The Korans fascinating verses about hell

reply to post by sk0rpi0n


I have a question for you

Sura 14:4 And We never sent a messenger save with the language of his folk, that he might make (the message) clear for them. Then Allah sendeth whom He will astray, and guideth whom He will. He is the Mighty, the Wise.

(the part in bold)

So we have allah making people with the sole intention of eventually sending them to hell – why would he do that and why bother with the 3 question judgement thing?

reply to post by racasan

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by sk0rpi0n

 

I have a question for you

Sura 14:4 And We never sent a messenger save with the language of his folk, that he might make (the message) clear for them. Then Allah sendeth whom He will astray, and guideth whom He will. He is the Mighty, the Wise.

(the part in bold)

So we have allah making people with the sole intention of eventually sending them to hell – why would he do that

At best, I can only give you a reply based on my own personal understanding of religion. Is that ok?
First, lets make it clear that if you find fault in my answer, then you only find fault in my understanding of these matters... nothing more, nothing less. Cool?

Anyway...on to your question.... I dont think God makes people just to eventually send them to hell. God leaves earthly matters and choices to humans. Which is why a reward/punishment system in the afterlife even exists in the first place.

(In reference to what you highlighted in bold), God CAN choose who He thinks is worth guiding. And God CAN choose who he thinks should rather be left astray.

and why bother with the 3 question judgement thing?

I've already posted my understanding of the 3 question "judgement thing" on the previous page.
I will NOT claim to know the exact reason.

Just want to add a bit to this thread. In islam, we will revived in full body and soul. Not a new body but the exact body that already scattered became dust, reunite and form the old exact body.
Hell and paradise already made since before adam and eva's time. Hell and paradise is not inside universe that consist of 7 layer sky, but somewhere near sidratul muntaha, a place next to the edge of universe.

Quran said that universe is expanding, and one time it will reach the limit of expanding and will start contracting and it is when armageddon happened.
Later on the universe will rebuild, and earth we know will be much much bigger than before. It is when people get revived to form their genuine body and soul. Position of the old earth will be in the middle of new earth, deep down underground.

When all the people revived and judgement days is done, hell and paradise will get closer to new earth. Hell will be placed between new earth and paradise that time.

reply to post by racasan


Meaning of that ayat simply god choose people who will be rescued or not. The rescued people only if they willing to follow the guidance, and the opposite to the people who are not.
There are reason why god choose some people and not the other. The choosen one because they already got hidayah or enlightment.

Not all people who got hidayah will be rescued, unless they follow the guidance. People that got hidayah or enlightment had it because they were seeking for the truth. The very same way with prophet abraham, realizing this world full of purpose and design, and he think it must be a designer who design and create it.
Using logic abraham seeking god and keep dissapointed because the criteria of god he seek he never find it in things that he think god.

In the end he just thinking about whoever god is, he just want to admit god who create everything, earth and heaven.Then he pray and ask to this god to show him the truth, the true way, and get enlightned.

About three question, it is not for judgment days, but the question for people who just get pass away recently and buried. The third question supposed to be who is your imam or leader.

Originally posted by maung
reply to post by racasan

 

Meaning of that ayat simply god choose people who will be rescued or not. The rescued people only if they willing to follow the guidance, and the opposite to the people who are not.
There are reason why god choose some people and not the other. The choosen one because they already got hidayah or enlightment.

And you don’t see a problem with that?

and from what I can see the text doesn’t support what you have read into it

My guess is that you and sk0rpi0n are good people who connected to a silly belief system and are forced to ‘invent’ solutions for the disturbing parts

did you know there are a number of other suras in quran that say allah will choose who he will save and who not, and this has been a problem for muslim scholars since the beginning of islam - because it means allah is making people to simply send them to hell

reply to post by racasan


The text alone cant explain the whole meaning. Quran cant be read like a judicial book of law. Explanation not directly in fully for an ayat. The key of hidayah in quran is really hard to find, mostly when someone read it like a book of law guidance. Will be easier if to read it like a book of story, complete and not chopping. Much better if know the background.

If one want to be able to interpret quran by ayat, word, even letter, one must master all the tool to uncover quran, such as sorof, nahu, bayan, mantek, sapiah,alfiah and tassawuf. Very rare who can mastered it all.

