The Morality Of Saving People From Hell

Are those people in your life who try to convert you to save you from Hell moral and correct in their actions?

If one sincerely believes in Hell and cares about you enough to try to save you from it, they must be a moral and caring person acting in the right, otherwise to let you perish would make them an amoral sociopath.

However, the more someone tries to save you, the more of an undesirable creep they are perceived to be. Religious conversion is often unwanted.

Is the attempt to save others from Hell a moral action or is it an unethical action?

Well, once I tell you I am not interested in your voodoo mumbojumbo, then it is time to shut up and let me burn.

There is nothing moral about trying to tell someone what to believe or to try and change what they believe.

reply to post by DarkKnight76
Agreed. If you are introduced to God by the person and you reject God, that person should move on to others who might possibly be saved. If God really wants the person who has rejected him, he will find another way. God has given us free will to decide for ourselves. Choose with him or against but recognize the consequences of your decision.

For most people it plain depends on their perspective.

But there's other issues. A lot of hell-believers spend most of their time touting the HELL is REAL and YOU'RE NEXT, BUDDY!, instead of spending time finding out where the person is coming from before going into their spiel. If this person is grieving over the loss of a loved one who doesn't believe in God, I've seen Christians tell them that their dead's in hell. True or not, this is only going to lead to hurt.

And no wonder so many hate on Christians.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
There is nothing moral about trying to tell someone what to believe or to try and change what they believe.

This is too absolute. We tell KKK members that they're wrong for their beliefs all the time, and never think about whether it is right or wrong for them to believe as they wish.

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
Are those people in your life who try to convert you to save you from Hell moral and correct in their actions?

If one sincerely believes in Hell and cares about you enough to try to save you from it, they must be a moral and caring person acting in the right, otherwise to let you perish would make them an amoral sociopath.

However, the more someone tries to save you, the more of an undesirable creep they are perceived to be. Religious conversion is often unwanted.

Is the attempt to save others from Hell a moral action or is it an unethical action?

The problem my friend, is people misconstrue what it means to save someone.

They invent invisible demons in their head that they can fight, because it is much easier to fight invisible demons than sacrifice one's own flesh for another.

To save someone means you will be there when they fall.

To save someone means you will warn them of immediate danger.

To save someone means you would sacrfice your life for them.

It is much harder to do this. So let me save you from the demons only I perceive.


I choose the hard road.

I would lay down my life for another.

That is how I would save them.

With Love,

Your Brother

Hmm damned if I do, damned if I don't? In this day and age, everyone has heard of the "gospel". If they want to understand it, its because they are seeking for the answers to their own questions in life....I don't believe its up to me to annoy, pester, bother, judge, humiliate, anyone who chooses not to believe. The only thing I need to do is defend my faith, if asked. There is a difference between someone who wants to understand, and someone who wants to have a fight.

There is nothing moral about trying to scare someone into believing something, nor is there any honor in convincing one to "hedge their bets", just in case they're wrong.

I personally have had many lectures, throughout my life, of my damnation and destiny to an eternity in hell, and never once did I walk away feeling loved. On the contrary, I felt alienated and judged and went on to experience the wrath of the very people claiming "God is Love."

reply to post by traditionaldrummer

Given your assumptions, it is an incredibly moral action, perhaps the most moral action. As you point out, however, it can be done in the wrong manner or at the wrong time.

The task requires wisdom, and a major dose of the Holy Spirit.

I'm sorry for just giving you truisms, but it is a fairly clear-cut question.

If you want to save them from "hell",

Tell them that fire and brimstone and judgement does not exist, its only yourself who judges yourself at the end of your life.

Tell them that Hell, and Heaven are here on Earth, we have always been here, as its designed to be both, that you chose your own environment.

Tell them that on their deathbed, their thoughts should be of loved ones and happy times, not demons and torture.

Tell them that when they are born again into another body, to use what they've gained from this life, to make the next one that much better.

Tell them that they can change the course of their personal history, to however they want it to be, at any moment by their own choice.

Tell them don't worry, everything will be ok.

Tell them these things and you'll have gained my respect for telling the truth, instead of telling the fear.

Originally posted by CynicalDrivel

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
There is nothing moral about trying to tell someone what to believe or to try and change what they believe.

This is too absolute. We tell KKK members that they're wrong for their beliefs all the time, and never think about whether it is right or wrong for them to believe as they wish.

No it isnt too absolute. Every single person on this earth has a right to believe anything and everything they want, and it is no one elses place to try and change their mind.

You are confusing beliefs with actions. We tell the KKK their actions are wrong. They have every right to believe that whites are the chosen race. Its when they ACT, infringing the rights of others, that it becomes wrong.

Originally posted by CynicalDrivel

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
There is nothing moral about trying to tell someone what to believe or to try and change what they believe.

