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Lisa Irwin - Missing - One Year Later

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posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:00 AM
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I think it may be time to figure out which one of thse networks, HLN or FOX ( since they are the 2 main ones reproting this now) is the most dishonest and twisty. When the DA's office made a statement saying it would be years to solve this case, then came out a week later to say that reporter had completely taken out of context what was said , it makes me think the media is possibly more to blame for the confusion than either KCPD or Irwins. WHat did that DA actually say ? Does anyone know ? I'm imagining soemthing along the lines of ' some times a case like this takes years to solve but this one will not'' and the reporter " SNIPPED FOR SPACE" the last part of it ?




posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:06 AM
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reply to post by Dav1d
 





If you accept this, that he did what the police failed to do.... Which I accept. The next logical questions are why did they fail, and have they failed to do other things as well? It appears that the man identified had a close working relationship with detectives. Do we ignore that? Do we pretend it doesn't matter? If we assume for a minute that such a relationship exist can it suggest a reason for why the police might have failed to pursue a certain lead? At best that is an assumption it doesn't mean it's true, but it may give us a potential reason.


I wasn't aware he had a close relationship with the police? If that is in fact true.. I smell rotten fish.. ugh..

IF ..and ..that is IF that information is true.. at this point ..I am leery to believe too much.. and hopefully the facts will come out at some point.

If baby Lisa is alive, and her whereabouts are being covered up by even one police officer .. that is an outrage to our justice system.. as well as a very sad outcome for baby Lisa


I would love to be a fly on the wall listening to officers within that force who are fair and honest and looking for justice, as they talk amongst themselves after work...just to hear what their honest hunches and knowledge of the facts tell them.
Edit:
I think I may have made a mistake as to who Mike identified as the man.. was it the husband of the Samantha next door?






edit on 18-11-2011 by gabby2011 because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:10 AM
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reply to post by schmae
 


This article may have already been posted here, but it's the second time I've read that the remark was taken OUT OF CONTEXT:


CNN recently reported that White's spokesman said it would be "years" before there are answers about Lisa's disappearance.

"There's no case," CNN quoted spokesman Jim Roberts as saying. "If it gets solved, it'll get solved years from now."

White said it was an offhand remark taken out of context by the reporter.

"That was a mischaracterization of what Mr. Roberts said," White said. "It was an offhanded comment he probably regrets at this time and wishes he hadn't made."

White said "no comment" when asked specific questions about the investigation and whether he believes an arrest will be made in connection with Lisa's disappearance.

www.kctv5.com...

In my view, the police are keeping quiet about much. And that is to their credit. As Xcathedra has pointed out, they must go slowly, and they have no interest in giving the media any information. Why should they? Just to satisfy some reporter's ego?

They clearly have not just "dropped" this case. And the statement "Dane" made regarding having called THEM first, and taken THEIR advice (the police) to not speak to media, is also of note. Particularly, Dane does not appear to have been "offered" a high-profile criminal defense attorney. From all indications (which are few and not to be taken as 'truth', but nevertheless noteworthy), he didn't feel it was necessary to have an attorney 'tell him' whether to talk to police or not.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:10 AM
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Originally posted by schmae
I have a random question for everyone, just sort of a poll please.... who believese that a call, ANY CALL, was made to Megan's phone from an irwin/bradley phone at any point that evening?


Something to consider - A cell phone that has restricted service due to non payment prevents calls from going out. However, some cell companies still allow unrestrcited access to incomcing calls.

If law enforcement is looking for an outgoing call on a phone and dont see any it doesnt mean a call / conversation didnt take place. Its easy to clear out your cell phone call / text logs, and most cell phone providers (will vary from company to company) have internal policies on how long they store information. As an example some of the larger but non main stream companies (boost / etc etc) will keep text messaging logs for only 7 days.

Reason being is the non nationwide cell phone carriers contract to use the infrastructure of the larger companies in some areas.

