It looks like you're using an Ad Blocker.

Please white-list or disable AboveTopSecret.com in your ad-blocking tool.

Thank you.

 

Some features of ATS will be disabled while you continue to use an ad-blocker.

 

The Lavon Affair: Could Isreal Be Behind 911? Are they really allies Or a Trojan Horse?

page: 1
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join
share:

posted on Aug, 26 2004 @ 06:09 AM
link   
This post is not intended to be flame bait, nor is it a mud pit discussion.

Alot of questions surround 911 and who was involved. One persistent claim is that the state of Isreal and its intelligence agency the Mossad may have either been behind the attack or allowed them to happen to further its political agenda.

There is a historical precidence for this type of activity from Isreal. In 1954 Egypt was plagued by a series of bombings that appeared to target American and British property in the cities of Cairo and Alexandria. the general assumption was the a nationalistic group called the "Moselem Brothers" were opposed to Nasser giving any concessions to the British to leave thier Suez bases. These bombings as it turned out were orcestrated by Isreal in an attempt to poison the relationship between the UK, US and Egypt.

In October of that year, the world was shocked when the Egyptian Minister of the Interior, Zakaria Muhieddin, announced the break-up of a thirteen-man Israeli sabotage network.



Indignation increased when, on 11 December, the group was brought to trial. In the Israeli parliament, Prime Minister Moshe Sharett denounced the 'wicked plot hatched in Alexandria ... the show trial which is being organized there against a group of Jews who have fallen victims to false accusations and from who mit seems attempts are being made to extract confessions of imaginary crimes, by threats and torture . . .'49 The trade union newspaper Davar observed that the Egyptian regime 'seems to take its inspiration from the Nazis' and lamented the 'deterioration in the status of Egyptian Jews in general'.50 For Haaretz the trial 'proved that the Egyptian rulers do not hesitate to invent the most fantastic accusations if it suits them'; it added that 'in the present state of affairs in Egypt the junta certainly needs some diversions'.51 And the next day the .7erusalem Post carried this headline: 'Egypt Show Trial Arouses Israel, Sharett Tells House. Sees Inquisition Practices Revived.'

Indignation increased when, on 11 December, the group was brought to trial. In the Israeli parliament, Prime Minister Moshe Sharett denounced the 'wicked plot hatched in Alexandria ... the show trial which is being organized there against a group of Jews who have fallen victims to false accusations and from who mit seems attempts are being made to extract confessions of imaginary crimes, by threats and torture. The trade union newspaper Davar observed that the Egyptian regime 'seems to take its inspiration from the Nazis' and lamented the 'deterioration in the status of Egyptian Jews in general'. For Haaretz the trial 'proved that the Egyptian rulers do not hesitate to invent the most fantastic accusations if it suits them'; it added that 'in the present state of affairs in Egypt the junta certainly needs some diversions'.And the next day the Jerusalem Post carried this headline: 'Egypt Show Trial Arouses Israel, Sharett Tells House. Sees Inquisition Practices Revived.'


Isreal used the hangings as reason for thier 1955 attack on Gaza.



This whole episode, which was to poison Israeli political life for a decade and more, came to be known as the 'Lavon Affair', for it had been established in the Cairo trial that Lavon, as Minister of Defence, had approved the campaign of sabotage. At least so the available evidence made it appear. But in Israel, Lavon had asked Moshe Sharett for a secret inquiry into a matter about which the cabinet knew nothing. Benyamin Givli, the intelligence chief, claimed that the so-called 'security operation' had been authorized by Lavon himself



Fast foreward to September 11th: Givent the fact that Isreal has shown a willingness as put forth in the Lavon Affair to run "False Flag" operations against the US, one has to wonder about the events that surrounded that day.

The first case is the group of Isreali men with ties or suspected ties filming the burning trade centers and posing for pictures, high fiving, and filming the events of the day. The FBI has refused to comment, but the filming supposedly starts before the first plane hits. The owner of the moving company that the five worked for fled to Isreal before officials could ask him any questions.