One of the key in quran that explain who will be choose by god is from the ayat about when iblis talk to god. Iblis ask for delaying for his punishment until the end of the world, and he will seduced every human on the world to follow his path and become like him, a satan. God said, do it and you will be able to get most human to his side, only people who ask protection from god that he cant.

Asking protection from god mean these people already through some step. First they search if god exist or not. Then believe that god exist. Knowing how great and ability of god, and god's power. Then ask protection.
God choose to save the people who ask protection doesnt mean subjective at all.

Originally posted by racasan
Ok atheist and people of other religions there is no need to worry about muslim hell

Here’s why
If you are dead you and find yourself in the company of two Arab looking angels then the muslims where right, (don't panic) the good news is they >have< to ask you 3 questions – here are the answers

Question 1 – who is your lord – answer = just say allah (of course)
Question 2 – what is your religion- answer = just say islam (of course)
Question 3 – they show you a picture and ask you to identify who it is

Ok question 3 is a bit tricky, the answer is ether; say its mohammad or you should riot and burn down a Danish embassy - im just not sure which at the moment

You really think you can just memorize the answer and actually be able to say it when the time comes? Do you think you can fool God or the angels who will be in charge of questioning you? Then let me tell you different, you can only answer ALLAH, if you truly believed Him to be your Lord, and Islam if you are truly a Muslim, and Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) if you truly believe him as a messenger of God. You cannot lie to God, who is the Knower of the visible and the invisible, of what is said openly and what is kept secret in the breast of men. As soon as your soul leaves your body, you will know, but how will that knowledge avail you when you disbelieved in it before?

52:9 On the day when the heaven will heave with (awful) heaving,
52:10 And the mountains move away with (awful) movement,

52:11 Then woe that day unto the deniers

52:12 Who play in talk of grave matters;

52:13 The day when they are thrust with a (disdainful) thrust, into the fire of hell

52:14 (And it is said unto them): This is the Fire which ye were wont to deny.
52:15 Is this magic, or do ye not see ?

52:16 Endure the heat thereof, and whether ye are patient of it or impatient of it is all one for you. Ye are only being paid for what ye used to do.

°°°°°°°

53:57 The threatened Hour is nigh.
53:58 None beside Allah can disclose it.
53:59 Marvel ye then at this statement,
53:60 And laugh and not weep,
53:61 While ye amuse yourselves ?
53:62 Rather prostrate yourselves before Allah and serve Him.

reply to post by queenofangels_17



Take a deep breath – now I was actually laughing at the non-sense religious people believe in – and there is nothing more comical than islam




(Pro tip – first try to prove your bogyman is real before you attempt and scare people with him)

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by sk0rpi0n

 

I have a question for you

Sura 14:4 And We never sent a messenger save with the language of his folk, that he might make (the message) clear for them. Then Allah sendeth whom He will astray, and guideth whom He will. He is the Mighty, the Wise.

(the part in bold)

So we have allah making people with the sole intention of eventually sending them to hell – why would he do that and why bother with the 3 question judgement thing?

ALLAH created all of us just for the purpose of worshipping Him.

51:56 I created the jinn and humankind only that they might worship Me.

He sent His messengers with the guidance, to worship God ALONE and to follow the messengers. ALLAH guides those who believe in the messengers, and send astray those who disbelieve the messengers. He does not pre-destine man to become a disbeliever, rather He keep sending messengers to bring them all back to their true home.

3:91 Lo! those who disbelieve, and die in disbelief, the (whole) earth full of gold would not be accepted from such an one if it were offered as a ransom for his soul. Theirs will be a painful doom and they will have no helpers.

---- As for the 3 questions which will be asked in the grave, it is to ascertain if you are a believer or a disbeliever..

God promised the Children of Israel that He will raise up a Prophet like Moses who will speak in His Name. The Holy Qur'an has 114 Chapters and all starts with or contains the phrase " In the Name of ALLAH". God has revealed His name in the last days to be ALLAH. Islam or the Surrender to His will as the true religion. And Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him) as His messenger in the Last Day. Whether you like it or not you belong in the generation of the Nation of Muhammad (peace and blessings be upon him), the last generation according to God before the Day of Judgment.