Some trivia for those following this thread -
If your home phone service and your cell phone service are shut off, you can still make 911 calls. I have advised people who were having domesic issues that all they need to do is go buy a cheap 10 dollar phone and put it in a room they feel safe with. That way if the cell service doe not work, or if the phone is broke / lost / sabotaged by the other half of the domestic issue, they an still use the corded phone for 911.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:13 AM
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reply to post by gabby2011
 


I think it is James Brando and not Jersey. I THINK, not sure. But Gil Abeyto put james brandos pic in with the others and the mtotorcycle driving witness to man with baby walking, picked out Brando. Brandos' wife Samanth is the neighbor deb was drinking with. It is also the house that Jeremy says he ran to at 4 am to see if Lisa ws there. It is ALSO, lest we forget, the house that police searched and removed a lot of bags of things from and implored the media to NOT take pics of anything removed from the house. Remember that day? We thought how odd? So Brandos' PLURAL are definitely i n the thick of it. Doesn't mean they are guilty of anything but they definitely have been looked at , talked to etc. Oh and Brando pt on his FB that he was an electronic surveillance specialist for SPRINT, and I think this is where David thinks he' s wroking closely with police. Because under a definitiiton of electronic surveillance for sprint, it lists aiding law enforement , etc.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:15 AM
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Dang....I hit the back button by accident and lost my whole post :/

My first "run in" with him I guess is when he posted a blog interviewing a roommate of MW's. In that blog which many people on the internet have a screenshot of (I will post screenshot) the roommate is saying "dane was huddling in corner" He then quickly (not quick enough) pulled that blog down and went on several FB sites saying he had to confirm the information first. AFTER posting for the public to see you go and confirm it? In his own words he said "this might be a vengeance thing"

Here is the FB status he put up about that blog going up the next day
Facebook status

Ron Rugen KansascityPiposted toJustice for Lisa Irwin Tomorrow on my blog, I'll discuss a followup interview I had today with a former roommate of Megan Wright (the Baby Lisa cell phone lady). The roommate saw Dane use Megan's cell numerous times through the night. When this person got out of bed after midnight, they saw Dane in panic-mode, huddled in the dark, in a corner of the house on the cell phone. It will be at Kansascitypi.blogspot.com...


He posted that blog and then took it down and posted this on his FB page:

Ron Rugen KansascityPi Upon consideration of the information I have, I decided not to print the blog and give it to authorities instead. Realistically, upon consideration, it's not responsible for me to print this when my source wont go on the record it makes it seem like gossip.


Ron Rugen KansascityPi No no no...dont speculate or start a rumor. What I said above is honest and factual. I want to be responsible and don't want to not hand information over to authorities thus hindering their investigation.


Ron Rugen KansascityPi I just can't confirm whether my source's alleged eyewitness account is factual and as a former journalist, I need to in my mind. With all due respect, they could have an axe to grind with the players involved. Or it could be it's true and just doesn't want to have the media spotlight and wants privacy. Without knowing, I can't move forward with the information not knowing if it's gossip.


Unfortunately many people saw and screenshot that first article. I would think a PI would know better than to post up that info. He could have just put a roadblock on an investigation or tainted another possible witness. I have looked all over but there was a FB page where he posted that he thought the information might be "vengeance" against Dane so he didn't want to post it. I will try to find that.

Some more Ron Rugens links below

His facebook page....starts posting on oct 12 re: baby lisa. He states

"I don't want the case since I do civil work and don't specialize in criminal cases. But under Missouri's mandatory PI whistleblower law, if we suspect unlicensed activity taking place, we are required under the law to report it."

That is in regards to Bill Stanton not being a licensed PI in MO. After stating he doesn't want the case (wasn't asked to take the case actually) and admitting he doesn't specialize in these cases...he insinuated himself into the case by tracking down people involved, interviewing them, and then putting them on FOX news.

Ron Rugen PI facebook

Ron's blog below...a few different interviews with Megan and a roommate:
Ron's blog


He went on air live yesterday with megyn kelly and said Megan had only had the phone for 1 months prior to Lisa disappearing. He said he got that information from a roommate...that he had emailed Megan but she hadn't responded back. So instead of waiting for confirmation from the actual owner he went live on air and said that...but of course covered himself by saying "she hasn't confirmed yet...." I don't understand why you even go on air and give out the info then.

He then posted on his FB page an hour later saying this:

Rugen Team Investigations, LLC Missouri Private Investigator While I was on air, Megan replied to my email, "I had that number for 3 or 4 months before this happened. Prior to that I didn't have a phone for about 8 months."


Then, 2 hours after posting to his FB page that he finally got confirmation he then links on his FB page to the written article and video interview where they are STILL giving the wrong information.
Written and video interview

However, revelations discovered by private investigator Ron Rugen may prove otherwise. After speaking to several eyewitnesses and people residing in Wright’s home at the time of Lisa’s disappearance, Wright had only had that particular phone and phone number for about a month before the baby vanished


Michelle



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:15 AM
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Originally posted by schmae
reply to post by Dav1d
 


Honestly David, I was leaning more toward intentional obstruction by LE, which should have thrilled you . I just wonder since Gil has helped cops in the past and must KNOW the drill, why he would do this. Did someone from KCPD prompt him to or even give him the go ahead, knowing it would taint the witness. Then they discount the sightings and go back to square one ie: parents ! I'm not SAYING it is so, only suggesting it as apossibility. Or rather asking if that seems plausible ? It was just such an amateur move from a guy who one would think might know better.