This is too absolute. We tell KKK members that they're wrong for their beliefs all the time, and never think about whether it is right or wrong for them to believe as they wish.

Members of the christian church, or the KKK have the freedom in this country to believe whatever they wish and it is protected by our constitution. However, in regards to both groups, when their beliefs cross the line into persecution, oppression and violence, then it becomes a problem of everyone.

The KKK isn't a problem when they hold their little meetings and rallies, but when they attack gays, jews or any other individual in order to force their beliefs on you, then they are in the wrong and must be corrected. The same thing can go for christians, islamist and any other religious belief. When they practice in the church each week no one has a problem, but when they openly force their beliefs on you and me (WBC is a good example), then they must be confronted and corrected as to proper social behavior.

Social behavior and culture acceptance of beliefs differs from region to region, so even this is up for debate, but no one has the right to force you to change your beliefs, but they do have the right to defend themselves from it.

King

I view it as unethical even though the person doing it is acting in a good-hearted manner.

If I find an ancient book from Greece that claims that eating huge amounts of honeydew will cure a particular type of cancer, I may be extremely eager to share this good news with a loved one afflicted with that cancer. I'd earnestly be trying to save a loved one but there's one problem: the claim has not been established as true. Eating honeydew instead of seeking treatment may hasten death.

Proliferating unestablished "truths" derived from ancient literature in this case would actually be harmful. It may also be harmful to inflict a fear of Hell into someone in order to "save" them from it, especially since all claims about Hell remain unestablished. Not only could this generate psychological issues but rob someone of a life they'd otherwise lead instead of adhering to ancient doctrine.

My 2 cents

Originally posted by traditionaldrummer
I view it as unethical even though the person doing it is acting in a good-hearted manner.

If I find an ancient book from Greece that claims that eating huge amounts of honeydew will cure a particular type of cancer, I may be extremely eager to share this good news with a loved one afflicted with that cancer. I'd earnestly be trying to save a loved one but there's one problem: the claim has not been established as true. Eating honeydew instead of seeking treatment may hasten death.

Proliferating unestablished "truths" derived from ancient literature in this case would actually be harmful. It may also be harmful to inflict a fear of Hell into someone in order to "save" them from it, especially since all claims about Hell remain unestablished. Not only could this generate psychological issues but rob someone of a life they'd otherwise lead instead of adhering to ancient doctrine.

I will criticize my own argument. I may be on untenable ground with this argument because though the person may not have truthful information they may still be justified in their actions on the basis on the information they do have. I may need to do some revisions...

It is unethical to push your religious beliefs on someone, that is why I don't necessarily agree with missionaries. I believe JC would also be against pushing a belief on another individual. Pushing a belief is different than "letting them know". Educate them or make them aware of where you are coming from and your purpose and let them know you care for their future.

MY .02

reply to post by traditionaldrummer


It is only moral, and ethical or with what NLP calls an organic integrity IF it or the person presenting the argument, is entirely willing to admit to their own folly, and weaknesses, while inviting you to share in the humor of your own prior ignorance. Only if it actually crashes the gate and gets you out, in other words. As a "threat", it is most absurd, since the unconditioned ground of all being and becoming, offers it's own invitation to love. At best, a gate crasher, even still can only serve as a civilized gentleman standing at the door to heaven well dressed and with invitation warmly and lovingly and homorously extended. If we cannot have the last laugh at the devil's expense, then yes, it's unethical and immoral, imho.

Originally posted by captaintyinknots
There is nothing moral about trying to tell someone what to believe or to try and change what they believe.

Ahh, I see... So then, the guy that I talked out of believing his life wasn't worth living and that he really should not jump from a 16 story balcony, because I believe his life IS worth while, So I should have just agreed with him and watched him jump?....

Originally posted by DarthMuerte
reply to post by DarkKnight76

 

Agreed. If you are introduced to God by the person and you reject God, that person should move on to others who might possibly be saved. If God really wants the person who has rejected him, he will find another way. God has given us free will to decide for ourselves. Choose with him or against but recognize the consequences of your decision.

Your response shows great wisdom. God indeed has given us free will. We can choose as we desire. That is what we have been given which is above all else. The right to choose. It is not for me to condemn. But for only he who has the power to judge mankind.
In light of that I will only say few recognize the consequences of their decisions. They find it easier to have a good time than to seek truth. Truly you do speak the truth.
DH

What you must understand, is that it is the responsibility of the christian to share their faith. That reconciliation to God is available to those who are willing to receive it. From their perspective, God didn't ask them to do it, he commanded them to.

Mark 16:15
And he said unto them, Go ye into all the world, and preach the gospel to every creature.

However, it is also their responsibility to know when to share, and when to quit. That's the short explanation, anyway.