I have a question for protestors

I have a question for protestors, or rather an experiment that would be interesting. I think somebody should go down to this "occupy wall street" protest and ask a few questions of the protestors:

Did you write to your congressperson? (seems silly, but is very pertinent)

Did you ever write to anybody in government?

Did you attempt to get involved in local government?(far easier than it seems)

Did you ever attempt to take a class in economics/government to assist in answering questions and forming arguments?

Did you participate in every form of voting you are allowed?

Did you sign petitions?



I would imagine that the answer would be a resounding NO to all or some of the proposed questions.

I would instead propose that the REAL sheeple are the ones that watch poorly researched propaganda circling the internet (which they then forward to 20 of their friends) in the form of video and e-mail that gets them riled up at the greatest free government ever formed.

The REAL sheeple are the ones that, instead of first following any other process the government allows them, immediately take to the streets to protest and disrupt the workweek of people with jobs.

I expect the answer to this will be to call me a "TROLL" , or to say "the government will never listen to me anyway!" But how can you know if you never try? How can you debate government...if you don't know it?

reply to post by hyperion.martin
Talk to me!
I've been saying this for quite some time.
We can blame the evil bankers all day long, but nothing will be accomplished until the clown-farts in Washington change the laws.
That won't happen until we replace said clown-farts.

Brilliant
Brilliant
Brilliant

reply to post by hyperion.martin


so you say doing nothing would be better then doing something?

reply to post by Acetradamus


Ugh. Read the OP again. That is not at all what is being said. The point is that all these people are rallying behind a cause they don't understand because they want to be a part of something and didn't take the time to do the most basic things to help further that cause.

I support the protests in some ways, but it is true that they are sloppy at best and completely unorganized and pointless at worst.

Originally posted by Acetradamus
reply to post by hyperion.martin

 

so you say doing nothing would be better then doing something?

If I may,
Have the protests, but have them where there will be an effect.
In D.C.!

TPTB are looking at this and saying, "Meh".

reply to post by Acetradamus


I would say that you are missing the point but that would just be redundant, please reread my post.
The real question is...what ARE protestors doing? I could do more in a day by voting, writing to congress/gov, attending town hall meetings, or going to class than a protestor could do in a week. The reason for this is because we live in AMERICA and that's how this works.

yeah protests dont solve anything in fact i think the current potus just found more voters to his class warfare

and no op vailid points and very much worth asking and the chances are they didnt do anything

their thoughts and opinions were shaped on face book twitter and other websites without any thought given to real world expeirences.

not a free or critical thinker among that lot.

reply to post by hyperion.martin

How can you debate government...if you don't know it?

I would say how can you expect listening, much less reacting, from gov and corps who's interest don't really keep the well being of people as a priority anymore. Some honestly feel that doing the things you mention are futile in a system that is so easily bought and manipulated by power, money and political positioning. The disenchantment comes form the lack of genuine change for the better overall, and many have lost faith in what used to be effective approaches we had.

You are probably correct in your assessment that many protesters have not pursued change via the avenues you listed, but do you really think calling a representative makes a difference these days? The constituency has shifted from public opinion to private funding. The methods of contributing to change are antiquated in this political evolved modality we live in.

I should state that we shouldn't give up totally, but addressing your premise, I believe people have lost faith, and imo, justifiably so to a significant degree. Public protesting is a last ditch effort for direct response, for better or worse. Oh man, I realize I have become cynical when it comes to issues, particularly on a national level. I do still participate and have faith at local and state levels, but that is it.

Peace,
spec

ETA: I was trying to think of an example where the methods you brought forth were utilized but without a proper response, and Eminent Domain is a prefect example of people, in the majority, voting, calling reps, and even protesting with no results. The electric car Who Killed the Electric Car is an example on the part of industry and gov denying public opinion, and how they removed the car(option) from the market, despite a demand from the people.

Then, I was thinking about example where nothing but protesting made a difference and there are many including Egypt, ERA issues, Ghandi's movement, Frederick Douglas..etc
Of course many of these were back in the day when big gov or corps still had some fear of the public and it's numbers, whereas today, I don't think they feel any threat at all.

reply to post by Domo1


Rally around END THE FED is really all they have to know. The rest is a result of the Federal Reserve System and the Banksters that own it. Cut the head off the snake and the body will die. There is a call to occupy the Federal Reserve Banks around the country. That should be simple and focused enough.

There are a lot of folks in the US that feel entitled to a good job right our of school, a pass on their debt, and the "right" to pursue things that make them "happy" instead of working hard to make a better life for themselves. It takes a lot of work to do the things you mention above, and that does not get the attention of media, which the protesters in turn feed off of. I'm not opposed to freedom of assembly or speech by any means, it's just that the whole situation is embarrassing to those that take pride in hard work and reject the notion of socialism. Sure there are lots of problems with the United States, with large corporations, with the bureaucracy of the government. There are numerous things to fix about the US and the world. But the truth is that many of the people protesting are looking for a pass in life vs. having to work hard for what they want, and I have zero sympathy for a bunch of college kids that complain about being broke at the age of 19. Been there, done that, and worked really hard to make a better life for myself.

So you really think the system set up by the Man for the Man is working?

