Can you prove evolution wrong

reply to post by MrXYZ

Tooth, it's really hard to take you serious if you post garbage like that. People have posted irrefutable proof that evolution is occuring, hell, I even posted links highlighting how exactly it's applied in modern medicine.

In short, you rob yourself of all credibility posting nonsense like that

Again I think your missing the point. They have never identified evolution in progress, therefore they can't claim that it's actually happening. They are just guessing its evolution.

The day they can say, hey thats not evolution that caused that one gene change, thats actually from ADHD, so the rest that changed must be evolution, is the day people will wise up about whats really going on.

Evolution happens, at least the cycle of such, I just so happen to believe that everything is accounted, or could be accounted for, rather than claiming that random things happen for no apparen't reason. You have to resort back to what we know about evolution. If something changes, thats evolution, if something decides not to change, thats evolution, if something mutates, thats evolution, if sexuall selection occurs that is also evolution, and if speciation occurs that is also evolution. Now don't you think its a little funny that evolution is going on under our noses to the degree that is supposedly is, yet we don't know what IT looks like, we have no way to verify its existance, because its looked at like a process, we have no way to predict what the next anything will be, but we are sure that its evolution.

I'm sorry man but it looks like the grandaddy of snake oil to me.

reply to post by MrXYZ

By the way, regarding ADHD, you don't seem to understand the disease. It doesn't even affect the DNA of everyone who has it. Some are missing a chromosome or have one too many, but not ALL of them. In short, they don't know what's causing it (yet). And even if it's a genetic disorder, how on earth does that disprove evolution? There's tons of genetic disorders both in humans and animals.

In short: Your argument is (as seemingly always) complete and utter nonsense.

ADHD was used as an example to prove that evolution is not the only thing making changes. ADHD DOES appear as a genetic change, and they have in fact identified that gene. All I'm saying is that I bet anything evolutionists would precieve this as a change and call it evolution, when its in fact ADHD. It also proves that evolution is not the only thing making changes, and I'll bet money that scientists didn't account for that, they just see a change and call it good to call it evolution.

reply to post by colin42


www.mania.com...

en.wikipedia.org...

www.oddee.com...

www.ufocasebook.com...

ufos.about.com...

www.phenomenalog.com...

www.kevincassell.com...

www.huffingtonpost.com...
Some are just stories but even those can be educational.

alienabductionsexposed.com...

www.buzzle.com...

reply to post by MrXYZ

I still can't get over the fact that tooth seriously claimed cows are being abducted by aliens so those aliens can "gain an edge"

Really, then let me ask you some questions.

Do you think that cattle have the mental capability to opperate an interstellar vehicle?
Do you thing that cattle would have the know how up pack up and move to another planet on their own?

reply to post by colin42


I may not have any proof that ANY of the millions of people that are reported missing, got abducted, but I do think its a little odd that people have reports about being taken against their will and some get returend. Now isn't it just possible that some don't get returned?

reply to post by itsthetooth
Every trait in every organism that has ever existed has its basis in genetic material. Its beyond obvious that ADHD is correlated with a sequence of nucleotides on some chromosome. So if its not through the differential reproduction of molecules that accounts for these changes (we actually see this under a microscpe, we can see chromosomes, we can see molecules, and we can see molecules change), what else do you think it could be? I'm assuming you think its an invisible, magical, supernatural hand, or some alien being traveling in other dimensions of space and time that can physically change the interaction of molecules. Obviously there is no evidence for that, and there never will be.

Evolution is a word that describes not only the actual mechanisms of change, but how organisms respond or change with these molecular changes. If you are searching for something more, like alien intervention, you won't find it.

Again, not sure how your brain is trying to work through the article on ADHD you read. Such articles are released daily, if not hourly, and are trivial. The only benefit from that study is now scientists can find a way to better treat or diagnose ADHD because they know where to look.

Originally posted by itsthetooth
reply to post by MrXYZ

 

By the way, regarding ADHD, you don't seem to understand the disease. It doesn't even affect the DNA of everyone who has it. Some are missing a chromosome or have one too many, but not ALL of them. In short, they don't know what's causing it (yet). And even if it's a genetic disorder, how on earth does that disprove evolution? There's tons of genetic disorders both in humans and animals.

In short: Your argument is (as seemingly always) complete and utter nonsense.

ADHD was used as an example to prove that evolution is not the only thing making changes. ADHD DOES appear as a genetic change, and they have in fact identified that gene. All I'm saying is that I bet anything evolutionists would precieve this as a change and call it evolution, when its in fact ADHD. It also proves that evolution is not the only thing making changes, and I'll bet money that scientists didn't account for that, they just see a change and call it good to call it evolution.

