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Can you prove evolution wrong?*

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posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 12:46 AM
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I would suggest that creationism and evolution can go hand and hand.

That it is all dependent on your understanding of the texts.

That 'God' = Universe

And that a lot of the stories are paganistic and celestrial worship in origin.

Enough said, no more dividing amongst eachother, gain a true understanding of the texts and stop allowing what 'religion'(as far as group and government and church) tells you is the way to comprehend the texts

If you read them word for word, and don't allow for other peoples dogmatic fashioned comprehensions get in the way, they become much clearer...




posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 01:08 AM
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Originally posted by Tony4211
reply to post by HillbillyHippie1
 





in favor of Intelligent Design Theory.


Intelligent design is no more a theory then the bible is. You can not test it; therefore, it is not a theory. It's disgusting how that word (theory) gets thrown around.


Did you not read what I said? Intelligent Design Theory is the ONLY testable theory and it is being tested everyday. Humans are intelligent and we are designing life. Do you read the news? What do you think intelligent design is supposed to be if it is not intelligence designing life?



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 01:14 AM
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Originally posted by HillbillyHippie1
Did you not read what I said? Intelligent Design Theory is the ONLY testable theory and it is being tested everyday. Humans are intelligent and we are designing life. Do you read the news? What do you think intelligent design is supposed to be if it is not intelligence designing life?




So if WE are designing life, well wouldn't we just be carrying out the same desire as what ever created us?

Mirror mirror on the wall,
I'm taking this hippy to the BALL!

With Love,

Your Brother



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 01:25 AM
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Originally posted by IAMIAM

Originally posted by HillbillyHippie1
Did you not read what I said? Intelligent Design Theory is the ONLY testable theory and it is being tested everyday. Humans are intelligent and we are designing life. Do you read the news? What do you think intelligent design is supposed to be if it is not intelligence designing life?




So if WE are designing life, well wouldn't we just be carrying out the same desire as what ever created us?

Mirror mirror on the wall,
I'm taking this hippy to the BALL!

With Love,

Your Brother



Yes, technically one could argue that we are doing precisely what we were engineered to do, and likely in accordance with some similarity to our Creator, as our Creator would likely design us in accordance with familiar means (ie. in their image in some way or another), but that is mere speculation, while IDT is a demonstratable and provable FACT of reality, unlike macro evolution via unmitigated natural selection.or any other purely METAPHYSICAL fantasy. IDT is everywhere and being demonstrated on a daily basis, since humans are intelligent and we design life - the case is closed. It is OBVIOUS that life is designed (via the everyday demonstration of IDT); therefore, although we do not know who designed us, we do know that it is the most likely thing to have happened.



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 03:08 AM
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Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

And no, can't read Sumerian

edit on 1-11-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)


so then how could you have a valid opinion of whether or not he's wrong? Your opinion has no credibility in this discussion.


So you never read a correctly translated book?



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 05:12 AM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

And no, can't read Sumerian

edit on 1-11-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)


so then how could you have a valid opinion of whether or not he's wrong? Your opinion has no credibility in this discussion.


So you never read a correctly translated book?


if you can't read Sumerian then how do you know whether or not it is correctly translated?



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 07:23 AM
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Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

And no, can't read Sumerian

edit on 1-11-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)


so then how could you have a valid opinion of whether or not he's wrong? Your opinion has no credibility in this discussion.


So you never read a correctly translated book?


if you can't read Sumerian then how do you know whether or not it is correctly translated?


Because true scientists back up their translations with facts whereas Sitchin and the other pseudo-scientists draw wild conclusions without backing them up properly. Take the famous Figaro opera for example, it was originally written in Italian...yet you can get accurate English translations. They're accurate because the translations are backed up by objective evidence...which cannot be said when it comes to some guy claiming the Sumarians writing about storing "essence in clay jars" is proof for them storing DNA!



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 07:11 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 





which cannot be said when it comes to some guy claiming the Sumarians writing about storing "essence in clay jars" is proof for them storing DNA!


And all this time, I thought DNA was discovered this century. hahaha I must be mistaken. :p



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 08:00 PM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

And no, can't read Sumerian

edit on 1-11-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)


so then how could you have a valid opinion of whether or not he's wrong? Your opinion has no credibility in this discussion.


So you never read a correctly translated book?


if you can't read Sumerian then how do you know whether or not it is correctly translated?


Because true scientists back up their translations with facts whereas Sitchin and the other pseudo-scientists draw wild conclusions without backing them up properly. Take the famous Figaro opera for example, it was originally written in Italian...yet you can get accurate English translations. They're accurate because the translations are backed up by objective evidence...which cannot be said when it comes to some guy claiming the Sumarians writing about storing "essence in clay jars" is proof for them storing DNA!



this is linguistics. What are some examples of linguistically objective evidence?

