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Why men are in trouble

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posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 06:36 PM
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reply to post by SuperTripps
 


A woman's test in life is MATERIAL

A man's test in life is a woman.

Or something like that . . .
edit on 8-10-2011 by MasterGemini because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 06:43 PM
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reply to post by MaMaa
 


Feminism, is moronic to say the least, women who despise men for the maistakes they made by choosing the wrong men in their lives. Men were originally put here as hunters and protectors, women were the gatherers and child bearers, neither could survive without the other. We are equal, so why must there be so much hate between sexes? It saddens me that this is what humanity has become, it saddens me that I know so many women who hate men because they're too dumb to tell the difference between a good guy and a bad guy. I'm a straight male and the few of them i'm friends with ask me for advice. I tell them how to tell the difference but they never listen they go for the good looking one every time, then they complain to me when that guy turns out to be an a$$hole. What a lovely world we live in.



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 06:49 PM
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Originally posted by MaMaa

Why on earth would I disagree with that? You say it like it's such a horrid thing. Think logically for a minute here. You have something that someone else wants, something you probably don't have as much interest in as they do, but they do however have something else that you would like. What do you do? You make a trade! Men use women for sex all the time, this is nothing new and it has happened since the beginning of time. Love them and leave them.. so women smarten up, realize the man only wants sex and uses it to her advantage to get something that she wants as equally as the man wants sex. It's a win win. It's just sex for crying out loud, it's not a multi million dollar deal being made.


That is precisely why they call it "the world's oldest profession". Trade is trade, whether cash is involved or not, and nearly every woman I've ever met engages in it, and most men are dumb enough to fall for it, mistaking it for some ethereal concept called "love". That ain't love. What you feel for your kids, that which doesn't have conditions placed upon it to exist, THAT is love. the rest is just trade.

I can honestly say that I don't "use women for sex", neither all the time nor part of the time. They want to hold out, that's fine by me. I keep doing what I'm supposed to do, with it or with out, and don't pop for the perks. I figured that sex hold-outs are why TV was invented in the first place. Gives ya something to do in between shifts at work.

Believe it or not, I've got references to attest to that. Out of 2 wives (yeah, I know, a fella really shouldn't collect things like that - gets expensive after a while) and a "roomate", every single one has tried that gambit, and every single one has failed, and failed hard. I didn't get up and walk off, I didn't really go out and find it elsewhere, I just kept on doing my part and ignored it. Not my lookout whether they live up to theirs or not - they still got provided for, and nary a one of them had to go find an outside job.

You know what? In the end of every single one of those cases - and not a one ended because of sex or lack thereof, or because of finances or lack thereof - they did sudden reversals and tried their damndest to keep the end from coming. I reckon maybe they figured out there was worse out there or something, but when I'm done, I'm done, so it was a wasted effort on their part to keep that from happening. Had they put a tenth of that effort in throughout the "relationship", the end would have never been.

I'm low maintenance, easy upkeep. The thing is, I WILL NOT be steamrolled, and they figured that out just a bit too late. The one I'm with now generally stays in her room, I stay in mine. I fork over most all of the money I get ahold of (what the hell else is there to do with it, really?), she does whatever it is women do with money, and makes sure I eat every now and then, and that I don't sleep in the street. Easy street. As long as she never tries to steamroll me, she's got it made, and ain't giving up much of nothing more than about 5 or ten minutes a day to make a sammich.

Life is so simple for us knuckle-draggers, and the women who stay under our roofs!

ETA: I gave you a star for that response - you're only the second or third woman I've run across in a lifetime that was willing to admit that!




edit on 2011/10/8 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 07:04 PM
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Originally posted by JohnCreed777
they go for the good looking one every time, then they complain to me when that guy turns out to be an a$$hole. What a lovely world we live in.


I'm not particularly good looking. In all honesty, I'm decidedly less that "plain" too. My sweetheart - or roomate - or whatever the hell that woman under my roof is - will be the first to tell you I'm an asshole. hell, she tells ME that about twice a day, and I just smile and nod and say "yeah, I AM, ain't I?"

Thing is, I'm HER asshole, and she'll scrap with any externals to make sure it stays that way.

What have you got against "neanderthals", anyhow?



