relationships are a part of TPTB plan?

ok...i'm providing a link to one source (you can google/yahoo and find many more)

Commitment to a Romantic Relationship Lowers Testosterone in Men

...but basically...



being in a committed, monogamous relationship lowers testosterone in men. hence...so many men have problems with premature ejaculation and erectile dysfunction (not saying that relationships cause all of these problems). i mean...pretty much every man i know, over like 30...who is married with kids (or even been with the same woman for more than 5 years) wants to cheat...feels like less of a man...has problems with PE and/or ED (hence the overwhelming flood of commercials/banners for vaigra/cialis/other sexual performance drugs/herbs/pills). most men who are committed like this also have nearly no desire to have sex with their committed mate and have this uncontrollable urge to cheat (hence so many men having a "porn problem" or wanting to jack off rather than have sex with their wife).

could it be...that, genetically (and instinctively), humans are not meant for monogamous relationships? could it be that part of the essence of man (possibly even woman) would include sexual variety? could it be that, perhaps, humans weren't meant for monogamous relationships? maybe we're meant to sleep around????

well then...why does the Bible preach to be faithful? to take one partner? to not masturbate? hmmm...good question??? MAYBE...it was all designed to throw us off track? maybe..TPTB started this lie that we're supposed to only find one mate!

why you ask??? hmmm...same reason as water fluoridation? to keep men from being men? to keep people in constant turmoil. i mean...what if...God designed us to sleep around? NO EFFING WONDER COUPLES FIGHT SOOO MUCH! even if you love the person..you wanna leave. "but...the bible says not to. the bible says you're supposed to stay together, through thick and thin. my parents did it." probably one of the responses running through your head. and now...i'm sure there are some exceptions. maybe there are some who break this mold i'm making in my head

i mean..everyone does it. everyone stays together and ends up spending their entire marriages in different rooms (her in the kitchen/living room...him in the shed/den).

the majority of couples i know who've been together more than 5 years...yes...they may still love each other...but deep down...they feel this desire to run and start over. what if that's natural? what if that's the way it's supposed to be? what if we're only supposed to fall in love/lust...learn something from that relationship (no matter how long or short you're together) and move on?

i mean...it would explain why so many true love marriages turn into divorce. why pretty much everyone wants to cheat (at least once, at some point). why relationships are usually only "fun" for so long (be it a couple months or a couple years). it would explain why the love never dies..but the desire to be around that person kinda fades away. it would also explain the church's strict abhorrence of homosexuality (homos can't make kids). i mean...of all the laws in the old testament...people love to quote the anti-gay laws (when there are laws that say not to wear clothing woven of two different fabrics in the same book as the gay laws...Leviticus).

maybe...just maybe...we're going against our natural drive by staying in a relationship for soooo long. maybe...just maybe...the great architects just fooled humanity into thinking we need to stay together so that we could produce more slaves (kids) and spend our entire lives trying to raise a family and pay a mortgage note. maybe...just maybe...relationships and marriages are just part of the enslavement scheme.

and...go ahead and bash me bible thumpers/dr phil...

Obviously, the state is all for encouraging partnerships between men and women.
The hope is that it results in children, i.e. generating more workers and consumers.

This has been a crucial part of any society since day 1.

Monogamy, as a social custom, exists most likely to ensure a good environment for offspring. If we were running around sleeping with everything that moved, we'd have a lot of children that would end up being wards of the state.

I can't say that I don't agree with the reasoning of society supporting monogamy. It makes perfect sense.

OK here it goes-- a few years ago I heard Marianne Williamson speak on a doc or something that aired on PBS. She stated that the ancient Greeks realized couples were only meant to stay together for a period of time in their lives, then they moved on to find other mates to fit whatever stage in their life they were going through.

It was said that religions brought on the "life-long" attachments, as they didn't want people going off having multiple partners, or whatever it was.

As I look, I see our society has programmed us to still be on this earth to mate and reproduce.
It is also looked down upon to be single. I see this because I see more dating sites and commercials and groups and therapy to aid that "single plight".

It gets easier and easier to see how society wants to keep us busier than busy finding a mate, and when that one doesn't work out, finding another.

