This IS NOT the Revolution

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posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 11:41 AM
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I've gotten tired of OWS protestors and supporters claiming that this is now the "revolution" or "rEvolution" as they seem to refer to it. I suppose it is catchy to have the upper case "E" so that it incorporates "Evolution" into the equation. But I am here as the bearer of bad news - this whole thing - this mass protest, this isn't a revolution. This isn't even going to accomplish anything. I'll tell you why.

During 2003 and 2004, hundreds of thousands, maybe even millions of people marched on cities all over the world to protest the war in Iraq. The protests were nonviolent and had a direct target and message: Government - get our troops out of Iraq now.
Eight or nine years later, many countries are still in Iraq despite the reports of all the troops leaving. The message was so powerful that a new president was elected on the grounds that he would bring the troops home, and even he failed to answer to the millions who had such a clear and direct message.

In 1969 and the rest of the 60's - millions of Americans marched around the US and in Washington with one clear direct target and goal: Government get our troops out of Vietnam now. It wasn't until 1975 - on their own terms that the government finally decided to bring an end to the war. Even after the deaths of many Americans in protest, government still did not listen.

In 2009-2010, hundreds of thousands of Americans rose up to let their voices be heard against Obamacare in cities, town halls, and even in DC up until the night the bill passed Congress. Their message was direct and clear: Government - we do not want Obamacare. The government ignored them and passed the bill anyway, and despite many court rulings since then against the bill, it still stands as an ignorant slap in the face of probably millions of people collectively.

In 2009 we saw Tea Party protests spring up around the country, some holding more than 300,000 Americans protesting taxes and an end to the Federal Reserve. Government ignored them as well.



So now here we are in 2011 and the latest fad is Occupy Wall Street and it's many children that have branched off into other cities, claiming that they have no true leadership but accepting funding from many corporate backed entities to continue their marches. I digress on that fact. OWS doesn't have a clear goal, only a clear target - Wall Street. They feel that by protesting Wall Street, they are some how going to get the changes they need, when the sad fact is that Wall Street itself doesn't have any say or control of how "business as usual" goes, the politicians in Washington DC do. They blame Wall Street for the financial crisis, yet seem to casually ignore the fact that it was Washington that gave Wall Street the billions of dollars in bailouts instead of letting the mega corporations tank like they were supposed to.

And what is worse is that OWS claims they are being misrepresented in the media, and the people on here believe it. Out of the many people I have personally spoken to who have attended the movements, nearly all of them were anti-capitalist, pro-socialism, and pro-Obama. Obama - the man who went to bed with Wall Street since his election in 2008. Not only that, but most of them ARE well off, as they surround themselves at the protests with the most modern of technologies to help them "pass the time".



But I am not here to attack the OWS movement. God knows that the spooky anonymous will hijack my personal information and post it for the masses to have a go at me. I am here to say that it takes more than a Guy Fawkes mask, luxury camping, and a loose set of demands to make a revolution in this country. These people don't have the drive nor will to do what needs to be done in order to make change happen.


Honestly, I would like to do a poll if I could. How many OWS protestors would be willing to DIE for what they believe in? How many protestors would be willing to walk up and slug a cop in the face if it meant that the protest would succeed?

My guess is not many, if any at all.

I have seen the "dedication" of Occupy Philadelphia, and it involved accepted a projector screen from the mayor so that the protestors could party in front of the capitol building and watch the Phillies game. The "dedication" of Occupy Wall Street was show in the Brooklyn bridge incident, when instead of pushing forward - THOUSANDS OF PEOPLE versus a few police officers, they stood in a nice little group and waited to be arrested. Phew. Dedication there.

Or how about while there friends were getting pepper sprayed or tazed unlawfully, they showed good dedication in helping them and proving a point: that they are all a bunch of push overs.


Change does not come by denying the system yet abiding by its rules. Change comes by denying the system AND denying its rules. So long as these protests continue to be peaceful and law abiding, and don't look for loopholes in the system and methods to make the people pay attention - then they are going the same way as Vietnam, Iraq, Healthcare Reform, and the Tea Party.



