A Manifesto for the Impending Second American Revolution, page 5
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ATS Members have flagged this thread 15 times


reply posted on 22-10-2011 @ 09:53 AM by wildtimes
reply to post by OutKast Searcher


sigh.

Okay.

I'm gonna pull the academic card.
I graduated in 2002 with honors as a Master of Social Work. In order to achieve that advanced degree, I was required to attend classes, write papers, work in the real world, and prove that I had a good handle on the complex ideas of social structure.

"Conservative" is a term used for different things at different times.
Yes, the Republicans are blaming Obama, because they are Republicans. In general parlance "Conservative" is part of the Republican platform, meaning they want SMALL GOVERNMENT. "Conservative" is also used to speak about those who want to keep the status quo, who staunchly refuse change, who stick to "traditional values". For example the bible-thumping evangelicals and the anti-unioners.

The Republican party , in theory, emphasizes private sector over government oversight. The private sector doesn't want to help those in need. They want to be left alone to do what they see as "profitable", their fellow less-fortunate citizens be damned.

"Liberal" is a term used to speak about people who are more progressive in thought. Who believe the common good is MORE important than one guy's bank account.
It is also a term commonly applied to Democrats, in the sense that Democrats are more comfortable with a 'Liberal dose' of government.

It's critical to understand the subtle nuances of those two words, as so MUCH depends on the context of the discussion at hand.

The private sector buys Republican Congressmen with huge donations. They also close up shop here in the USA and move overseas, to AVOID TAXES. Thereby, they are depriving AMERICANS of jobs that are WANTED and NEEDED, so that their PROFITS are bigger. Lots of people in other threads are defending that right to choose "how or whether to spend profits".

The Republicans then fight the Democrats who want fairness, the common interest held highest (NOT the profit-margins of super-rich corporations and individuals).

This has gone so far past the Republicans throwing a tantrum every time the White House tries to do ANYTHING that it doesn't even really apply anymore.

But I'm done with my portion of the debate with you. You seem irrational, angry, and ill-prepared to discuss this intelligently.


reply posted on 22-10-2011 @ 10:03 AM by OutKast Searcher
reply to post by wildtimes


Was that just a lecture to yourself?

Because you were the one saying that Conservatives only use the 9% number, and that is just plain wrong.


And that is fine, you can run away from the conversation after I have answered every single question you put forth and even responded to your list of "specific issues".


I love when people try to brag about their credentials...claim other people aren't "intelligent" enough to debate with...and then run away from the conversation.


I'm sorry you can't clearly state why you support what you do...but that is not my problem, that is yours.
edit on 22-10-2011 by OutKast Searcher because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 22-10-2011 @ 10:07 AM by OutKast Searcher
Originally posted by wildtimes
reply to post by OutKast Searcher


This happens to be my thread. Stop the attacks.


This is actually ATS's thread...not yours.

Responding when you directly address me is not an attack...it is a conversation.

I'm sorry you don't like the way the discussion has turned, that it has exposed the flaws in OWS and your reasoning behind supporting it.

But that doesn't mean you can just attempt to silence me.


You are free to refute anything I have said in any of my posts...but you dont' have the authority to silence me.


reply posted on 22-10-2011 @ 01:00 PM by SM2
reply to post by wildtimes


Actually Wild, the democrats do not necessarily want fairness, you want to have this thread be unbiased, but you have just shown bias. Yes the republicans want limited government intervention in business, and truthfully everything, not just business, and you admitted that they want this because higher taxes drive more firms overseas to avoid all of the taxes so they have higher profits. Well, attack the cause, not the symptom. Lower taxes as America has the highest corporate income tax rate in the industrialized world. The cost of doing business in America is extraordinarily high.Not saying they do not have problems and they are great, just saying, be a little more truthful about the actual stance instead of saying what you hear from Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid.

