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posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 05:55 AM
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Originally posted by 74Templar
A very poignant post, and one with a very logical leaning toward the inevitable. Of course in this world it seems hopeless, I just can't see the end being good for us middle class no matter what.
Despite this I refuse to believe the world cannot be changed, or even fixed. The world has it's ears on now, it's eyes open, moreso than any other point in history, and people are waking up to what is really going on en masse. This movement started long ago, even though people do not realise, in the 60s with a shift away from the war mongering towards the voice of the people gaining ground. Unlike them, we are not separated by distance.
Granted, we the people still wield little power compared to those who are running the show at this point, but remember they've had longer than us to make plans. At some point the balance will have to tip, it simply must as more and more people realise the true nature of the game and rise up to put a stop to it.
I firmly believe people as a whole (with a few exceptions) are good and will be kind or help given the oppurtunity, and that these overlord types that have brainwashed us into being secular and selfish are rapidly losing ground, they just have to be shown that doing so is not wrong, and to be genuine about it.
Remember, one ripple can create a wave with enough momentum. It just takes time.


Sure hope that a few million RIPPLE can come together to a super big wave
A 100 foot tasunomi

Don't think we have much time left




posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:03 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 


I had a long reply carefully constructed reply to your most excellent narrative and description of the state of the world.

Your outline is probably one of the best I've read in decades.

I don't have the heart to try and reconstruct my effort that was lost when I hit a wrong button on my trackball.

I'll just post:

www.amazon.com...=sr_1_1?s=digital-text&ie=UTF8&qid=1318934034&sr=1-1

which infuriated me when I read it during a long dark night of the soul--looking for comfort..

And, I'll note that I believe that

America was established for 3 basic reasons:

1. To further the Gospel of Jesus The Christ;
2. To help establish and protect Israel until God was ready to 100% take over providing for and protecting Israel after He disciplines her for being far from Him.
3. To DEMONSTRATE to ALL CREATION that even the most ideal form of government in all recorded history would result in greed, corruption, tyrannical evil

APART FROM GOD.

I believe this END TIMES ERA is a vivid object lesson to all Creation--that

GOD ALONE IS WORTHY;
GOD ALONE IS ABLE;
GOD ALONE IS LOVE;
GOD ALONE IS RIGHTEOUS;

GOD ALONE has all our best interests at heart.

As Scripture indicates . . . ALL CREATION waits expectantly yearning, groaning for the manifestation of the sons of God [to put things right].

And after literal ARMAGEDDON--things will be put to right.

Until then--the blood will flow in increasing horrific quantities.

At some point even billionaires with their plush bunkers etc. will discover that all their planning and resources have come to devastating naught apart from God.

And that for all . . . who trust in God and cling to the truths in Psalm 91--GOD IS ABLE; GOD IS FAITHFUL; GOD WILL BE STRONG in behalf of all who TRUST UTTERLY AND ABANDONED-LY IN GOD . . . .

GOD ALONE.
edit on 18/10/2011 by BO XIAN because: left out a word



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:07 AM
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reply to post by BO XIAN
 


Well God helps those who help themselves. Has that stopped the American government, regardless of who is pulling the strings, from killing millions of innocent people lately? Or torturing little kids in front of their families? Or taking older people's rights away and stealing their money to protect them, or any of the thousands of things I could type?

Face it. God is NOT going to save you, except when you're already dead. That doesn't help the living though, does it?



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:08 AM
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Money is the root of all...

Money is also just a bit of paper used as a means of exchange by consensus of the majority aimed at reducing the complexities of barter...

Barter is an exchange system to primarily provide us with the necessities of life. ...and ever more items/services perceived as being luxuries. Poverty is always measured relative to your time and place in this world - not usually in terms of absolutes.

Society, apparently, is in place to ensure that the vulnerable among us are provided with the requirements to live a satisfactory life.

Somewhere, sometime we lost sight of what our time in this world is all about.

