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Can you prove evolution wrong?*

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posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 07:56 AM
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Originally posted by itsthetooth
Here is where your dead wrong. You see they did leave some proof behind, they left us with our DNA.

How does DNA itself prove aliens?



There is a hell of a lot more than that. Pryamids, nazda lines, hyroglifics, areas destroyed by what appears to be atomic bombs, Paintings in prymids depicting what appears to be mad scientist DNA work. There is tons more. I suggest you watch charriot ot the gods and our jaw will drop at just how much of this there is. There is no question this planet was inhabited before us.

It also raises a good question as to where they went. It appears they were shipped out of here the same way they got here.

I'm well aware of all that, but again we can only speculate since we don't know the actual answer. Ancient humans simply could have been advanced or had a technology boom similar to the one we've had in the past 1000 years, 50,000+ years ago. It's a really cool concept, but I there's no objective evidence unfortunately and it still has nothing to do with the fact that is evolution. Instead of trying to downplay it, acknowledge it for what it is and use it to help you formulate a legitimate hypothesis. That's the main issue. You are arguing against evolution but using arguments about aliens as evidence. You need to use science as evidence.

edit on 11-12-2011 by Barcs because: (no reason given)




posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 08:30 AM
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reply to post by iterationzero
 

It has nothing to do with faith, it has everything to do with reality like the logistics of these very very early feats of skill and architecture and the level of sophistication in the blink of an eye. Your believing they had some technology that has since gone away somehow is more like believing in God than my accepting aliens as the people who, as told by cultures from all around the world to be from other planets and star systems. Why is every ancient culture obsessed with astronomy and why do they all talk about specific details of other planets and space faring cultures? This modern science snobbery is getting in the way like an ignorance.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 08:53 AM
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Originally posted by iterationzero
Yes, you are. You take every single event that's currently unexplained and invoke aliens as the cause. It's no different than creationist doing the same thing with God.


no I'm not
I'm arguing the physical and logistical argument. The erosion evidence, things tangible. Your the one squirreling around looking for some fantastic way of tying a knot or how to make tiny detailed carving in rocks that are so hard only cutting blades found today could have cut and worked them. Even today some of the work would be if not impossible done in a way we haven't yet mastered. The levels of sophistication they reached would be putting us at our current limits and it seems to me after overwhelming consensus of cultures from all around the world and through out history that the simplest most tangible explanation is just what the ancient people tell us about gods doing all this stuff in one way or another. You are the one with the ethereal explanation.





Originally posted by iterationzero
Because it wouldn't be taking them at their word, it would be taking you at your interpretation of their word. Unless you've actually spoken to these people from ~10kya and confirmed that these are eyewitness accounts of alien contact and not just allegorical stories. Have you?


don't play stupid it's unbecoming



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 09:08 AM
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Originally posted by vasaga

Originally posted by colin42
Evolution dies not lack an explanation and it is backed up by evidence. You cannot explain diversity evident by the total lack of it when asked so until you can come up with a theory, backed with evidence Evolution wins, every time.

I agree not knowing X is no proof god did it. It does not stop the claims by the creationists side though does it?

I also agree evolution has nothing to say about creation but creationist cannot understand or will not understand this fact.

We, on this thread have not had anyone put forward an alternative only blind faith in a guy called Pye and rubbish about we dont fit.

You have your own thoughts but will not share. What a cop out. So again you post on a thread asking for an alternative explanation with no intent to do so.

Creationists do not seem able to grasp the concept and get upset when we ask for an alternative explanation to evolution and I believe that anger stems from the knowledge that you do not have one.

BTW "it's not my own view, but the truth"
Just because the creationists use those arguments doesn't mean you are justified to do so yourself. Two wrongs don't make a right, and if you can claim that you are right or whatever, you shouldn't need those arguments in the first place because the truth speaks for itself. But apparently, evolution needs some crusading...