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 07:57 PM
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reply to post by Partygirl
 


Great post!


If I could bump this higher I would. Being the baby of the family raised by 5 older sisters I would say nothing makes a man out of ya quicker.


I do however blame my sisters for me being still single as they have taught me all the ways of getting under a womens skin without vulgarity.


Can't help it now, it's second nature.

Oh well, that's life.

edit on 8-10-2011 by TDawgRex because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Partygirl
 


Great post!


If I could bump this higher I would. Being the baby of the family raised by 5 older sisters I would say nothing makes a man out of ya quicker.


I do however blame my sisters for me being still single as they have taught me all the ways of getting under a womens skin without vulgarity.


Can't help it now, it's second nature.

Oh well, that's life.

edit on 8-10-2011 by TDawgRex because: (no reason given)


Oh do share a few please




posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 08:07 PM
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Originally posted by MaMaa

Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by MaMaa

As far as holding back their 'garden valley' as you put it.. well that's simply because women don't need or want it the same as men. Men will go after women because they want to get lucky, not because they like the woman.. they like what they will get from her. Women have learned to not just be used and abused over years and years of men only wanting one thing from them.



Baloney. They use it for "leverage" in "negotiations" to get stuff out of men. Why else would they get so spastic when that tactic fails?



Why on earth would I disagree with that? You say it like it's such a horrid thing. Think logically for a minute here. You have something that someone else wants, something you probably don't have as much interest in as they do, but they do however have something else that you would like. What do you do? You make a trade! Men use women for sex all the time, this is nothing new and it has happened since the beginning of time. Love them and leave them.. so women smarten up, realize the man only wants sex and uses it to her advantage to get something that she wants as equally as the man wants sex. It's a win win. It's just sex for crying out loud, it's not a multi million dollar deal being made.


The problem here is that there is no price on morality. Sure, it's a logical assessment that sex can = profit. But at what cost? Surely there is more to selling sex than just money, no?

That's how some Women are labeled sluts or whores, pardon my language. When the value of their integrity is lost in favor of profit via sexual favors. You might ask now "Why would a single Woman be de-valued as a person because she sells sex for profit?"

Character. Would you be interested in having any type of relationship, be it professional or personal, with someone of low character?

It's not "just sex". It's how a person is viewed as society as a whole.



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 08:08 PM
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God made man before woman, but, there's always a rough draft before the masterpiece.

2c



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 08:18 PM
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Originally posted by MasterGemini

Originally posted by TDawgRex
reply to post by Partygirl
 


Great post!


If I could bump this higher I would. Being the baby of the family raised by 5 older sisters I would say nothing makes a man out of ya quicker.


I do however blame my sisters for me being still single as they have taught me all the ways of getting under a womens skin without vulgarity.


Can't help it now, it's second nature.

Oh well, that's life.

edit on 8-10-2011 by TDawgRex because: (no reason given)


Oh do share a few please



I can't. The horror...the horrer.


It's kind of like a PTSD that I have embraced.


Best kept in the dark recesses of my mind.



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 08:48 PM
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reply to post by Partygirl
 


so as a man, all you got to do is to have your shti together and you get your pick of women? is that what your implying? so lets see... college - check, job - check, my own home - check...transpo - check
invested in metals and cash - check...weapons - check... cutie brunette - check...

too bad for those other clueless dudes...



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 09:06 PM
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I've personally seen a switch over from what used to be considered "male" behavior, ie. abandoning family, cheating, abusing, etc. I know a great many men who have taken the lead in caring for their children (myself included) because their wives/girlfriends/baby mommas just want to party and fornicate. I've seen a lot of woman lately who just don't care about their children or remaining faithful, and too many good woman who stay in relationships that just aren't healthy for them or their children. I've been single for 5 years so far because I can't seem to find a woman in my area who actually looks for a caring, compassionate, honest man. I used to think being the kind of guy who would write a woman poetry or cook her favorite dinner (chivalric behavior) yet still be a "man", was what most woman looked for in a man. From what I have experienced, you have to be a #head to woman to keep them, and I simply refuse to lower myself to such troglodyte behavior. As far as wages and careers go, if she can do the job, a woman should be payed the same wage as a man doing the same job. As far as degrees or college go, I thing a lot of men nowadays enter the workforce right after high school in lieu of college.