now on the the democrats, they do not want things "fair" They show more tendency to have the government involved in every aspect of your daily life. They do not show a bit of this "the individual knows best" they show a "government knows best" approach. They also advocate more government entitlement programs for touchy feely, feel good programs and support organizations such as SEIU, the now defunct ACORN, and other such groups that advocate a more socialistic approach to society, which leads to diminishing individual liberty and freedom. Now, not taking a side on either one, just saying, be a little more truth full and unbiased on your explanation in regards to the platforms. Again, I personally do not care which group most closely represents you, as we are each entitled to our own opinions, and neither one is right for everyone. I personally err on the side of liberty and freedom and choose not to support either party. On the matter of fair, how is it fair to force me and my family that all work extremly hard to get by, to support people that want to just pop kids out all day and not go out and work when they are perfectly capable and just plain lazy? that is not fair to either party invovled, it encourages the lazy people to remain lazy and the hard workers to not work so hard. The best way to battle poverty is to make the poor uncomfortable in their poverty


reply posted on 22-10-2011 @ 02:56 PM by wildtimes
reply to post by SM2


Respectfully disagree. I was speaking about the education I recieved- not saying at all that it was unbiased.

The statements I made regarding what I learned in graduate school are only reflections of what I was taught. They may be erroneous. I was simply trying to point out the difference in usage between "liberal" and "conservative."

admitted that they want this because higher taxes drive more firms overseas to avoid all of the taxes so they have higher profits. Well, attack the cause, not the symptom. Lower taxes as America has the highest corporate income tax rate in the industrialized world. The cost of doing business in America is extraordinarily high.Not saying they do not have problems and they are great, just saying, be a little more truthful about the actual stance instead of saying what you hear from Nancy Pelosi or Harry Reid.


Actually, don't know what either of them has to say.
I have heard from my Congressmen (one a Senator and one a Rep) that they want to lower corp taxes in America. .... so, I respectfully ask that you excuse me if I seem to be espousing what someone else is saying...I don't "hear" anything from either of them. My opinions and stance are based only on my own situation and understanding of the current events.
I generally don't listen to politicians at all... nor do I listen to MSM anchors.
edit on 22-10-2011 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)
edit on 22-10-2011 by wildtimes because: (no reason given)



reply posted on 23-10-2011 @ 06:45 AM by gamesmaster63
reply to post by wildtimes


I wish I had a nest egg, even with my disability I am having to work full time and still living paycheck to paycheck.


reply posted on 23-10-2011 @ 07:59 AM by gamesmaster63
reply to post by OutKast Searcher


You are correct in that she does not have the authority to silence you, that is what free speech is all about.

You are wrong about it being ATS's thread. If you go to your profile you will find a section labeled...

Thread I Authored
(see all my threads)

meaning, by common law, ATS has granted ownership of the thread an individual has authored to them.


reply posted on 23-10-2011 @ 08:14 AM by wildtimes
reply to post by gamesmaster63


gamesmaster, I was almost going to ignore this thread altogether, it having been so derailed. I want to extend my thanks to you for your calm, supportive and clear posts.

No, I haven't read OWS' Manifesto. I started the thread after reading the "Manifesto" I found online, and wanted to find out what ATS thought about it.

I neither advocate it nor decry it. It is someone else's work.

I then went on to further research the Constitution (as it had been brought up by a few others), the various forms of government as described by past thinkers and philosophers, and finally tried to elucidate some of the "theories" I was taught. I did not CREATE the lessons I was taught, I absorbed them.

Since then, I have come to see "social work" as a very different animal than I THOUGHT it was when I entered the profession. It is more an art than a hard "skill-set."

I believe that everyone is entitled to dignity, to determine their own goals, and to assistance in learning the skills to achieve those goals. I am no politician, nor do I believe politicians, Ron Paul included.

Anyway, everyone else seems to have buggered off here, so, thanks for the chance to wrap up calmly and with a cool head.

Cheers, mate!

Oh, and btw -- at one time I thought I would gladly "rule the world." Now, uh uhn. No way jose. But if there's an opening for an Ethics Committee, sign me up.



reply posted on 23-10-2011 @ 08:41 PM by gamesmaster63
reply to post by wildtimes


You are quite welcome, and I apologize for the times that I have been off topic. I advocate a free exchange of ideas, which occasionally causes the original topic to get lost in the discussion.

Have peace and love in your life and my hopes that a revolution is not needed.
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