Extreme Chemtrail-day in Holland! Is anyone else seeing this?

reply to post by CherubBaby


How many times must it be pointed out that:

Its 90 degrees here today....

....has absolutely no relevance to contrails?

It is "90 degrees" there (90°F = 32°C). But, that is the temperature at the surface!

It is not difficult at all to find online information about the ambient air temperatures at the altitudes where jets fly, and contrails are formed.

For example, in North America:

weather.uwyo.edu...

Originally posted by ProudBird
reply to post by CherubBaby

 

How many times must it be pointed out that:

Its 90 degrees here today....

....has absolutely no relevance to contrails?

It is "90 degrees" there (90°F = 32°C). But, that is the temperature at the surface!

It is not difficult at all to find online information about the ambient air temperatures at the altitudes where jets fly, and contrails are formed.

For example, in North America:

weather.uwyo.edu...

You beat me to it. ^^That^^

It could be 100+ degrees on the surface and still be freezing in the upper atmosphere.

You know how cold space is? About -454.765 F
It may be a sweltering 100 degrees in LA one day, but at that exact same position 32,000ft up it would still be from -20 to -40 deg.

The closer you get to space the colder it will get exponentially.

I don't know why it's such a hard concept to grasp.

reply to post by pshea38

Don't waste your time entertaining the deniers here who will glibly take the sight from your eyes and the sense from your judgement.

Don't worry about that, I am sure of what I saw and I trust my reasoning capacities; sometimes I can be not so sure of what I know, but it should be a normal assumption for everyone...

reply to post by Hundroid


You're welcome.

Here on ATS I see countless threads appearing from either in Europe, in the UK, or in North America (USA and Canada) that report similar skies as you are *worried* about. Not just rarely, either.

Think about something.....I've traveled in Europe extensively, and know how some days there will be overcast skies of low stratus clouds (1,000 to 2,500 meters) that completely block your view of the upper atmosphere....AND any airplanes that are flying overhead on those days. Those airplanes very likely could also be making similar contrail formations, if conditions up there were right for it. But, being on the ground under the overcast, you would never know.

When I lived on the East Coast USA, I saw such skies often, in Fall or Winter..but of course, I understand how and why they form.

Most of my life (40+ years) of aviation knowledge makes the difference.


Perhaps if those who still cling to the myth and hoax of "chem"trails would take time to learn about flying, maybe take a lesson or two (I know, they[re expensive), get to know some pilots personally, take some courses in meteorology, then this education would be useful to them......

reply to post by ProudBird


One time.. Why doesn't it happen at night? Don't tell me it does. I have seen this for years and it never happens at night and if so rarely. So why in the day? Does it warm up at altitude at night and cool in the day? BTW Do you seriously think the pics the op posted are normal? Are my eyes missing something here?

reply to post by CherubBaby



??

Why doesn't it happen at night?

Why doesn't what happen? Contrails?

They do. Just one video example:



At night, of course, harder to see....no sunlight. Full, very bright Moons helps, though......

reply to post by ProudBird


I notice you selectively quote my post. But I know you know we know what I am saying .. Don't bother the disinfo with this Marine friend.. Its a waste of your time..

reply to post by JustBreathe11


Why are chemtrailers pinning their theory to cloud seeding? It is very clear even from your own link that this is about working with existing clouds, plainly, as it is cloud seeding, not cloud creation. what does it have to do with leaving long white trails in the sky to create them? How did a cloud become a bad thing and anything to do with chemtrails?

Why do you refute the information that in the right conditions aircraft contrails can persist, can spread, and can even promote the creation of cirrus clouds by themselves?

Why do I keep asking questions that nobody answers?

I would appreciate a specific answer to the points in my previous post. It is far too easy for chemtrailers to gloss over difficult questions and move on, then they have the cheek to deride the answers provided by the other side of the argument.

Another question. How was the nasa contrail chart debunked, exactly? and by whom?

it seems that all chemtrailers can do is spout lies, post fake pics and make sweeping statements. explanations appear conspicuous by their absence.

Originally posted by pshea38
reply to post by Hundroid

 

This is sickening hundroid, and it seems we are powerless to do anything
about this BS. Don't waste your time entertaining the deniers here who
will glibly take the sight from your eyes and the sense from your judgement.
This is sickening, deadly serious s**t.
All our governments are actively out to harm us!

Whereas something like that is bound turn the tide isnt it, that doesnt at all look it came from a lunatic.

Originally posted by ArrowsNV

It could be 100+ degrees on the surface and still be freezing in the upper atmosphere.

You know how cold space is? About -454.765 F
It may be a sweltering 100 degrees in LA one day, but at that exact same position 32,000ft up it would still be from -20 to -40 deg.

The closer you get to space the colder it will get exponentially.

