99%? Who wants to be a part of the 100%?

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
reply to post by beezzer

 

If you believe OWS is fully supported by the democrats then your fooling yourself. The democrats are almost as conservative as the republicans. By conservative I mean looking out for BIG BUSINESS! And yes I support unions and am proud of it.

To be specific, I'd say fully supported by the progressive branch of the DNC. Van Jones being one of their "leaders".

Do you honestly believe that this progressive administration will change ANY laws that'll inhibit Wall Street?
Cough* Goldman Sachs*cough
Cough* GE *cough

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07
reply to post by beezzer

 

If you believe OWS is fully supported by the democrats then your fooling yourself. The democrats are almost as conservative as the republicans. By conservative I mean looking out for BIG BUSINESS! And yes I support unions and am proud of it.

To be specific, I'd say fully supported by the progressive branch of the DNC. Van Jones being one of their "leaders".

Do you honestly believe that this progressive administration will change ANY laws that'll inhibit Wall Street?
Cough* Goldman Sachs*cough
Cough* GE *cough

This administration needs the voter base even more than it needs its funding...

The only reason MSM is covering OWS nationwide is because they have to. Trust they would like for those people to burn in hell and be done with it but the REAL AMERICANS have decided enough is enough and are doing something about it.

The tea party fools were pretenders. I support smaller government in some regards, with a smaller budget and much less USC, BUT the conservatives still support banks and multinational corporations which will bring us a tyranical world government. Communism is dead so I do not fear it anymore. Even cuba is becoming socialist which means north korea is the last pillar. Anyone who fears communism is dellusional. Look around you and smell the coffee.

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by NoHierarchy

 

Double think?

...

Yes, double think. Read the book 1984 by George Orwell.

en.wikipedia.org...

Originally posted by projectvxn
reply to post by daskakik

 

You cannot OVERTHROW a constitutional government.

You CAN ignore the constitution if you want to, but if you violate the rights of others, or if you attempt an armed insurgency then you have to deal with LEO or the military respectively.

Personal liberty does not mean you get to impose on others. The wonderful thing about how the Country works and functions is that if you do not like it you can 1 leave, 2 you can live in the middle of nowhere in a commune with people you share ideals with, 3 you can actively, PEACEABLY and LEGALLY try to change it to your liking.

What would you say to JFK?

"Those who make peaceful revolution impossible will make violent revolution inevitable."
-John F. Kennedy

reply to post by EarthCitizen07
Bull.
Conservatives are just serious about about the changes that need to be made.
Change the laws and you'll change the influences that Wall Street has on DC.

But all are cowards and spineless weasels in DC. So do your marches. Sing your chants.

Want real change?

Get people of integrity into office.

Originally posted by projectvxn

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by projectvxn

 

Again, that wasn't the question.

The question is how am I more free living under the constitution that the forefathers forced upon us than without it?

The answer is I'm not. That is why I don't see much difference between being forced to live in a constitutional collective or a manifiesto collective when my options in both are are accept it, leave, hide or try to change it.

Well, in a Constitutional government, ours in particular you have the right to express yourself as you see fit, you have the right to PEACEABLY assemble, you have the right to petition government for redress of grievances, you have the right to religious expression of your choosing.

You have the right to not be killed without due process of the law, or even searched or have property seized. You have the right to defend yourself in a court of law, you have the right to not incriminate yourself, you have the right to not be punished for your crimes beyond what is reasonable and conscientious. You have the right to move about as you see fit without having to produce papers. You have the right to make as much or as little money as you see fit and comfortable to your sensibilities. You have the right to keep and bear arms. To defend your life and property in a manner that is most befitting to you.

If you don't like any of this, then I recommend tyranny. These are enumerated NEGATIVE rights. Why are they negative? Because it restrains GOVERNMENT from imposing upon you so that you can live your life in liberty free to pursue happiness in accordance to your beliefs.

If you don't like it, you can go somewhere else. It is not making you less free because it is there. It would make you less free if it weren't.

edit on 9-10-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

Have you been living under a ROCK?? Most of these rights have been compromised if not downright STRIPPED from us in certain circumstances. How can you be so unaware??

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

You really are f*cking brainwashed aren't you???????????

How much time have you spent in the military?
(and playing HALO doesn't count)

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

 

Bull.
Conservatives are just serious about about the changes that need to be made.
Change the laws and you'll change the influences that Wall Street has on DC.

Haven't you noticed? It's the Corporations and wall Street that influences the laws that are written. All in their favor and against the American working man.

So who's going to buck the banking/Corporate oligarchy to change the laws against them and stamp out their greed and corruption. A politician?.........

I can't believe that you are so naive in the ways of Washington.

Originally posted by ThreeThreeThree
Some people like the laws that are "forced" upon them.... What about those people that like to have laws that you don't like- would you like to get rid of all goverment and laws and FORCE that upon other people?