Iterationzero and I disagree with the meaning of a symbol on a specific tablet the Sumerians made depicting man being given agriculture from a race of space people. I'm assuming he agrees it literally represents actual space people because he didn't object when I brought that up. He's hung up on whether the symbol represents our solar system or a constellation. I say our solar system because the planets match up with ours and also because the Sumerians say that's what it means. I don't think anybody disagrees the Sumerians were talking about people from another planet they called Nibiru in our solar system (they counted the bodies in our solar system from the farthest planet in toward the sun and described them accurately) but Iterationzero probably doesn't want to talk about that issue though. He/she says the center object is a star in a constellation somewhere else because the star is depicted with four radiating lines with a central disk and the Sumerians regularly depicted our sun as simply a disk (like the ones you see in Egyptian symbols) without any radiating lines. Even if it does represent another constellation IZ is missing the big picture that we are still being told they were space people. I'm sure now you will say they were just making it up because they were very humble people and wouldn't want to brag about creating such a sophisticated and advanced civilization by themselves randomly as if they just made it all up out of boredom.



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 09:22 PM
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Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

Originally posted by bottleslingguy

Originally posted by MrXYZ

And no, can't read Sumerian

edit on 1-11-2011 by MrXYZ because: (no reason given)


so then how could you have a valid opinion of whether or not he's wrong? Your opinion has no credibility in this discussion.


So you never read a correctly translated book?


if you can't read Sumerian then how do you know whether or not it is correctly translated?


Because true scientists back up their translations with facts whereas Sitchin and the other pseudo-scientists draw wild conclusions without backing them up properly. Take the famous Figaro opera for example, it was originally written in Italian...yet you can get accurate English translations. They're accurate because the translations are backed up by objective evidence...which cannot be said when it comes to some guy claiming the Sumarians writing about storing "essence in clay jars" is proof for them storing DNA!



this is linguistics. What are some examples of linguistically objective evidence?

Iterationzero and I disagree with the meaning of a symbol on a specific tablet the Sumerians made depicting man being given agriculture from a race of space people. I'm assuming he agrees it literally represents actual space people because he didn't object when I brought that up. He's hung up on whether the symbol represents our solar system or a constellation. I say our solar system because the planets match up with ours and also because the Sumerians say that's what it means. I don't think anybody disagrees the Sumerians were talking about people from another planet they called Nibiru in our solar system (they counted the bodies in our solar system from the farthest planet in toward the sun and described them accurately) but Iterationzero probably doesn't want to talk about that issue though. He/she says the center object is a star in a constellation somewhere else because the star is depicted with four radiating lines with a central disk and the Sumerians regularly depicted our sun as simply a disk (like the ones you see in Egyptian symbols) without any radiating lines. Even if it does represent another constellation IZ is missing the big picture that we are still being told they were space people. I'm sure now you will say they were just making it up because they were very humble people and wouldn't want to brag about creating such a sophisticated and advanced civilization by themselves randomly as if they just made it all up out of boredom.


I agree, and either way you slice it, they were space people.



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 09:27 PM
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So you think we have evolved huh?

You might be shocked to learn that we in fact have not evolved. Here are just some examples....
We now drink processed water. Now we wear clothing. We live in buildings to protect us from the planet. We make indoor heat and AC to accommodate our tight temperature needs. We ventured from jungles to toothbrush, toothpaste, combs, and deodorant. It wasn’t easy enough to eat in the wild so we ventured away from the jungle to the city where we work jobs, to buy food. Food is grown, harvested, processed, packaged, shipped, merchandised, bagged shipped, and cooked because it’s easier? Nothing else on this planet goes through what we go through simply to eat a meal.


We suffer from REDUNDANT adaptation, and I don’t know how in the world anyone can mistake this for evolving. Evolving would mean we wouldn’t have to adapt, but we are. Everything you come into contact with on a daily basis, is most likely a form of adaptation. It’s so bad that we honestly would have been better off staying primates, if thats where we really come from. So if we have evolved, we have actually de-evolved. Our health is in constant check from the moment we are born, to the degree that we would die without medical intervention. I know every area is different but in my town, the medical profession accounts for about 20 to 25% of the yellow pages. But remember, we evolved because we are better off. Have you every just perused the medical isles in a store? We are very sickly.