THIS is your peaceful protest in America.
-You are allowed to protest - but only if we "permit" you to do so.
-You are allowed to protest - but only in the defined areas we allow you to.
-You are allowed to protest - but we are allowed to arrest you.
-You are allowed to protest - but it can't interfere with anything else.


It is sad that people actually believe this stands a chance for change. No, I take that back. It does stand a chance for change - the same change Obama promised while running for President. This should serve to back his agenda, and with his clear support of the movement, no doubt we are going towards more change in the future.



THIS IS NOT THE REVOLUTION.

You will know the revolution.

The revolution will come when people grow a set of cahones, deny the system, and FIGHT the system - not abide by it. When demands are made with real ULTIMATUMS that cannot be denied by those in power. When the police are too scared to stand up against the protestors because others have been made an example before them.

That is the revolution, and it will march into Washington DC with a set of demands that is clear and precise. We return to our Constitution or you will all leave this place and we will institute new government, laying its foundation on such principles and organizing its powers in such form, as to us shall seem most likely to effect our safety and happiness. And when that time comes they will listen - or there will be war in this country.


The revolution will not be pretty. But at least it won't be ridiculous and ultimately useless as OWS.
edit on 10-10-2011 by gwydionblack because: spelling




posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 11:44 AM
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Ok so I will continue living my life this way until the entire system crashes, and I'm killed in the ensuing chaos. Thank you for clearing that up now back to work. La la la de dah de dah



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 11:48 AM
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Perhaps it isn't - but everything has to start somewhere, the only sure way fail is not to try.


+15 more 
posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 11:54 AM
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If these guys were serious about a "revolution", they'd be storming the White House and Congress. Not standing outside financial institutions protesting. It's not a revolution, it's Woodstock Light.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 11:56 AM
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Peaceful protests do nothing but make tptb complacent, they know that people are upset, but the people will still obey, hence, peaceful protests.

The only revolution that will take place is one of violence, destruction and true occupation of facilities and infrastructure, when we truely take it back.

These peaceful protests may turn into a violent uprising with the right catalyst, and there is nothing wrong with a violent revolution, because that signifies that the people are taking back what is theirs.

And there will be violence, destruction, and true occupation, lets just hope it comes from our side, (the people) and not the powers that be.
edit on 10-10-2011 by sicksonezer0 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:06 PM
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I (We) am/are not being Peaceful because it's 'the Law of the Land,' We are peaceful because we acting out of peace, love and cooperation is the only way to achieve this.
Sure, we could resort to violence and see some major 'changes' a lot quicker, but then we are just re-establishing ourselves as a angry, violent force that kills/attacks all opposing forces...which...kind of seems like a re-iteration of the system we are already in. And would thus be destined to become the 'new' system that we created out of the old.

THIS IS ABOUT CHANGE. THIS IS ABOUT LOVE. THIS IS ABOUT COMING TOGETHER

and guess what, violence, hate and physical force are some the oldest and most used versions of 'getting what you want.'

You don't have to believe that "this is it." But it has to start somewhere, and it only takes one person.
If you do not believe it, you can not create it.
And, if anything, this movement could be the catalyst that puts the 'true revolution,' if you will, into motion.

But, on a side note, I understand the concept of DEFENSE. If someone is physically attacking me or my loved ones (which are everyone) then I will defend myself/us. But I will not instigate and I will not attack.

Much love be to you. Whether "this is it" or not, "It" HAS TO COME, or we are all doomed.


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posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:08 PM
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I would say it's a good start. I would guess to say that the protesters are using "Wall Street" as a symbol of what America has come too be known... Greedy. Weather it's government or corporate corruption it all comes down to money and GREED. Our politicians take money from corporations to push their agendas and policies while they sit back and rake in the money. I don't think Wall Street is entirely at fault. Our "elected" officials have allowed this to happen so they can get that campaign money for the next election. The whole system needs to be fixed.

