Lisa Irwin - Missing - One Year Later

reply to post by whyamIhere


''No we don't....Why automatically assume they have. ''
I dont' automatically assume they have. You said she has 2 other kids, why wait until this one to decide to kill one....... So I'm just pointing out we have no clue if the other kids have ever been abused or not. It's a fair question with the issue is whether or not mom did something to the baby. Maybe she wasn't drinking as much when her older son was an infant?

reply to post by silo13


sex offenders don't usually target infants. The area is a lower middle class area; it is a lower crime area. I live near this area and it is pretty safe for being in Kansas City. this is not the ghetto or the north east area at all. Kansas City North is pretty safe so it is rare for something like this to happen. It is not a high crime area but a fairly good area; family area. Sure they are better areas but there aren't drive by shootings or murders etc.

reply to post by dreamseeker


I'd agree an infant is an unlikely target for a pedophile. And when someone wants a baby really bad because they cannot concieve or what not, they generally want a days old tiny infant. It's unlikely an outsider of any kind took the baby. of course it is still possible, but I'd have to say unlikely. If someone did steal her to make her their own baby, someone they know would have turned them in by now. Some friend or family member would realize OMG that's the baby from tv and our family member's story seems all askew , etc . and turn them in. So I would say the window for any stranger being involved in this is closing rapidly ....

You know I'm really being in to wonder at my sincerity in complimenting you on your intelligence. You yourself now are falling into the 'presumption trap'. See how easy it is? You should know better than that.

If you were this woman...with these facts...you would be scared to death.

You don't know that. You don't even have a clue. So DO NOT presume.

Until you have had media trucks waiting for you every where you go.

How do you know I've not? You don't! Fact is I have been 'hounded but it was not a death of a child. Enough said.

You really don't know how you would respond.

BS I don't. I know exactly how I would respond and one thing I would NOT do - is lie - or withhold evidence - especially when the truth might save a life or find a killer.

peace

edit on 23-10-2011 by silo13 because: bbc

I have had media trucks waiting for me also....It's terrifying especially if you are innocent

How do we know she lied.............The Media?............enter Richard Jewell

Look OP, I know where you are coming from. It does not look good.

But until the cops tell us the child is dead...Shouldn't we keep looking for the baby?

It's still possible the little girl was stolen.

PS...Remember Jaycee Dugaurd (spelling?) she was missing for years.

Her parents were horribly treated by almost everyone. They had to move.

Her poor father was talked about everywhere he went.

I would do it different than these parents are too.

But that does not make them guilty. We have rights for a reason.

I am not willing to trample this family's rights because the media says so.

I love your thread. I not defending this woman. Only her rights.

You can question my intelligence if you want. Just don't deny me my rights.

reply to post by schmae

reply to post by dreamseeker


Thank you both for your input on that. I've read such horrible reports lately - but - I have to agree with you two - and hope and pray we're all right!

I'd lean towards an abduction from someone who saw pics of her on the internet and wanted that baby. Wasn't it just last week a woman cut a baby out of a pregnant woman? Some people get so desperate they just loose it.

At least if it's an abduction - the abductor someone that really wanted a baby - Lisa is safe and loved - in a strange kind of way.

peace

Hey Si,

Your thread got me to pay attention to this case. So flagged.
Little more of your own text and I would have starred you as well Darlin.

I'm seeing this mothers innocence and the fathers, is unmistakable really. I see Moms drinking and meds, more as a source for both reason and vulnerability from an outsider. As opposed to guilt by way of an accident, or
neg. behavior on Moms part, towards lil Lisa. There are obviously no medical records of abuse, or they would be getting blow horned by the MSM.

I believe Mom is a vulnerable enough type of person, who in her normal state, is hardly aware of the world that is
going on around her. I'm going to short this response in lieu of your reply, to say I believe this child is alive.
Tho she may not be safe. And also that this case, will never be solved unless Interpol is brought in yesterday.

No vision or dreams involved here. Just how I'm reading everything, including the state of the world economy, into the big picture, of what I see going on here.

I love threads like this with a heavy heart over why they get posted.

