What Survival is and isn’t.

My considered opinion...

We hear a lot about riots potentially erupting in cities as the economy continues to fail and hungry people become desperate. This tells me to stay away from big cities. Some postulate survival in a remote place. I think this would be not the best choice. It's my opinion that a small community of like minded citizens would be more likely to survive and fight off mobs than a single family in a remote setting, in today's world.

One thing I think a lot of people miss when talking survival is the long term. Rarely do you see the word community mentioned in any survival situation but as a spieces we humans need and thrive in community.

In a end of the world serarnio the best thing to have is a community of like minded people helping one another live.

I have learned a lot of skills for survival but personally I would rather do it with a bunch of people, that way all the skills you dont have or dont have time to do are more likely to be available to you for trade.

reply to post by jpmail


You are so right... and when I next sit to ponder what to post I think it will be on how to organize a group, assess skills divide the workload and assign tasks... thanks for bringing it up..

I was part of the Air Force Survival School many moons ago...one of the key things they teach is:

The difference between life and death is the will to survive.

I give you one Amos Richards, a 64 year old backpacker hiking alone in the remote canyons of Utah. You all heard the story...Fell 10+ feet, crawled for 4 days to be found. story

In contrast, we have poor Jerry McDonald. Jerry went car camping in the spring in Oregon. Waking to a fierce storm, he found himself snowed in on Feb 14th. Jerry stayed in his car for 60 days, documenting his plight. He finally succumbed to starvation. Oh...Jerry was 3 miles from town. story

Ultimately the will to survive is the only difference in these stories. Amos could have licked his wounds in that canyon, hoping for a miracle, but most likely dying. Jerry could have assessed the situation and came to a rational decision to walk out, and most likely live.

The most important tool you have in a survival situation is your mind. What you do with it is up to you.

reply to post by blamethegreys


Maybe we should both work on treads on what to do when you want to be rescued....

Back when I was working for the New Mexico Mountain Rescue team... we had one fellow who was determined to be seen and recovered... what he did to be spotted ... was build a bonfire under a pine tree... needless to say that entire tree went up in flames... thankfully he picked a lone pine otherwise he would have started a major forest fire... but there was no mistaking his SOS and that tree lead us right to him...

Be proud BTW... he was former Air Force too... and it just goes to prove... you have to think your way past the problem ... find the solution...

Nice post and very well put.

But after reading the thread, there are those who still didn't get the gist of it.

DaddyBare is talking about survival...nothing more, nothing less. And the skill sets to do such.

Survival in the city will require a scavenger mindset at first, but without the other skills, that will get you only so far. If you decide to stay in place in an urban environment, you will have a tough time of it. At least until the population has thinned out and wildlife has returned.

The person that has the knowledge of how to Hunt, Fish, Trap, grow various food, do basic first aid, build shelter, etc, etc. has a much better chance of surviving than a scavenger.

For those of you who think tactical isn’t comparable to hunting have another think coming. They go hand in hand. Try hunting with all the tacti-cool gear on and I guarantee you’ll come home hungry.

reply to post by DaddyBare

Damn Air Force guys!!!!

Oh wait, I was AF.

Damn Marines!!!!

reply to post by TDawgRex


Light and fast.... cover and concealment...know your surroundings... make the opportunity then take it with both hands...

No I wasn't born in a city... I don't really like them myself...

but I know there are those... city born... who have comparable skills....

they know where to find water...food shelter... we hear stories of people living in the subways... taking over abandoned homes and businesses... not my idea of ideal... but my way is not the only way.... it's up to all of you to find that for yourselves...

Originally posted by jpmail
One thing I think a lot of people miss when talking survival is the long term. Rarely do you see the word community mentioned in any survival situation but as a spieces we humans need and thrive in community.

In a end of the world serarnio the best thing to have is a community of like minded people helping one another live.

I have learned a lot of skills for survival but personally I would rather do it with a bunch of people, that way all the skills you dont have or dont have time to do are more likely to be available to you for trade.