It makes no sense that in our evolving we are now having to use soap to bath, wearing socks and shoes, clothing, wear coats when it’s cold etc... This is not a pity party, as though life is hard. There is a big difference between hard and life threatening. It’s as though most of our choices in food were not intended for us. Did primates have stoves? Why do we have to double kill most things we eat? Did they have dishes? I don’t think so. Anyhow, we are not better off, we are screwed. There is only one logical explanation for this. Earth is not our home and we were brought here. Aside from air and water, try to think of a single thing on this planet that ties us to it? There is nothing. We can’t even safely drink water without processing it first.


We don’t look anything like primates aside from the fact that we are both humanoid. You might think oh sure, we both have two eyes, two ears, a mouth, and a nose, but what other species doesn’t? I don’t think we are related simply though association. We have vestigial organs which evolutionists seem to believe is in there favor, when it’s actually the opposite. If we left unused organs behind, it means we once again failed in evolving by not getting rid of them.


Probably the biggest problem in this picture is all of the plethora of proof showing we evolved from primates. The Assam tribune posted an article on Dec 12th 2010 indicating our species never fell below tens of thousands. They were able to tell this through our mtDNA. Whats scary is they never tell us what the true age is of our species, just that we are over 200,000 years old. Now if we are that old, why in the hell isn’t there oddles of bones to prove we have always been here? Simple, we aren’t from here, we were brought here from a different planet.

The bible concurs. In a twisted way it appears that Adam and Eve might have been abductees. The ezekiel chapter speaks about god visiting us in a space craft. Aliens do abduct people so it is possible that is how we got here. Hebrews speaks about how earth is not our home, and there are much better choices for us in different citys on different planets. Adam and Eve seemed to have no memory of being abducted and it is well known that aliens have had the ability to erase memory.



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 11:08 PM
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Originally posted by HillbillyHippie1
Yes, technically one could argue that we are doing precisely what we were engineered to do, and likely in accordance with some similarity to our Creator, as our Creator would likely design us in accordance with familiar means (ie. in their image in some way or another), but that is mere speculation, while IDT is a demonstratable and provable FACT of reality, unlike macro evolution via unmitigated natural selection.or any other purely METAPHYSICAL fantasy. IDT is everywhere and being demonstrated on a daily basis, since humans are intelligent and we design life - the case is closed. It is OBVIOUS that life is designed (via the everyday demonstration of IDT); therefore, although we do not know who designed us, we do know that it is the most likely thing to have happened.


Designing and creating are 2 completely different things. Humans build things, that isn't evidence for intelligent design, unless you simply mean intelligent people designing things, and not a creator of humans or the universe. Apples and oranges trying to claim that humans building is the same as a powerful god creating the universe. There is way more physical evidence that shows evolution is true. Some of the details might not be perfect, but we can say with confidence that humans evolved from the same ancestor that many great apes evolved from. There isn't a single shred of evidence to suggest the universe (or humans) were created. Nice try.



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 11:41 PM
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Originally posted by itsthetooth
Evolving would mean we wouldn’t have to adapt, but we are. Everything you come into contact with on a daily basis, is most likely a form of adaptation. It’s so bad that we honestly would have been better off staying primates, if thats where we really come from. So if we have evolved, we have actually de-evolved. Our health is in constant check from the moment we are born, to the degree that we would die without medical intervention.

That's a very poor argument against evolution, because in reality disease are evidence (and also catalysts) FOR evolution, PLUS the medical industry is a business based on profit. People get sick, diseases spread not just to humans but animals as well. The ones with better resistance survive. This is natural phenomena and evolution of bacteria and viruses. Our high intelligence is what separates us from the other animals on earth and is the reason why we've taken over the planet, and mass produce food and other things. Money is the prime survival tool today, therefor humans don't need to be physically superior to survive on this planet, as was the case in the past. People are fatter and generally less in shape than we used to be for that very reason. Evolution IS adaptation on the long term. Humans have PHYSICALLY changed. Proof of this is the various races of human. We evolve based on sexual selection and beneficial traits passed down. This doesn't change and never will. Also claiming humans are a sickly species is simply inaccurate. Our life expectancy 5,000 years ago was like 30. Now people live past 100. Medicine has changed our planet for the better, although plenty of people abuse the system.



It makes no sense that in our evolving we are now having to use soap to bath, wearing socks and shoes, clothing, wear coats when it’s cold etc... This is not a pity party, as though life is hard. There is a big difference between hard and life threatening. It’s as though most of our choices in food were not intended for us. Did primates have stoves? Why do we have to double kill most things we eat? Did they have dishes? I don’t think so. Anyhow, we are not better off, we are screwed. There is only one logical explanation for this. Earth is not our home and we were brought here. Aside from air and water, try to think of a single thing on this planet that ties us to it? There is nothing. We can’t even safely drink water without processing it first.

