managing a mature environment to discuss these relevant issues. A great alternative to many. I hope to be around for awhile, unless the "banhammer" somehow finds me here. Clearly not all sites are created equal. Thanks again for this sigh of relief.


Surfeit

Originally posted by stainlesssteelrat
In my opinion same thing that makes US military so effective and consolidated outside country, will make them useless for TPTB to use on protests. I dont believe US forces would oppose common citizens, if a looot of them comes from same social grounds.
Cops are different, they are specifically trained to act against their own on an order.

I can see a lot of people don't understand the difference between the National Guard and the regular armed forces. One of the primary functions of the National Guard in its history and that of state militia forces is to deal with civil unrest. Only since 2001 has the Guard been counted among the primary operational forces for overseas conflicts (maybe since 1991 & the Gulf War but that was short lived).

1903- 2001, they were a reserve force for the regular armed forces while being the primary force for domestic military problems. These include dealing with natural and manmade disasters, local first response, as well as civil unrest. Before being federally funded in1903, they were fully under the control of their state. Do a bit of reading. Not saying it is likely to go down because I don't think it is, but 1 of the main purposes of the NG/militia is to put down civil unrest.

reply to post by radosta


When I wrote it I actually had marine corps on my mind, Im well aware of purposes of National Guard.
But still, they hadnt do it for a long time, 40 years now? Beating protesters I mean. D

reply to post by macman
"You had me until you regurgitated this crap."


I see. Since I used the term "Tea Baggers", my post is not true. Spoken like a true "Tea Bagger". If I don't use the verbage that you approve of, then nothing I say is true. Political affiliation has nothing to do with the veracity of this information. It is what it is, no matter what you or I think politically.There is no one to be "had" here. I came across this, and I put it out there. You guys always perform to expectations, on cue, every time, and that's why I said that in advance. Thanks for proving my point on that.

reply to post by radosta


I've been on ATS for years, long before the Right Wingers jumped on board and started trolling here. Things were a lot different here on ATS before the Tea Baggers showed up. I've witnessed the "before and after" for myself. I've been here long enough to able to reasonably predict how most, not all, Right Wingers will respond to certain topics, and having seen their comments on other OWS-oriented threads.
And your comment about most of the regular military being predominantly conservative...well, isn't it interesting that (based on your own observation ) the job that requires aggression, violence and the outright killing of civilians with the push of a button or drones is filled by conservatives. Think about that. I'm not sure that it's statistically true, but it does provide insight into your perceptions of the ideology of military personnel.
I provided information suggesting that this perception may not be true across the board, and of course it draws fire.
The topic at hand has nothing to do with the tgraditional functions of the National Guard. We all know what their their traditional was before 9/11. That has nothing to do with it.