It gets easier and easier to see that when we are all wrapped up in relationships, or the act of obtaining a relationship, that we are FAR too busy to see what is really going on around us.

The corporate/gov't lies and deceits don't seem near as real when you are either falling in love, in the honeymoon phase, or ripped and torn over the last relationship that ended.

Testosterone noted and aside, there are many reasons relationships can be detrimental to our ascension.

Or maybe it's just part of natures plan to keep you with your mate.
If the hormone level naturally goes down, then potentially you shouldn't really feel the need to go being the big testosterone lady hunter.
www.psypost.org...

Honestly, at first, upon reading your title, I opened this thread because I wanted a good laugh....

BUT, you actually addressed questions I myself have had. Many times I've asked these same exact questions.
I'm known, amongst my circle of friends, of being the very faithful guy. I've never cheated, I'm always honest, and I never hold back anything, as far a truth goes, from my girlfriends. My policy is: Always tell the truth, even if it's gonna hurt, because it will only help in the long run. I'm also the 'advice' guy, and many people tend to ask me about relationships, even some people I don't know.

With that said, to back your theory up, I may not have ever cheated, but I have definitely had the urge. Several times. I've asked myself, "Is this wrong to have intentions that indicate being unfaithful, when they're coming naturally?" It's not like I want to hurt my significant other, and I want to NOT be attracted physically/sexually to another girl, but it's just the truth. What would happen if I told my girlfriend that truth? I'm only being honest.....

I believe people can find that 'one' person if they share a multitude of common and similar traits and likes, but that's quite rare. Especially in California/America. Opposites DON'T attract by the way. I believe that we can be monogamous, but is it normal? Why do so many claim to 'know' that is the right way? There's only a few animals in the animal kingdom that have such relationships. The rest seem to follow a very, very open relationship.

So, I'm curious as to what people will say as well. And I would love for some to post some psychology reports on the subject. And, great job OP. Thanks for asking this, although, you're gonna definitely get the 'other' side of the spectrum, that's gonna scream, "You're wrong!" when you're merely asking a simple question....

I have a hard time believing that TBTP are promoting both procreation (through monogamy) and eugenics.

I know they like their double-speak, but it seems counter-intuitive to encourage people to have babies while at the same time planning to minimize the human population.

Originally posted by ItsEvolutionBaby
OK here it goes-- a few years ago I heard Marianne Williamson speak on a doc or something that aired on PBS. She stated that the ancient Greeks realized couples were only meant to stay together for a period of time in their lives, then they moved on to find other mates to fit whatever stage in their life they were going through.

Excellent thread OP. As for EB, It makes sense what Marianne Williamson stated. I myself have completely changed what I want in a relationship throughout the different periods of life. Now i'm only 29, but what what i want in a man is completely different than i wanted in a man in my early 20's. Before it was just about having fun and now its someone that i can grow and understand me spiritually (not the religious kind, but just self growth). Thanks for posting that info. Maybe that explains why so many people end up in divorces because they try to adjust who they can grow with at different periods of their life. Ill try to search for the documentary

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
ok...i'm providing a link to one source (you can google/yahoo and find many more)

Commitment to a Romantic Relationship Lowers Testosterone in Men

...but basically...



being in a committed, monogamous relationship lowers testosterone in men. hence...so many men have problems with premature ejaculation and erectile dysfunction (not saying that relationships cause all of these problems). i mean...pretty much every man i know, over like 30...who is married with kids (or even been with the same woman for more than 5 years) wants to cheat...feels like less of a man...has problems with PE and/or ED (hence the overwhelming flood of commercials/banners for vaigra/cialis/other sexual performance drugs/herbs/pills). most men who are committed like this also have nearly no desire to have sex with their committed mate and have this uncontrollable urge to cheat (hence so many men having a "porn problem" or wanting to jack off rather than have sex with their wife).

could it be...that, genetically (and instinctively), humans are not meant for monogamous relationships? could it be that part of the essence of man (possibly even woman) would include sexual variety? could it be that, perhaps, humans weren't meant for monogamous relationships? maybe we're meant to sleep around????

