The real reason why the truth movement clings to their theories

reply to post by micpsi


The government can either pull off anything, so they can pull off those wars without 911, or they can not pull everything, and need to go through extreme efforts (such as 911) to pull off something. You can't have it both ways, the ability to pull off anything and requiring complex operations to pull off something.

So the logic here is severely flawed. The argument that the government can pull of anything because they control the media and money is false.

Wow, another truther bashing thread, keep it up guys, we must be doing something good.

So you have decided to apply your principles to everyone OP? You being fearful and needing a nanny state to keep your hand is not making the rest of us like you, luckily.

reply to post by Saltarello


The only bashing being done on this thread, is coming from posters like you. This is just another thread examining the psychology of people who are unable to accept that the US Government is not the well oiled, evil, entity that they believe it is.

reply to post by GrinchNoMore


If your post had any basis in reality, there might be something to discuss.

Although, with the posts so far that show a need to lash out at my OP, one might think I hit pretty close to the truth.

reply to post by -PLB-

I don't believe that fear is the main motivator. I think it is the feeling of greatness, of being "awoken", of being able to see through all the lies, being one of the few who has the wits to figure it all out, of being special in an otherwise pretty much meaningless life. I think this feeling is addictive and people will go through great lengths in order to keep it.

You hit the nail on the head with that observation (opinion). When i was young i almost fell into that trap myself, when you are young you think you know everything.
i also tend to think there might be an Oedipal type thing happening with all of the anti-authoritarianism that gets posted.

So along with the OPs - Fear, and your - feeling of being in the know, we can perhaps add a dislike or distrust of dad (authority or Big Brother). Maybe it's a mix of the three. Also, perhaps with some good old fashioned paranoia and mental problems (don't forget two ATS members became notorious mass murderers).

i've been trying to figure it out. i read posts condeming MSM when most of the info on ATS uses the MSM. i read posts where it automatically is assumed the US gov is lying as if other goverments wouldn't lie or can't control what the US does within their borders.

And when asked the questions: To what end? What purpose would it serve? It winds up being evil ancient societies (or families), reptilians from outer space or some other conspiracy in which for anyone to believe would have to mean our whole basis of reality which has gotten mankind to this *amazing point of history is all a sham. And yet if it is all a sham what reality is there to replace it with?
[*amazing point of history - ie: computers, refrigeration, engines, skyscrapers, highways, federal parks, medical breakthroughs, farm production, gains in civil rights, oceanic and space exploration and everything else that's taken for granted.]

It is my opinion that if there is an "evil" agenda or grand conspiracy those perpetrating it are particularly inept at it, as our current lifestyles are pretty good www.reddit.com....

reply to post by vipertech0596


The American people have been lied to countless times.

That is WHY the truth movement clings to their theories.....history has shown us that secrets do exist and often are not revealed to the public.

Or else they're no longer secrets.

Here are a couple ....

1.) The Manhattan Project - Secrets held by Thousands ...

2.) WWII Internment Camps - Japanese American US Citizens Constitutional rights denied due their Race

3.) The USS Liberty - US Naval Vessel attacked by Israel our Ally ??? Failed False Flag ???


Once you have been lied to over and over again by a Liar, you begin to doubt anything you are told.

This is why the TRUTH movement clings to their theories

Originally posted by vipertech0596
reply to post by GrinchNoMore

 

If your post had any basis in reality, there might be something to discuss.

Although, with the posts so far that show a need to lash out at my OP, one might think I hit pretty close to the truth.

Lol poor deluded guy, or girl, whatever, yes we all believe all you say about yourself and the government, just pass the koolaid. Cant really lash the OP, shallow and with no taste.

Originally posted by nh_ee

 

Or else they're no longer secrets.

Here are a couple ....

1.) The Manhattan Project - Secrets held by Thousands ...

...and when the bomb went off, every single one of them instantly knew what it was they were working on. Even then, the Soviets were able to infiltrate the project and steal nuclear secrets.