Community...the glue that holds us together. That is why I want to move back to my sisters little town in Wisconsin and get out of Northeastern Ohio. There is little sense of community where I currently live.

Her town has only four roads in and out. Two have bridges on them and two pass through valleys…very defensible.

They also have a large community garden where they grow veggies & herbs and sell them to the organic market.

The town is small enough that strangers are noted, but are treated in a friendly and welcome manner. (In a SHTF situation, that would probably change)

It would be and is a great place to survive, as well live, for that matter.

I just hope that things remain stable in my life so I can go home. If they don’t remain stable…well, I have a couple of plans for that as well…just in case.

As MacAurther once said, "I will return."

Look at what i caught while out gettin supper the other day.
This yellowcat was put back after i weighed him.56lb
To me this is part of survival.



You made since to me thanks for your soapbox chat.

reply to post by deadeyedick


the image isnt showing up...

hoping it's just a temp bug...

reply to post by DaddyBare


When you have an image pulled up you cant copy the link in the address bar and use it.
Looks like you need to copy where it says this External full URL link:

reply to post by deadeyedick


Man that bad boy is freakin huge.....
and have I got a recipe for fried catfish....

that ain't survival man... that's living it up.... like kings and queens baby, kings and queens

reply to post by DaddyBare


Yep. Some cornbread and a beer.

I could eat for a week on that guy.

On this site and many others I've seen people try and define what being a survivalist is and what it isn't. The simplest answer seems to be someone who has the skills necessary to survive in their given situation and environment.

Wilderness and primitive survival skills are important and could be translated to many situations, even for those of us in the city. However, in our modern world where most people have lost those skills, survival may come down to pitting you against your fellow man. Especially for those in larger cities where millions of unprepared suddenly find themselves without.

Knowing how to hunt rabbit and build a shelter out of twigs and branches is good to know but will do you little good when twenty people are trying to break down your door because they think you have some canned tuna and a few bottles of water, all while your kids are crying out of fear. You may not want combat but the situation may leave you no choice. I'm no Rambo and the last thing I would want is to find myself, or more so my family, caught anywhere near a firefight. However I'm not going to pretend it's not an important consideration or could never happen.

I live in the city but also know many wilderness skills. Most here do not. Someone will undoubtedly say to just leave the city....easier said then done so don't bother. I've heard it all before. Should TSHTF here survival may iinclude surviving against fellow man.

Not disagreeing, just feeling there may be more to it depending on the situation.

Have the skills to survive in a primitive setting is essential but being prepared to protect you and yours is just as important. Those without those skills to survive will have no other choice than to try and take from those who do.

Well i like to put the big ones back for breeding.Plus these around 20lb are much tastier.




It has been said on ats before that one can learn alot from gods creatures about survival.Let me tell you i have been watching and its amazing.Take these guys for example the seem modest enough to me however next to the gator gar yellowcat are fierce eaters.They can eat fish up to a forth of there size and will try for much bigger.You can place one of these bad boys in a stock pond and they will consume everything in it bass perch minnows and other catfish will be gone.they love to seek shelter and can even dig a shelter.

With the risk of being flamed, I cannot refrain myself from emphasizing the difference between being a "survivalist", an expert and living the whole life in harsh conditions, knowing that there is little hope to get out of that.
I saw such experts bragging about their skills but how many of them will survive in REAL situations, without their little toys, without their Nikes, without their feeling that the normal life is few miles and a gallon of gas away? Let me tell you how many: quite a few.
Its so damn easy to to take pictures on the fishes you catch but how easy would be to do that if the lake will be crowded by hundreds of starving people, each of them trying to put a fish more on the table for their starving families? What would you do? Grab the shotgun and blast the bastards to their Creator? No, really...?
How about the starving people who might walk towards you, with a dying child in their arms, begging you for food? Who you will shot first, the child or the parents? Of course you have to protect your family even if you have to splat the other child's brains out, isn't it?
How about your survival skills when you or your wife or worst, your child, gets a septicemia due to some infected wounds, there aren't any doctors around, no antibiotics, no medicine, nothing? What would you do then? Oh, of course,you would grab your shotgun again and raid the family who asked you for some food earlier, hoping that they have some antibiotics because, of course, only the fittest will survive and you and your family deserve to live while others deserve to die.

