Even Free-Energy Has Its Price, Especially To Keep It Hidden

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posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 01:39 AM
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Ever think of where we will be 10, 20, 30 years from now? When I was a kid, in response to this question my mind would mock up flying cars, teleporting, holographic video gaming. Now, here we are, the year 2011, and reality had hit me - hard. Dreams of hover-cars have been replaced by dreams of basic electric cars that are affordable to the avg American; I'd rather someone invent a Job-Creator than a Clone-Creator. These ideas, these dreams, where did they all go? Did we give up? Was the technology just simply not there? Maybe so, or maybe, were just not being let in.

That brings us to Mr. K. R. Sridhar.



Sridhar graduated from the National Institute of Technology in Tiruchirappalli, India in 1982, his bachelors degree in Medical Engineering. He moved to the United States in the 1980s and got a M.S. in nuclear engineering and a PhD in mechanical engineering from the University of Illinois at Urbana-Champaign (Wiki)

He began his work at the University of Arizona, recruited by NASA to investigate the possibilities of sustaining life on Mars. He led a team at the Space Tech. Lab to develop the Mars ISPP Precursor, a device for oxygen production on Mars using solid oxide electrolysis, Solid State Ionics. Otherwise known as the "MIP Experiment."


The MIP package will be small and light weight. Its overall external envelope is approximately 40 x 24 x 25 cm (15.7 x 9.4 x 9.8 inches), and its mass is 8.5 kg (18.7 lbm). The long-term effects of operating in the Martian environment is key information being sought by MIP. Therefore, MIP would like to operate for a lifetime of 90 sols or more on Mars.

4H2 + CO2 --> CH4 + 2H2O
The water (H2O) produced by the reaction is then electrolyzed to produce oxygen and hydrogen; the hydrogen is re-used to produce more methane. Since it uses the atmosphere on Mars, no drilling or searching is needed.

The question is, did it work? Well we wont know. The Mars Surveyor Project of 2001 was cancelled after complications with the Moon Polar Lander. However, the device WAS sent up to the moon, a late addition to the Phoenix Mission.

In 2003, an organization named PATH - M (Program for Advancement Towards Humans on Mars) actually took this pretty seriously. They used the MIP and the ISPP as the foundation of the beginning of a serious effort to being civilizations and advancements of companies on martial soil. R. K. Sridhar worked directly with this funded group to make his machine a reality. They, however, were looking much further into it.



The development of a “Mars Treaty” would be challenging in many ways, one of them being the attempt to avoid the above mentioned mistakes made during the elaboration of the 1979 Moon Agreement – which today is in practical terms “dead”. A Mars Treaty could contain provisions such as territorial aspects (common heritage of mankind?), freedom of scientific investigation, jurisdiction over ground facilities, Mars orbit regulations, space debris mitigation or avoidance (that could not be regulated in time in the Earth space environment), liability issues, a new and functional resource exploitation regime, commercial utilization of infrastructures, the preservation of the natural Mars environment, and criminal jurisdiction over ground crews (and future colonies).
A future human mission to Mars will have to meet all the legal obligations set by the general corpus iuris spatialis, the international legal framework governing Outer Space, the celestial bodies and, mainly, the major part of human activities carried out in Outer Space.


Is this really serious?


ANYWAYS The important part, the part regarding life on this planet. R. K. Sridhar had the idea to reverse-engineer his invention. If you can take power, and turn it into Oxygen and Hydrogen, why cant you take Oxygen and Hydrogen and turn it...into power.

Introducing: Bloom Energy Corp



In October 2001, K.R Sridhar C.E.O had a meeting with John Doerr from the large venture capital firm Kleiner Perkins. Sridhar was asking for more than $100 million to start the company. Bloom Energy has received $400 million of start-up funding from venture capitalists, including Kleiner Perkins[8] and Vinod Khosla.
The company, originally called Ion America, was renamed to Bloom Energy in 2006.