1) Ban corporate lobbying.
2) Close the tax loopholes that allow corporations to pay next to nothing in taxes.
3) Penalize corporations that send our jobs overseas.
4) Fix the trade deficits with other countries.
5) And stop the BS with "to big to fail"... let them. If they can't make sound business decisions, they should go bankrupt.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:11 PM
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Originally posted by Stan71
I would say it's a good start. I would guess to say that the protesters are using "Wall Street" as a symbol of what America has come too be known... Greedy. Weather it's government or corporate corruption it all comes down to money and GREED. Our politicians take money from corporations to push their agendas and policies while they sit back and rake in the money. I don't think Wall Street is entirely at fault. Our "elected" officials have allowed this to happen so they can get that campaign money for the next election. The whole system needs to be fixed.

1) Ban corporate lobbying.
2) Close the tax loopholes that allow corporations to pay next to nothing in taxes.
3) Penalize corporations that send our jobs overseas.
4) Fix the trade deficits with other countries.
5) And stop the BS with "to big to fail"... let them. If they can't make sound business decisions, they should go bankrupt.


Well said.

Keep working to get that message out there!



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:12 PM
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Very true, OP, and I agree completely.

What this is, is a Big Union hi-jacked( or orchestrated) political rally.

In a revolution, common ground would be found and the White House lawn would be 'occupied' effectively.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:17 PM
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I agree the Occupy wall street protesters dont have a true goal or objective yet but when the tea party first started they didnt have a clear goal of what they wanted. They just knew what they didnt want. and as they went along they formed misssion statements. And what they stood for.

I dont know I hope your not being a hater OP. I dont know if it is the revoulution or not. But we can;t just be happy that people are finally getting mad as hell and are not gonna take it anymore???
edit on 10-10-2011 by American-philosopher because: making the meaning of my statement clear



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:19 PM
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reply to post by gwydionblack
 


Agreed, its been so long these people do not know what a true revoluyion is anymore. Thry will know when the revolution starts. This is just a protest with some banner and shouting. When the protests and shouting falls on deaf ears then things will start to heat up in a major way I believe.

At the moment I am just sitting by watching, tweeting, and supporting certain aspects of the protesting. What I want is my freedom, plain and simple. Then there are morons and retards who say things like, what do you mean by "freedom". This just proves my point, the morons dont even know what freedom is anymore!!

Unbelieveable really.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:22 PM
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Originally posted by Stan71
I would say it's a good start. I would guess to say that the protesters are using "Wall Street" as a symbol of what America has come too be known... Greedy. Weather it's government or corporate corruption it all comes down to money and GREED. Our politicians take money from corporations to push their agendas and policies while they sit back and rake in the money. I don't think Wall Street is entirely at fault. Our "elected" officials have allowed this to happen so they can get that campaign money for the next election. The whole system needs to be fixed.

1) Ban corporate lobbying.
2) Close the tax loopholes that allow corporations to pay next to nothing in taxes.
3) Penalize corporations that send our jobs overseas.
4) Fix the trade deficits with other countries.
5) And stop the BS with "to big to fail"... let them. If they can't make sound business decisions, they should go bankrupt.


Ok, fair enough. How do you accomplish these aims? Legislation? Further legislation and lawyers will ensure that the big banks and big corps will not be touched. Let's say the legislation is actually enforced (it won't be). The corps will say, "see ya!" and move elsewhere, taking the rest of the jobs with them.

The ONLY way to end corporatism is to end the Federal Reserve, completely dismantle the powers picked up by the Federal Government since 1861, and return the power to local and state governments. It also means no more social programs and it means allowing people to be personally responsible and self reliant.

You can't have both. You want some federal nanny state and large amounts of government spending? There WILL be money in politics. There WILL be elites. It is inevitable.

The choice is clear. What do you want? handouts and "social justice"? Great. Then accept the fact that you will have no power and elites will.
You want freedom and empowerment? Don't rely on big government or mobs.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:23 PM
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Originally posted by Stan71
I would say it's a good start. I would guess to say that the protesters are using "Wall Street" as a symbol of what America has come too be known... Greedy. Weather it's government or corporate corruption it all comes down to money and GREED. Our politicians take money from corporations to push their agendas and policies while they sit back and rake in the money. I don't think Wall Street is entirely at fault. Our "elected" officials have allowed this to happen so they can get that campaign money for the next election. The whole system needs to be fixed.