"I will raise them up a Prophet from among their brethren, like unto thee, and will put my words in his mouth; and he shall speak unto them all that I shall command him. And it shall come to pass, that whosoever will not hearken unto my words which he shall speak in my name, I will require it of him." Deut. 18:18-19

3:19 Lo! religion with Allah is the Surrender to His Will and Guidance ( Islam). Those who formerly received the Scripture differed only after knowledge came unto them, through transgression among themselves. Whoso disbelieveth the revelations of Allah will find that lo! Allah is swift at reckoning.

3:20 And if they argue with thee, (O Muhammad), say: I have surrendered my purpose to Allah and so have those who follow me. And say unto those who have received the Scripture and those who read not: Have ye too surrendered ? If they surrender, then truly they are rightly guided, and if they turn away, then it is thy duty only to convey the message unto them. Allah is Seer of His bondmen.

reply to post by racasan


Go ahead and laugh, you will soon weep much. And wait...we too are waiting! How can we be sorry for people like you who deny guidance and choose to wallow in ignorance? Whoever choose disbelief instead of faith, they are indeed the losers and their lost is manifest!

83:29 Lo! the guilty used to laugh at those who believed,

83:30 And wink one to another when they passed them;

83:31 And when they returned to their own folk, they returned jesting;

83:32 And when they saw them they said: Lo! these have gone astray.

83:33 Yet they were not sent as guardians over them.

83:34 This day it is those who believe who have the laugh of disbelievers,

°°°°°

38:62 And they say: What aileth us that we behold not men whom we were wont to count among the wicked ?

38:63 Did we take them wrongly for a laughing-stock, or have our eyes missed them ?

38:64 Lo! that is very truth: the wrangling of the dwellers in the Fire.

38:65 Say (unto them, O Muhammad): I am only a warner, and there is no God save Allah, the One, the Absolute,

38:66 Lord of the heavens and the earth and all that is between them, the Mighty, the Pardoning.

reply to post by queenofangels_17


Right – so you think I should be concerned about the contents of a book that thinks the
world is flat
stars are lamps that can be fired at devils
mountains hold the earth still
sky is held up on invisible pillars


not gonna happen

reply to post by racasan

and there is nothing more comical than islam

If you find it "comical" then know that you have only been allowed to laugh a little.

Originally posted by sk0rpi0n
reply to post by racasan

 

and there is nothing more comical than islam

If you find it "comical" then know that you have only been allowed to laugh a little.

Allowed?
So what are you talking about here
Allowed by allah?
Or
Allowed because I have the freedom to express my views?

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by queenofangels_17

 

Right – so you think I should be concerned about the contents of a book that thinks the
world is flat
stars are lamps that can be fired at devils
mountains hold the earth still
sky is held up on invisible pillars


not gonna happen

What in God's name are you talking about?

1. Qur'an does not think earth is flat - on the contrary, it describes it as "egg-shaped" (which is the correct astronomical description, since earth is not a perfect sphere).
2. Seriously? You have a problem with an allegorical description of stars as lamps?
3. Mountains INDEED hold the earth (ground) still - not only this, but in Qur'an the mountains are said to have "pegs" - which is a recent geological discovery. The "pegs" of the mountans serve as stabilizers for the earths crust.
4. "It is Allah who erected the heavens without pillars" - Qur'an, 13:12


Stop posting nonsense. Read the Qur'an for yourself, not quotes from anti-islamic websites.

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by queenofangels_17

 

Right – so you think I should be concerned about the contents of a book that thinks the
world is flat
stars are lamps that can be fired at devils
mountains hold the earth still
sky is held up on invisible pillars


not gonna happen

not gonna happen? you got that right... ALLAH does not guide wrong-doing folk.

The Holy Qur'an is a sealed book... only the purified can touch it or understand its meaning... Purified meaning purified from idolatry and serving other gods beside ALLAH.

And if I were minded to guide you, you wil not be guided if ALLAH's will is to send you astray.. poor clay!

reply to post by queenofangels_17



It looks you have me confused with someone who takes you seriously.

Originally posted by racasan
reply to post by queenofangels_17

 

It looks you have me confused with someone who takes you seriously.

--ditto---

May Allah forgive us our sins and permit us to enter the heavens , and bless everyone

peace