Why should it have thrilled me? I don't win, we as a society don't win. It is NOT what I want. Sure I understand that some have tried to divert the attention here, to make it about me.

Perhaps Gil does indeed know the drill, and therefore KNOWS it doesn't take weeks to get around to doing a line up? There is a lot about give the KCPD the benefit of doubt.. At some point we need to do what is right for Lisa.

Look at our little world here in this corner of the Internet. Did I attack a certain member of law enforcement here? Did I suggest/imply he did not do his job in anyway here? He acknowledges that they are trained not to take it personal. Indeed I went out of my way to thank him for stopping by, for sharing his thoughts with us. And in return I'm attack as a person. I will not pretend to know what that family is experiencing now.

I posted that the police in the Sky have a very different attitude/feel. One that I feel is much better. They have an arrest and it is not months, not weeks. They aren't talking about years there... Yet the attack on me is I'm down on all law enforcement. I've attempted to ignore certain attacks to not respond in kind, and clearly the refusal to respond, is seen by some as acceptance.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:16 AM
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Sorry ran out of room. I'm getting carpal tunnel and have 20 windows open here :/ I need to get on with my day here...if you want more silo, I can get more links and such for you but it will have to be a bit later!

Michelle



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:18 AM
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Originally posted by gabby2011
I agree its wrong to be close minded either way..

I also have to add that it is wrong for the law enforcement to be close minded as well.. They are doing their job in suspecting that it could be the parents..but their expertise in how they extract a confession from any guilty party is very important..not only concerning the parents but all other possible suspects as well.


Something to keep in mind. What we see on the outside looking in are distraught parents, a missing child, no leads, KCPD and the FBI trying to do their thing and the media running their typical game of clue for ratings..

Keep in mind that all parties can talk to the media with the exception of law enforcement. They will be restricted on what info they can release since any disclosure could jeopradize evidence / leads / suspects etc. We dont know all of the info the police have gathered, and to play devils advocate there might be a reason they are focusing on the parents. The police may very well have incriminating evidence in their possession but arent entirely sure how it fits into the puzzle yet.

Its a balancing act, especially in cases like this where you have victims who are also possible suspects.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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Originally posted by schmae
reply to post by gabby2011
 


I think it is James Brando and not Jersey. I THINK, not sure. But Gil Abeyto put james brandos pic in with the others and the mtotorcycle driving witness to man with baby walking, picked out Brando. Brandos' wife Samanth is the neighbor deb was drinking with. It is also the house that Jeremy says he ran to at 4 am to see if Lisa ws there. It is ALSO, lest we forget, the house that police searched and removed a lot of bags of things from and implored the media to NOT take pics of anything removed from the house. Remember that day? We thought how odd? So Brandos' PLURAL are definitely i n the thick of it. Doesn't mean they are guilty of anything but they definitely have been looked at , talked to etc. Oh and Brando pt on his FB that he was an electronic surveillance specialist for SPRINT, and I think this is where David thinks he' s wroking closely with police. Because under a definitiiton of electronic surveillance for sprint, it lists aiding law enforement , etc.


Thank you schmae.. I am getting confused with some of the names and players in this case.

There are definitely a lot of interesting little twists of information regarding this case..and I'm praying that the real truth comes out.

If the truth is being covered up by LE, I doubt we'll ever know.. if the truth is being covered up by players in this case.. I would hope that LE have a good idea as to who, and are still diligently working on all clues and leads they may have, and using all resources of acquiring information they have at their disposal.

I can well imagine they have tons of phone records to pour through..as well as online activity, that could give them clues as to the whereabouts of Lisa.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:27 AM
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reply to post by Dav1d
 


Misunderstanding ! I did not mean you should be thrilled that its attack against le.. I thought you should be thrilled that some of us are thinking outside the box...suspecting everyone. I am at this point suspicious of ALL players. So I thought you would appreciate that. If not, it's ok. The longer it goes on the clearer it is that LE is guilty of something, hopefully 'merely' incompetence and not something more sinister.
Here's the bottom line.
SOMEONE IS FAILING LISA !
Either the police are failing in their investigation OR
The parents are obstructing the investigation.
Until she is found and we know what happened, we don't know who's failed really.