"The night before the attacks on the World Trade Towers, men using those stolen identities visited bars and strip clubs, making sure they would be noticed and remembered by all they met. Students of Islam will confirm that no Muslim devout enough to be willing to commit suicide would spend the night before he was to meet Allah violating so many of Islam's laws regarding alcohol and nude women"

Mohamed Atta's passport was found within a few blockes of the collapsed towers (the one he had reported missing years ago) intact despite all the distruction.

"ICTS is [...] an Israeli owned company, and [...] it sells services to every airport from which the hijacked planes operated, including security, sometimes through wholly owned subsidiaries like Huntleigh USA Corporation. "

" it has been suggested that the incredible feat of hijacking four aircraft without a single arrest at the gate would require the resources of a nation-state. This is even more true with the revelation that at least one gun had managed to be aboard a hijacked plane. One company had automatic inside access to all of the airports from which hijacked planes departed on 9-11, and to the airports used by Richard Reid, the shoe bomber. An Israeli company. One that Mossad agents could easily find employment with without the management knowing who they were or what their purpose really was."

"Contrary to early reports (including a statement by George Bush) of large numbers of Israelis being killed in the 9-11 attacks, only two Israelis died, both passengers on the airplanes. No Israelis working in or near the World Trade Towers died. The foreign press has long rumored that Israelis were given an advance warning not to go to work on 9-11, and in the case of Odigo, an Israeli company with offices located near the World Trade Towers, the existence of a warning message sent before the four aircraft had even left the ground is an established fact. That someone in Israel knew of the attacks ahead of time is beyond question."
The above two were taken from: www.whatreallyhappened.com...

Other sourses dealing with Isreal spy ring int he US
www.forward.com...
www.whatreallyhappened.com...

These are but a few of the things that point to an Isreali Involvement. Do people feel that this is plausable? Isreal has attacked the US before (the USS Liberty incident) and Jonathan Pollard sold nuclear secrets to Isreal who may have in turn given them to the USSR in kind for increased imigration of Soviet Jews. Add to that the lavon affair, it makes for an interesting picture

[edit on 28-8-2004 by FredT]




posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 07:44 PM
link   
Funny how this thread has gone ignored.

Fred I know all about The Lavon Affair and also the attack on the USS LIBERTY. More people should be paying attention to this.




Cover-Up Alleged in Probe of USS Liberty
A former Navy attorney who helped lead the military investigation of the 1967 Israeli attack on the USS Liberty that killed 34 American servicemen says former President Lyndon Johnson and his defense secretary, Robert McNamara, ordered that the inquiry conclude the incident was an accident.

In a signed affidavit released at a Capitol Hill news conference, retired Capt. Ward Boston said Johnson and McNamara told those heading the Navy's inquiry to "conclude that the attack was a case of 'mistaken identity' despite overwhelming evidence to the contrary."

It was one of the classic all-American cover-ups, said retired Admiral Thomas Moorer, a former Joint Chiefs of Staff chairman who spent a year investigating the attack as part of an independent panel he formed with other former military officials. The panel also included a former US ambassador to Saudi Arabia, James Akins.

Torpedo hole in USS Liberty
Why would our government put Israels interests ahead of our own? Moorer asked from his wheelchair at the news conference. He was chief of naval operations at the time of the attack.

Moorer, who has long held that the attack was a deliberate act, wants Congress to investigate.

Please visit the link provided for the complete story.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 07:47 PM
link   
There are hundreds of Mossad agents running around in the US. Pollard was the tip of the iceberg. Isreal has sold our tech to the Russina in the past to get them to allow more imagration. The list of offenses goes on and on. NOVA did a great piece on how Isreals lobby influences media and news in the US.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 07:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by FredT
There are hundreds of Mossad agents running around in the US. Pollard was the tip of the iceberg. Isreal has sold our tech to the Russina in the past to get them to allow more imagration. The list of offenses goes on and on. NOVA did a great piece on how Isreals lobby influences media and news in the US.


Yeah especially these sorry sons of bitches at the ADL who like to scream "anti semitism" every time someone even tries to criticize Israel.

ADL = Anti Defamation League



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 08:59 PM
link   
Do a google search on "Israeli Art students Incident"

www.google.be...

You'll be amazed how much Isreali Intelligence had to do with 9/11.
They had actualy been monitoring the 9/11 terrorists for a long long time on a day to day basis, not to mention they also kept a close eye on the activities of the US intelligence groups. Including snooping around inside US Intelligence offices and stuff like that.