2.) WWII Internment Camps - Japanese American US Citizens Constitutional rights denied due their Race

This wasn't kept secret. It was well known by everyone, and photographers like Dorothea Lang created very good photographic documentation on them. I have her book.

3.) The USS Liberty - US Naval Vessel attacked by Israel our Allie

How was this a secret? Israel admitted they attacked it and coughed up restitution to the families of the crewmen who were killed.

Once you have been lied to over and over again by a Liar, you begin to doubt anything you are told.

...but apparently not everyone here is getting the message (cough cough).

Originally posted by nh_ee
reply to post by vipertech0596

 

The American people have been lied to countless times.

That is WHY the truth movement clings to their theories.....history has shown us that secrets do exist and often are not revealed to the public.

Or else they're no longer secrets.

Here are a couple ....

1.) The Manhattan Project - Secrets held by Thousands ...

2.) WWII Internment Camps - Japanese American US Citizens Constitutional rights denied due their Race

3.) The USS Liberty - US Naval Vessel attacked by Israel our Ally ??? Failed False Flag ???


Once you have been lied to over and over again by a Liar, you begin to doubt anything you are told.

This is why the TRUTH movement clings to their theories

edit on 27-9-2011 by nh_ee because: typos

i'm pretty sure out of the three examples you gave only the first one was kept a secret and only while it was part of national security during war time, now it is in children history books (since the 50s that i'm positively aware of).

The Liberty incident ocurred in 1967 and by 1968 Israel paid restitution to victims families and the US gov. (that's hardly a secret). Anyway, if anything it was Israel lying about it being a case of mistaken identity.

And Japanese internment camps weren't secret and were done under executive order (although wrong in terms of bigotry and civil rights). It also only included Japanese who lived on the coast and not anywhere else.

The reason you know the government lies sometimes is because they are caught lying sometimes. The government is not a singular *entity as in your saying "lied to over and over again by a *Liar".
Some government employees in some agencies have lied and been caught lying and the probability is that some folks have gotten away with it. But because Joe senator lied about using funds wrongly you can't say Jane NASA aerospace engineer is also a liar. The US government is huge and consists of many many agencies and people with no conections between them other than they fall under the term US Government. The people in government positions today are not the same people who were there even 40 years ago (some positions are not even the same people as last week). The amounts of people all keeping "Government secrets" would be so vast and over the course of history that it is an impossibility for such large conspiracies to exist for any amout of time. Any exception would be for the time period of a career or at the most an adult lifetime of a few individuals. Unless of course there really is lizard people who live indefinitely and not permanately on the Earth.

PS. you also said, "here are a couple", then listed three... i know just a dumb mistake but it was kinda funny

See Good Ol Dave above

reply to post by vipertech0596


it's cool how everyone fits into their little box. "All truthers" box is filled with those nutty no planers and DEW wackos, while the "OS Believers" box is filled with those obstinate, hard headed old guys who refuse to even contemplate anything other than what is "supposed to be said".

Just to let you know, in the real world, away from your keyboard, there are many different types of people. Some would like nothing better than to be able to just believe that the OS is 100% right, but find it so incredibly difficult due to some nagging questions. Some of these people aren't out to vilify the gubbament, or make Bin Laden a saint, they just think a few aspects of the story are very hard to swallow.

But I do understand how intelligent thought is a big challenge and should be replaced with ignorant rants whenever possible.

reply to post by vipertech0596


The worst conspiracy out there aside from the micro-nuke theory, is that the theory that it was simply 19 cave men from across the world who did it without any help except maybe direction from Osama Bin Ladin.

I can't speak for everyone else but the reason I believe the conspiracy facts out there is because George Bush said something I believed. George Bush directly implied he was involved with the 9/11 terrorist attacks. Thats a conspiracy fact, whereas the 19 cave-men nonsense which is a conspiracy theory, and I don't buy into conspiracy theories unless there are supporting facts which make them conspiracy facts rather than conspiracy theories.

I thought they clung to their beliefs because they felt like something was wrong and found something of interest and valid in alternative research and found/heard about holes in the official story.

