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Lisa Irwin - Missing - One Year Later

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posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 12:48 PM
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reply to post by silo13
 


Seems like you've made up your mind on who is guilty Silo.. which is a shame..




This coming from the woman who would 'honestly' would rather see a baby dead - so you can 'rest easy'? Someone who's brought nothing but strife to this thread between your blatant attacks and off-topic post? And you're going to give a lesson to a new member on negativity?


When a new member goes on the introductions to say, that they see so much negativity on this site..and they are here to put out positive vibes.. then they post crap and negativity about Debbie..well..I have to call them out on their BS..

As far as me rather seeing the baby dead.. well..that is out of love..
If you truly understood what children have to be submitted to on a daily basis for many years..when they are used and exploited by the "sickos" in this world.. you might see it as compassion..

Anyone who would hope the baby is still alive..yet being sexually abused..and terrible mistreated for the profit of these sickos..well... I have to wonder where their compassion is.

You can dump on me all you want Silo.. and you can dump on Debbie as well...

I hope you would understand the families grief.. if that lil baby never shows up.. because that is a mental and emotional torture they will have to live with the rest of their living years.

I also hope you would be willing to take back so much of the harsh criticism, if it is proven she was innocent of having anything to do with the disappearance.




edit on 25-10-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)




posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 12:50 PM
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Instant Confusion.

Just add Lawyer...



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 12:53 PM
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I'm old, and the police of my childhood, are NOT who we have today. Lets be honest and acknowledge that the police lie, today. And sadly in my opinion most people don't really see that as an issue, but rather a given. Our country has become a country where the ends justify the means. Most people who have had dealings with law enforcement no longer expect them to be honest with us. Yet the police, in my opinion are given every benefit of doubt in a court of law.

From police who plant drugs on random people to make their quotas, police who rape, who exchange drugs for sex, one doesn't need to search hard to find bad cops! Justice is no longer just, and the rich can buy a level of so call justice that the poor never will get. Law enforcement has thrown away our respect, most Law Enforcement officers see the world through eyes that see a them, and a Us.

When told the government will spend millions of dollars to convict you, and once convicted send you jail for the rest of your life unless you agree to spending two years in jail, how many would be foolish enough to take the rest of their life in a hellhole? By blackmailing enough people one can start to effect stats. Prove what one believes



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 12:58 PM
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reply to post by Dav1d
 



Yes..sadly you are correct.. and sadly there are law enforcement people who protect the scum of the earth..

and could even indeed be a part of the scum.

I would like to think that there are more who actually care.. I'm hoping there are.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 01:08 PM
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Quote from Silo


Someone who's brought nothing but strife to this thread between your blatant attacks and off-topic post? And you're going to give a lesson to a new member on negativity?


I see you have edited a few things from your post..but I would still like to address what you originally posted..

My purpose on this thread..was to STOP negative attacks..not based on anything but MSM garbage.

I guess I would not be considered negative, and off topic if I wholeheartedly jumped on the band wagon of ripping this woman apart , like some of you have?

What you call blatant attacks , was merely trying to stop blatant attacks..






edit on 25-10-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 01:31 PM
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Gabby2011- I noticed you call the mother Debbie. Do you know her? All the writings and articles I have read she is called Deborah.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 01:46 PM
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Originally posted by AuntB
Gabby2011- I noticed you call the mother Debbie. Do you know her? All the writings and articles I have read she is called Deborah.


I call her Debbie because I have seen her addressed this way on this thread.

I suppose now I will be 'accused" of knowing her..from the keyboard cops..


Why don't you read the posts.. there are a few who have referred to her as "Debbie"..

(your post is a small example of the accusations and assumptions made over very frivolous things)
edit on 25-10-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 01:46 PM
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reply to post by gabby2011
 


My purpose on this thread..was to STOP negative attacks..not based on anything but MSM garbage.


What part of reality do you just not get?

This woman admitted in her own words to getting drunk to the point of ‘blacking out’ and not just once, repeatedly! HER WORDS. Not, the Media.

Lisa's mother's own words. She had her ‘adult time’ leaving those babies (one who isn't even her own) in danger. Her ‘adult time’ was soooooo much more important than those three little lives under her care she didn't and doesn't bother for her husband to get home - she just goes right on a bender without bothering to provide those children with a clean sober mature adult to watch over them while she's inebriated!

Her blatant endangerment of those children - along with her incessant lies? That’s what I take issue with. As any sane minded adult should do. And no, I don’t want to hear ’but everyone else does it’. I don't care if the whole nation does it - that does not make it right.

Lisa’s Mother’s actions were reprehensible. Absolutely reprehensible and anyone who would condone or try to make excuses for her actions has a screw loose. You don’t like it? Tough. I wouldn’t expect someone who would rather a child is ‘dead’ by their own words to understand.