well then...why does the Bible preach to be faithful? to take one partner? to not masturbate? hmmm...good question??? MAYBE...it was all designed to throw us off track? maybe..TPTB started this lie that we're supposed to only find one mate!

why you ask??? hmmm...same reason as water fluoridation? to keep men from being men? to keep people in constant turmoil. i mean...what if...God designed us to sleep around? NO EFFING WONDER COUPLES FIGHT SOOO MUCH! even if you love the person..you wanna leave. "but...the bible says not to. the bible says you're supposed to stay together, through thick and thin. my parents did it." probably one of the responses running through your head. and now...i'm sure there are some exceptions. maybe there are some who break this mold i'm making in my head

i mean..everyone does it. everyone stays together and ends up spending their entire marriages in different rooms (her in the kitchen/living room...him in the shed/den).

the majority of couples i know who've been together more than 5 years...yes...they may still love each other...but deep down...they feel this desire to run and start over. what if that's natural? what if that's the way it's supposed to be? what if we're only supposed to fall in love/lust...learn something from that relationship (no matter how long or short you're together) and move on?

i mean...it would explain why so many true love marriages turn into divorce. why pretty much everyone wants to cheat (at least once, at some point). why relationships are usually only "fun" for so long (be it a couple months or a couple years). it would explain why the love never dies..but the desire to be around that person kinda fades away. it would also explain the church's strict abhorrence of homosexuality (homos can't make kids). i mean...of all the laws in the old testament...people love to quote the anti-gay laws (when there are laws that say not to wear clothing woven of two different fabrics in the same book as the gay laws...Leviticus).

maybe...just maybe...we're going against our natural drive by staying in a relationship for soooo long. maybe...just maybe...the great architects just fooled humanity into thinking we need to stay together so that we could produce more slaves (kids) and spend our entire lives trying to raise a family and pay a mortgage note. maybe...just maybe...relationships and marriages are just part of the enslavement scheme.

and...go ahead and bash me bible thumpers/dr phil...

edit on 9/28/11 by ICEKOHLD because: (no reason given)

So basically, anyone in disagreement with your vein, superficial perspective is going to be labeled or called names by you. Please. I am thinking you are either to young to "know" anything about it or you look like Dr. Phil and you can not find anyone to stay with your gimpy self absorbed arse.

reply to post by AskWhy11


thanks man. i'm just like you! i have never cheated. the thought of cheating on my gf now repulses me. i do love her. and i do CHERISH truth. funny...truth is my number one thing. everyone knows i speak the truth...even when i shouldn't. yes...i am too honest.

i've actually had this talk with my gf...and you know what? she gets it. we've actually had talks about trying out a 3some. she is attracted to woman and understands my standpoint. neither of us are saying it's true...but that it could be...it does make sense. and we are treading into these waters lightly.

i really do think that there is something to this. i mean...think of all the great/wise kings...they had concubines/sex slaves/servants...hell..Solomon...the wisest king in the good book...had like 300 something concubines. i do not think that monogamous relationships are "natural". i think they have been kind of bred into us. i mean..if it were natural...why would it be such a (almost) natural urge to cheat? i think that urge for variety is meant to be fulfilled. but...it is a tricky situation because of how deeply engrained it is the society's mind that it is wrong. again...i think it is bs...yet...i have never cheated nor could i ever. why? because it is wrong to lie. and if you tell the truth...it's no longer cheating. so yes...cheating is wrong. wanting to have sex with others??? not so much.

yeah...those darn architects sure did lead us asunder. i am having the time of my life watching them lose their grip on society over the past year or so...as the people are beginning to awaken!. soon enough...they will have lost control...and then..we will be free...ON ALL ACCOUNTS!

Originally posted by blackmetalmist

Originally posted by ItsEvolutionBaby
OK here it goes-- a few years ago I heard Marianne Williamson speak on a doc or something that aired on PBS. She stated that the ancient Greeks realized couples were only meant to stay together for a period of time in their lives, then they moved on to find other mates to fit whatever stage in their life they were going through.