Cutting to the chase, Sridhar's product could be reverse engineered, and he designed a lightweight, inexpensive way to create energy straight from the intake of Oxygen and Hydrogen, called the Bloom Box.

Now, Sridhar is no modern day Nikola Tesla, but his invention, is not too different from one theorized by the master of electricity himself.

Tesla was funded by JP Morgan to set up a wireless telecommunication tower in Shoreham, Long Island. However, Tesla had other aspirations. He planned to invent a worldwide free energy system that used the Earth as a conductor. After time of fruitless work, Morgan and Westinghouse allegedly cut Teslas funding because it was not profitable. Morgan even went to lengths to convince other wealthy investors to avoid Teslas work. Later on, Westinghouse Electric LLC has become owner of CBS and many other electricity resources, and JP Morgan is one of the world largest energy market makers.




Bloom Energy worked in secrecy for almost 8 YEARS before being pressured into holding its first press conference. It, and its inventor Sridhar was featured in 60 Minutes introducing the Bloom Box to the world in Feb. 2010! (Ironically also on CBS, the same company bought by Westinghouse who refused to further fund Teslas research into free energy)



So here we are, almost 2 years later, how many people here have a bloom box in their backyard? Why should free energy be restricted to large companies like Google, Wal-Mart, FedEx? Sridhar says he can see individual homes having a $3000 box in their backyards in the next 5 years, I highly doubt it.

Its simple, free-energy would cripple the United States economy. The largest energy sources will pay to suppress the public understanding and access to these free energy sources such as the Bloom Box for the capital that exists in the energy business. Millions of USD$ spent a year, plus more millions propped up for weak green-energy projects are all being spent, when only around $100M was needed as an initial investment to start up Bloom Energy.

Luckily, someone with money has come along with the idea to boost this knowledge into the spotlight, that man is Foster Gamble.



"He who controls the money controls the world"




posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 01:52 AM
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A lot to go through, thanks. I always love the free energy threads.



"He who controls the money controls the world"


"He who controls the FOOD, controls the world."



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 02:05 AM
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Interesting post. One correction though, Westinghouse did not defund Tesla. They in fact were the only ones who supported him. They ran out of funds and were about to go bankrupt so he told them they did not have to pay him other money they owed him etc. They actually funded his power plants at Niagara falls which was the first rbig step to the current electrical society we enjoy today. it was JP Morgan who screwed him and all of us when he found out he could not put a meter on Tesla's wireless free electricity.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 02:54 AM
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reply to post by Plan2exist18
 


Yes this does indeed appear very credible...but lets be clear here...from watching the video it is made quite clear that these are NOT free energy as they need to use fuel!
For instance the Bloombox's at Google run off of natural gas....the Box's are simply much more efficient than a normal power station....but they are anything but free energy.
edit on 3-10-2011 by bhornbuckle75 because: stumble monkey flop



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:00 AM
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reply to post by Plan2exist18
 

Free energy. Are you serious? It is a fuel cell and not a free energy device.

to create energy straight from the intake of Oxygen and Hydrogen
See: en.wikipedia.org...


The "box" generates its power through a combination of oxygen and a fossil fuel - natural gas, bio-gas, etc. It is presently being tested by companies such as Google, WalMart, FedEx and eBay, who have shelled out hundreds of thousands for the "green" machines.
It is suppressed but tested at the same time?


He planned to invent a worldwide free energy system that used the Earth as a conductor.
He worked on wireless energy transfer by the means of electrostatic induction(tesla coil). No free energy here too.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:11 AM
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I hope to see this come to fruition in my life time.
Only time will tell.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:16 AM
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Originally posted by Plan2exist18
R. K. Sridhar had the idea to reverse-engineer his invention. If you can take power, and turn it into Oxygen and Hydrogen, why cant you take Oxygen and Hydrogen and turn it...into power.
Introducing: Bloom Energy Corp



Simply not true.
The Bloom box is just a fancy fuel cell. Sridhar did not come up with the idea.