They reckon the baby boomers are the most brain washed and materialist generation the world has ever known. My parents are still in awe of the television screen - it's still a novelty in their lives albeit perhaps the most effective tool of propaganda ever invented. Thanks to the rise of the net and our ability to communicate directly with one another in all corners of the globe has fast reduced the efficacy of tv propaganda.

The waged bondage many in the world are forced to endure (including the so-called affluent west) - giving of your labour for the majority of your waking week no longer leads to increased security and needs satisfaction - many work simply to earn the necessary money to go to work again next week. That is a very depressing treadmill.

That consensus about those bits of paper - can't we simply change our minds? Create an alternative means of exchange and a new mind set that regards the chasing of wealth for the sake of wealth as being nothing more than the shallow and vulgar detractor of our glorious humanity that it actually is.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:15 AM
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reply to post by christina-66
 


BAH!!!! Money is the root of all evil BULL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Selfishness is the root of All Evil.

Plus if you want to blame money, don't. Blame DEBT. Even Jesus whooped on the money lenders.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:17 AM
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Originally posted by thejlxc
reply to post by BO XIAN
 


Well God helps those who help themselves. Has that stopped the American government, regardless of who is pulling the strings, from killing millions of innocent people lately? Or torturing little kids in front of their families? Or taking older people's rights away and stealing their money to protect them, or any of the thousands of things I could type?

Face it. God is NOT going to save you, except when you're already dead. That doesn't help the living though, does it?


I don't pretend to understand very thoroughly at all

the mind of God Almighty.

I do know from a long RELATIONSHIP with Him

that He does all things well.

I don't understand His seeming to spend people like water.

I do KNOW that He knows our suffering better even than we do ourselves.

I do KNOW that He knows when every sparrow falls and has ever hair on our heads numbered.

I do KNOW that He Loves us more than we love ourselves.

I have no brilliant explanation for all the suffering

EXCEPT THAT

TO ESTABLISH THE POSSIBILITY OF

AUTHENTIC TRUE LOVE

There MUST be the genuine option of choosing NON-LOVE--ELSE THERE CAN BE NO MEANINGFUL, TRUE LOVE.

AND

That choosing Non-Love necessitates SUFFERING AS A CONSEQUENCE.

I know that all the collected choices and collected consequences over and throughout history have resulted in horrific suffering of astronomical proportions, types and abundance.

Somehow, God has it all in hand.

There's not a shred of suffering for those of good heart--which will NOT result in greater benefit.

AS The Book says--the sufferings of this life are not worthy to be compared to the glories of our

Eternal Life in God.

I have learned from very hard painful experience that going it on my own is insufficient, inadequate, doomed to utter painful failure. I don't want to go around that mountain yet again.

Been there.
Done that.
Got trailer loads of T-shirts.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:19 AM
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reply to post by christina-66
 


Christ said the

LOVE of money was the root of all evil.

Idolatry always has destructive consequences.

Whether we worship ourselves, power, greed, ego, social stars, status . . . drugs . . . anything and everything other than

GOD ALONE

the consequences will be destructive. Idolatry is always deadly.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:23 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 



Face it. God is NOT going to save you, except when you're already dead. That doesn't help the living though, does it?


Actually, He HAS already saved me from death 3 times in my life.

And that doesn't count the time when a relatively small whirlwind lifted all the tin roofing from our chickenhouse, barns and sheds and brought them toward our adobe mud hut with a fury. Mother quickly prayed "Oh, Jesus, Help us!"

ON two sides of the mud hut--one could have virtually drawn a straight line--about 1.5" from the walls--the tin came that close and no closer.

It is clear from Scripture that God WILL BE saving many supernaturally in this era.

and

that some will be martyred.

And that those martyred will have abundant reward for their suffering as will all who trust in God.

Sure, I've stocked up on food etc. And, I live in a relatively way above average location for survival.

However, I do not trust in my prep etc. to more than help a while in major degrees and respects.