Excellent thread OP. As for EB, It makes sense what Marianne Williamson stated. I myself have completely changed what I want in a relationship throughout the different periods of life. Now i'm only 29, but what what i want in a man is completely different than i wanted in a man in my early 20's. Before it was just about having fun and now its someone that i can grow and understand me spiritually (not the religious kind, but just self growth). Thanks for posting that info. Maybe that explains why so many people end up in divorces because they try to adjust who they can grow with at different periods of their life. Ill try to search for the documentary

oops in a hurry here, and this post will look like a whole quote-- I don't have time to search it out this morning, so thanks for the offer of trying to find that doc.
It seems I saw it about 6 years ago... it stuck with me, because it made so much sense.
Then I noticed a billion or so dollar industry was being built to keep people busy looking for that one mate - and busy busy busy!

Also good note re: if you would have found a mate in your youth, how they probably wouldn't be the right individual for your life now. Wait til you hit your mid-life! All those bald men driving corvette convertibles - aah yes some things never change--

reply to post by Turkenstein


no. i wasn't saying that if you disagree you're a bible thumper/dr phil. i said that the bible thumpers and dr phils could go ahead and bash me.

notice the people who posted above you...that don't agree with me...didn't bash me. they simply stated their point...said they didn't agree...and did so in a calm, mature manner (unlike you)? yeah...they probably aren't disagreeing with me from a religious point. point proven! thanks. star for you!

reply to post by ICEKOHLD

I actually think you are onto something. I don't think it is human nature to stay in relationship with same partner for more or less most of their life.
I has even been proven by science that the feelings of love weaken over time.

If you truly look at people who have stuck together most of their life they dont really seem that happy. Most seems to just stick together for their children or families sake.

You see the same thing in animal kingdom. Very few animals have the same partner throughout their life.

reply to post by blackmetalmist


exactly. i think that a couple can stay together if they by each while they each kinda go their own way. and this isn't even about sexuality (which i'm glad you took it past that with your thoughts of spirituality). i'm going through an extremely spiritual point in my life (check my signature).

honestly...i have little sex drive right now.i love my gf. i think she's attractive. even the talks of 3somes don't really get me going. so this isn't even really like a plea for strange sexual partners. i really am going through an EXTREMELY big growth point in my life. i am becoming such a spiritual being as of lately.

i just feel that people put oo much emphasis on their relationship and lose themselves. my gf and i are both going through a lot right now with this awakening. i'm glad we're both feeling it. if she weren't...i couldn't be with her. i just think that relationships can only last if the partners are either headed in the same direction or are willing to stand by and hold the others hand whilst they each walk their own path.

I wouldn't cheat on my wife.

But, I do acknowledge that our nature is likely not monogamous. I think it's more of a societal custom than a natural drive. However, I do like the perks of a monogamous relationship, the stability of it, and my wife is more than that, she is also my best friend.

Society is all about suppressing our natural urges for mutual benefit. I mean, someone ticks us off, we want revenge, but we suppress our urges to follow laws. We see an attractive person, we admire them, not run over and rape them. Just because something is a natural urge, doesn't mean we can't control our natural inclinations with our intelligence, and our minds.

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
reply to post by Turkenstein

 

no. i wasn't saying that if you disagree you're a bible thumper/dr phil. i said that the bible thumpers and dr phils could go ahead and bash me.

notice the people who posted above you...that don't agree with me...didn't bash me. they simply stated their point...said they didn't agree...and did so in a calm, mature manner (unlike you)? yeah...they probably aren't disagreeing with me from a religious point. point proven! thanks. star for you!

Point proven? It sounds a lot like you are you insinuating that I was coming from a religious standpoint? If so, you can save that point proven baloney for someone else. I was simply pointing out that you seem to be an instigator of anyone who is in disagreement with you beyond a passive "i disagree, respectfully." Your little closing disclaimer on the original post and the reply to me exposes you for the child that you are. What is this reply if it isn't to paint me religious? Thanks for the star, and your confirming reply.