But I believe she is already out of country and reached a destination, maybe 3 to 4 days after she vanished.
She was most likely taken by someone very close to where she lives. The person who took her, was able to justify it in thier mind, while at the same time, go unnoticed in thier observations. This kind of thing will definetly
be on the rise, as the economy is trashed thru out our world. Giving rise to a much larger market for the vatican and the elite banksters, rich barren couples and even those who practice the satanic arts, of gaining power.

There is a gigantic market, for little ones of this exact profile. That I believe law enforcement is intentionally kept from the knowledge of. Their isn't even any training to look at this gigantic market, as being suspect. Here again we have a bright, shinning, gleaming like the sun, everyday example, of the absolute dull ignorance, that is rampant not only in law enforcement. But thru out every civilized aspect of society on the planet. A bad economy,
is a friend to the rich and powerful.

reply to post by whyamIhere

I have had media trucks waiting for me also....It's terrifying especially if you are innocent

Tough that isn't it. My belated sympathy and empathy.

How do we know she lied.........

Again we went over this before. Lying or 'lying by omission.

But until the cops tell us the child is dead...Shouldn't we keep looking for the baby?

Believe it or not that's what I'm trying to do by working day in and day out listing info and facts or purported facts. Maybe, just maybe someone will read something that... Well you get the idea. Don't forget, if the posters on this thread are to be believed we have one that was right next door the night of the disappearance and others who live in the same area.

It's still possible the little girl was stolen.

I've never dismissed this possibility.

I would do it different than these parents are too.

But that does not make them guilty. We have rights for a reason.

Point taken. Point agreed with.

I am not willing to trample this family's rights because the media says so.

No joke huh.

You can question my intelligence if you want. Just don't deny me my rights.

Dang if I haven't been quoted to say the same a time or three myself, lol.

I am extremely interested in the point you brought up about that medication though.. I wonder - for real - once the label is printed and the prescription bottle is in hand - what happened to those Doc-Patient rights?

Interesting question that.

Thanks again for your input. Believe it or not I'm a constitutionalists.

peace

Originally posted by schmae
reply to post by whyamIhere

 

''No we don't....Why automatically assume they have. ''
I dont' automatically assume they have. You said she has 2 other kids, why wait until this one to decide to kill one....... So I'm just pointing out we have no clue if the other kids have ever been abused or not. It's a fair question with the issue is whether or not mom did something to the baby. Maybe she wasn't drinking as much when her older son was an infant?

It's a fair question for the authorities. Not the media.

Earlier it was mentioned what was on her computer.

How long would it take for a good lawyer to deem anyone on ATS a complete lunatic?

I submit to you if your computer was seized people might have a few questions.

I am sorry....I have a complete distrust of the media's investigative skills.

If this woman hurt that baby. She will not outsmart the FBI.

ADD....I think those new forms you sign at the Doctors office allows Cops to see the records.

Yes, a few more rights slowly eroding...

reply to post by randyvs

There is a gigantic market, for little ones of this exact profile. That I believe law enforcement is intentionally kept from the knowledge of. Their isn't even any training to look at this gigantic market, as being suspect. Here again we have a bright, shinning, gleaming like the sun, everyday example, of the absolute dull ignorance, that is rampant not only in law enforcement. But thru out every civilised aspect of society on the planet. A bad economy,
is a friend to the rich and powerful.

You know you bring up something I was sure of about ten years back maybe more... There was a local mob boss here who's little boy needed a transplant - I forgot which organ. A child in the UK was killed, I'm vague on the details but it was VERY suspicious. This child was an exact match, age, etc to the child here needing the transplant. I remember at the time thinking 'Well would you just look at that coincidence'.

There was never any proof, but, you see where I'm going with this.

Baby Lisa is unique. I think we can call agree on that. It's something about her eyes. Something that grabs you. If we are 'grabbed' if our 'attention' is caught up - I can't imagine the other people who troll FB for so many nefarious reasons would not be 'caught' by little Lisa too.

And you're right. There is enough info on FB alone to put the parents in the 'pigeon hole' of lower middle class not too intelligent family problems conflicts etc - like you listed.

At least I'm in hopes if you're right - and I have no reason to doubt that you are not - Lisa is somewhere loved and cared for.

I'd like to be able to make myself believe that before going to bed at night.

Thanks you...

peace

reply to post by whyamIhere

Earlier it was mentioned what was on her computer.