I explained why I won't post my views. I will say that I have nothing against evolution, in specific particular senses of the word, since it can mean different things and is used randomly with these different meanings. In this case, it basically means change over time, and I have nothing against this particular aspect of evolution.
Not sharing has nothing to do with anger in my case btw. It has to do with the clear intentions of people here.. Like.. Why do you criticize me for posting in a thread because I lack the intention to share an alternative view? Why do you want me to share one so badly? Aside from that.. Are you here to share an alternative view? No? Oh right, the question wasn't directed at you either then, now was it? Why are you here then? So your reason is also different than what the thread was intended to.. So.. Why do you criticize me while you're doing the same thing?


The argument for Evolution and defending against ill informed and purposeful denial has been done to death in many threads. This thread asks you to explain diversity without it. That is why I am asking you to show an alternative view.

If people can be so sure that evolution is wrong then they must have an alternative which they obviously do not. It looks like you are also in that camp. So no, I will not be distracted and will continue to ask you and others who say evolution is wrong to offer an alternative. Which is a 100% fail at this point.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 09:51 AM
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reply to post by bottleslingguy
 


no I'm not I'm arguing the physical and logistical argument. The erosion evidence, things tangible. Your the one squirreling around looking for some fantastic way of tying a knot or how to make tiny detailed carving in rocks that are so hard only cutting blades found today could have cut and worked them. Even today some of the work would be if not impossible done in a way we haven't yet mastered. The levels of sophistication they reached would be putting us at our current limits and it seems to me after overwhelming consensus of cultures from all around the world and through out history that the simplest most tangible explanation is just what the ancient people tell us about gods doing all this stuff in one way or another. You are the one with the ethereal explanation.

The tangible evidence says that, in some cases, we don't know exactly how they did it. You're invoking intangible aliens as your explanation.


don't play stupid it's unbecoming

Don't make claims you have no evidence for. It's dishonest.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 10:32 AM
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Originally posted by bottleslingguy
reply to post by HappyBunny
 

that argument has no bearing on the objective proof that cave people with rocks and sticks could not build these things. It's as simple as that.


People who lived just a few thousand years ago weren't living in caves. They could and did build those structures. Just because we're not quite sure how they did some of it, it doesn't necessarily follow that it was aliens.

Please give our ancestors some credit for being intelligent.

And see this one. They've found a Neandertal megalith, built from mammoth bones:

www.sciencenews.org...

And this:

www.pasthorizonspr.com...

And another:

www.history.com...

The Neandertals were not the hunchback brutes they're still portrayed as. Early H. sapiens thought enough of them and their abilities that we borrowed their tool kits--there's no point in re-inventing the wheel, after all.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 10:37 AM
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Originally posted by iterationzero
reply to post by bottleslingguy
 


you can't pretend this can be done by banging rocks on the stones that must have been much heavier than 16 tons before they were carved. The guy says they could've been raised by posts or whatever like that solves the entire logistic problems involved with something of this scale. You can't downplay the reality of this with a shrug of your shoulders like when you said "just because we don't know all of the answers at this point ". I know the answer to what it takes to work with stone to that degree and people back then couldn't do that without help.

So we have to revise our view of the technology they possessed. It still doesn't mean aliens did it. It just means mankind was more advanced earlier than we had originally understood.

Exactly. And 50,000 years ago we were in the middle of an ice age. Ice destroys a lot. Between the ice and sea level rising 300 feet at the end of the Ice Age, a lot of evidence is either ground to dust or off the coasts at the bottom of the sea.

50,000 years is a long time. Look at how far we've come in just the last 150 or so.
edit on 12/11/2011 by HappyBunny because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 10:40 AM
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Originally posted by bottleslingguy
reply to post by iterationzero
 

It has nothing to do with faith, it has everything to do with reality like the logistics of these very very early feats of skill and architecture and the level of sophistication in the blink of an eye. Your believing they had some technology that has since gone away somehow is more like believing in God than my accepting aliens as the people who, as told by cultures from all around the world to be from other planets and star systems. Why is every ancient culture obsessed with astronomy and why do they all talk about specific details of other planets and space faring cultures? This modern science snobbery is getting in the way like an ignorance.