Originally posted by ICEKOHLD
ok...i'm providing a link to one source (you can google/yahoo and find many more)

Commitment to a Romantic Relationship Lowers Testosterone in Men

...but basically...



being in a committed, monogamous relationship lowers testosterone in men. hence...so many men have problems with premature ejaculation and erectile dysfunction (not saying that relationships cause all of these problems). i mean...pretty much every man i know, over like 30...who is married with kids (or even been with the same woman for more than 5 years) wants to cheat...feels like less of a man...has problems with PE and/or ED (hence the overwhelming flood of commercials/banners for vaigra/cialis/other sexual performance drugs/herbs/pills). most men who are committed like this also have nearly no desire to have sex with their committed mate and have this uncontrollable urge to cheat (hence so many men having a "porn problem" or wanting to jack off rather than have sex with their wife).

could it be...that, genetically (and instinctively), humans are not meant for monogamous relationships? could it be that part of the essence of man (possibly even woman) would include sexual variety? could it be that, perhaps, humans weren't meant for monogamous relationships? maybe we're meant to sleep around????

well then...why does the Bible preach to be faithful? to take one partner? to not masturbate? hmmm...good question??? MAYBE...it was all designed to throw us off track? maybe..TPTB started this lie that we're supposed to only find one mate!

why you ask??? hmmm...same reason as water fluoridation? to keep men from being men? to keep people in constant turmoil. i mean...what if...God designed us to sleep around? NO EFFING WONDER COUPLES FIGHT SOOO MUCH! even if you love the person..you wanna leave. "but...the bible says not to. the bible says you're supposed to stay together, through thick and thin. my parents did it." probably one of the responses running through your head. and now...i'm sure there are some exceptions. maybe there are some who break this mold i'm making in my head

i mean..everyone does it. everyone stays together and ends up spending their entire marriages in different rooms (her in the kitchen/living room...him in the shed/den).

the majority of couples i know who've been together more than 5 years...yes...they may still love each other...but deep down...they feel this desire to run and start over. what if that's natural? what if that's the way it's supposed to be? what if we're only supposed to fall in love/lust...learn something from that relationship (no matter how long or short you're together) and move on?

i mean...it would explain why so many true love marriages turn into divorce. why pretty much everyone wants to cheat (at least once, at some point). why relationships are usually only "fun" for so long (be it a couple months or a couple years). it would explain why the love never dies..but the desire to be around that person kinda fades away. it would also explain the church's strict abhorrence of homosexuality (homos can't make kids). i mean...of all the laws in the old testament...people love to quote the anti-gay laws (when there are laws that say not to wear clothing woven of two different fabrics in the same book as the gay laws...Leviticus).

maybe...just maybe...we're going against our natural drive by staying in a relationship for soooo long. maybe...just maybe...the great architects just fooled humanity into thinking we need to stay together so that we could produce more slaves (kids) and spend our entire lives trying to raise a family and pay a mortgage note. maybe...just maybe...relationships and marriages are just part of the enslavement scheme.

and...go ahead and bash me bible thumpers/dr phil...

edit on 9/28/11 by ICEKOHLD because: (no reason given)

Now, to reply to the actual subject matter beyond the veiled "i dare yas." It has been the subject of many medical studies that try to explain that it is in man's nature to want to spread his seed as far as possible to promote the race. On the female side of the fence, they are unknowingly always looking for the best potential mate. I think these primal urges are what makes monogomous relationships so tough. It is easier to imagine seeing someone else after being in a relationship for a long time because you have already learned all the faults of the person you are with. When you start looking for somerthing else you are normally hunting for this imagined perfect person when in reality we all have our faults. A guy once told me a saying that has stuck with me, "show me the most beautiful woman on the planet and I bet there is at least one guy out there who is tired of her B.S." I alway thought that said a lot when you think about it.

Provocative post OP - kudos to you!!

Although I disagree with the proposition of monogamy being a mechanism of TPTB, I do agree that it's an unnatural state. It's generally accepted within evolutionary psychology that monogamy was formed once it was apparant that offspring experienced improved survival rates when parenting was shared. Its corresponding biochemical origins in pair bonding, or the chemical cocktail bathing our brains as we fall in love, is still being debated.