There is no hope apart from God. That's simple fact, imho.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:26 AM
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Look Bo. I like the idea of God. If the rules to go to heaven were "Be a good human being at all times" then I'm in like Flint. Love of money is selfishness. Selfishness is truly the root of Evil.

But I will not trash on religion. Believe as you will, if it does no harm to others. Fine.

The idea that no man may know Gods plan is fine and dandy, except this...

I VERY much doubt it's God's plan for everyone to sit around and watch the world die...

but have faith it will be alright.

I know one thing about God, God has some Wrath in there for the wicked too. There are wicked people killing us all. Maybe God is waiting for us to stop being lazy, stop asking for Gods help, and do something?



Look you wanna trade stories of how You were saved by God against the literally dozens of times I've cheated Death without?
edit on 18-10-2011 by thejlxc because: Reply to bo above added.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:28 AM
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reply to post by christina-66
 


Well put.

I've often pondered what an alternative VOLUNTARY system would look like in say during the Millenial reign of Christ.

Evidently there will be an 'every man his own vineyard' sort of existence . . .

It seems to me that there must be a voluntary sharing of abundance with others.

Coercion etc. is not going to cut it.

Selfishness is certainly not going to cut it nor be allowed--certainly at some point, it seems to me.

Massive unbounded greed is not likely to be allowed at all.

Even now we are instructed to give our extra coat to the one without.

Yet, even many authentic Believers fail far too much at that--though they are the MOST GENEROUS-to the poor group on the planet and have been so for 2,000 years.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:35 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 


imho,

God is merciful extremely often toward all . . . even unbelievers.

Read free online:

ANGELS ON ASSIGNMENT

www.angelsonassignment.org...

I heard him speak before he died. He had the build AND PERSONALITY of Walter Cronkite.

He was NOT the sort of person to be easily fooled. He was very hard nosed and practical.

Anyway--I do agree with you that we ought to do the good we can.

AND that on occasion, that will be shredding, destroying, dispatching evil as best we can in our sphere of influence.

. . . for me . . . as God leads. I don't trust my own fleshy judgment alone, in such matters.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:35 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 


Let me first just say, EPIC thread dude. I agree with almost everything you said, but I don't believe violent resistance is the only way. I used to believe money was just pure evil, and root cause of all our problems. It took me a while to see money is actually a very useful tool for trade. I like the idea of a resource based economy, but I'd rather have a balance between capitalism and communism ideologies, instead of an extreme version of either.

A person should have to earn their wealth, and I believe that a person who works more or a much harder job deserves to be payed more. Without money there would be so many problems. Lets be realistic. It's highly unlikely that everything will suddenly become free. People are too greedy to make it work properly. Now consider trade without money...there's no way you are going to trade random stuff each time you need a burger from McDonald's. That's why people use a currency to represent wealth and they trade using that.

Now back to my original point. Money is a very important tool, but it can also be a very powerful tool. That's why the "elite" are obsessed with money. It's their single most important tool for manipulation and getting what they want. That's why it is also our single most powerful tool for getting what we want. What you seem to forget is that all their money and power was generated by us! No one else is responsible but our very selves.

How many people actually achieve the "American dream", has anyone actually done the math on that? Because I can tell you now it will be damn small percentage. The solution is the boycott the banks and literally rip away at the foundations of their most important money making schemes. I will always believe the pen is mightier than the sword. You don't need to shed blood to win a battle, but I will not be surprised in the slightest to see these events escalate within the next few months.

Now you may argue that "money is indeed a problem because these people abuse the financial system so easily", but that's just the fault of one specific currency operating under one specific monetary system. Just look at Bitcoin. It's an ingenuous design. So much for them being able to print new money, the whole thing is operated on a decentralized P2P network and there is no central bank or financial institution that can regulate or produce new currency.