Using soap and modern technology has nothing to do with evolution. We are smart. We design things, learn through science, and pass the knowledge down to the next generation. We don't need soap to survive, we just prefer it. In this modern world, convenience is #1, and money buys convenience. We know that drinking water straight out of a lake can cause unwanted bacteria in the system so we avoid it. Simple fact of reality, intelligence drives the human species, and the smarter ones have the best chance. The ones who drink that lake water without boiling it first will be more likely to get sick and die. Evolution in action. This isn't evidence we don't belong here. We are composed of something like 75% water, as is the earth. Our DNA is 80% similar (or close to it) to every known life form on earth.



You might think oh sure, we both have two eyes, two ears, a mouth, and a nose, but what other species doesn’t? I don’t think we are related simply though association. We have vestigial organs which evolutionists seem to believe is in there favor, when it’s actually the opposite. If we left unused organs behind, it means we once again failed in evolving by not getting rid of them.

Another terrible argument. The fact that we share a common ancestor with chimpanzees, is based on DNA, not because they look similar. Vestigial organs simply mean we've changed. The organ isn't going to disappear over night because it isn't fully used. If our survival was in jeopardy because of it, it might. Evolution doesn't make a species perfect. Besides, the appendix DOES have a purpose in modern day humans, regardless of what most people assume.


The Assam tribune posted an article on Dec 12th 2010 indicating our species never fell below tens of thousands. They were able to tell this through our mtDNA. Whats scary is they never tell us what the true age is of our species, just that we are over 200,000 years old. Now if we are that old, why in the hell isn’t there oddles of bones to prove we have always been here? Simple, we aren’t from here, we were brought here from a different planet.

en.wikipedia.org...
I don't know what your definition of "oodles" is, but there are tons of fossils, but fossilization is rare. Obviously your understanding of science and evolution is pretty poor to even suggest something like that. If we didn't evolve, then we were placed here exactly after we should have evolved anyway based on early hominids. So you believe that all life on earth evolved except humans? That seems a bit silly considering the fossils lead right up to us.
edit on 2-11-2011 by Barcs because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 11:46 PM
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Instead of concentrating on where we came from, how about we focus on where we are going. This is a typical ATS thread that merely divides people. We are supposed to be denying ignorance not feeding it. Grow up. God gave everyone the right to think for themselves so if someone wants to believe God created us, fine by me, and if another someone wants to believe humans evolved from monkeys or apes or gorillas or orangutangs or anyother primate then more power to them. Set aside these silly trivial differences and use the energy you would use to argue a never-ending arguement to better ourselves and give future generations a world to live in that is better than we live in now. You like Coke, I like Pepsi, big funking deal, let's drink and not be thirsty. (WARNING: high fructose corn syrup is the leading cause of diabetes and obesity)


 
Posted Via ATS Mobile: m.abovetopsecret.com
 



posted on Nov, 2 2011 @ 11:57 PM
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reply to post by DoNotForgetMe
 


But education and knowledge are important to moving forward and progressing as a species. If people continue to ignore facts that scientists have dedicate their lives to researching, that are testable, repeatable and falsifiable, then our future is looking dim. Creation and evolution are compatible with each other, it doesn't have to be one or the other. The debates always stem from a lack of understanding of the science or a particular scientific field of study. Prime example being the person I responded to above. I enjoy educating people because knowledge is power. It's not like we're debating semantics, or soda flavors. We're talking about irrationally denying a scientific field of study here. If I can help someone improve their understand of something, I'm going to do it. I care about intelligence in society, and I feel its a travesty that it is so often downplayed, especially when it comes to politicians and people in positions of power. It's also generally thought of as "uncool" to be too smart. We need to change this trend or we're not going anywhere.
edit on 3-11-2011 by Barcs because: (no reason given)



posted on Nov, 3 2011 @ 07:29 AM
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reply to post by bottleslingguy
 





I don't think anybody disagrees the Sumerians were talking about people from another planet they called Nibiru in our solar system (they counted the bodies in our solar system from the farthest planet in toward the sun and described them accurately) but Iterationzero probably doesn't want to talk about that issue though.


Given that there's no objective proof anything shown on tablets and the like are people from space (you're SPECULATING), I'd say that most real scientists disagree with your assessment. Especially considering you're now implying a planet for which we have zero objective evidence


I strongly suggest you stop watching pseudo-scientific programs on the History Channel and learn the difference between real objective evidence and subjective speculation



posted on Nov, 3 2011 @ 07:42 AM
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reply to post by itsthetooth
 





You might be shocked to learn that we in fact have not evolved. Here are just some examples....


