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Iran and YOU agree on Something! Hey Conservatives and Rick Perry - Start Clapping

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posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:08 PM
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reply to post by neo96
 


But, if murder is murder, how can it be justified?

CJ




posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:09 PM
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reply to post by neo96
 


If you wish to start a debate about abortion, feel free to start a new thread on it - as it is completely off topic for this thread.

No amount if saying it's on topic is going to change that.

For the record, I agree with abortion only if it's to save lives ie: if there are major complications etc. I do not advocate abortion for the sake of it at all. So, now that you know this, can you explain the point of trying to make out like we agreed with abortion willy nilly? Or are you just deflecting?
edit on 22/9/2011 by Kryties because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:17 PM
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reply to post by ColoradoJens
 


capital punishment is law hence justified and so if abortion

and if you dont live in texas then those words are hollow

and last time i checked they dont stone women and make them have 5 witnesses to prove rape as per the comparison to a "blood murdering regime" that murdered american servicement in iraq and afghanistan.

waiting for people to "justifiy" irans actions there and funding terroristic actions against isreal as the same time.

after all murder is murder



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:18 PM
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reply to post by Kryties
 


no the topic is about murder and murder doesnt have a single form in this country nor the world

any conversation should and must be put in the proper context

which means any and all evidence pertains to the said topic.

dont like it sorry any real discussions cover a broad spectrum and that is broad when the topic is murder



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:18 PM
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Originally posted by Kryties
For the record, I agree with abortion only if it's to save lives



Then executing a Serial Killer does the same thing. [Saves Lives] Just like most reasonable people wouldn't think twice about putting a round or two in a Rabid dog....



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:21 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Sticking him in a jail cell achieves the same thing mate. That, and it doesnt lower us to their level.

After all, murder is murder is murder as some people say.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:26 PM
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reply to post by ColoradoJens
 


Davis had been convicted of MacPhail's 1989 killing.Davis' execution had been halted three times since 2007. The U.S. Supreme Court even gave Davis an unusual opportunity to "clearly establish" his innocence in a lower court last year. But a lower court judge ruled that defense attorneys didn't meet that standard ...

22 years... you had 22 years to do something... Don't look at me, As the Parent of a murdered child I say fry him...but if this bugs you so much... why didnt you do something????

At least I go to victims rights gatherings, I started a web site, I joined the national group "Parents of murdered children... all of those and more I did... to further my agenda... you had 22 years...and did nothing until one day after....
edit on 22-9-2011 by DaddyBare because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:34 PM
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Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Sticking him in a jail cell achieves the same thing mate. That, and it doesnt lower us to their level.


To whose level?
Russia's, China's, Japan's, India's etc.

I see plenty of "Civilized" Countries carrying out executions. I know you want to focus on North Korea and Iran. You always come out against the US on their side so why are they carrying out executions if their way of Government is so much better than the US?

How About China? China executed over 2000+ people Iran over 246+ people in 2010 They really must have a HUGE problem with murders and Rapists. Because if they don't then a HUGE percentage were probably political opposition. So which system is worse? China's, Iran's, North Korea or the US?.Why don't the next time you're spewing your Anti-US rhetoric remember your stance here today on how you feel about their executing prisoners.

Never mind, I'll remind you

After all, murder is murder is murder as some people say.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 12:53 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Which system is worse? All of them. The death penalty should be abolished, not excused because you do it differently or not as much.

And when did this become a "Kryties is anti-US" thing? That's really grasping at straws mate. It's got nothing to do with that, I thought you were above that sort of nonsense. Seems not.

edit on 22/9/2011 by Kryties because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:09 PM
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the death penality should be abolished

alright just by the state and all those "good people running around offing others"

get a lifetime all expenses paid vacation on the taxpayer dime and all it takes to get their is

what? murder



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:22 PM
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Originally posted by LondonerBLV

It is definately the most important factor. The method of mortality. At least it is painless.
How many times per year is the method used, hanging or firing squad? I would like to see figures because in my opinion that is completely BS and I am not even from America. I simply don't believe you that Hanging and Firing
squad is used even one time to 20 to Lethal injection.
Is it not a fact that you can only contend for the death penalty if the evidence is overwhelming?


While perhaps technically legal in some places, neither firing squad not hanging are currently used in the US. The last hanging I am aware of was the military hanging of Eddie Slovik for desertion early last century. I'm not aware of any recent uses of a firing squad, either. The law in most states is either electrocution, lethal injection, or gas chamber, with the HEAVY predominance on lethal injection. They put you to sleep first, then give you a heart-stopping hot shot after you're asleep.

I can't think of the last time Old Sparky or the gas chamber were used, either.

Edit: I see CJ has provided a link to a somewhat more recent hanging, and so I stand corrected on that point.



edit on 2011/9/22 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:32 PM
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Originally posted by Kryties

Originally posted by LondonerBLV
Except it's completely different in the fact that you use lethal injection and not stoning.
So don't compare the United States to Iran because it is false and misleading.
I would much rather have the death penalty than not have it.

(From the UK & I completely agree with having the death penatly, I wish it was here...)



Complete nonsense. No amount of excuses can justify killing somebody who killed somebody else to teach people not to kill. That is the most illogical bunch of nonsense I have ever heard.