Kind of - that's correct up to about the altitude aircraft fly, but at a certain altitude it actually stops cooling, then it starts to get warmer! Then higher up it starts getting cooler again, then warmer, eventually getting way warmer than on the ground, above the boiling point!



When you get into space, there's not actually a measurable temperature, as there is nothing to measure. In fact most of the temperatures in that graph don't really mean much, as there's practically no air there to hold the temperature, so it's not too different to being in a vacuum.

So maybe it is a bit of a hard concept after all

reply to post by angelchemuel


So then why do they look like contrails? In fact here is a few pics for you....

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/f18f0f341082.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/632d04d81bdd.jpg[/atsimg]

[atsimg]http://files.abovetopsecret.com/images/member/7f9ce404792d.jpg[/atsimg]

and you can see more here..

www.flickr.com...

reply to post by dplum517

I don't have to.... it's obvious.... if you are fooled by a 1-2 page PDF made by NASA then you have no ability to distinguish lies from truth when told by the government.

And you have proven you don't know the difference between a contrail and a so called chemtrail.

reply to post by dplum517

If you are unwilling to accept that a large portion of people do not give credence to your sources on contrails ....ie... NASA and the Air Force then you should leave the conversation......because I will not stop saying that the science of persisting contrails does not add up. Period.

So then who is the authority on this subject? Funny but this is a real NASA webpage not a PDF page...

www-pm.larc.nasa.gov...

You should read and understand it if you keep trying to say contrails are chemtrails. Again I will ask where is all of this evidence from a scientist to prove the reality of chemtrails? Oh wait nobody has been able to do that why?

reply to post by dezertdog


Maybe you should look at some of the other threads on this subject, then you may see that there has not been one bit of evidence that has not been debunked concerning chemtrails.

second.

This ridiculousness has taken up far too much band width. You people either need to put up the evidence that those planes are spaying chemicals on purpose or you need to shut up.

Every single pic that has been posted was classic contrail(clouds you nitwits).

Fear mongers will be Fear Mongers. Get a grip people, the government is not out to kill you.

More than that, you will never accept any evidence that contradicts your position. That is willful ignorance. Be ashamed.

Originally posted by Uncinus

Originally posted by ArrowsNV

It could be 100+ degrees on the surface and still be freezing in the upper atmosphere.

You know how cold space is? About -454.765 F
It may be a sweltering 100 degrees in LA one day, but at that exact same position 32,000ft up it would still be from -20 to -40 deg.

The closer you get to space the colder it will get exponentially.

Kind of - that's correct up to about the altitude aircraft fly, but at a certain altitude it actually stops cooling, then it starts to get warmer! Then higher up it starts getting cooler again, then warmer, eventually getting way warmer than on the ground, above the boiling point!

When you get into space, there's not actually a measurable temperature, as there is nothing to measure. In fact most of the temperatures in that graph don't really mean much, as there's practically no air there to hold the temperature, so it's not too different to being in a vacuum.

So maybe it is a bit of a hard concept after all

Nice find, I didn't realize that. I figured it just kept dropping. But still, any commercial flight is in the -deg range at cruising altitude.

And space, yes is a vacuum, but you can get a temperature reading, although it wouldn't be in Fahrenheit, it would be in Kelvin, which I converted for.

If we put a thermometer in darkest space, with absolutely nothing around, it would first have to cool off. This might take a very very long time. Once it cooled off, it would read 2.7 Kelvin. This is because of the "3 degree microwave background radiation." No matter where you go, you cannot escape it -- it is always there.

- Taken from: imagine.gsfc.nasa.gov...

reply to post by dplum517


Five stars?? (so far).....

All I see is continued hand-waving, here....implying that NASA is somehow an agent of the US Government, unreliable, liars, etc....blah, blah, blah.

SO, dplum, is the entire WORLD in on this alleged *plot* and *cover-up*??

What about the ESA? (European Space Agency). It's a consortium of many governments:

envisat.esa.int...


How about the Japanese? And, their version of an aerospace agency, JAXA?:

airex.tksc.jaxa.jp...



Well informed scientists and skeptics:

www.skepdic.com...


On the other hand, we have "chem"trail believers, via many websites, who are shown to post false photos, misleading photo captions, incorrect science facts, etc, etc.....and all of this *frenzy* started in order to push the myth of this terrible thing on to naive and ignorant people in order to sell them magical homeopathic "cures", balms, salves, pills, etc.

Art Bell

Will Thomas

Clff Carnicorn.

Rogue's Gallery of con artists, flim flam and charlatans.

reply to post by TsukiLunar

More than that, you will never accept any evidence that contradicts your position. That is willful ignorance. Be ashamed.

Will you ever accept?

reply to post by Hundroid


Accept what? Claims based on nothing but fantasy? No, no i will not.

reply to post by Cerdofuego


Extreme chemtrail spraying here in Utah, United States today too.