America’s Child Death Shame, page

The link below contains several embedded videos. Together with the graphs and other commentary at the link, they paint a distressing but very familiar picture. Yet again – as in many other categories of offence, such as handgun deaths – reports and statistics seem to show that Americans are more violent, per capita, than the citizens of other wealthy, developed countries.

America’s Child Death Shame

There is no denying the facts. But we can discuss the reasons for them, and talk about what to do to solve the problem. I am not American nor have I lived in America, so I will not presume to make any general comments; I will leave that to those who have more experience, or more conviction regarding solutions, than I. However, I believe that as long as America remains as influential on the world stage as it still is, such matters are of interest to everyone. For example, American soldiers deployed overseas are products of America’s violent society. It is difficult to believe that their actions abroad would not be influenced by their upbringing. In this, as in many other ways, the violence of American society affects the world – which makes it the world’s business.

Incidentally, I would caution those who propose solutions that are in themselves violent, such as capital punishment, that they are not actually solving the problem, but merely adding to the violence.

Also, just to be clear: this is not about children who are abducted or assaulted by strangers. This is about children being killed by members of their own families or other related individuals.

All right, then: why do Americans kill their children in such massive numbers? And what, if anything, can be done about it?

Who wants to go first?

reply to post by JustinSee

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Thank you for being the first to reply. The comparison being made is between America and other rich, developed countries, so I’m not sure I understand what the actions of people in the third world have to do with the subject. Would you care to elaborate? How does the behaviour of third world parents under extreme economic pressure explain or solve the problem of Americans’ frightening tendency to kill their own children?

reply to post by Astyanax

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That whole thing seemed like a Texas smear campaign lol. I don't know why child abuse is so bad here in Texas, my guess would be that it is were most of the drugs come into the US from. Or maybe we are just a bunch of bible thumping, child abusing nuts here lol. Who knows.

BBC Doc. 'Guinea Pig Kids'. The House That AIDS Built.

In New York's Washington Heights is a 4-story brick building called Incarnation Children's Center (ICC). This former convent houses a revolving stable of children who've been removed from their own homes by the Agency for Child Services. These children were poor. Many of their mothers had a history of drug abuse and have died. Once taken into ICC, the children become subjects of drug trials sponsored by NIAID (National Institute of Allergies and Infectious Disease, a division of the NIH), NICHD (the National Institute of Child Health and Human Development) in conjunction with some of the world's largest pharmaceutical companies - GlaxoSmithKline, Pfizer, Genentech, Chiron/Biocine, others.

The drugs given to the children were toxic - known to cause genetic mutation, organ failure, bone marrow death, bodily deformations, brain damage and fatal skin disorders. If the children refused the drugs, they were held down and force fed drugs. If the children continued to resist, they were taken to Columbia Presbyterian hospital where a surgeon put a plastic tube through their abdominal wall into their stomachs. The drugs were injected directly into their intestines.



Now I'm not saying all CPS is bad

reply to post by mnmcandiez

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Interesting, but I don’t see what it has to do with the thread topic. Would you like to explain?

reply to post by Astyanax

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child abuse is child abuse

reply to post by Recouper

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What is causing people to get frustrated to the point that they react violently?

Is this question really helpful? It assumes that violence occurs because its perpetrators are frustrated. Millions of people, in America and around the world, find themselves frustrated in their aims and desires yet do not kill their children. I doubt these particular Americans are more frustrated than others.

Even if they are, why do they express their frustration in this peculiar form? Killing one’s children not only threatens one’s personal posterity, it also pours down the drain all the investment and care one has already put into the child’s upbringing and welfare. In a genetic sense it can be literally more self-destructive than suicide.

More generally, what lies behind Americans’ excessive propensity to take out their frustrations – if that is what they are doing – in violence? You can’t deny that the violence is real.

Also, your question tends to suggest that people are not responsible for their own actions. One does not have to be a believer in free will to feel that this is wrong – an untenable excuse for inexcusable behaviour.

And why aren’t these people apparently incapable of controlling themselves?

That is a better question, although a still better one might be: why can’t they stop themselves killing their children? But that’s pretty much the question of the thread.

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reply to post by mnmcandiez

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child abuse is child abuse

This thread is not about child abuse per se. It is asking why Americans murder their own children, as well as those of their relatives and domestic partners, in such horrifying numbers. Perhaps you misunderstood the topic under discussion? Thanks for contributing, all the same.

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reply to post by FoxStriker

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so by your post your pro- invasion of privacy, invasion of parental obligation... What your asking reeks of Orwell's 1984...

So you presume.

Are you denying that Americans are unusually prone to the behaviour being discussed at the link and in this thread, or are you saying that they should be allowed to continue indulging in it because preventing them amounts to an invasion of their privacy?

Originally posted by Astyanax
reply to post by Recouper

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What is causing people to get frustrated to the point that they react violently?

Is this question really helpful? It assumes that violence occurs because its perpetrators are frustrated.

Yes, of course you're right that I'm making an assumption. It is a tentative one and indeed may be wrong. What we can be sure of is that something or a number of things are causing an effect.

People are people. There's no significant genetic difference between your average American and your average European. So what's causing the statistics?