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 09:26 PM
link   
YES YES YES, THANK YOU FRED T, I KNEW THERE WAS A REASON WE SEEM TO THINK ALIKE!

Isreal's involvement in 9/11? You bet you ass! Any close scrutiny of 9/11, both our govornment and thiers, shows the whole incident had the stink of Mossad activity all over it. Remeber, the CIA and the Mossad often know what one or the other is doing, and sometimes collaborate.

And thank you, Ocelot, for reminding us of the USS Liberty. That alone gives you your answer about Israel. Anyone who studied that sad day in 1967 would see just how close we were to a full blown nuke attack on Egypt, all because our ship was under attack, and they were getting info from Israel pointing to the Egyptians.

And youre right about the Lobbys. i gotta find that book, written by former congressmen, taloking about "The Lobby", as they call it. When they hear the Lobby commin, congress runs for cover. Shameful.

Dont these lobbyists realize the harm they are doing to Jews all over the world? They arent the ones who pay, its the average Jew at the wailing wall praying, or the average Jew trying to make a living that suffers.

The gains they get through trying to push and pressure govornments with agencies like the ADL (Americas own terrorist org) are petty and insiginifigant compared to the ruin and damage they end up inflicting on the average Jew.

Also remeber, right after 9/11, I do remeber the Mexican article about 2 Mossad agents arrested for trying to blow up the Mexican parliament, one moneth after the 9/11 attacks.

Go figure. yeah, the Israelis govornment has stabbed us in the back more times than i can count. Doing things, like running exstacy trade rings in the US and using Rabbis as pack animals. Gee.......way to rpomote ones religon. Sounds an awful lot like the CIA and thier crack pushing back in the 80s. Who gave who the idea?

Great post. Definitely way above!



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 10:50 PM
link   

Originally posted by thematrix
Do a google search on "Israeli Art students Incident"
You'll be amazed how much Isreali Intelligence had to do with 9/11.
They had actualy been monitoring the 9/11 terrorists for a long long time on a day to day basis, not to mention they also kept a close eye on the activities of the US intelligence groups. Including snooping around inside US Intelligence offices and stuff like that.


There is a theory that the "Art delegation" may have kidnaped and replaced Atta. Several pieces of evidence point to this:
1) The "art" students were in florida at the same time as Atta?
2) An instructor at the flight school knowing that Atta was fluent in German, approached "Atta" and tried to engage him in a converstaion in German. "Atta" did not understand a word.
3) How was Atta's passport that he had reported stolen 2 years prior appear intact in the wreckage of the towers?

Hmmmmmmmmmmm??????????



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 10:56 PM
link   

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
YES YES YES, THANK YOU FRED T, I KNEW THERE WAS A REASON WE SEEM TO THINK ALIKE!

Also remeber, right after 9/11, I do remeber the Mexican article about 2 Mossad agents arrested for trying to blow up the Mexican parliament, one moneth after the 9/11 attacks.


Thanks Skadi, I had posted it a night ago and was starting to wonder if anybody cared? The Liberty and Lavon incident are not conjecture or based on circumstantial evidence, they are proven FACTS that the media and the US government keeps quiet on. Ocelot was nice enough to follow a thread link in another topic and it bumped the post up for more people to see.

Another one, don't forget the Mossad guys arrested in New Zealand! Thank god thier prime minester has balls to stand up to them and not put up with thier CRAP!



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 11:06 PM
link   
I havent forgotten New Zealand. To tell you the truth, my big question is, what the hell were they doing there? is there something going on Down Under Im not aware of, that would catch the attention of the spider known as Mossad? I havent seen anything on that, and I am VERY curious. Wonder what they were up to?


Whats amusing yet tragic, is the US govornment refuses to talk about the USS Liberty incident, no matter, what, they simply clam up.

I find that disturbing, that the actions of some #hole Middle Eastern Country with questionable values and priorities, can scare the US govornment into Silence or colpliance. Oh, what goes on.....

I have been gone a few weeks, otherwise, I would have hit this topic as soon as I saw it. I feel this is really hardcore stuff worthy of discussion and ATS. No reptilians, Satanists, or psychics needed!