The US are hypocrites. Absolutely no doubt whatsoever about that. Hypocritical, vengeful and I would dare to say worse than the nations they accuse and invade.


I had to leave the entire exchange here to illustrate my point. NOWHERE in the post did LondonerBLV give any sort of rationale for the death penalty, much less the one that Kryties spuriously injects into it.

Who says it's about "teaching" anything? The simple fact is, if the offender is dead, he will NEVER be able to murder again. No prison escapes to endanger the community, that sort of thing. It's a done deal, and the murderer's murdering days are over, thus protecting society from that one.

If you want to "teach" someone something, send 'em to school.

It's not about "teaching" or "retribution", it's about preventing that murderer from murdering again.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:37 PM
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Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by LondonerBLV
 


No, ATS is full of enlightened individuals who consider execution to be barbaric, backwards, hypocritical, vengeful crimes against humanity and those who uphold the death penalty and wish to perpetuate it to be disgusting people who are no better than animals, salivating with blood lust and desire for revenge.


You probably ought to "protect" yourself from barbaric folks like me then. How you gonna do it? Can't kill us, you know....




edit on 2011/9/22 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:41 PM
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Originally posted by DaddyBare
reply to post by ColoradoJens
 


Davis had been convicted of MacPhail's 1989 killing.Davis' execution had been halted three times since 2007. The U.S. Supreme Court even gave Davis an unusual opportunity to "clearly establish" his innocence in a lower court last year. But a lower court judge ruled that defense attorneys didn't meet that standard ...

22 years... you had 22 years to do something... Don't look at me, As the Parent of a murdered child I say fry him...but if this bugs you so much... why didnt you do something????

At least I go to victims rights gatherings, I started a web site, I joined the national group "Parents of murdered children... all of those and more I did... to further my agenda... you had 22 years...and did nothing until one day after....
edit on 22-9-2011 by DaddyBare because: (no reason given)


Hear, Hear. Finally, the voice of reason.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:44 PM
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Originally posted by nenothtu

Originally posted by LondonerBLV

It is definately the most important factor. The method of mortality. At least it is painless.
How many times per year is the method used, hanging or firing squad? I would like to see figures because in my opinion that is completely BS and I am not even from America. I simply don't believe you that Hanging and Firing
squad is used even one time to 20 to Lethal injection.
Is it not a fact that you can only contend for the death penalty if the evidence is overwhelming?


While perhaps technically legal in some places, neither firing squad not hanging are currently used in the US. The last hanging I am aware of was the military hanging of Eddie Slovik for desertion early last century. I'm not aware of any recent uses of a firing squad, either. The law in most states is either electrocution, lethal injection, or gas chamber, with the HEAVY predominance on lethal injection. They put you to sleep first, then give you a heart-stopping hot shot after you're asleep.

I can't think of the last time Old Sparky or the gas chamber were used, either.

Edit: I see CJ has provided a link to a somewhat more recent hanging, and so I stand corrected on that point.



edit on 2011/9/22 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)


Thank you for replying to my questions to the thread creator.

I find it ridiculous most of the arguments that he has put across on this subject.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:51 PM
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It's funny because Britain (well, it's not on the news but people will be disgusted when they find out anyway) will be pissed off, upset and angry at the 17 year old being hung in Iran but most of us want to bring the death penalty back for rapists, pedophiles, murderers and other criminals as well as making lower level criminals (burglars, violent offenders etc) do National Service ie work in the military as punishment on the front lines in Afghanistan which is fair enough to me.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 01:53 PM
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reply to post by SLAYER69
 


Because it is a moral issue, not a political one.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 02:02 PM
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Originally posted by Kryties
reply to post by neo96
 


The abortion debate is a whole different kettle of fish and completely off-topic.

I love it when people try to deflect the topic so as to avoid facing facts.


How so? Isn't killing killing, or is it just ok if the victim is to little to fend for itself, and hasn't offered to kill anyone else, hasn't done anything to any one, and didn't ask to be put there to begin with?

Yet you call ME "barbaric"...



edit on 2011/9/22 by nenothtu because: (no reason given)



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 02:26 PM
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Originally posted by LondonerBLV

Thank you for replying to my questions to the thread creator.

I find it ridiculous most of the arguments that he has put across on this subject.


It seemed to me that your questions were going unanswered in favor of an emotional promotion of an agenda, so I tried to answer them, especially in light of your speculation of a "1:20" ratio regarding hangings vs. lethal injections. The ratio is nowhere near that close.

I was only trying to correct a potential misconception. 3 hangings in 35 years, with the most recent being 15 years ago, according to CJ's own link, doesn't make hanging a predominant or preferred method as some here were trying to suggest. CJ ought to know better, being an American and all. Kryties perhaps not so much, since he's Australian, and everyone the world 'round knows Australians don't believe in hurting any one for any reason. If you don't believe me, just ask an Aborigine.



posted on Sep, 22 2011 @ 03:05 PM
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reply to post by DaddyBare
 


The thread is about appying the same "civilized" justice methods that our supposed enemies do. Killing someone will not take back any crime comitted and it doesn't seem to be a deterent. Obviously people continue to commit henious crimes regardless.

CJ




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