As far as me rather seeing the baby dead.. well..that is out of love..


Love? LOVE? Not the love I know. And honestly? I refuse to continue to debate with someone who’s manner of thinking I find appalling.

To rather a child was dead? Then call it Love? I can’t even fathom that kind of...thinking.


Anyone who would hope the baby is still alive..yet being sexually abused..and terrible mistreated for the profit of these sickos..well... I have to wonder where their compassion is.


And I wonder at the ‘compassion’ of someone who’d rather a child was dead.

I know what I speak of. No matter how horrible life can be? Children are given coping mechanisms and they get through. It‘s hell, but they do get through and they can go on to live happy normal lives. But you? You'd rather see them dead so you could ‘rest easy’... That is beyond my comprehension.


You can dump on me all you want Silo.. and you can dump on Debbie as well...


I don’t ‘dump’ on anyone. I give my opinion and I will never ‘take back’ my opinion nor will I condone a mother like Lisa’s who has her ‘adult time’ while putting her and other women’s children's in danger. Period.


I hope you would understand the families grief.. if that lil baby never shows up.. because that is a mental and emotional torture they will have to live with the rest of their living years.


This is the real world. Parents feel grief for their children every day. We feel grief over Lisa. So does her family. Parents feel grief when their children are hurt, maimed, lost, die. It’s called LIFE! But for a parent, for anyone to rather a child be dead - like a pet you’d have put down?

Enough said. I’ll no longer debate with someone who's (in my opinion) who’s reasoning is far too handicapped by some twisted sense of ‘love’ for me to continue to try and reason with.

Peace to you... I’m done here...

edit on 25-10-2011 by silo13 because: bbc and spelling



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 01:57 PM
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reply to post by silo13
 





To rather a child was dead? Then call it Love? Then call it love? I can’t even fathom that kind of...thinking.


I cannot fathom anyone who thinks that a child would be better off alive, and living through horrible abuse.. who ever calls that love..has serious issues.




What part of reality do you just not get? This woman admitted in her own words to getting drunk to the point of ‘blacking out’ and not just once, repeatedly! HER WORDS. Not, the Media.


Yes...she did.. Does this make her guilty of wanting to harm her child?.. What don't you get about that reality?

OMG..the woman got drunk..so she obviously totally unfit to be a parent,and most likely has something to do with her disappearance? What kind of case based on reality is that?




Peace to you... I’m done here...


I can only wish

You seem to have branded this woman as totally evil.... because she has an alcohol problem..


You have branded me evil..because I would rather not see a child go through a life of hell in the grips of a dark and ugly underground world...

You try and come off as some loving guru with baby Lisa's best interests at stake..but you really come off as a self righteous accuser.... pretending you care.
edit on 25-10-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:16 PM
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Beware - you might be tempted to 'face palm' after this one.

Lisa Irwin case: Parents grieving, defense attorneys work overtime


It appears in addition to not being able to just tell the same story twice about the most critical night in their missing baby’s life, they can’t even get their story straight on why they won’t talk to local media, which should be (right behind the KCPD) their second best chance for finding their baby! According to their attorney, Cyndy Short, their reason for not speaking to local media yesterday was:

because they’re afraid of the attention the missing baby case has brought to their family.


Did you FP? I did!


When your 10-month-old baby is missing the ONLY thing you want is attention to your baby’s case. That’s it. You WANT EVERYONE TO KNOW. And did you think going on every national morning program, Judge Jeanine’s program, and the cover of People were NOT going to bring attention to YOU (not so much Lisa, but lots to you! )


So, that's the new 'spin' and the new excuse, I mean 'reason' for Bradley and Irwin not talking to local press.

peace



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:23 PM
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Baby's Parents Concerned Nat'l Spotlight On Them

The parents of missing 11-month-old Lisa Irwin say they are concerned for their other children as national attention to the search continues to grow.

Short said the couple is trying their best to keep life as normal as possible for the boys as the search for their missing 11-month-old sister continues.


Good thing that.


“We had a talk just yesterday about her wanting to provide the kids a Catholic education, and how important that would be to her,” Short said.


Does the family have any past history of attending a church - or have they just found ‘religion’???


Short also said the couple has one fear: that the spotlight and attention is focused on them.


*bangs head on table*

peace



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:24 PM
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Afraid of the attention it has brougth t he family? The only way the baby may be found EVER is by bringing attention to her and her family. I think they mean more that its the negative attention brougth to the family. Despite what some people say the negative attention started basically after MOM made ridiculous comments. I don't recall so much negative attention before the 'drunk/blackout/wine' interview. So the media hasn't brought neg. attention to the family. Mom's own words have.