No they haven't identified the gene. What they DID find out was that some people with ADHD are either missing a chromosome, or they have one too much. And again, it's not all of them that show those symptoms.

reply to post by itsthetooth

They have never identified evolution in progress, therefore they can't claim that it's actually happening. They are just guessing its evolution.

Evolution isn't a person or something causing the change. For the gazillionth time, EVOLUTION IS CHANGE!!

And of course we have identified it, for crying out loud, they are USING THE THEORY IN THE LAB EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK!!

God (no pun intended) you're clueless...

reply to post by itsthetooth
And what the hell is a list of links? You truly are the most ignorant, uneducated person on this site.

You are here to debate. Not preach you unfounded claims. I am not interested in your links to more fantasy story tellers,

If they are part of your supporting evidence then they need to be part of your LOGIC based argument and the pertinent parts of those links quoted.

You supplied no argument. No supporting evidence. no links and quotes from those links. No reason to reply further.

Originally posted by itsthetooth
reply to post by colin42

 

I may not have any proof that ANY of the millions of people that are reported missing, got abducted, but I do think its a little odd that people have reports about being taken against their will and some get returend. Now isn't it just possible that some don't get returned?

You have no proof that your figure of millions is even true.

All your opinion is bunk and based on nothing at all. So show evidence to support your claim. Show the where it is confirmed that millions go missing. Is this every decade, year, month? Your post was as usual uneducated trash. No need to reply further.

reply to post by itsthetooth
So tooth what is the lie and what the truth and what is just ignorance on your part from the statements you make in this post:

No you can, if you study it close enough, but it's not always easy. Honey could be a target food for bees, Ants could be a target food for anteaters. Krill could be a target food for whales.

1. How can honey be the target food for bee's if they MAKE honey from pollen?
2. What came first the ant or the ant eater?
3. Not that you have the slightest clue of the world around you but there are many types of whale from the Orca to the blue whale. Of course all your opinion and no evidence at all.

Which is all a very good analysis but ony if you honestly believe that dogs migrated from wolves, which I don't.

Here is a whopper from you. You state the above yet Here on page 401 You make this claim:

Clearly dogs and wolves have evolved from one or the other, If you want to believe in evolution anyhow, so why is it they can mate? Meanwhile we have times where the same species can't mate. Obvious tampering.

You say here :

I have in the past used the term that they are relatives but genetics doesn't prove that.

You have been shown THIS many times And this Wolfdog so you have no excuse for your ignorant statement above. Explain.

reply to post by uva3021

Every trait in every organism that has ever existed has its basis in genetic material. Its beyond obvious that ADHD is correlated with a sequence of nucleotides on some chromosome. So if its not through the differential reproduction of molecules that accounts for these changes (we actually see this under a microscpe, we can see chromosomes, we can see molecules, and we can see molecules change), what else do you think it could be? I'm assuming you think its an invisible, magical, supernatural hand, or some alien being traveling in other dimensions of space and time that can physically change the interaction of molecules. Obviously there is no evidence for that, and there never will be.

Just because we don't know what it is, and haven't been able to identify the changes doesn't mean I'm going to just agree its evolution. Thats like saying you have to have something to believe in.

IMO it is possible that most of those changes are nominal changes though our own genome, that have nothing to do with evolution. It is possible since we have never established a base to compare it to. In fact all we have at this time is assumptions based on whats normal. We know that being between 5 and 6 feet tall is normal, but when someone comes out to be 8 feet tall we assume that to be a defect. The fact is we don't know, we are assuming based on the fact that he will usually have many more complications as a result. And I'm not necessarly disagreeing because I understand as well.
All I'm saying is that we base a lot on assuming.

Now if our species is suppose to make changes normally within acceptable limits, what ever that is, in our genome, it is possible that they are just normal and have nothing to do with evolution as we understand. it. It's going to be pretty hard to convince everyone that evolution is occuring when you can't even identify it.

The day that they can look at our genome and say oh ya this section specifically occured from evolution, is the day that scientists will have the worlds attention.

reply to post by uva3021

Evolution is a word that describes not only the actual mechanisms of change, but how organisms respond or change with these molecular changes. If you are searching for something more, like alien intervention, you won't find it.

Again, not sure how your brain is trying to work through the article on ADHD you read. Such articles are released daily, if not hourly, and are trivial. The only benefit from that study is now scientists can find a way to better treat or diagnose ADHD because they know where to look.

No I think those changes are coming from somewhere else not evolution, and there is no proof on either side at this point.

In order for evolution to be responsible for such a vast amount of different things, is like impossible.