What if a large number of people were to withdraw their assets from big banks and put it into Bitcoin...you think that wouldn't achieve anything? You think the elite bankers wont be worried about that? It would probably scare them 1000 times more than any violent uprising. How are they going to fund their false wars and keep the people living in artificial scarcity if we cut off their greedy blood sucking fangs (aka big banks)?
edit on 18-10-2011 by ChaoticOrder because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:40 AM
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Such a great post.
I love this topic and could write about it for years...
Your sentiments are exactly how I see things, albeit with a little less gloom.
I am very surprised to read something that mirrors my own very thoughts.

But here's my addition:
You see all the corruption, you see all the greed.
You see the evil in this world that completely overwhelms the good.

There is a reason why we all consume mindlessly.
There is a reason we all pass down this American lifestyle of lustful living.
Face it, when you have a TV, with cable and internet, you are part of the group.
When you buy lavish things you don't need, you fit in the group.
But you are predisposed to think this way.

It's what you have been taught.
It's what has been passed down.

It's all a plan.

It's not about control of the money...it's about controlling the people.
And they are doing a perfect job at both.
If we fought back against this tyranny, which is exactly what it is, we could stop this.
The people can actually do something if they just realize what is taking place.
But they have to see it!
Don't think, "There is no way!"
They may have mass weapons of destruction, but we have hundreds of millions of people.
We can scare and bring down the biggest army...

Herein lies the problem.

You have paid for ALL of this


Don't believe me?
Where do you think your taxes go anyways....?

It's not just about printing money from thin air.
It's not just about the power that the 'elite' have.

It's the fact that we have all been tricked.
Tricked into believing we are free, when we actually funded everything they have done.
We have mindlessly bent over backwards to fund the war-machine.
All because we continue to obey, consume and conform.

Just like good little cattle.


There is a BIG solution...if the people want to actually do something...
They HAVE to stop the machine by getting back to basics.
We have to stop thinking that we can't survive without money.
Giving up this endless, mindless dream for success.
Quit their tax funding jobs and actually put a halt to this.
But we all, every last 300 million of us, have to stop.
Not just 1,000.

And yes I see exactly what you mean about the social division happening today.
Everyone is fighting about the most trivial things.

Division between everyone is why we won't stop anything.

We need to stop thinking money is necessary.
It's only necessary when slave owners say it is.
The problem is, most Americans agree with it and are heavily dependant on it.
Because they are engrained or programmed to think we can't live without it.

Well, we can.
You might not have hot showers and fresh make-up everyday...
You may never get to the gym, or a tanning bed...
You may not be able to own a brand new car or house...
Or any other toy that is completely based on a programmed, consumer society...
Then it gets worse!
You may have to actually break a sweat in order to eat...
You might have to start a fire to keep warm!
Or actually put in a hard days work to get by...
Real work? With no compensation?!
Oh no!



I'll add another post when I see fit...

Good thread!





posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:42 AM
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OP, slit your wrists and get it over and done with?

The US is not all the world, sorry to break it to ya.

Plenty of freedom out there.

Freedom starts on the inside, then family, then local community, then government.

Liberate yourself from doom. You enslave yourself for thinking the way you do. It ain't worth it.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:42 AM
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More and more people are waking up to reality every day. I agree with you whole heartily....the imaginary debt system has got to go. Other leaders such as JFK tried and you see where it got them. It will take much more than a few hundred a city to rise up. I think it will take an entire city in concert to rock the boat but even then, I am not so sure what tptb would do with a whole city of mad people. Concentration camps anyone?

The system definitely needs to broken to pieces and then some...but how?

I think I speak for a lot of people when I say.....

WE WANT REAL CHANGE
WE WANT PEACE
But....WE DO NOT KNOW HOW TO DO IT!!!

The system is a cancer that has grown into something so massive we do not know how to surgically remove it!!!

How many citizens is needed to bring about a "new government"?