Welsh Physicist William Grove developed the first crude fuel cells in 1839.

ref



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:23 AM
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As others have stated, this is a type of fuel cell.

It's one of the more interesting areas of chemical engineering, these days, as nanostructures have been shown to behave much differently than we expect them to - which has lead to a sort of "revitalized" chemical engineering front.

Hydrogen-oxygen fuel cells have been around for some time. Hydrocarbon-oxygen fuel cells are somewhat new and more tricky. The goal, for them, is to have a single-stage system whereby a hydrocarbon is combined with oxygen and 'burned' - the resulting energy captured in the form of voltage potential (and current flow between two terminals). This will, eventually, replace the Internal Combustion Engine.

Many existing systems use a two-stage approach, first requiring the hydrogen to be separated from the hydrocarbon so it can be passed to a more standard hydrogen fuel cell.

I am not really seeing where the "suppression" in this article comes in... or where the "free energy" comes in, either.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:25 AM
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reply to post by Plan2exist18
 


watch your vid again - it clearly states that the device is a fuel call :

oxygen + fuel = direct electrical power

due to its design - the fuel must be a gas

so - the 64k question

where do you get a free fuel gas from ???????



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 09:52 AM
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Originally posted by Plan2exist18
Is this really serious?...

Cutting to the chase, Sridhar's product could be reverse engineered, and he designed a lightweight, inexpensive way to create energy straight from the intake of Oxygen and Hydrogen, called the Bloom Box.
Are you serious?

Anybody can make energy from the input of Oxygen and Hydrogen. 5 minutes on Google would have told you that, and because you failed to find out such basic information, you get an eye roll:


Then the fact that you can say such well known processes are suppressed adds to the ridiculousness of your post and premise. Apparently you don't know the space shuttle made its electricity that way?

www.nasa.gov...


Fuel Cell Use in the Space Shuttle

Fuel cells are used in the space shuttle as one component of the electrical power system. Three fuel cell power plants, through a chemical reaction, generate all of the electrical power for the vehicle from launch through landing rollout...

The three fuel cell power plants are individually coupled to the reactant (hydrogen and oxygen) distribution subsystem, the heat rejection subsystem, the potable water storage subsystem, and the electrical power distribution and control subsystem. The fuel cell power plants generate heat and water as by-products of electrical power generation.

This is one of the three fuel cells that make up the generating system that provides electrical power to the space shuttle orbiter. The unit is a little more than a foot high and weighs approximately 200 pounds. Credit: NASA
It's not suppressed, this technology is well known.

Here's the problem with your whole premise. If you're claiming that combining hydrogen and oxygen is the solution to our energy problems, tell me this. Where is the hydrogen going to come from?

That's the problem. You don't have an economical source of hydrogen. The space shuttle used it because their economic considerations are quite different in space than ground based economics.

Nothing is being suppressed regarding how to combine hydrogen and oxygen.

Your OP:
edit on 3-10-2011 by Arbitrageur because: clarification



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 12:28 PM
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I like how she said, "like how laptops raplaced desktops". Not the type of upgrade I would want for powering my home.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 01:11 PM
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This thread is ridiculous. OP, you spent all that time writing your post, didn't you even bother to do some basic fact checking?



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 02:10 PM
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Wow. Tough crowd. I disagree with those of you who are just being jerks. Yes, the OP misstated the fact that it is not "free" energy. However,

1) Show me another commercially viable fuel cell. The Bloom box is ready to rock right now.
2) While not free, the energy is produced in a manner that is more efficient than any current method that I am aware of. I think I read somewhere that it uses 60% less hydrocarbons per kWh than an electrical generating plant.
3) OP, it is actually $3,000 per 1kW box. My microwave is 1.2kW, so I would need at least 2 boxes for my house in order to just run my microwave. But, if my AC should cycle on while the microwave is running...oops. I really don't know the logistics of how many a given house would need, but I promise we would have to change how we use power.