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 11:18 PM
link   
Of course Israel knew about 9-11 as well as 14 other nations that warned the Bush admin numerous times. Don't blame Israel for Bush not acting on valid multiple source warnings of highjacked aircraft hitting the WTC. Jordon, Kuwait, Morocco, Russia, France, Italy etc.etc. to see more check out Alex Jones site for more prior knowledge.

www.infowars.com...



posted on Aug, 27 2004 @ 11:47 PM
link   

Originally posted by Skadi_the_Evil_Elf
I havent forgotten New Zealand. To tell you the truth, my big question is, what the hell were they doing there? is there something going on Down Under Im not aware of, that would catch the attention of the spider known as Mossad? I havent seen anything on that, and I am VERY curious. Wonder what they were up to?


Not just that Skadi, where else? these are the ones that got caught, how many in how many countries? What are they doing? The Mossad has a history of kidnaping and murder in foreign countries. Anybody remeber Gerald Bull? What about those poor souls in Belgium (I think) that they wacked by mistake. Given the history and track record of the Mossad it is not for global peace and security..



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 05:15 AM
link   

Originally posted by FredT
Another one, don't forget the Mossad guys arrested in New Zealand! Thank god thier prime minester has balls to stand up to them and not put up with thier CRAP!


The NZ Prime Ministers name is actually.....Helen Clarke.
And figuratively, yes I do suppose she has quite the pair. Figuratively Kiwis....relax.

Fred, There have been numerous times when I havnt agreed with your views etc, but you seem to have a much more open mind that a lot of republicans I have had the pleasure (?) of reading on these boards.

Keep setting an example.
(the open mind kind)

There are probably a multitude of events affecting Down Under that could be linked to Mossad, but one conspiracy stands out the most. I dont have time to go into it, but I may dig up some links tomorrow. I may not necesarily believe 100%, but it pays to open your mind.

In the meantime, check the latest news:

FBI investigates Israeli spy claims

[edit on 28-8-2004 by cargo]



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 07:28 AM
link   
If Israel had anything to do with 9/11 (which I do believe they had) then it was not in secret against the USA, but in partnership.

And you wont get any non true Americans posting otherwise, as I am starting to think some Americans are just waking up and finding out things, but are to embarrassed (and so they should be) to say a word.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 10:04 AM
link   

Originally posted by SiCkBoY
If Israel had anything to do with 9/11 (which I do believe they had) then it was not in secret against the USA, but in partnership.

And you wont get any non true Americans posting otherwise, as I am starting to think some Americans are just waking up and finding out things, but are to embarrassed (and so they should be) to say a word.


Off base here- a few Americans have spouted this from THE day. I remember reading questions regarding the occupants of the buildings. Those questions asked if there were any Israelis in the buildings. SICk, it all goes to what is believeable- it is real hard to believe that a people that owe their continued existence to you would commit the acts.

Israel link to WTC?
Israel announces attack
Pakistan news picked up the story

There are lots more. Just because the administration (Bush) wouldn't acknowledge the possibility/reality doesn't mean many Americans didn't have deep suspicions.

I believe that Israel gets a bum rap some times (as does Palestine) but there seems to be a mad group within which pops up from time to time causing unmitigated hell.

From the history of the area including Zionist/German/US/British relations back prior to WW I it seems evident, although not clear, some group wants something to occur that hasn't. This(these) group(s) also seems to have no problem creating horrific incidents.


LL1

posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 10:16 AM
link   
This you may find quite interesting, and now with that "mole" in the Pentagon.....
Makes one say hmmm...




U.S. officials spent months investigating five Israelis to determine whether they were working in America as spies for Israel. (ABCNEWS.com) The White VanWere Israelis Detained on Sept. 11 Spies? June 21 Millions saw the horrific images of the World Trade Center attacks, and those who saw them won't forget them. But a New Jersey homemaker saw something that morning that prompted an investigation into five young Israelis and their possible connection to Israeli intelligence.


