The Ides of March - A Discussion about Disgust

Mods - this thread is not so much about the movie The Ides of March, but my reaction to it and my realization about the acute "Political Madness" that is pervasive here in the US. If you feel the need to move the thread to another forum, please do so. Also, I did a general search for a similar discussion and nothing came up which matched my theme.

So I went to see the new movie, The Ides of March with my young adult son yesterday. Although he is familiar with the general principles of how our political system is supposed to work, he’s not quite old enough yet to truly understand the intricacies of the political arena or what truly goes on behind closed doors. I don't know how many of you have seen the movie yet and I won't give anything away; however, when we left the theater, I was very quiet and quite noticeably upset. My son asked me what was wrong and I asked him to just let me be silent with my thoughts for a little while because I was feeling incredibly angry and, unbeknownst to him, ready to erupt in a fit of rage which is very unlike me. All through dinner, I struggled to articulate what was bothering me so much about the movie, but even then, I couldn't put my finger on it. While starting to write this thread to ask if anyone else has seen it and had a similar reaction, it finally occurred to me.

I'm angry because the movie was just so damned predictable and if you've seen it, you know what I'm talking about. IT SHOULD NOT HAVE BEEN THAT PREDICTABLE!! Out of consideration for those who haven't seen it yet and are planning to, I won't disclose any of the specific details and will provide, instead, a general overview so that you can understand the point I'm trying to make.

The movie is about a young political idealist who makes certain choices he thinks are justified because they're for the "greater good". Some are moral choices which he doesn't even really struggle with (disconcerting) and he carries through on those decisions without hesitation because in his heart of hearts (at that time) he is a loyal purist and believes that seeing his cause through will be of benefit to us all.f In the end, he learns what many of us who live in the US and most other "democratic" countries have learned long ago; everything in politics is an illusion, everyone is corrupt or corruptible and it's all just a great big game of chess in which we're all disposable pawns. In the end, this young idealist becomes just as jaded and corrupt as the rest of them. It was, for me, a truly troubling depiction on so many different levels, the least of which involved my hope (or the loss thereof) that our "youth" would somehow rise above it all and find some solution to our current state of political madness.

None of what occurred in the movie reveiled any great epiphanies to me, hence my inability to initially understand my strong negative reaction to the film, but now I finally realize what has me so enraged. It's not the film's message or ending that has me so upset, but the predictability of it all which showed me, with genuine clarity, that I have completely and irreparably reached the point of no return where I've lost all faith in our political system or our ability to fix it. It's this realization about my own complete loss of faith and hope that has me so enraged. I don't think I realized I had reached that point and it's a scary and hopeless reality.

I'm curious if anyone else saw the movie and what your thoughts are on the matter. Thanks!

Timidgal

it's a work of fiction, correct ?

I haven't seen it, is it supposed to be a true story ?

there are many good people in government, you should make it a point to go meet some of your local state representatives or town mayor, and talk to them about issues that concern you, you'd be surprised how they will be willing to listen

it shouldn't surprise you someone is trying to make money putting a movie out that portrays politicians in a negative light

Originally posted by syrinx high priest

Firstly, thanks for your reply and feedback. I loathe being seen as a pessimist but...

it's a work of fiction, correct ?

That's part of the point - it is supposed to be a work of fiction and in theory one can say it is because it uses fictitious names, etc.; however, to me it was more a reflection of reality than any other piece of fiction I've ever seen on the big screen. I felt it was a true depiction of what occurs in our hallowed halls of government every single day.

there are many good people in government, you should make it a point to go meet some of your local state representatives or town mayor, and talk to them about issues that concern you, you'd be surprised how they will be willing to listen

Believe me when I say that I have always been an optimist and although that description has changed to a "cautious" optimist over the years, I still try to see the good and potential in all people and any given situation. I've always been politically involved and I have done what you suggested. My own town recently went through a heavily debated local election and I watched as the candidates made all kinds of promises based on popular concensus and then proceeded down the opposite path once in office. They listened - I had their full attention when they were standing there looking for my handshake and vote - but then they did what was in their own or big biz's best interest and not what was promised. Now, I'm not so naive as to believe that everything can be accomplished with a handshake over a pint of beer, but we're talking about some pretty powerful issues that reach way beyond my own little enclave and could potentially affect the entire area and planet (nuclear power plant less than 20 miles away and major metropolitan bridge that is on the verge of collapse just to give you two examples that immediately come to mind). To say that I'm disappointed and disillusioned over their inefficiency or inability to make any real beneficial progress in these crucial areas is an understatement. They've now closed town meetings because they don't want to hear the local griping and whereas I'd like to give them the benefit of the doubt, none of us can afford for me or you or anyone else to do that any longer because we all suffer the consequences of their inability to follow through on their promises.

it shouldn't surprise you someone is trying to make money putting a movie out that portrays politicians in a negative light

I wasn't surprised at all but that's not the point. The point is that to me, it was more a piece of non-fiction than fiction and it was as if I was slapped directly in the face by my realization that I've suffered a complete loss of faith in our political system. I was merely trying to articulate my experience and wondering if any others' have had similar reactions.

I am relieved to hear that there are some out there, such as yourself, who have not suffered this same complete loss as I have. I genuinely hope that your beliefs prevail over my own. Thanks again for the input!

TG

reply to post by timidgal


I haven't seen it, but I totally understand what you are saying about the message and the predictability of it, I think-- which is to be that predictable, it is underlining our response, especially on this forum, to what we perceive as what both controls us and ignites us to protest against that control....am I right, because I am willing to be corrected...and dont mean to put words in your mouth... But what that means is controlled and manipulated, manufactured problem, response, solution.....which only shows how all of us are played....from beginning to end, whether we are on the right, left, good, bad, up or down side of what is happening. And nothing could be more disheartening, especially as a parent who loves our children and wishes for some kind of hope for their future, if not ours....