I'm one who believes in fate/ karma to a point. I think if a child is returned home after enduring some horrific abuse and they are alive and able to move forward then there is a reason for that. So to make a blanket statement that children who endure abuse would be better off dead is... zany.
I have a family member right now who suffered abuse as a child. She recently became a first time mother. I'll ask her if she'd be happier if she had died.

She has brought love and joy to all of our lives all of HER life, pre, during and post abuse. She's a wonderful and sensitive and forgiving and compassionate woman. How dare anyone presume she'd be better off dead.
HOW DARE...................... ANYONE presume that !
edit on 25-10-2011 by schmae because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:29 PM
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Originally posted by silo13
Beware - you might be tempted to 'face palm' after this one.

Lisa Irwin case: Parents grieving, defense attorneys work overtime


It appears in addition to not being able to just tell the same story twice about the most critical night in their missing baby’s life, they can’t even get their story straight on why they won’t talk to local media, which should be (right behind the KCPD) their second best chance for finding their baby! According to their attorney, Cyndy Short, their reason for not speaking to local media yesterday was:

because they’re afraid of the attention the missing baby case has brought to their family.


Did you FP? I did!


When your 10-month-old baby is missing the ONLY thing you want is attention to your baby’s case. That’s it. You WANT EVERYONE TO KNOW. And did you think going on every national morning program, Judge Jeanine’s program, and the cover of People were NOT going to bring attention to YOU (not so much Lisa, but lots to you! )


So, that's the new 'spin' and the new excuse, I mean 'reason' for Bradley and Irwin not talking to local press.

peace



Just a wild guess on my part, but they Irwin and Bradley are becoming the story, rather than baby Lisa? Thanks to the media circus of last week, the focus is no longer on Lisa, what with all the CSI spectacle/media show?



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:31 PM
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reply to post by schmae
 





She has brought love and joy to all of our lives all of HER life, pre, during and post abuse. She's a wonderful and sensitive and forgiving and compassionate woman. How dare anyone presume she'd be better off dead. HOW DARE...................... ANYONE presume that !


There are different types of abuse... and there are many who have endured abuse to the point where they have taken their own lives...

I guess they thought they would be better off dead.. and maybe they have the right to feel that..

How DARE you presume they are wrong to feel that way.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:35 PM
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reply to post by gabby2011
 


I made no presumption about anyone's suicide. You're now presuming that every single child kidnapped would suffer abuse so bad that they want to take their own life. Rather than admit you might have overspoken a tad, you're trying to rationalize . Yes there are various types of abuse. If a 3 yr old can be sexually abused for years and still want to live and be content with her life, then so can MANY NOT ALL BUT MANY abuse victims.
You've assumed that if Lisa were taken by a kidnapper the abuse would be the most horrific ever that a child could endure and there are all sorts of other things that might happen. By your reasoning, I'm not sure why you arent' CHEERLEADING that her mom did kill her so at least she's not being abused. You're confusing and erratic.
Gabby , you're too defiant and difficult to talk to. I cannot anymore.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:37 PM
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Hmm is ALL LIFE precious? Or is it just certain life, lived in certain ways? Life experienced in certain approved ways?



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:44 PM
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Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by redhorse
 

When I posted in red about Lisa's mother 'knowing the truth' - I was referring to the many times she's changed her story and the lies she's been caught in between one interview and the next. If my wording led you to believe I'm accusing Lisa's mother of 'knowing the full truth' that is not what I meant at all in this instance.


Fair enough, but please consider context and tone, and considering your overwhelmingly accusatory stance on this I still fail to see how your words can be taken any other way. There may be a miscommunication here however.


Originally posted by silo13
Actually the 'compassion for mom' was not directed at you at all. Again, my miscommunication possibly?


Maybe, or more likely my own biased interpretation; but I'll own it regardless. If this woman didn't have anything to do with what happened to this child then I do feel sorry for her... alot. However, all of that is very much an unknown.


Originally posted by silo13
Beyond that if you're implying I'm on a power trip come right out and say it.


I did say it. Imply my foot; but I will be clearer: You Are On A Power Trip. You and everyone else spouting this lunacy. Although, in all fairness "Power Trip" is an gross-over simplification for this dynamic, however it is the most encompassing and easily defined characteristic. To get into the rest of it would likely bore pretty much everyone to tears.


Originally posted by silo13
But I'd like to know what that has to do with Lisa?


It has alot more to do with Lisa than all of the arm-chair "detective" work going on that always comes around to demonizing this woman. How does that help this baby? It doesn't. Not one bit. In fact, I would counter the sort of rampant speculation that characterizes this thread contributes to the sort of mob-hysteria that will bias and further convolute a measured logical search, investigation, or trial. Just one more black ball in the bucket to be sure, and may seem harmless to all of you indulging in this, but it's not.