And that was the whole point about the ADHD article, NOW they know where you look. In other words they didn't know before, which means evoltuion was claiming those genetic differences. Not no more.

reply to post by MrXYZ

No they haven't identified the gene. What they DID find out was that some people with ADHD are either missing a chromosome, or they have one too much. And again, it's not all of them that show those symptoms

It doesn't matter, all that matters is that they are sure its in our genetics. If they have a problem identifying it, it just means its possible that evolution will be claiming it as evolution changes.

reply to post by MrXYZ

Evolution isn't a person or something causing the change. For the gazillionth time, EVOLUTION IS CHANGE!!

And of course we have identified it, for crying out loud, they are USING THE THEORY IN THE LAB EVERY SINGLE DAY OF THE WEEK!!

God (no pun intended) you're clueless...

I know that, its just my way of being sarcastic. IMO, in order for evolution to be able to be responsible for all of the things that its capeable of, it must be a species, or bug, but defintaly not just a process. If for some reason it is just a process, and it is real then there must have been intelligence behind the creation of that process.

reply to post by colin42

And what the hell is a list of links? You truly are the most ignorant, uneducated person on this site.

You are here to debate. Not preach you unfounded claims. I am not interested in your links to more fantasy story tellers,

If they are part of your supporting evidence then they need to be part of your LOGIC based argument and the pertinent parts of those links quoted.

You supplied no argument. No supporting evidence. no links and quotes from those links. No reason to reply further

You asked if I had links to support that theory, so I gave you links.

reply to post by colin42


www.csicop.org...

This figure has been widely publicized and is often assumed to mean that millions of people have been visited by members of an alien species and, in some cases, physically taken from their beds, cars, or homes to an alien craft or planet.

It's all over the internet, and I was sure it was even on wiki as well, they even narrowed down the fact that more than half of those reported are to be from the alien grays.

There are a few ways to look at this. You could consider that some people lie, so there may not be millions, or you could go the other route and realize that not everyone reports their occurances so its probably an accurate figure.

You have no proof that your figure of millions is even true.

All your opinion is bunk and based on nothing at all. So show evidence to support your claim. Show the where it is confirmed that millions go missing. Is this every decade, year, month? Your post was as usual uneducated trash. No need to reply further.

Nope, I got it by reading.

What are you going to say now that millions of people just so happen to be having the same nighmare ??? Or let me guess, no comment.

reply to post by itsthetooth
You still don't understand what evolution is. Evolution can only happen if individuals vary at any spot along their DNA. And since every organism ever to have lived has a different sequence of nucleotides that make up their DNA, evolution occurs. Even twins, asexual organisms, or bacteria that undergo binary-fission, have differences proportional to the mutation rate. Nothing is 'attributed' to evolution, because everything is evolution if there is nucleotide variation. ADHD is diagnosed because some people have adenine instead of guanine at locus X, for example. And these are the discoveries of traits 'for something' that are being found every day. Technology makes genetic findings a very simple task, and evolution predicts, rather mundanely, that given a trait that shows variation, there will be a corresponding variation in nucleotides on some locus that relates to how that trait is expressed under certain conditions. And that variation may or may not relate to variation in reproductive success.

We see this happening under a microscope. There is no other alternative. There will never be any other explanation. The scientists that studied ADHD have to assume evolution is at work, just like a physics teacher dropping objects off a building has to assume gravity is at work. The ironic thing is evolution doesn't require the laws of chemistry and physics to be at work, all it requires is heredity and variation. Physicists can only dream of such a unified theory in their field. Evolution is a fact, it happens. The problem is you, as well as many others, don't understand it because of some misguided views on human superiority. I call such the "burden of bipedal consciousness."

reply to post by colin42

1. How can honey be the target food for bee's if they MAKE honey from pollen?

Well they do eat their own honey, and it is a source of food for them, a mojor one, so it does qualify.

2. What came first the ant or the ant eater?

Probably the ant.

3. Not that you have the slightest clue of the world around you but there are many types of whale from the Orca to the blue whale. Of course all your opinion and no evidence at all.

whale.wheelock.edu...

Other baleen whales (like humpbacks
and fin whales) feed on small schooling fish (herring, sand lance,
capelin etc) as well as on krill.

I was referring to the humpback whales.

You have been shown THIS many times And this Wolfdog so you have no excuse for your ignorant statement above. Explain.

Exactly, becasue if they were in fact the same species, you would not be creating a 3rd species called wolfdog. Now if that offspring created dogs, you would be right, if it created wolves, you would be right, but its creating a wolfdog. The fact that you can identify the difference between wolf and dog and wolf dog tells you.

reply to post by itsthetooth

You asked if I had links to support that theory, so I gave you links.

Dishonest again. I asked for a logical argument supported by evidence and links with quotes from those links. I guess you are too lazy and to ignorant to do it

Nothing to answer here. No comment