Maria, who asked us not to use her last name, had a view of the World Trade Center from her New Jersey apartment building. She remembers a neighbor calling her shortly after the first plane hit the towers. She grabbed her binoculars and watched the destruction unfolding in lower Manhattan. But as she watched the disaster, something else caught her eye. Maria says she saw three young men kneeling on the roof of a white van in the parking lot of her apartment building. "They seemed to be taking a movie," Maria said. The men were taking video or photos of themselves with the World Trade Center burning in the background, she said. What struck Maria were the expressions on the men's faces. "They were like happy, you know They didn't look shocked to me. I thought it was very strange," she said. She found the behavior so suspicious that she wrote down the license plate number of the van and called the police. Before long, the FBI was also on the scene, and a statewide bulletin was issued on the van. The plate number was traced to a van owned by a company called Urban Moving. Around 4 p.m. on Sept. 11, the van was spotted on a service road off Route 3, near New Jersey's Giants Stadium. A police officer pulled the van over, finding five men, between 22 and 27 years old, in the vehicle. The men were taken out of the van at gunpoint and handcuffed by police. The arresting officers said they saw a lot that aroused their suspicion about the men. One of the passengers had $4,700 in cash hidden in his sock. Another was carrying two foreign passports. A box cutter was found in the van. But perhaps the biggest surprise for the officers came when the five men identified themselves as Israeli citizens. We Are Not Your Problem According to the police report, one of the passengers told the officers they had been on the West Side Highway in Manhattan "during the incident" referring to the World Trade Center attack. The driver of the van, Sivan Kurzberg, told the officers, "We are Israeli. We are not your problem. Your problems are our problems. The Palestinians are the problem." The other passengers were his brother Paul Kurzberg, Yaron Shmuel, Oded Ellner and Omer Marmari. When the men were transferred to jail, the case was transferred out of the FBI's Criminal Division, and into the bureau's Foreign Counterintelligence Section, which is responsible for espionage cases, ABCNEWS has learned. One reason for the shift, sources told ABCNEWS, was that the FBI believed Urban Moving may have been providing cover for an Israeli intelligence operation. After the five men were arrested, the FBI got a warrant and searched Urban Moving's Weehawken, N.J., offices. The FBI searched Urban Moving's offices for several hours, removing boxes of documents and a dozen computer hard drives. The FBI also questioned Urban Moving's owner. His attorney insists that his client answered all of the FBI's questions. But when FBI agents tried to interview him again a few days later, he was gone. Three months later 2020's cameras photographed the inside of Urban Moving, and it looked as if the business had been shut down in a big hurry. Cell phones were lying around; office phones were still connected; and the property of dozens of clients remained in the warehouse. The owner had also cleared out of his New Jersey home, put it up for sale and returned with his family to Israel. A Scary Situation Steven Gordon, the attorney for the five Israeli detainees, acknowledged that his clients' actions on Sept. 11 would easily have aroused suspicions. "You got a group of guys that are taking pictures, on top of a roof, of the World Trade Center. They're speaking in a foreign language. They got two passports on 'em. One's got a wad of cash on him, and they got box cutters. Now that's a scary situation." But Gordon insisted that his clients were just five young men who had come to America for a vacation, ended up working for a moving company, and were taking pictures of the event. The five Israelis were held at the Metropolitan Detention Center in Brooklyn, ostensibly for overstaying their tourist visas and working in the United States illegally. Two weeks after their arrest, an immigration judge ordered them to be deported. But sources told ABCNEWS that FBI and CIA officials in Washington put a hold on the case. The five men were held in detention for more than two months. Some of them were placed in solitary confinement for 40 days, and some of them were given as many as seven lie-detector tests. Plenty of Speculation Since their arrest, plenty of speculation has swirled about the case, and what the five men were doing that morning. Eventually, The Forward, a respected Jewish newspaper in New York, reported the FBI concluded that two of the men were Israeli intelligence operatives. Vince Cannistraro, a former chief of operations for counterterrorism with the CIA who is now a consultant for ABCNEWS, said federal authorities' interest in the case was heightened when some of the men's names were found in a search of a national intelligence database. Israeli Intelligence Connection? According to Cannistraro, many people in the U.S. intelligence community believed that some of the men arrested were working for Israeli intelligence. Cannistraro said there was speculation as to whether Urban Moving had been "set up or exploited for the purpose of launching an intelligence operation against radical Islamists in the area, particularly in the New Jersey-New York area." Under this scenario, the alleged spying operation was not aimed against the United States, but at penetrating or monitoring radical fund-raising and support networks in Muslim communities like Paterson, N.J., which was one of the places where several of the hijackers lived in the months prior to Sept. 11. For the FBI, deciphering the truth from the five Israelis proved to be difficult. One of them, Paul Kurzberg, refused to take a lie-detector test for 10 weeks then failed it, according to his lawyer. Another of his lawyers told us Kurzberg had been reluctant to take the test because he had once worked for Israeli intelligence in another country. Sources say the Israelis were targeting these fund-raising networks because they were thought to be channeling money to Hamas and Islamic Jihad, groups that are responsible for most of the suicide bombings in Israel. "[The] Israeli government has been very concerned about the activity of radical Islamic groups in the United States that could be a support apparatus to Hamas and Islamic Jihad," Cannistraro said. The men denied that they had been working for Israeli intelligence out of the New Jersey moving company, and Ram Horvitz, their Israeli attorney, dismissed the allegations as "stupid and ridiculous." Mark Regev, the spokesman for the Israeli Embassy in Washington, goes even further, asserting the issue was never even discussed with U.S. officials. "These five men were not involved in any intelligence operation in the United States, and the American intelligence authorities have never raised this issue with us," Regev said. "The story is simply false." No Pre-Knowledge Despite the denials, sources tell ABCNEWS there is still debate within the FBI over whether or not the young men were spies. Many U.S. government officials still believe that some of them were on a mission for Israeli intelligence. But the FBI told ABCNEWS, "To date, this investigation has not identified anybody who in this country had pre-knowledge of the events of 9/11." Sources also said that even if the men were spies, there is no evidence to conclude they had advance knowledge of the terrorist attacks on Sept. 11. The investigation, at the end of the day, after all the polygraphs, all of the field work, all the cross-checking, the intelligence work, concluded that they probably did not have advance knowledge of 9/11," Cannistraro noted. As to what they were doing on the van, they say they read about the attack on the Internet, couldn't see it from their offices and went to the parking lot for a better view. But no one has been able to find a good explanation for why they may have been smiling with the towers of the World Trade Center burning in the background. Both the lawyers for the young men and the Israeli Embassy chalk it up to immature conduct. According to ABCNEWS sources, Israeli and U.S. government officials worked out a deal and after 71 days, the five Israelis were taken out of jail, put on a plane, and deported back home. While the former detainees refused to answer ABCNEWS' questions about their detention and what they were doing on Sept. 11, several of the detainees discussed their experience in America on an Israeli talk show after their return home. Said one of the men, denying that they were laughing or happy on the morning of Sept. 11, "The fact of the matter is we are coming from a country that experiences terror daily. Our purpose was to document the event." ABCNEWS' Chris Isham, John Miller, Glenn Silber and Chris Vlasto contributed to this report.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 11:09 AM
link   
How much of that $3 billion goes to Mossad? Didn't Ariel Sharon say, "Isreal owns the Americans!"