I'm already feeling the urge to puke by reading these posts written by so many people who have no slightest idea what is the life about, not to speak about survival as a philosophy. I will stop here, not before telling you few secret words which might help you survive when SHTF:

COMMUNITY
NEIGHBORS
HELP EACH OTHER
DON'T GRAB THE GUN SO FAST, RAMBO!

One more thing then I'm out: I know what I am talking about.
Peace.

Originally posted by shansen
With the risk of being flamed, I cannot refrain myself from emphasizing the difference between being a "survivalist", an expert and living the whole life in harsh conditions, knowing that there is little hope to get out of that.
I saw such experts bragging about their skills but how many of them will survive in REAL situations, without their little toys, without their Nikes, without their feeling that the normal life is few miles and a gallon of gas away? Let me tell you how many: quite a few.
Its so damn easy to to take pictures on the fishes you catch but how easy would be to do that if the lake will be crowded by hundreds of starving people, each of them trying to put a fish more on the table for their starving families? What would you do? Grab the shotgun and blast the bastards to their Creator? No, really...?
How about the starving people who might walk towards you, with a dying child in their arms, begging you for food? Who you will shot first, the child or the parents? Of course you have to protect your family even if you have to splat the other child's brains out, isn't it?
How about your survival skills when you or your wife or worst, your child, gets a septicemia due to some infected wounds, there aren't any doctors around, no antibiotics, no medicine, nothing? What would you do then? Oh, of course,you would grab your shotgun again and raid the family who asked you for some food earlier, hoping that they have some antibiotics because, of course, only the fittest will survive and you and your family deserve to live while others deserve to die.

I'm already feeling the urge to puke by reading these posts written by so many people who have no slightest idea what is the life about, not to speak about survival as a philosophy. I will stop here, not before telling you few secret words which might help you survive when SHTF:

COMMUNITY
NEIGHBORS
HELP EACH OTHER
DON'T GRAB THE GUN SO FAST, RAMBO!

One more thing then I'm out: I know what I am talking about.
Peace.

Don't worry about us we will share.As far as the lakes being crowded well my advice is to go where the crowds are not at that will be your best chance.

As far as wanting to puke if you live in the country you can go outside and fing some whitemans foot and that will settle your stomach.wildplanthealing.com... t.html
As far as the infection goes Echinacea plant can work wonders.Now ask yourself where the use of medicine comes from its people.We done it before and can survive if we remove the panic from our lives.
I figured that you would like to hear this.

ok read the posts I have to agree you need a community around you but it means inviting the mayor to the party.

next you are having obama round to lunch.

Your mind is the tool: I took that one on. Knowing what and where the small mercies are is not yet the advantage of using them.

I cant complain reallly I exist upon a barrel of good luck . Something some others dont seem to . I is not disabled either .

I loved america I sometimes wished I could have been american , something about the space the peace and what is captured in that song , the people and the wide open way of life .

I was there in the heart of the deep south and happen was sleeping with the enemy , the cia s finest , back in the late 90s . I met there general Strong who had Noriega's hat , at his hunting lodge . I first felt the kick of a 9mm there , saw a brother's gun barrel peel itself , and nearly shot myself in the foot ! <

Anyhow , longer ago than that , at the zoo , there was a door with a sign > Warning the most dangerous animal in the world is in here ! Behind it was a mirror . There are folks who dont tell you what games they are playing nor why , and actual predation is what they are about. With community comes something called order , and not everybody is in a position to give commands , or receive a share .

No one has sent me to war nor retained control of self for long . In fact have skipped all around them all and shall do ,, inshal'lah

Stay safe .. oh and
_______ is not an al qaida nutjob 1

reply to post by Chewingonmushrooms
Yatahay cuz, well said......... Not only what your saying is survival, but it is freedom, how many will not help their family, and call themselves rich. you know what I'm saying......wink.......