Neither police or family have spoken much at all in 3 weeks or better. Who can really say what is going on
behind the scenes. I do think that casey anthony plays in here. If the cops think they know mom did it but do
not have the supporting evidence to convict, why arrest her and get the ball rolling so it can end in a fiasco
like anthony trial at a cost of millions to tax payers?



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:28 AM
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Originally posted by gabby2011
He did what the police seemed to have failed to do..up to that point..and that is try and get a concrete ID on the man who was seen.

Consider that as law enforcement, we are required to follow certain laws / procedures in gathering information where a private investigator operates under a completely different criteria.



Originally posted by gabby2011
I can't say for sure that the police haven't tried to find the identity of this man.. but it seems odd that they did not set up pics for identification very soon after having all possible suspects associated .

A photo lineup in Missouri is nothing like what you see on tv. You just cant take a suspect picture and randomly add in 11 other pictures. You have to present photos that resemble the suspect photo.

One of the cooler functions ive seen with the in car computers is the ability to enter the suspect information (height, weight, race, hair / eye color etc etc etc). That entered info is sent through the computer systems to the Department of Revenue (Drivers license info / photos). It takes the information the officer input, and scans the system for similar stats and will randomly create a photo lineup that can then be used as well as being admissible in court.

Also, as far as identifying the man with the baby. We dont know if the police identified him or not. Just because they dont talk about it, doesnt mean they arent working different angles of that lead. Just because a possible suspect is identified doesnt mean they are going to pick the person up right away and announce it to the media. As before, its possible the info they have fits into the puzzle, they just dont know how it ffits yet.

Premature actions can be detrimental to a case.


Originally posted by gabby2011
I would be very interested in hearing what the couple has to say about the man they saw carrying a child..these are important leads.. and are "key' factors to this investigation in my opinion.


KCPD says they exhausted all leads, which tells me they investigated that incident and might still be pursuing it.
edit on 18-11-2011 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:38 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 





Keep in mind that all parties can talk to the media with the exception of law enforcement. They will be restricted on what info they can release since any disclosure could jeopradize evidence / leads / suspects etc. We dont know all of the info the police have gathered, and to play devils advocate there might be a reason they are focusing on the parents. The police may very well have incriminating evidence in their possession but arent entirely sure how it fits into the puzzle yet. Its a balancing act, especially in cases like this where you have victims who are also possible suspects.


Very true.. and there very well could be a valid reason they are focusing on the parents..

We have no idea who said what to police among all these possible suspects, and who was telling the truth as well.. so the police have to sort out a lot of different info, and try to key in on the truth.

I have no problem with having the parents as suspects.. but not the exclusion of other possibilities.. or half hearted measures used in investigating other possibilities.. which I am not saying is the case here at all.. I really don't know..(yet I do have to wonder why the police never put a line up together for Mike to look at before gill came into the picture..or even a set of pics)

What I have a problem with is the assumption that the parents are guilty.... and the trash talk about them like some episode of 'mean girls".

I hope with all my heart law enforcement are doing everything in their power to find baby Lisa.. I can't imagine the feeling of not knowing for extended family and friends...as well as the Irwins if they are indeed innocent.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:40 AM
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reply to post by schmae
 


Media is notorious for "making leaps of logic". They take the info they get from the police press briefings. They usually have sources inside the department that provides some info on deep background, they get bits and pieces of info from other agencies who have friends working on the KCPD department. Youhave the FBI doing their thing including their own press releases.

Media will interview people in the area and will put togeher a "story" that is based on facts that arent verified /. accurate.

Look at what happned when Congresswoman Giffords was shot in Arizona. For a good hour plus after the event the media went back and forth on reporting her death, then she was alive, then she was dead, but not quite.

Any info the media reports on should be taken with a grain of salt, especially in ongoing investigations. Just because the police state in a press briefing evidence was recovered from the parents bedroom, doesnt mean the evidence recovered has anything thing to do with the parents.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:40 AM
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Originally posted by Xcathdra

Consider that as law enforcement, we are required to follow certain alws / procedures in gathering information where a private investigator operates under a completely different criteria.



I wonder what the statment analysis might make out of that typo? A hidden meaning? An issue with following certain laws?



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:48 AM
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Originally posted by Dav1d

Originally posted by Xcathdra

Consider that as law enforcement, we are required to follow certain alws / procedures in gathering information where a private investigator operates under a completely different criteria.



I wonder what the statment analysis might make out of that typo? A hidden meaning? An issue with following certain laws?