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 09:18 PM
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Manly men left with the introduction of feminism and the loss of our manufacturing base when we off-shored it to another country (in an attempt save money: who needs protectionism?). It's not males, in general, that're failing, it's the males of yesterday that're failing. The very male you put on that pedestal is the one that's failing. The manly man, the strong man, the gentlemen, the leader, whatever you call it! He's not passing the genetic test!!! He's failing, and taking it out on games. He's going to prison, getting dead end jobs, surviving on unemployment, protesting, getting drunk and getting laid.. Only the very best are surviving because the whole genotype is failing and being pressed into smaller numbers. The old man is being replaced by the new man: the metrosexual, highly educated male. This male does not need a manufacturing job. He does not need to pack heat. He does not need to be a manly man. He just needs to be responsible. He needs to be intelligent. He needs to be courteous. He needs to be modern. He is the future.

What's funny is that I see people wanting the very thing that's causing this. They point to their shining examples of manly men. But they fail to point out that many more manly men fail. Manly men, on the whole, have proven to be incapable of surviving in the modern world. People want to deny this because their internal expectations are at odds with what actually is happening. Since it's too much work and effort to change, people find it easier to avoid it altogether.

Google Cognitive Dissonance.

The manly man you remember is not all that he's cracked up to be. He can be a wife beater, a child beater, a drunk, an xenophobe, a rapist, and so on. History is filled with it. The man of history survived because you needed him. But the world is changing. A different kind of man is needed now. One that can survive in a more peaceful world. (In the past, men were more disposable because of war and harsh conditions. Evolution gave them heightened senses and fears - which incubate conflict in a peaceful world. It does exactly the opposite of its original intention: to protect from conflict.) One where intelligence is valued more than strength. One where he's not the patriarchal leader of all things. He is not the boss anymore in this world.

A manly man caught in this world is stuck between two realities. The inner one where he rules and the outer one where he doesn't. The battle inevitably leads to projection. He projects the inner conflict onto the outer world. This allows him to deny the existence of the original conflict. He blames a million millliion different things. The endless conflict he fights, whether it's on his computer or in the world, is the illusion he keeps in his mind to hide from his true self.

Don't be fooled. Every manly man on the battlefield dreams of owning the world and being the superior rather than the grunt. The slow pace up the ladder is not the goal. The top! It was always the top! He doesn't want freedom, by itself. He wants control. Freedom ensures that he has a chance at the top. He doesn't want to be your equal, he wants to be better than you.

Sorry to burst your bubble. But your bubble is dangerous, like the economic one.

PS: In case you're wondering: NO, I did not mean any of this. I wrote it with sarcasm in mind. It's aimed at the metrosexual computer game playing virgin losers that can't hold a job for their life.
edit on 8-10-2011 by jonnywhite because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:13 PM
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Originally posted by yourignoranceisbliss

The problem here is that there is no price on morality. Sure, it's a logical assessment that sex can = profit. But at what cost? Surely there is more to selling sex than just money, no?

That's how some Women are labeled sluts or whores, pardon my language. When the value of their integrity is lost in favor of profit via sexual favors. You might ask now "Why would a single Woman be de-valued as a person because she sells sex for profit?"

Character. Would you be interested in having any type of relationship, be it professional or personal, with someone of low character?

It's not "just sex". It's how a person is viewed as society as a whole.



Actually, that's a cultural thing, and a surface one at that. Things are what they are, even in this culture as it stands now. making value judgements contrary to what IS can lead to severe disappointment.

Why is it better to get all roped up with them, THEN find out how they work that bargaining chip?



edit on 2011/10/8 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:35 PM
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page 12

I'll stay home & do nothing



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:41 PM
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Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by yourignoranceisbliss

The problem here is that there is no price on morality. Sure, it's a logical assessment that sex can = profit. But at what cost? Surely there is more to selling sex than just money, no?

That's how some Women are labeled sluts or whores, pardon my language. When the value of their integrity is lost in favor of profit via sexual favors. You might ask now "Why would a single Woman be de-valued as a person because she sells sex for profit?"

Character. Would you be interested in having any type of relationship, be it professional or personal, with someone of low character?