Originally posted by silo13
Isn't that mud slinging of a sort


Yes. No arguments from the peanut gallery here. I'm saying bad things about people. By the social definition that is slinging mud. I'll accept that.


Originally posted by silo13
- just like you accuse others of doing?


No.

1. All of you are here to defend yourselves, or sling mud back, or... whatever... Now, to many of you this probably doesn't mean much, but by the way that I was raised attacking someone who is not there to defend themselves is dishonest, cowardly, and dishonorable.


Originally posted by silo13
Anyway, you've no idea the time and effort and personal sacrifice - and cost I've put into this thread. And for what? Because I finish what I start, no more, no less.
peace


Actually, I think you are wrong there. I have a fair to good idea how much effort you've put into this. It is admirable, darn use full, and for the information (believe it or not) I am grateful, and impressed frankly. However, the accusatory slant that you present the information with is inflammatory, unnecessary, and (In My Opinion) utterly socially, and morally irresponsible, and I would go so far as to categorize it as reprehensible.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:49 PM
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Gabby, I asked if you knew Deborah cause you called her Debbie and kept saying she was an alcoholic. I asked to know, not to be catty. Do I think the mother is an alcoholic? I don't know, all I know is Deborah likes her adult time. That is what I know, those were her words.

Now regarding this debate rather dead then abused, I don't really care for it. The only abuse I see regarding this case, is baby Lisa was probably neglected while Mommy was having adult time. If Lisa had been sexually abused, when they get her back, she will be thoroughly examined and it will be known then. If she was, healing time etc... will factor and she may not go home.



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:50 PM
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reply to post by schmae
 





I made no presumption about anyone's suicide. You're now presuming that every single child kidnapped would suffer abuse so bad that they want to take their own life.


I'm not presuming that at all.. if you have ever read what Cathy Ob'rian had to endure in her childhood, as well as her siblings..you might understand why an 11 year old would choose to hang himself.(not sure if that was the exact age he did that)




might have overspoken a tad, you're trying to rationalize . Yes there are various types of abuse. If a 3 yr old can be sexually abused for years and still want to live and be content with her life, then so can MANY NOT ALL BUT MANY abuse victims.



You have a penchant for taking my words out of context..but I will explain ..and no..it isn't rationalization.. its an explanation of what I meant by that post.

A child who goes through mental, physical and emotional abuse.. and enters adulthood in that way..will no doubt be tainted in a very bad way.

If I was a parent of a missing child..after so many years.. it would bring me relief to know my child is dead, and is not suffering any longer.

I would really be interested in hearing what parents of missing children that have been missing for decades would have to say about this.




You've assumed that if Lisa were taken by a kidnapper the abuse would be the most horrific ever that a child could endure and there are all sorts of other things that might happen. By your reasoning, I'm not sure why you arent' CHEERLEADING that her mom did kill her so at least she's not being abused. You're confusing and erratic. Gabby , you're too defiant and difficult to talk to. I cannot anymore.


I remember reading an article a few years back about an international police force trying to stop the dark underground world of child sex trade, as well as child exploitation. This grown man was also on TV , and broke down in tears describing some of the things they had to watch catching these criminals. Gang bang rape of an 8 month old child is not pretty.... putting them in cages and making them eat feces..is not pretty.. and it doesn't stop there.

I'm not saying that ALL abduction cases result in this "behavior"..but many of them definitely 'train wreck" the psychi of a child.

I may be confusing and erratic to you.. but I know understand why I feel this way.. and if you can't at least see my point to an extent.. then I find you confusing as well.

Where ever baby Lisa is now..I pray that she is not suffering..



posted on Oct, 25 2011 @ 02:52 PM
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reply to post by redhorse
 


Most of the 'attacks' come in the form of new headline, mom said this or that,,, and we comment on it, USUALLY the comments are like what is she thinking? does this mean anything? etc etc..... I don't know about
attacks . Maybe I don't see an attack in the same way. I don't say anyone really saying lock her up and throw away the key or EVEN take her other kid from her , shes' a horrible mom. I havent' seen that kind of attack. It's fair to speculate about what happened. That's what the thread is for ,, either someoen took her or her parents know something. There are no other options. We've spent plenty of time speculating on the people walking with baby and the neighbor's possible involvement. If you're only reading the posts regardign mom's involvement, that's fair enough , because there are MORE of those posts. But we're also discussing other things.

What do you make of the inconsistencies and things that do not add up? You think they are nothing and mean nothing? If so that's fair and that's your opinion . I for ONE hope you are right and that mom is innocent because then baby Lisa is out there. I for one hope Lisa is found ALIVE no matter what she's been through.



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