Now, with that said, I live in NorCal where we are blessed with PG&E. These criminals think their power is gold. According to my last bill I used 1200 kWh, and they magnanimously only charged me around $250 for that small amount of power.

So, how quickly does a super-efficient source of power pay for itself? Well, in CA I think that if you factored everything in, it would take less than 5 years for the average homerowner to recoup the expense of swapping over.

So, naysayers, what was so horribly bad with the OP bringing this up? yes, many of us already knew about it, but so what? The more people who know, the better.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:42 PM
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reply to post by DragonTattooz
 


It's no secret and a natural gas fuel cell electricity generator + water heater unit is commercially available right now here in Oz but it's obscenely expensive at the moment at something like $40000 for a 1.5kW unit plus tax and installation costs so a unit bought now would possibly not break even before its life expectancy comes up. Only applicable for people with a natural gas main at their property of course. They call it the 'BlueGen' here and not sure what the relationship is to US-based 'Bloom' units, if any but the technology appears to be the same.

That $250 for 1200kWh amounts to around 21c per kWh which is pretty much what we pay here once service charges are included for a typical household with off-peak water heating.

The smart money is on that cost doubling over the next 5 years or so unfortunately.
edit on 3/10/2011 by Pilgrum because: (no reason given)



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 03:52 PM
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Originally posted by Pilgrum
reply to post by DragonTattooz
 


It's no secret and a natural gas fuel cell electricity generator + water heater unit is commercially available right now here in Oz but it's obscenely expensive at the moment at something $40000 for a 1.5kW unit plus tax and installation costs so a unit bought now would possibly not break even before its life expectancy comes up. Only applicable for people with a natural gas main at their property of course. They call it the 'BlueGen' here and not sure what the relationship is to US-based 'Bloom' units, if any but the technology appears to be the same.


Cool. I was not aware of that unit...I'm not an expert in this field by any stretch of the imagination. Do you happen to know how efficient it is? One of the benefits of the Bloom box is that it is incredibly efficient and incredibly cheap vs. what else is out there. At least that is the way I understand it.



posted on Oct, 3 2011 @ 04:03 PM
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reply to post by DragonTattooz
 


Up to 85% efficiency is the official figure

Some more info:

What is BlueGEN?
BlueGEN is a modular gas fired generator which creates electricity by electro–chemically converting natural gas. It is a residential or commercial product, capable of producing an output of around 1.5kW per hour, 24 hours per day. This means it produces around 15,000kWh annually, double the amount a typical household needs. This is about the same as a 10kW solar electricity system, which needs roof space for 54 solar panels! A Blue Gen is about the size of a dishwasher, which is installed outside your house. It is also able to heat your water for household use as a by product of operation. This is known as ‘Co-Generation’ and has a world leading electrical efficiency of up to 60% and total efficiency of up to 85%.

Background of BlueGEN
BlueGEN was invented by the CSIRO in 1992, and has since been continued as a developing idea under private consideration. BlueGEN is manufactured by an Australian-based company operating in Melbourne; Ceramic Fuel Cells Limited. They are listed on the Australian Stock Exchange under CFU. Ceramic Fuel Cells was formed in 1992 by the CSIRO and a consortium of Australian Government bodies. Since then the Company has invested more than $250 million in developing its technology, which is all wholly-owned and developed here in Australia. Harvey Norman Commercial Division was appointed as a BlueGEN distributor in June 2010.

Whilst BlueGEN is available at a premium compared to solar electricity, it has all the advantages of solar, with the ability to create electricity 24 hours a day all year round. The gas consumption is around 12 megajoules (mJ) per hour, which is equivalent to a small gas cook top burner. BlueGEN has been installed in many demonstration scenarios world wide, and is on the verge of becoming a domestic and commercial solution to rapidly rising electricity costs.






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