You mean except for tons of animals like ants?





We suffer from REDUNDANT adaptation, and I don’t know how in the world anyone can mistake this for evolving. Evolving would mean we wouldn’t have to adapt, but we are.


What are you talking about? Of course we're adapting...and that's exactly what the theory predicts


Even worse, we are actively using the theory in modern medicine to predict outcomes. If the theory were wrong, we couldn't predict future outcomes as accurately as we are...




So if we have evolved, we have actually de-evolved.


And more nonsense


I wouldn't call evovling to the point where we get disposable thumbs "de-evolution"





Our health is in constant check from the moment we are born, to the degree that we would die without medical intervention. I know every area is different but in my town, the medical profession accounts for about 20 to 25% of the yellow pages. But remember, we evolved because we are better off. Have you every just perused the medical isles in a store? We are very sickly.


...just like every animal and plant. All suspectible to disease





It makes no sense that in our evolving we are now having to use soap to bath, wearing socks and shoes, clothing, wear coats when it’s cold etc... This is not a pity party, as though life is hard. There is a big difference between hard and life threatening.


Wait, are you seriously claiming us using clothes is proof against evolution


According to that "logic", monkeys using sticks to get to maggots is proof against evolution too...which makes no sense as it's a prime example of how evolution works





Earth is not our home and we were brought here. Aside from air and water, try to think of a single thing on this planet that ties us to it?


Let's ignore the fact that you don't present any proof suggesting we came from somewhere else. Apart from water and air we are also tied to earth because of food, and of course the environment that's habitable for us.




We don’t look anything like primates aside from the fact that we are both humanoid.


Which is further proof that we share a common ancestor





We have vestigial organs which evolutionists seem to believe is in there favor, when it’s actually the opposite. If we left unused organs behind, it means we once again failed in evolving by not getting rid of them.


Now you're just showing how little you actually know about the theory. Having "left over organs and limbs" is PROOF of evolution. We see it over and over again not only in humans, but also animals and plants.




Probably the biggest problem in this picture is all of the plethora of proof showing we evolved from primates. The Assam tribune posted an article on Dec 12th 2010 indicating our species never fell below tens of thousands. They were able to tell this through our mtDNA. Whats scary is they never tell us what the true age is of our species, just that we are over 200,000 years old. Now if we are that old, why in the hell isn’t there oddles of bones to prove we have always been here? Simple, we aren’t from here, we were brought here from a different planet.


Because bones are ony preserved under specific circumstances after 200,000 years. You might wanna read up on how fossilization works





The bible concurs. In a twisted way it appears that Adam and Eve might have been abductees. The ezekiel chapter speaks about god visiting us in a space craft. Aliens do abduct people so it is possible that is how we got here. Hebrews speaks about how earth is not our home, and there are much better choices for us in different citys on different planets. Adam and Eve seemed to have no memory of being abducted and it is well known that aliens have had the ability to erase memory.


Well, given that we KNOW for a fact taht humans share a common ancestor with today's monkeys...the bible account is DEMONSTRABLY wrong if you take it literally


In short, you have preconceived religious beliefs that override your sense for logic and rationality. You try soooooooo desparately to make the bible "fit", you completely ignore the massive amount of objective evidence supporting the theory. For crying out loud, we have just as much evidence for the theory of evolution as we have for gravity...yet I don't see you spouting nonsense about how gravity has to be called "intelligent falling"



posted on Nov, 3 2011 @ 10:06 AM
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reply to post by Barcs
 


So we just one day grew a brain, and which is it, are fossils everywhere, or are they rare?



posted on Nov, 3 2011 @ 10:11 AM
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Please tell me your joking, we are way sicker than anything else on this planet. Constant intervention is needed just to keep us alive, other life isn't going through this. And I think you meant opposable thumbs not disposable thumbs.



posted on Nov, 3 2011 @ 11:05 AM
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Originally posted by MrXYZ
reply to post by bottleslingguy
 





I don't think anybody disagrees the Sumerians were talking about people from another planet they called Nibiru in our solar system (they counted the bodies in our solar system from the farthest planet in toward the sun and described them accurately) but Iterationzero probably doesn't want to talk about that issue though.


Given that there's no objective proof anything shown on tablets and the like are people from space (you're SPECULATING), I'd say that most real scientists disagree with your assessment. Especially considering you're now implying a planet for which we have zero objective evidence


I strongly suggest you stop watching pseudo-scientific programs on the History Channel and learn the difference between real objective evidence and subjective speculation


science.nasa.gov...



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