All work and no play make the jobless scream Nazi

Source

The European Commission said yesterday (20 September) it is unaware that local authorities in Hungary are putting Roma to work under programs reminiscent, according to the opposition, to labour camps under Nazi or Soviet domination.

A plan approved by the Hungarian Parliament in July requires anyone who receives a social allowance to work on construction sites, to clean the streets or maintain parks and forests. In the case of refusal, the allowances would be stopped. Some flexibility is envisaged with respect to elderly and sick people, as well as to single parents with children.

Some 300,000 people are expected to be working in "community services". Officially targeted toward the jobless, according to critics, the plan is ethnically motivated and directed toward the Roma population.

People under the programme are paid the equivalent of €200 a month, which is more than the basic social allowance, but less than the minimum wage.

This is a biased source of course because it is a Roma news website but it gets the message out. If you strip it of its rhetoric and get down to the facts:

• Paid 200 Euro a month
• 300,000 working in community services
• Anyone on social allowance who is not elderly, sick, or a single parent must work in these community service jobs
• You do not have to take the social allowance, you could get a job or find some alternative.

I support the program and even if it is aimed at the Roma minority it is the same law for everyone, the law does not say “this is only required of the Roma”. So if you want to rely on government social allowance then you have to work, simple as that. It is not a radical idea making you work to earn money. And it is not ‘forced labor camp’ either, you can opt-out of the social allowance altogether or break your leg, you have options. The state does not put a gun to your head and say “you have to take social allowance!”

Hungary is taking a step in the right direction.

Sounds like a good program to me. After some of these people work at this for while they will get it into their heads Hey if I'm working everyday then I'll get a real job.

reply to post by Misoir


That is a pretty good solution to a growing problem in Europe. Other European countries should adopt this system in regard to welfare. $200.00 Euro isn't a lot, but a lot of people who work especially in Eastern Europe earn an average of $300.00 Euro a month. They have to pay rent, food, gas and bills out of that. There is no "free" money. The Government has to take it away from one person in order to be able to give it to another. It's redistribution of wealth. If we're going to take tax dollars from working people to support irresponsible lifestyles (excluding the elderly, injured and disabled of course), then those people should have to help out the community somehow to try to pay back the generosity of the tax payer. If they are able-bodied there is no reason why they shouldn't be able to support themselves through some type of work.

We could do with a dose of this in the UK. I get sick of paying taxes to fund the workshy masses languishing on state benefit in this country. Really, for some its a way of life.

Benefit should be reserved for those who really need it.

If there is welfare, work doesn't seem unreasonable to me... Although that can raise
some similarities to communism, working for the state in order to obtain survival

I disagree.
Although it is easy to blame the jobless for their plight, it is not that simple.
People can be jobless by choice or by the design of an economic system. At some point, when joblessness is rampant, you have to blame the architects of our economic system.
Make THEM work in labor camps.
For the simple reason that whenever the banksters WANT to create an economy, they DO. When they want an economy to crash, they DO. How?
By allowing a small group of people the right to turn trees into paper into federal reserve notes. Accepted by the world as "money", based upon DEBT, they can feed the beast and make the beast grow. They create an empire based upon this false money, children and grandchildren dependent, so you know what? If you can create it, you can SUSTAIN it.
THERE ARE PLENTY OF TREES. Keep printing that money, keep feeding the beast you created with your Keynesian economics.
Keep up the "Quantitative Easing", but forget about "easing" us into poverty. Let's just go back to "Quantitative Wealth" like we have done before! No more joblessness.
Unless you CHOOSE to be, and then #ing starve. Let them starve if they don't want to work.
But, no. That is how nature works. Nature can't teach us anything, can it?
This is all a scam to make you feel good about having everything taken from you. You deserve it.

Originally posted by Misoir
The state does not put a gun to your head and say “you have to take social allowance!”

They do when they tell you to pay taxes so you can can social allowances.

Try not paying taxes, you'll find out just how cheap life is nowadays.

Originally posted by SirClem
I disagree.
Although it is easy to blame the jobless for their plight, it is not that simple.
People can be jobless by choice or by the design of an economic system. At some point, when joblessness is rampant, you have to blame the architects of our economic system.
Make THEM work in labor camps.
For the simple reason that whenever the banksters WANT to create an economy, they DO. When they want an economy to crash, they DO. How?
By allowing a small group of people the right to turn trees into paper into federal reserve notes. Accepted by the world as "money", based upon DEBT, they can feed the beast and make the beast grow. They create an empire based upon this false money, children and grandchildren dependent, so you know what? If you can create it, you can SUSTAIN it.
THERE ARE PLENTY OF TREES. Keep printing that money, keep feeding the beast you created with your Keynesian economics.
Keep up the "Quantitative Easing", but forget about "easing" us into poverty. Let's just go back to "Quantitative Wealth" like we have done before! No more joblessness.
Unless you CHOOSE to be, and then #ing starve. Let them starve if they don't want to work.
But, no. That is how nature works. Nature can't teach us anything, can it?
This is all a scam to make you feel good about having everything taken from you. You deserve it.