People can write to their congressman or even become politically active in their local area, but what does this really achieve?

The only way people can reinforce their feelings is to adopt the action they are taking.

Western Governments are in the pockets of the banking system and have allowed more and more influence of the banking sector to set the political agenda.

Protests are the way forward I'm afraid, no politician is really listening and the few that are listening are usually on the fringes of the political system. They have very little clout and in the main ignored.

We are many, they are few.

Good luck to the protestors, when no one is listening or reacting to what is going on, what other options are left?

reply to post by redrose123


I don't think even 1 out of 10 people on this site know what the Fed actually is. I doubt the number is any higher among the protesters. Would you care to tell me what the Fed is.

reply to post by speculativeoptimist
So many are missing the point.
In another thread I stated that the bankers are giving bribes, and are getting slammed for it.
Good.

But the weasels in DC are the ones accepting the bribes!!!

Get them out, replace them with honest, decent people and no matter HOW much money the bankers throw at them, they'll do the right thing.*



*If we can find honest people, that is. . . .

As a spectator of American politics I have to ask what Ron Paul actually changed in the gov system in the past 30 years. If a person with such a message who discusses and debates with the gov on TV has not affected change neither will a letter.

Getting involved in gov does not have an affect on the system itself because the whole thing is corrupt. The individuals involved may start out with good intentions and attempt real reform, they do not last long in gov unless they themselves become part of the corrupt system.

Change must come from the bottom up with massive numbers. The demand must be for a different system or no system because the system is the problem and is under the control of corporate entities with your consent, you finance them.

Originally posted by hyperion.martin
reply to post by Acetradamus

 

I would say that you are missing the point but that would just be redundant, please reread my post.
The real question is...what ARE protestors doing? I could do more in a day by voting, writing to congress/gov, attending town hall meetings, or going to class than a protestor could do in a week. The reason for this is because we live in AMERICA and that's how this works.

*BZZZZT*

I'm sorry but the judges are telling me that is an incorrect answer.

Perhaps the cause is clouded, perhaps lack of proper organization leaves something to be desired..Perhaps all of these observations are correct. (According to the MSM they are spot on!)

Protesting does something VERY important, which is RAISE AWARENESS of the cause. If 10,000 (arbitrary number) protesters can raise awareness in another 10,000 people (perhaps MANY more) is that not just as valid as 10,000 votes?

Not only does it raise awareness in the voter but it sends a message to government officials. How can you minimize or wave away the importance of this?

Before you attack me know that I volunteer heavily for an ethics in government organization in my state. I vote for city, district, state and federal elections. I've also been part of many protests, although none of the Occupy protests.

Since I've answered your questions will you answer one of mine? When is the last time you did something "outside of the box" to help enact the change you seek, whatever it may be? Have you ever felt something so strongly that you joined a group of like minded individuals and went to great lengths to share a message that the media ignores? I'd love to hear of your personal experience, please share!

The reason for protesting is WE LIVE IN AMERICA and that's how it works.

reply to post by beezzer

Agreed, but 'getting them out' means putting only honest people in, but I say take the money out because it seems apparent that one can enter politics with the best intentions and innovative ideas, but they realize it is a game and they have to play by the unwritten rules. So the one thing that can make a difference is taking the doe out of the political campaigning, but that will never happen imho. There is an effort, but how it will play out remains to be seen.
www.getmoneyout.com...

Originally posted by Threegirls
As a spectator of American politics I have to ask what Ron Paul actually changed in the gov system in the past 30 years. If a person with such a message who discusses and debates with the gov on TV has not affected change neither will a letter.

Getting involved in gov does not have an affect on the system itself because the whole thing is corrupt. The individuals involved may start out with good intentions and attempt real reform, they do not last long in gov unless they themselves become part of the corrupt system.

Change must come from the bottom up with massive numbers. The demand must be for a different system or no system because the system is the problem and is under the control of corporate entities with your consent, you finance them.

A good question. Paul has been inside for 30 years.
What has he done? (hint, start a thread on this)
If one Ron Paul isn't enough to exact change, then what is the threshold?
Two?
Five?
Twenty?

Also, I wonder how many of the "protesters" went home after Radiohead failed to show...

reply to post by speculativeoptimist
It sounds like you're making excuses for future corruption.

Have faith.

Originally posted by hyperion.martin

Did you write to your congressperson? (seems silly, but is very pertinent) YES

Did you ever write to anybody in government? YES

Did you attempt to get involved in local government?(far easier than it seems) YES

Did you ever attempt to take a class in economics/government to assist in answering questions and forming arguments? NO

Did you participate in every form of voting you are allowed? YES

Did you sign petitions? YES



Okay, so I missed one.

I also voted for Obama "for a change". And look where that got us.

You are delusional if you think we can, as an individual, make a change to government.

I'm afraid you might not grasp the level of corruption on Wall Street.

Here's an article written by Matt Taibbi for the Rolling Stone that might open your eyes.

From tech stocks to high gas prices, Goldman Sachs has engineered every major market manipulation since the Great Depression -- and they're about to do it again

The Great American Bubble Machine



How can the "People" get Wall Street out of the pockets of government?

It may be impossible, unless perhaps there's a Revolution.