1) Ban corporate lobbying.
2) Close the tax loopholes that allow corporations to pay next to nothing in taxes.
3) Penalize corporations that send our jobs overseas.
4) Fix the trade deficits with other countries.
5) And stop the BS with "to big to fail"... let them. If they can't make sound business decisions, they should go bankrupt.


I don't think the OWS movement is the way to go about it, but I aggree with EVERY ONE of your 1-5 topics above.

I've been a tea party supporter from the beginning. Both the tea party and OWS agree that the problem is corruption. I think it's corruption in GOVERNMENT that is the main problem, because of all of the laws that have benefitted their cronies.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:31 PM
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Every human life is precious, and NO ONE, absolutely no human should have to end his life just to be heard by his leaders, either by himself or in the hands of his leaders.

To do so would only regress us back to our animal states, and will be treated as one.

Every revolution thus begins with incremental steps:- the vote, then if no change, it will be the smaller protests, then if still no change, it will only grow larger, and the last, massive turnout to be heard. All these are revolutions, the method for the ignored massed to be HEARD so that changes take place.

At times, benevolent leaders will listen and know what's at stake, and will take the steps to correct errors if any, or explain honestly if there aren't.

But more often than not, they seldom listen, and even with massive turnouts, they are seldom frighten. They have protection and knows none want violence. Thus they continue their depridations, propaganda, sleight of hands tricks and hypocratic mickey mouse song and dance routines.

Those leaders whom panic will use the military to engage in violence to the people, and will only be rendered into pieces later by the surviving masses.

Those leaders whom dont panic, will just watch and see, and calmly do their thing without a fear.

BUT WHAT WILL TRULY make them FEAR is when you DOWN TOOLS.

This generation and lot of politicians and elites depend on the economy for their wealth and priviledges. Once the economy is to be crippled, they will bawl out loud and either go down on their knees to beg the people for compromises, or flee the country to enjoy their rotten gains on foreign shores.

Crippling the economy will hurt the masses too, but as long as food and water is shared amongst all, we will all survive. If you had already lost your job, or are sustaining on meagre pay while the elites are enjoying their days in the suns with your efforts, downing tools is not as hard as you think, for it is the only message that the leaders will listen to and make the necessary changes.

Money and opportunity that had been lost can always be gain back over time. But when lives are lost, it is forever. There is no need to resort to violence, not in our day and age. There are more peaceful ways to win. Revolutions too, will progress with evolution.
edit on 10-10-2011 by SeekerofTruth101 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:49 PM
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You are correct, gwydionblack. I’ve been saying it all along. OWS isn’t the revolution; it is the awakening that there is something very wrong with this world. A year ago, those who knew the elite controlled the banks, the politicians, the government, legislation, your life, were few and far between, and generally labeled as Conspiracy Theorists, or just plain crazy, but now this knowledge is in the main stream. People are waking from their slumber and are finally seeing the strings that control their lives, and the lives of the people they elect into office.
The revolution will be an ugly ordeal, not cute, not fun, and not spelled in some mainstream hip way. The revolution will require lives lost to make a difference. I am prepared to die and kill to see change. These “elites” aren’t going without a fight, and neither can we. The moment we return to the status quo will be the moment they punish you for disobeying their rule. We’re seeing it already with the rising bank charges, illegal foreclosures, and the erasure of our rights. We cannot afford to look back, and we cannot afford to play nicely. Bow to no one. Rise to your worth. Remember your free will.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 12:54 PM
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I really don't understand you Americans. You go on and on about taking down the fed, the Governments and all other manner of mis-haps but when someone actually does something about it, you moan and complain that this isn't what we wanted blah blah blah.

Are you really that scared of change?

ALS



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 01:01 PM
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reply to post by gwydionblack
 

It's attitudes like yours that make people want to give up and give in to the wrong doings of our government.
Even if there isn't any hope for change, you should be trying to convince people that there IS hope.
I know it's kind of an oddball quote, but we've all seen "Bambi".

"If you can't say something nice, don't say nothing at all."

One thing is for sure, nothing will EVER be solved with your attitude.