We don't know what really, but we do know just from going to FB there are a LOT of pictures of Lisa and Deb's brother uncle and a few others are there, grandparents, pics, etc.

If this woman hurt that baby. She will not outsmart the FBI.

Tough to agree with you when this case is ridding on the coat tails of the Casey Anthony ruling. But I do see your point.

peace

reply to post by whyamIhere

Her parents were horribly treated by almost everyone. They had to move. Her poor father was talked about everywhere he went. I would do it different than these parents are too.

Reading this about jaycee dugards parents..just made me want to cry.

Its bad enough to have your child disappear ...but to have the whole world think you are a monster, and guilty, and have to move your family is just heartbreaking.

Jaycee's siblings must have gone through much trial and tribulation... and when they needed support the most from outsiders..what did they get? mostly condemnation..and accusations against their parents.

Makes me wonder how little baby Lisa would want her family treated..if she indeed is passed away..and with the angels...

I feel so bad for her brothers.

reply to post by whyamIhere


''How long would it take for a good lawyer to deem anyone on ATS a complete lunatic? ''

I have to LOL at this. Yes I'm sure all of us who frequent ATS would be getting a label of something.......
maybe we like it, maybe we don't. But actually this particular thread is more factual and less
speculative than some on here. It's light on conspiracies as far as taht goes.

Originally posted by silo13
reply to post by whyamIhere

 

Earlier it was mentioned what was on her computer.

We don't know what really, but we do know just from going to FB there are a LOT of pictures of Lisa and Deb's brother uncle and a few others are there, grandparents, pics, etc.

If this woman hurt that baby. She will not outsmart the FBI.

Tough to agree with you when this case is ridding on the coat tails of the Casey Anthony ruling. But I do see your point.

peace

Keep up the great work...

I mean nothing personal to anyone on this thread.

As bad as the timing is....This is no Casey Anthony case.

But I see your point as well.

reply to post by silo13


You went to exactly the right place with my shortened, there by slightly vague response. Star !

She may very well be far better off. We just don't get to know.

Rest easy Si, I think she's ok.

Just a note on the issue of the basement. Down steps on floor plan for a one story home is not necessarily indicative of a basement. My house is one story and the floor plan would show four separate downs. I do not have a basement. I do, however, have a raised hall through the main living area. You step down to the back hall, down to the living room , down to the dining room and down to the front entry.

The icon used for down on floor plans is not a statement of the number of steps down. It is a standard symbol for any type of down. It is very reasonable that the computer room could be lower than the rest of the house. There was a time that "sunken living rooms" were all the rage. The plan would show down to indicate that the room was "sunken". The computer room could have originally been a "sunken" den or living room.

If a home had a basement, the layout of the basement should be shown on the floor plan. Look at the plans for two story homes and you will see how off to one side they show the floor plan for the second floor.

reply to post by TXTriker

Great input. I just can't find any info on that 'basement' and even with the public only getting part of the story it's hard to believe we wouldn't have at least heard of it in passing remarks???

Thank you.

reply to post by silo13


You're welcome. I don't post much because most of the time someone has already provided whatever info I might have to share and don't really see any point in it being repeated.

I will jump in if I have something and no one else mentions it.

reply to post by randyvs

Rest easy Si, I think she's ok.

OMG !!! ..rest easy? she is ok? wtf?

Who ever can think that someone who would go to great lengths to STEAL a child..would be a better parent than the "alcoholics" who have brought her into this world.. are twisted.

Local attorney: 'We might not get the happy ending that we want.'

"When you are in crisis and one of the things that is withheld from you is information, it is devastating," said Short. "They are on a roller coaster. They are doing the best they can and holding out hope. They love this little girl. They really did. And she was a precious little girl. So they are just hanging on doing the best they can. And people are surrounding them and supporting them."

My god. This is the families layer? Talking about Lisa in the PAST TENSE?

You've got to be kidding me...

That's it for me tonight. I'm dead tired. I've been at this all day and been up since 0400. It's almost 2200 now.

See you tomorrow.

Peace all.

reply to post by gabby2011

Who ever can think that someone who would go to great lengths to STEAL a child..would be a better parent than the "alcoholics" who have brought her into this world.. are twisted.

It's better than Lisa being dead.

Or are you going to gripe about that too?

peace