It's not "just sex". It's how a person is viewed as society as a whole.



Actually, that's a cultural thing, and a surface one at that. Things are what they are, even in this culture as it stands now. making value judgements contrary to what IS can lead to severe disappointment.

Why is it better to get all roped up with them, THEN find out how they work that bargaining chip?



edit on 2011/10/8 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)


It may definitely be a cultural thing, but every society is ruled by its native culture, and a great many of the world's cultures hold contempt for Women who are unable to remain faithful or who suffer from questionable loyalties.

In China, it used to be normal for a Man to take his Wife out back and execute her if she was found to be unfaithful.

In Albania, the Groom was often presented with a bullet wrapped in straw, by the Brides own family, in case she was ever unfaithful or disobedient.

Muslim Men have been known to have their Wives stoned to death if found to be unfaithful.

I mean, if this isn't actually a very important part of EVERY culture in the world, I don't know what is.

Granted, I think the West is a tad more civilized in how Women are treated after becoming untrustworthy, but the problem persists nonetheless.

It's almost a joke here in the US now. Marriage is basically expected to end, and Women marry purely for the divorce settlements, and for the event itself. The divorce rate here is staggeringly high, compared to the rest of the world.

What does this tell you about the liberal movement for Women?

It tells me they are unable to adapt to it.

I'm definitely not against Women's Rights, but neither do I really see it to have had any beneficial effect on Western culture. Quite the opposite. Homosexuality is impossibly high. Straight men have all become cuckolded into a passive and even feminine role in many relationships. Popular media has made it trendy for Men to adopt the "Metrosexual" lifestyle. It's now OK for guys to get a pedicure and manicure.

Quite disturbing. I find absolutely nothing attractive about a Woman who is just a pair of balls short of being a Man.



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:42 PM
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reply to post by Partygirl
 


First of all, to even acknowledge this as an issue means you believe that men should uphold some sort of expectations because they have penises. Women have been complaining about the roles they have been expected to play in the past because of their genitalia as well. It's called sexism.

In this wonderland of the 50's that these people seem to come from, the wealthiest tax bracket were getting taxed at 90% which meant that even the lower class families could support themselves with one income. Today, the only way that seems achievable is by going to college for at least four years then having to pay a crippling loan for the next 20. Men are realizing this and also are realizing what women have been wanting us to see for years: they are just as capable as men.

You may also want to look at the divorce rate of those nuclear families. Of all my friends, we work, study, raise kids, drink, and geek out on video games and we are all well into our 30's. We've also all been happily married for years. For every gold digging heartless woman out there, there are two who are actually looking for true love.

So I'd say it's the women who are in trouble. At least the ones looking for a sugar daddy to cheat on.
edit on 8-10-2011 by Cuervo because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:53 PM
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Originally posted by Cuervo For every gold digging heartless woman out there, there are two who are actually looking for true love.


Definitely going to disagree with you there. Society has degenerated Female morality to practically nothing, in my experienced opinion. And yes, it's just an opinion.

I know Women in this thread think we're harping too much on Women morality, while ignoring Men's morality, but the topic here is Liberal Women, and if it's an experiment here in the West, I believe it to be a failed one.
edit on 8-10-2011 by yourignoranceisbliss because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 10:55 PM
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I live in a small village in Mexico and have had the opportunity to be with groups of young mothers and their small children. A couple of years ago I observed a big difference between the little boys and the little girls. The girls were bright eyed, curious and animated. In other words normal. The boys however seemed listless, dull, uninterested and well abnormal. The older boys now are wild, very bratty and a general pain in the ... you know. Why? My theory is the 32 vaccinations these children receive by age two is affecting boys differently than the girls. If its true that we are all being led into a slave state wouldnt they want the boys to be more maliable, easier to manipulate than the generally peaceful girls. Four times now I have been told by adult men who are working for the government cutting down the trees, spraying toxic gas to control mosquitos, etc that they had their orders. It made my skin crawl. The problems between men and women are far bigger than whats going on in the USA. It is everywhere. The men here are also uncaring about their families not like in the states but they never attend school functions, buy their wives gifts or treat the family like the center of their world, even though they in fact are the glue that holds it all together. I think that this is more than a social issue, I thinks its been chemically engineered and is gonna get worse. Just my two cents-



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 11:03 PM
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Originally posted by yourignoranceisbliss

Originally posted by Cuervo For every gold digging heartless woman out there, there are two who are actually looking for true love.