Here in the US candidate Ron Paul is considered "crazy" ....a "nutter". I want to vote for him as I see it is the a way for real change. Others do not see it that way. I hear many talking about Herman Cain!! Herman Cain? Really? Ugh.....this is when I know not enough people are truly awake. Ron won't get it. He will not be voted in because it is rigged just like everything else. They do not want him in the seat.....change would happen.

I just don't know and I think a lot of people feel like I do....powerless!!!!


I have to wonder though....why are OWS not at the Federal reserve banks, white house, chanting at congress and so on? Why Wall Street?



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:44 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 


I didn't say money was the root of all evil....I said 'money is the root of all...' it was you who completed the sentence. We are however indebted with money...not the same as returning a favour (another form of debt) when the debt of money can lose you all your security and perceived status. Money is the root of all in this system we have created. We are bound to selfishness with the promotion of the nuclear family and the loss of our extended relatives. The increasing selfishness has become a necessity of our current system - it always has been necessary to a degree as a means survival.

You say we're doomed. I say bull....I say you're having a bad day and its affected your outlook and your perspective.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:47 AM
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The thing is though - we are TRAPPED in the system.
It's darn hard to get out of the trap without money, and these days it is hard to get money because we are trapped.

The govt makes everything so darn hard!
Want some chickens -just a few chickens, for eggs - nope, laws against it.
Maybe I'll grow some plants to sell. Nope, no license - no sell.
Start a garden? It's not a suitable lawn - nope, if it isn't a HOA it's a local ordinance.


This is a problem that is not only about the rich and the powerful, but the control freaks and the power. There's this idea that THIS IS OUR STANDARD - you have money, you have a house, you stay IN the house, and you have grass, which you cut. You buy your eggs in the store, and your meat in the store, like everyone else, or you go to jail. You buy your permits and your licenses and you do it the way we say, because you are free - free to be like Meeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:54 AM
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reply to post by Logman
 


LOL I have no desire to slit my wrists. I can manage just fine with this doom, it's been creeping up on me for years, I've just finally hit the end of my "Hoping it will work out" phase of life. I'm very happy personally, it's the world that concerns me, and the future for everyone.

Once again, yes Freedom begins inside, gotcha, right there. However, if enough organized jerks with superior weapons decides you don't need freedom, or need to be felt up at the airport, or need to be x-rayed for bombs every day, or an endless number of other things, unless you do something more than saying "I'm free" as you die, the world just gets worse and worse.

It's time for the "Free" people to realize this isn't going away, it's terrible, it's getting so much worse, and it's going to get even worse than that, and then DO SOMETHING.

I've talked and I've talked, I don't feed the "machine", I do the right things by me and mine, and honestly, everyone. It wont help me if six goons with military weapons come to my house to take me to a FEMA camp (or your countries equivalent). You're only free on the OUTSIDE, if the Free vastly outnumber the bad people and do something about it. That's what I'm saying.

Plus you're acting like there's time left to arrange things! LOL! That ship has sailed, next stop attacking Iran and WW3. It's not a joke. Well I guess it is a joke, on us for letting it happen.

You will see your "freedom" become internal only soon enough.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:57 AM
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reply to post by christina-66
 


No I said Selfishness if the Root of all Evil and I can argue it all day. I've done so with preachers, college professors, people everywhere, and on and on. I haven't lost the argument.

I understand you might feel I'm having a bad day. It's so NOT that. I've been slowly coming to this over decades, ever fighting for simple Hope it would be ok. I strive to do good each and every day. I know I'm good to go inside. It's the rest of the world I'm worried about.



posted on Oct, 18 2011 @ 06:57 AM
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reply to post by thejlxc
 


You did not read my words. You read your own thoughts and projected those ideas into my text. My words are that hope is not passive. It is not something you idly sit and hold. You must have hope to take action or your motion will be chaotic and ineffective. Hope gives direction and stamina. It moves mountains. Faith (do NOT read that word as having to do with organized religion nor indeed even any deity) gives impetus to your actions. Both taken together give you what you need to succeed.





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