If I may:

Originally posted by Astyanax
Yet again – as in many other categories of offence, such as handgun deaths – reports and statistics seem to show that Americans are more violent, per capita, than the citizens of other wealthy, developed countries.

I would believe that there is a problem (or problems) causing the problem.

Ok, you've asked why American's kill their own children and what can be done about it.

Well I'll try to pose a possible answer as to why: They are doing it because there is something affecting their development as they mature which is causing a personality and/or social disorder.

If we are going to work with more than speculation we are going to need to do some reading up on the issue and the studies that have been done so far.

reply to post by thejlxc

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I'm an American, I've seen it my whole life. Picking on the weak is normal here, like a lot of places.

I’m not saying I agree with you, necessarily, but... if this is true, could it have something to do with the very competitive nature of American capitalism and American society? This is certainly one way in which America differs from others.

Just a thought.

reply to post by Pervius

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Toxins and Dioxins have effected mens neurological systems causing a disconnect between their nerves and their cranium. They try drugs, they try Porn....eventually when all that doesn't work they go get little girls to rape and when they realize what they did, they kill them.

Why, then, does it happen so much more in America? Are there more ‘toxins and dioxins’ in the American environment than, for example, in China or Bangladesh? And why do they have this peculiar effect? Can you explain how that happens?

What is ‘a disconnect between nerves and cranium’ anyway? ‘Cranium’ is just a word for that part of your skull that contains your brain. How does a malfunctioning skull make people murder their children?

It can be partially blamed on putting Fluoride in the Water which the Government wanted to subdue the population and keep everyone calm.

Fluorides are common in water supplies the world over. In many cases the fluoridation is natural – nothing is added to the water, the fluorides are already there. I live in one such country. People here are well known for killing each other as adults, but not for killing their children.

Naturally fluoridated water is used in many countries, including Argentina, France, Gabon, Libya, Mexico, Senegal, Sri Lanka, Tanzania, the U.S., and Zimbabwe. In some locations, notably parts of Africa, China, and India, natural fluoridation exceeds recommended levels; in China an estimated 200 million people receive water fluoridated at or above recommended levels. Source

So if fluoridated water is the cause, why is the effect peculiarly American? Can you explain that?

There's even rumors Viagra gives free millions to Municipalities/Cities so they buy Fluoride and dump it in the water.....which leads to men needing Viagra.

Rumours, rumours. So fluoride in water makes men impotent? Can you cite some source to verify that?

It's a man made epidemic, partially required to control the fall of society. Children pay the price. It's a medical situation people in power created.

Do you mean that people who kill their children do it because somebody else made them? Should the actual perpetrators not take any responsibility for their deeds, then?

The creation of Aluminum for airplanes, beer cans....eventually oxidizes and gets into the air, soil, and water.

Aluminium oxide is chemically inert.

Civilization is being controlled destroyed....just bring in another million new souls to America every year to hide the secret.

You’re having a laugh, aren’t you? Surely you can’t be serious?

reply to post by Astyanax

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reply to post by FoxStriker

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so by your post your pro- invasion of privacy, invasion of parental obligation... What your asking reeks of Orwell's 1984...

So you presume.

Are you denying that Americans are unusually prone to the behaviour being discussed at the link and in this thread, or are you saying that they should be allowed to continue indulging in it because preventing them amounts to an invasion of their privacy?



I only deny ignorance, Lol

I think you presume way to much, only giving me 2 option to pick from huh? I don't I'll take either.

Child Abuse is a problem that hits every country. This thread smells of an agenda to label Americans as child abusive citizens.

You call it our shame, did you forget the same happens in whatever countries your from and in very country. This is a world wide problem.

Do I agree there need to be programs for child abuse of course, but not at the expense of a parents right to take care of their children the way they want too...

reply to post by FoxStriker

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only giving me 2 option to pick from huh? I don't I'll take either.

If you can find another option that is implied by your words and still fits the facts, by all means take it. I don’t think you will find one.

Child Abuse is a problem that hits every country.

This is not about child abuse generally; it is about children being murdered by their close relatives. Yes, that, too, happens in ever country. But among developed, law-abiding countries, it happens far more often in America than it does anywhere else. Just as Americans also kill each other with handguns more often than citizens of comparably advanced and prosperous societies do. The differences aren’t minor, you know; the statistics for the United States are well out of the ballpark in which the other countries make their scores.

This thread smells of an agenda to label Americans as child abusive citizens.

On the contrary, it is an opportunity for Americans to explain why, on average, their children are more often murdered by family members than children in other advanced societies. It is an opportunity for Americans to demonstrate, with evidence and logical arguments, that they are not nearly so violent as the facts appear to suggest. I must say you, personally, haven’t done a very good job of that so far.

You call it our shame, did you forget the same happens in whatever countries your from and in very country. This is a world wide problem.

Not, at least in developed countries, nearly as much of a problem as it is in America. And though the statistics are unavailable, I don’t believe it is as much a problem in many poor countries as it is in America, either. Certainly it is an almost unheard-of issue in my own country. But that is debatable; the facts of America’s child-death shame, on the other hand, are not.

a parents right to take care of their children the way they want too.

Why do you think parents have any such right? Who told you they do?

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