You really need to stop the partial quotes on what peope say in an effort to change the meaning and portray them out of context. Read the posts all the way through, and stop seeing only what you want. The only contributions I have seen you make to this thread is nothing but attacks on law enforcement and people who dont agree with your opinion of things.

Let me clarify for you -
Since the 4th amendment applies to the government and not the individual, a person acting under color of law (Law Enforcement) must follow the law when attempting to gain information.

A private investigator, who is not comissioned law enforcement, is not subject to those same restrictions.

So no, no hidden meaning, no obfuscaton of laws. Just you taking what I said out of context and twisting it.

So again, respectfully, knock that crap off.
edit on 18-11-2011 by Xcathdra because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:49 AM
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Originally posted by schmae
reply to post by Dav1d
 


The longer it goes on the clearer it is that LE is guilty of something, hopefully 'merely' incompetence and not something more sinister.
Here's the bottom line.
SOMEONE IS FAILING LISA !
Either the police are failing in their investigation OR
The parents are obstructing the investigation.
Until she is found and we know what happened, we don't know who's failed really.

Neither police or family have spoken much at all in 3 weeks or better. Who can really say what is going on
behind the scenes. I do think that casey anthony plays in here. If the cops think they know mom did it but do
not have the supporting evidence to convict, why arrest her and get the ball rolling so it can end in a fiasco
like anthony trial at a cost of millions to tax payers?


Indeed, Schmae, and I think Xcathedra has made it clear that LE will go as slowly as necessary so they DON'T screw anything up and have a cluster in court.

This is a statement by Capt Young from weeks ago, but I think it bears repeating here:

"We don't feel any pressure to accuse anybody," Kansas City police spokesman Capt. Steve Young told the Kansas City Star. "We are under pressure to do what we can to find a child."

m.ibtimes.com...

They are under pressure to solve this case. Just because it hasn't happened quickly enough for the public's taste does NOT imply they are FAILING, nor does it imply they are doing NOTHING. Nor again, does it imply they are somehow covering up for some sinister underground porn ring. Those allegations are being made by people who have no idea what's going on, and who are either unwilling to see further than some MSM shouting head and a bunch of sketchy bloggers, or are so convinced they have the answers that they are willingly and (in my opinion) criminally guilty of defamation and libel....and all of whom have agendas of their own.

It is true that some officials are corrupt. Indisputable. It is also true that there are some very upstanding, honest, intelligent, hardworking people who have chosen to devote their careers (if not their lives) to seeing justice be done. And, unfortunately, it is ALSO true that some parents neglect their responsibilities, and engage in behaviors that MOST people find bizarre and unseemly. There are more PARENTS in the world than cops or law enforcement personnel or DAs. So, if a person's only real and verifiable frame of reference for their "take" on this whole mess is from a parent's POV, they (we) really have no business judging or publicly crucifying anything the authorities are doing. NOT UNTIL it is all said and done.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:51 AM
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Originally posted by gabby2011
What I have a problem with is the assumption that the parents are guilty.... and the trash talk about them like some episode of 'mean girls".

The 100 meter rush to judgment is a bad game to play. The trash talk will be present no matter what simply because people like gossip while others want any info to process but not neccisarily judge from.

In another thread on this site I posted a news article that was an offical repsonse from a Government in the Middle East. People skipped right over it and still continued to believe the rumors about an Israeli / US operation.

I pointed out 4 different times that the government said the explosion was an accident, yet there they are, talking about how the CIA / Mossad carried it out.

You can lead a horse to water......



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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reply to post by Xcathdra
 


You have provided so much insight Xcathdra , and I must admit my faith in LE has been boosted by your postings.

The only problem is that there are corrupt cops.. where they work, and who they cover for and why is another story..

I can only hope that all LEO's in this case are totally honest and wanting to find baby Lisa...and if they are indeed using the best methods possible within the law.. that is all we can ask of them.. as well as to be grateful for their hard work and dedication to serving justice.



posted on Nov, 18 2011 @ 09:58 AM
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Regarding the actions of law enforcement and the pressure deal - let me ask you guys a question.

Whats worse -
A - Law Enforcement taking the time needed do to a thorough investigation, with an end result of finding baby lisa alive / finding the body of baby lisa and sending an abductor / murderer to jail?
or

B - Pressuring the police to run full speed ahead into a wall, cutting corners, only to find baby lisa alive / find the body of baby lisa and be unable to prosecute the suspect because evidence was handled incorrectly / requried paperwork is not valid, etc etc etc.



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