Lets pave the whole region.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 11:25 AM
link   

Originally posted by FredT
Another one, don't forget the Mossad guys arrested in New Zealand! Thank god thier prime minester has balls to stand up to them and not put up with thier CRAP!



Ah of course not! I remember covering that story on ATSNN a couple of months ago:



NEWS: Foreign spy charges whip up top-level security storm
The New Zealand Herald is reporting that the local authorities have arrested two men believed to be Israeli Secret Service Agents after trying to obtain a false New Zealand passport. The case is generating a lot of controversy about the possibility that MOSSAD spies may be masquerading as New Zealand travellers.


Please visit the link provided for the complete story.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 11:42 AM
link   
Very very interesting...it could be possible, as they see it as the world is against them, so they would use "ANY MEANS NECESSARY" to achieve their goals.



posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 11:50 AM
link   
NO ARIEL SHARON DID NOT SAY THAT EVER NEVER....
...AND READ THIS




posted on Aug, 28 2004 @ 11:51 AM
link   

Originally posted by theindependentjournal
NO ARIEL SHARON DID NOT SAY THAT EVER NEVER....
...AND READ THIS




ummm WTF are you talking about?


And read what?

[edit on 28-8-2004 by Ocelot]



new topics




 
1
<<   2 >>

log in

join