A few European countries have a somewhat unique problem, which is a large Roma population collecting welfare and giving birth to more children than they can support. Many don't value education, which in turn breeds more poverty among them. If you can't read and count, you'll have a hard time finding a normal job. All that's left to do is to either perform labor-intensive jobs, welfare, or support your family by stealing from your neighbors. The crime rate among the Roma population has been rising, and one way to reduce that crime is to give them welfare checks so they wouldn't have to steal to feed their family of five to ten children. Since the Governments around Europe are going broke and can't afford to just give the money away, giving these people gardening or clean-up jobs in exchange for their welfare check is a pretty fair bargain. The City doesn't have to hire outside help, they save a couple of bucks and the Roma don't have to steal to feed themselves.

Naturally there are problems that could arise from this, but Europe has tried so many different programs to get the Roma to assimilate into their populations, that I feel this might just be another desperate stab at some kind of solution. It could work, and it might fail. Either way I hope it helps both sides in the long run.

Sounds to me like the Roma need there own state, i reckon we could carve another piece out of Palastine for the Roma just like we did with the Jews.

reply to post by Misoir


Shouldn't they be paid a fair wage? Being forced to work below the poverty level is similar to slavery.

reply to post by LDragonFire


No one is forcing them to work at all. They choose to take social allowance because it is not the law to do so, however it is the law that if you choose to take social allowance that you must earn it.

Originally posted by 2manyquestionsA few European countries have a somewhat unique problem, which is a large Roma population collecting welfare and giving birth to more children than they can support. Many don't value education, which in turn breeds more poverty among them. If you can't read and count, you'll have a hard time finding a normal job. All that's left to do is to either perform labor-intensive jobs, welfare, or support your family by stealing from your neighbors. The crime rate among the Roma population has been rising, and one way to reduce that crime is to give them welfare checks so they wouldn't have to steal to feed their family of five to ten children. Since the Governments around Europe are going broke and can't afford to just give the money away, giving these people gardening or clean-up jobs in exchange for their welfare check is a pretty fair bargain. The City doesn't have to hire outside help, they save a couple of bucks and the Roma don't have to steal to feed themselves.

Naturally there are problems that could arise from this, but Europe has tried so many different programs to get the Roma to assimilate into their populations, that I feel this might just be another desperate stab at some kind of solution. It could work, and it might fail. Either way I hope it helps both sides in the long run.

My goodness, it seems that you have the same problem that Los angeles has with their illegal aliens. They as a group have figured out the welfare and state aid programs nearly to octomom levels and since it is a close knit society it is hard to break. The mothers claim their sisters and cousins children as their own and since it is different social workers they don't realize the same children are being counted three and four times.

The state is in a talespin and I don't think it will pull up anytime soon.

Originally posted by lokdog
Sounds to me like the Roma need there own state, i reckon we could carve another piece out of Palastine for the Roma just like we did with the Jews.

The Roma originate from India. They have been nomads for hundreds of years, and I don't think they see that changing. They move from one country to another and as far as I can tell (I could be wrong) they are not interested in assimilating to any other culture. They do so just enough to get along while they're in one place, but most don't go above and beyond to do so. It's not the case for all Roma. Some Roma try to assimilate, but due to the crime among them they are heavily stereotyped by the native populations, which makes it hard for those who really do try. It's truly a very complicated thing. Even if you were to carve out a piece of Palestine for them, they'd probably disburse within a couple of years, and the Palestinians would be happy again. That, or the Palestinians would pay them to leave, like France did.

Originally posted by VforVendettea

Originally posted by 2manyquestionsA few European countries have a somewhat unique problem, which is a large Roma population collecting welfare and giving birth to more children than they can support. Many don't value education, which in turn breeds more poverty among them. If you can't read and count, you'll have a hard time finding a normal job. All that's left to do is to either perform labor-intensive jobs, welfare, or support your family by stealing from your neighbors. The crime rate among the Roma population has been rising, and one way to reduce that crime is to give them welfare checks so they wouldn't have to steal to feed their family of five to ten children. Since the Governments around Europe are going broke and can't afford to just give the money away, giving these people gardening or clean-up jobs in exchange for their welfare check is a pretty fair bargain. The City doesn't have to hire outside help, they save a couple of bucks and the Roma don't have to steal to feed themselves.

Naturally there are problems that could arise from this, but Europe has tried so many different programs to get the Roma to assimilate into their populations, that I feel this might just be another desperate stab at some kind of solution. It could work, and it might fail. Either way I hope it helps both sides in the long run.

My goodness, it seems that you have the same problem that Los angeles has with their illegal aliens. They as a group have figured out the welfare and state aid programs nearly to octomom levels and since it is a close knit society it is hard to break. The mothers claim their sisters and cousins children as their own and since it is different social workers they don't realize the same children are being counted three and four times.

The state is in a talespin and I don't think it will pull up anytime soon.

Sort of, but I think it's way worse for Eastern Europe for example, because the Roma are not illegal yet still aren't doing enough to assimilate. They've been living in Europe for hundreds of years, and are still outsiders. Forcing them to go to school, giving them new housing and welfare hasn't worked to bring them out of poverty, whereas the illegals of California actually try to find work, and work hard when they find it. There's crime among the illegals, but I'd still rather live among them than to live next to a Roma village. Don't get me wrong, I've met some very nice Roma, it's just that their culture and values are very different from ours. I couldn't live the way they do.