Personally, I don't really know what happened because I don't care enough to research it, but I do know that there are certain branches of the U.S. government that are extremely efficient, and while it takes forever for communication to take place, once it does, most branches are Johnny-on-the-spot.

To me, it sounds like you're dismissing them out of hand because you're thinking that the massive reams of red tape are synonymous with the competency of the people involved, which is far from the truth from what I've seen and heard.

Originally posted by bussoboy
Where is the incontrovertible evidence that proves that truthers cannot accept a substantial body of cold hard evidence that proves the events happened as the government claimed?

Whatever happened to all the incontrovertible truth that many involved in the 911 commission claim it was all a sham and a cover up?

Whatever happened to the incontrovertible truth that many of the witnesses who say I saw this and that are immediately vilified by the government who tells them... "No. You didn't see what you saw and you didn't hear what you heard and if you keep insisting ... you are a kook." Such as ... William Rodriguez.

Vilify. vilify, vilify. Obfuscate, obfuscate, obfuscate. Lie, repeat. Lie, repeat. Lie, repeat. It works the same in any country ... lack of patriotism. You are either with us, or you are with the terrorists. And ... no, you can not see all those video's we have hidden from you. If we allow you to see them, it would be detrimental to ... National Security?

In truth, these conspiracy theories are a game, a bit like professional wrestling. Adherents suspend reality and partake in the "entertainment". They take on roles and personas. People like Icke become celebrities within the game, and make it more enjoyable. Players even form clans, or "alliances", and attack other players with differing views (roles).

It's all the more fun because they embrace the game wholeheartedly, and convince the other game players that it's reality, and anyone implying otherwise is to be degraded, as every time logic is used, it detracts from the game, and makes it less real.

Is it better to accept reality and be miserable, or is it better to embrace a world of fiction, which brings excitement and/or comfort? To people who dabble in the supernatural, follow far-fetched conspiracy theories, and join religions, the latter choice is taken.

Of course the Laws of Physics are incapable of giving a damn about the human race much less the government.

So why shouldn't we have accurate data on the distributions of steel and concrete down the building regardless of any of the psychological crap?

So are the pro-government people just as psychologically screwed up as the anti-government people.

psik

reply to post by psikeyhackr

Of course the Laws of Physics are incapable of giving a damn about the human race much less the government.

Apparently the laws of physics don't care about the laws of physics either:
www.washingtonpost.com...

So why shouldn't we have accurate data on the distributions of steel and concrete down the building regardless of any of the psychological crap?

Because, as you proved by coming to your conclusions two weeks after 9/11, the information is not needed.

So are the pro-government people just as psychologically screwed up as the anti-government people.

No.

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by psikeyhackr

 

Of course the Laws of Physics are incapable of giving a damn about the human race much less the government.

Apparently the laws of physics don't care about the laws of physics either:
www.washingtonpost.com...

ROFLMAO

It is really funny that you can't find an article that really specifies how much faster than light it is supposed to have been. The say 60 nanoseconds over a distance of 450 miles.

You have to calculate it for yourself and how many people can figure out the calculation?

It is a difference of 1/400th of 1%.

Warp 10 here we come.

Sorry, the WTC business is strictly Newtonian.

psik

reply to post by nh_ee

exactly......thankyou!

The real reason the government clings to their theory is because if the truth ever got out they would most likely go to jail. Or if not that, the wars would have no more myth to base themselves on, they're probably more worried about that since they have no souls to really care if they are alive or not, only money is what matters to them.

Originally posted by hooper
reply to post by psikeyhackr

 

So why shouldn't we have accurate data on the distributions of steel and concrete down the building regardless of any of the psychological crap?

Because, as you proved by coming to your conclusions two weeks after 9/11, the information is not needed.

Not needed by people who can figure out the obvious. Apparently morons need to be beaten over the head.

The 9/11 Decade is a psychological issue. The marketing people have had decades of practice.

Economists can't talk about the planned obsolescence of automobiles and report the total depreciation of all of the cars in any country. Consistent global stupidity. Ignoring physics again.

psik