I'm not complaining. It's just an example.

Your right you can't please everyone. Like I said those that complain about uncostitutional laws being forced on them don't realize that when they call for a return to the original constitution that they are also in fact forcing that change in the laws on others.

Originally posted by projectvxn

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by projectvxn

 

How does government equal freedom?

Liberty isn't forceful or coercive having to accept the constitution and the power that it gives the government over the individual is.

The Constitution restrains government from imposing on the individual.

But you wouldn't know that since apparently you've never read it.

It only does so IN RELATION to many other, more oppressive, modes of government.

ALL government is oppressive and restraining. If you deny this, then you have ZERO INPUT ON THIS DISCUSSION.

Originally posted by projectvxn

Originally posted by daskakik
reply to post by Cinaed

 

Not True.

People have protested even in dictatorships and monarchies.

And many of them were killed, thrown in jail, abused by the authorities and still are to this day in many countries around the world...Many people simply don't try again.

How is it not true?

edit on 9-10-2011 by projectvxn because: (no reason given)

And..... that doesn't happen HERE to an extent??

We imprison more people than ANY OTHER NATION (including China/Russia), we have MORE MILITARY BASES than Rome at its HEIGHT (72 versus over 700). We are an ENDEMIC SURVEILLANCE SOCIETY and quasi-police state in certain circumstances. Every single protest (especially by left-wingers) has been INFILTRATED by government and attacked with violence and imprisonment, despite being peaceful or non-threatening. Read into the red-scare, the green scare, COINTELPRO, MKULTRA, violation of habeus corpus, etc. etc. hell... just go to the ACLU website and see DAILY violations of our constitutional rights by the powers that be. Stop living in a dreamworld.

Originally posted by Cinaed
reply to post by NoHierarchy

 

Where did I say you are a comunist????? I explained why no matter how good it sounds in theory, never does in the real world, how does this make me an idiot???
Why so defensive?

Because you missed my point and then restated it as if I was saying the opposite, as if I was a Communist. And even if I was, SO WHAT? Hopefully someday in the future, people look back at Capitalists with the same disgust and suspicion.

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by EarthCitizen07

I am not saying voting for a democrat is the right answer but it sure as hell beats voting for a republican. I used to support the tea party till it merged with the republicans, now I support OWS which seems more sincere and more grass roots.

More grass-roots?
OWS is funded by unions, adbusters, Moveondotcom.
So a liberal movement is okay, especially one encouraged by Obama, Pelosi.
Just not a conservative one.

BULL.

It was as CALL TO ACTION. There are no leaders, this is a Democratic movement.

Funded by unions? Moveon? PROVE IT. And no... donations for food and such don't count.

And in any case... Adbusters and Moveon are hardly some sinister force against freedom... they're actually more radically PRO-freedom than just about any group on the right.

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

 

Bull.
Conservatives are just serious about about the changes that need to be made.
Change the laws and you'll change the influences that Wall Street has on DC.

But all are cowards and spineless weasels in DC. So do your marches. Sing your chants.

Want real change?

Get people of integrity into office.

Republicans... of integrity? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH, please tell me you did NOT just imply that!!

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

You really are f*cking brainwashed aren't you???????????

How much time have you spent in the military?
(and playing HALO doesn't count)

Oh right... I'm not a soldier so I "just wouldn't understand"... makes perfect sense.

Originally posted by NoHierarchy
BULL.

It was as CALL TO ACTION. There are no leaders, this is a Democratic movement.

Funded by unions? Moveon? PROVE IT. And no... donations for food and such don't count.

And in any case... Adbusters and Moveon are hardly some sinister force against freedom... they're actually more radically PRO-freedom than just about any group on the right.

edit on 9-10-2011 by NoHierarchy because: (no reason given)

*Yawn*
Pro-freedom?
Does that mean that moveon and adbusters now support personal responsibility, individuality, less government?

Didn't think so.

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

Originally posted by beezzer
reply to post by EarthCitizen07

 

Bull.
Conservatives are just serious about about the changes that need to be made.
Change the laws and you'll change the influences that Wall Street has on DC.

But all are cowards and spineless weasels in DC. So do your marches. Sing your chants.

Want real change?

Get people of integrity into office.

Republicans... of integrity? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAH, please tell me you did NOT just imply that!!

Where did I say republicans?
I said people of integrity.

You just assumed republicans.
Fail

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

Originally posted by beezzer

Originally posted by NoHierarchy

You really are f*cking brainwashed aren't you???????????

How much time have you spent in the military?
(and playing HALO doesn't count)

Oh right... I'm not a soldier so I "just wouldn't understand"... makes perfect sense.

I'm glad we can agree on ONE issue then.