Definitely going to disagree with you there. Society has degenerated Female morality to practically nothing, in my experienced opinion. And yes, it's just an opinion.

I know Women in this thread think we're harping too much on Women morality, while ignoring Men's morality, but the topic here is Liberal Women, and if it's an experiment here in the West, I believe it to be a failed one.
edit on 8-10-2011 by yourignoranceisbliss because: (no reason given)


I thought the topic was the change in men (what I like to call our own mens liberal movement, hah!) in contemporary society. I was responding to the OP and haven't been following all the pages. I wasn't aware the thread started to become about men and women morality but I'm glad my post was still relevant!



posted on Oct, 8 2011 @ 11:16 PM
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Originally posted by nenothtu



Life is so simple for us knuckle-draggers, and the women who stay under our roofs!

ETA: I gave you a star for that response - you're only the second or third woman I've run across in a lifetime that was willing to admit that!




edit on 2011/10/8 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)


I'm happy to hear that your not just using women for sex, I know plenty of men who do. Although this day and age it would seem as though some women do that as well. What's good for the goose is good for the gander or something like it. Most of things in life are trade and yes there is love involved. I deeply care, love and respect my husband. We met in high school, dated and married shortly after. He is and always has been my best friend so to me that isn't so much love as it is respect, friendship and connection. However we still operate on trade in some respects. He has things I need and want as I have things he needs and wants, it works out and is mutually beneficial.

2 wives eh? Didn't learn the first time around?
I always tell my hubby that if anything ever happened to him, there is no way in hell I'd go through all the work of getting married again. To mesh two lives together, learn to live with each other and actually make it a workable life is too much damned work!

As for relationships ending I believe that in almost all cases the demise of a relationship is almost always a mutual failing from both sides. If my husband were to leave me tomorrow I'd take half of the blame. I too am low maintenance and easy upkeep. I'm not a shopper/spender, I am not a nagger, I do what needs to be done because I'm capable of doing it and I am very independent. So long as he never tries to control me or tell me how I ought to live my life to better suit him then it's all good! Besides, he knows he has a good thing here. I am a good cook (or so I have been told by just about everyone who eats my cooking), I am a full time mom, the house is kept clean (although I do this for my own need and it has nothing to do with him.. I'd keep it pristine even if I were single because I hate mess and clutter), kids are taken care of, school stuff is handled by me.. basically anything that happens in this house is my domain. Anything that happens with our business is his. I don't go tell him how to do his job or 'help' and he doesn't tell me how to do my job or 'help'. At the end of the day we both clock out and become mom and dad together as well as revert back to just being ourselves trying to relax for the evenings. This was something we agreed to before marriage and he full well knows that when the boys are grown and gone that I'm going back into the working world and plan on traveling.

I somehow don't peg you as a knuckle dragger, you seem fairly intelligent and not cave man like at all. LOL As for me, I could never tolerate a stupid man. I need someone who is at least at my level of intellect, not to say I'm some rocket scientist, but it wouldn't be a very complimentary match if I married someone less intelligent than myself. and.. not to be ADD, speaking of food (your sandwich comment got me to thinking).. hubby is quite the baker! I can't bake to save my life, if it can't be tinkered with and changed around it isn't worth my time. LOL Hubby on the other hand is the resident nerd.. (we own our own IT company if that gives you any indication of who he is). LOL He loves to bake, I suspect because it is very precise and requires the need to measure and has a higher need for accuracy than cooking does.! Made a killer banana bread tonight! Tomorrow night.. we celebrate Canadian Thanksgiving because his sister is in town with her Canadian boyfriend. I'll be doing the cooking for that! Hubby and I joke that he keeps me happy with the occasional pan of brownies and I keep him happy with all the cooking I do. It's a good thing I like to cook because I think I got the short end of that stick. LOL

As for admitting to it, I don't see why it needs to be made into something it isn't. Nothing wrong with healthy trade so long as everyone is ok with it.
edit on 8-10-2011 by MaMaa because: (no reason given)




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