I'm disgusted how they released a movie called "The ides of MARCH" in October.

reply to post by tetra50

Yes you are right in everything you said. Add to that my belief that there truly is no one uncorruptible in some form or another - whether it be through intimidation, manipulation or greed - and that these tactics and standards of "fair play" have been passed down to our younger generations via role modeling and a distorted emulation of the words "success" and "power". All those factors just about sums up my hopelessness and anger. All of that emotion and more was brought to the surface by this film. It was, at least for me, pretty powerful.

reply to post by Ghost375

Levity can be a wonderful thing!!!

reply to post by timidgal


Perhaps the way to look at this experience, the film I mean, is as a galvanizing force for you....politics require galvanizing forces to bring about change.....perhaps you could be that change... Many of us who see the clarity and need for that are too old and jaded and have too many skeletons as a result of all that pain to ever be elected or engender the necessary faith to bring about the change......how about it... I'll vote for you

reply to post by tetra50


Believe me, Tetra50, I have thought of little else since this happened and the reality is that I would not even know where to begin.

This is a time for radical change and I don't have a clue as to how to be that catalyst. I think that is a common yet unspoken feeling among many people and perhaps the answer is right before our eyes but we've been conditioned to remain blind to it. That's why I feel these discussions are so incredibly important. I thank you for your thoughts and words of encouragement.

reply to post by timidgal


I'm just surprised that it took so long and a movie for you to become disillusioned with the world of politics.

I know your sadness, anger and feelins of helplessness, but my solution was to look at politics as just another form of entertainment.

And pushing the buttons of those that still take it seriously is really a treat in an otherwise boring day.

Otherwise....how did you like the movie?

reply to post by whaaa

I can live with accepting blame for being a hopeful optimist and that should be the greatest error I make in my life. You should understand that I was born and raised in an era marked by the civil rights movement and civil protests that led to so much reform and change; some peaceful and some hard fought but my philosophy has always been "hope and reach for the best but expect the worst and then try to find another solution". I guess my threshold for worst came about in its own place and time.

As for being a part of your entertainment during a boring day, I could find this insulting but instead find it very sad that you should be so cynical and judgemental of people in the same boat as yourself, but it's always easier to focus our ridicule on those we consider naive rather than those responsible, yes? Believe me, you are speaking to someone who is neither naive nor ignorant, someone who has lived a life based on uncompromised ethics and morals. I have also seen great things come about from pure intent. It took over fourty years for that hope to disappear so please try to be a bit more compassionate and less superior-minded since that gets us nowhere.

As for the movie, it evoked the lifting of the veil for at least one person and would not have been able to do so had it not been realistic and rivoting. Need I say more?

As with everyone else, I thank you for your input because every contribution creates food for thought...

Timidgal

Perhaps, timidgal, you are still young enough.... Frequently, when we realize what it's truly all about and what we face and our children face, we have two choices: take the system on, conquer it from within and be the change we seek in that way,and try to model this for our children so that they can persevere and pick up where we left off, or, withdraw completely, move as far away from the population as possible, become as self sufficient as possible, and show our progeny how to do this instead, and wait for the right moment to fight that same battle--it is a question of the right moment, and strategy, and for those of us older than you, who have already been too marked and defeated by the struggle, but see hope in you who are still young, newly angry and raising the next generation, for me anyway, as what I just described in the first instance, applying to you in the latter instance, please find yourself a piece of land for you and yours, show them how to live and the way to be at peace with this earth and who they truly are, and that being human is a righteous and worthy state of being--not what they see all around them today.... You always have my unconditional support as a woman and a mother....

reply to post by timidgal


My cynicism and sarcasm are just my defense mechanisms to keep from falling into hopelessness, despair and depression.
We all deal with reality in sometimes dysfunctional and surreal ways.

reply to post by tetra50

And your advice and comments have reached across my anger and hopelessness. Who is it that said we meet who we are supposed to meet in our lifetimes?

Thank you so very much!

With friendship and respect,

Timidgal

reply to post by whaaa

And you have incited a genuine 180 in me about you based on your comments. Humility suits you well and you've proven that you have more integrity and compassion than 95% of the other people I meet in the forums. Thank you for your honesty!

Timidgal

reply to post by whaaa


I am humbled to read what you wrote. I seldom see such honesty, humility and it gives me such hope in a time when I need it. May you find all that you seek....

reply to post by timidgal


I hope simply because people like you and your sincerity and response to what should horrify but spur us to something better give me hope, where I cannot hope for myself anymore. But there are still those who understand the battle, like yourself, who will carry on for those of us who cannot.....it is sometimes the only hope of loving and nurturing our fellow humans we meet along the path.. And that gives us strength. Be well, and let your frustration at what is now propel you to either make or influence the future. Much love and hope to you and yours

reply to post by tetra50

Hope is inspired by contributions far greater than any physical limitation can ever impose, tetra. Age provides the wisdom that youth lacks (and I am a TRUE believer that age is a mindset but fatigue is hard to overcome). Perhaps it is, in fact, the midlifers in which the role of actionary rests until the youth are ready. You have the gift of inspiration and that is immeasurable.

reply to post by timidgal


And your words give me strength that I still have a purpose to serve, no matter my weariness, and can make a difference in that way, if no other...... I truly wish the best for you and all, and hope you will fight for the future of my children when I cannot and as I have fought for you and yours, and know we have all suffered for this and our successive generations...
Truly, take care of yourself, for these are times when we are very close, I believe, to losing the worth and value of what we all truly are