That said, there are many angles from which the phenomenon is perceived. Yes, testosterone levels in men decrease, as they do in women, once the first six months of a new love relationship is completed. It is only during those six months that the brain releases oxytocin and seratonin at rates that cannot be maintained (and they literally blind us to red flags). However, once the relationship results in childbirth, the mother's oxytocin production increases again to facilitate bonding with an infant. For the man, nothing happens. This failure for men's brains to "recover" its happy chemicals is further compounded by the fact that the mother's brain chemistry is set up to regard anyone outside the mother-baby relationship as an interloper - even the dad. This feature argues the point further, hitting home the idea that, at least biochemically speaking, monogamy is really only good for offspring.

I think as the landscape of marriage evolves, more and more plural relationships will become mainsstream. They've defined every egalitarian society (where men and women have equal influence and access to resources) because dependence on one part of the populus fades, as has happened in the US over the last several decades. Divorce skyrocketed because the dynamic of female dependence upon male breadwinning began to disappear. Once equality is maintained, both men and women will define the territory of their relationships. And hopefully they won't be too hard on those fringe practitioners of monogamy.

I am not sure we were designed to be monogamous,but sexually transmitted diseases are an excellent reason to be.It is too risky to take on the wanton behavior of the ancients with STDs looming everywhere.Self-control is necessary in many aspects of life today,including relationships. The Greeks werent exactly known for being level-headed in matters of sex and romance. They indulged their decadence. Many were pedophiles for pitysake. In modern society we have a broader understanding of what all sexual urges involve. We all have fantasies and get fed up with monogamy at one time or another but in a loving,committed foundation those feelings are fleeting if we have the power of reason not to give in to every temptation that comes our way. With or without a spiritual belief system to tell us otherwise.

No OP,the TPTB do not support relationship's they destroy them.Couples and families have something to unite them and something to fight to defend.TPTB destroy relationship's by setting the social norms in society.They allow programing on your television that show you things,making them socially acceptable.How many show's have someone having an affair? How many movies are about a group of guy's trying to score a one night stand?
Many years ago couples on television were shown as being in individual single beds,that was durring the time that marriges actually lasted to the end.
Now cheating or scoring a one night stand is endorsed on television (even comes with dubbed laughter).Hence endorsed by the TPTB.Do you think that politician's if they were true to the holy,righteous persona's that they project couldn't stamp out pornography or at least drive it underground?Oh know that would be politically incorrect or anti-freedom of expression! Bullock's these weren't our expression's until we were taught them.Pornography paint's a false sense of reality,with unobtainable expectations.Hence the partner fails to meet expectations and the relationship dies or cheating begins.Pornography is a major social killer that break's down families,put's alot of confused angry kid's of single mum's or dad's on the street's.These kid's in turn don't know how to create a healthy realationship as they have never seen one and the problem grow's like a cancer.

reply to post by ICEKOHLD


Dude you either are, or you are not, if you have to try and its a constant battle then your are most likely not the monogamous type....End of Story. You should ask yourself, why do you care what a book says about what you want to do and are doing. Really if you need a book a whole religion and mind-frame trap for you to be monogamous then that says it all about you.

Everything is natural, so do as you will. But everything has its price, remember that even for the most monogamous by nature it still is a thing that they have to work at, to achieve.

But yes monogamy is a new creation, and not in the natural instinct and order of pretty much all humans walking the planet. In fact it was only started being implemented really after the fall of Babylon and mostly as a way of keeping males from leaving all there kids everywhere, and females from dropping there fetuses everywhere and all the crazy things they did. Though I am sure you would not believe me in that, but like it matters. And that which was the cause of what i said above, all the promiscuity that was going around which lead to a bunch of problems.

You know some order had to be implemented, either by sword, or by fire, but sooner or latter memetic constructs were constructed in keeping populations within check a little, and of course we know them today as the major religions of the world, for that was one of there major purposes and functions. And so the love goddess of Babylon became the whore of Babylon, oh yes things were different back then, but the more things changed the more they stayed the same.

So yes relationships are a part of the TPTB's plan, its either that and some order, or we can go back to the sword and fire, that really keeps people and whole populations in line. So many things going on in this subject one could write a bunch of books about it, but most of them, no one would believe. Or they wouldn't want to believe.