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 01:06 PM
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reply to post by navy_vet_stg3
 


True story. I like that. Woodstock Light.



reply to post by Stan71
 


It is only a good start if it goes anywhere other than where it is now. History shows that it is very unlikely that such will happen. Another person posted a very interesting topic about OWS in which he listed the three choices the movement has, These people protesting are in support of entitlements for themselves and others. Anyone who feels they should be given something for nothing obviously doesn't understand working to achieve something and thus is not willing to make any sacrifices along the way to reach their goals.


reply to post by American-philosopher
 


I have seen this come and go. I have been a part of some of the former protests. I thought long and hard about being a part of this one, but ultimately there is no point. People may be mad as hell, but they are going to continue to take it and take it and take it some more. Don't fool yourself by thinking people are actually "not going to take it anymore" because the protests themselves are continuing to "take it", it being the degradation and control by the powers that be.


reply to post by TheMindWar
 


So true. People don't know what freedom is anymore. I have seen that myself. I support the protests as well in some regard, but I ultimately feel they are pointless and if they achieve anything at all, it will simply be more "social justice" programs and loss of individual controls.

reply to post by SeekerofTruth101
 




Every human life is precious, and NO ONE, absolutely no human should have to end his life just to be heard by his leaders, either by himself or in the hands of his leaders.


What SHOULD be and what reality dictates are two very different things. The fact is, this government ignores the people unless something drastic is done to make them listen.

Your idea about crippling the economy is novel, however, in the times such has happened it usually ended up worse for where for the citizens. See Germany post WWI.

You assume that it is even possible to cripple this economy, and while it certainly may be, the complacency of the masses to use that economy for their welfare and the pleasures will prevent them from ever joining in any attempt to topple that economy. I have never seen a citizenship topple its own economy, it is usually the government that ends up doing it first, which our government is doing very well. This will allow for the election of "new" leaders promising change and prosperity and hell, we know where this is going already, don't we?

Revolution has been tried and tested and it works. It is the only way to strip the old power elite bare and install new governors with new regulations and make sure that the corruption is most definitely wiped out of the system.


reply to post by FugitiveSoul
 


I'll be happy to fight by your side on the battlefield when that time comes.



reply to post by ALOSTSOUL
 


You miss the point. This isn't going to change anything. If I were afraid of change, why would I call for a revolution? Why would I support toppling probably the most powerful government in the world? If that doesn't cause change, I don't know what will.

I am a realist. I have been a realist. While others promote love, togetherness, and peace, actions which have accomplished NOTHING in the past century, I look towards the ideas that WILL produce change, the ideas that created this and every country that is sitting on the map today. It all started with some kind of revolution and nine times out of ten, it was always violent in nature.

It is time to reboot the United States of America as it was founded to be, not the coporatocracy that it has become and not a nation of welfare and social justice.

Scared of change? I embrace it.


reply to post by GmoS719
 


My attitude is what is going to save this country. You can HOPE that you become rich and powerful but that isn't going to do anything. Once people look past their petty distractions and false "hopes" they will realize the ACTION that needs to be taken to enact change. Believe me, there is hope still, just not in the actions of OWS or any other peaceful protestor that abides by the system.

There is HOPE in a real revolution.

edit on 10-10-2011 by gwydionblack because: finish last sentence



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 01:13 PM
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How is your attitude going to save this country?
What have you done to acquire change?
Posting an anti-OWS thread is hardly saving this country.
Once you get out of your computer chair and actually make a difference, I will listen to what you have to say about a
"R3volution".
Like I said, it's people like you who never get ANY thing accomplished.
edit on 10-10-2011 by GmoS719 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 10 2011 @ 01:33 PM
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reply to post by FugitiveSoul
 


I suggest you drop the idea of violence in a peaceful protest. We all can win this one using peaceful means alone. Arab spring had proved it so. The only violence that came was from the authorities and not from the masses, which ultimately ended up international revile upon those authorities and universal support for the masses.

Should you choose violence or preach violence, you or the few who follow you will be rendered to pieces by the masses whom only seeks for peaceful protest, and handed over to the authorities, so long as the authorities do not resort to violence.

This message goes to all the elites' agent provocatuers who intents to spead pre-fear of violence or actual violence, as well.

The masses WILL NOT be denied of their peaceful protest for incremental change, one way or another.





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