Most people today are still interested in astronomy. How could you live under the stars, look up at night, and not wonder what's out there?



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 11:30 AM
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reply to post by steveknows
 




TextDo you know that in your brain you have areas of immidiate memory and long term memory and sometimes the immidiate memory gets sent to the long term area of your brain so it feels like you've experienced it before but you haven't

Your analogy is so human,but its human thinking.

what does what you said have to do with loooking in the future some 20 years?


edit on 11-12-2011 by LogiosHermes27 because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 11:52 AM
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After talking to my team of experts, we have decided to set the record straight on some of the 1.4 million questions about this subject.

1. If evolution is correct...then it has and never will be a thing as aliens, for this world is the first of its kind as well as evolution.

2. If evolution is correct, then this world is the first meaning that you humans have to evolve onto other planets in the future as well as terror forming and long distance space travel.

3.If this is true then it means that you humans are probably the worst example for a first race in the history of the cosmos and the big bang of the life being born in the existence of life it self.

Nevertheless, because it’s not true that only means one thing.

It means that


The first and only thing that should first be considered in solving your little evolution riddle would be…
‘IS THIS THE FIRST PLANET OR THE LAST’

ILL GO AHEAD AND TELL YOU’

This is the last planet, and the same thing your ancestors did on all the other planets over the course of a little under 43,000 years

Your carbonating system is well known to be flawed by over hundreds of millions of years, but it is necessary to keep many things a secret from you people.

‘The only thing earth has is a ozone layer over all the other planets’

It will be very quick…very quick when the solar flares hit this earth on that particular day…they wont feel a thing im told.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 12:17 PM
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Originally posted by LogiosHermes27
1. If evolution is correct...then it has and never will be a thing as aliens, for this world is the first of its kind as well as evolution.

2. If evolution is correct, then this world is the first meaning that you humans have to evolve onto other planets in the future as well as terror forming and long distance space travel.

3.If this is true then it means that you humans are probably the worst example for a first race in the history of the cosmos and the big bang of the life being born in the existence of life it self.


Where do you get this nonsense? If evolution is correct, it means life can form anywhere, and increases the likelihood of aliens and alien life, intelligent alien life simply through probability. If the ingredients for a replicating set of chemicals are formed, all it takes is time and a little luck to get to the point of highly complex life. Since there are billions and billions of other stars, life is extremely likely.

I don't know why your perception of evolution makes this planet special or unique in any way.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 12:33 PM
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reply to post by LogiosHermes27
 


You're joking, right?



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 01:24 PM
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Once again, reading comprehension is low due to arrogance and bias..



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 02:09 PM
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reply to post by vasaga
 

Hi again Truth. Truth, really when you say its the last thing you are going to share? Oh well.

Once again you are off topic. If explaining diversity is not in your bag I suggest you post in the 'I want to argue in an endless cycle thread'. Bye.


edit on 11-12-2011 by colin42 because: truth, who would have guessed



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 02:31 PM
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reply to post by iterationzero
 





Yes, and that's the definition of an autosomal dominant disorder. Maybe you read a basic genetics text and try and understand how these diseases are expressed. It's why I chose Huntington's as an example. Huntington's is autosomal dominant and has complete penetrance i.e. if it's in your genetics at all, you will have the clinical symptoms of the disease. This means I actually underestimated the number of people that would have Huntington's -- if everyone had all 4000 genetic disorders, everyone would have Huntington's. It only takes one copy of the gene that causes Huntington's and it expresses in 100% of the people who have a copy of the gene. The portion of the population that has Huntington's is well under 1%, ergo we all don't have all 4000 genetic disorders.
Unless its #4001. He doesn't actually give us a list by name.




And once again, you're just pulling things out of your rectum to support your case. Herpes is not a genetic disorder. Most people have been exposed to some form of one of many varieties of the herpes virus at some point, but it's not a genetic disorder.

Between your apparent inability to process any kind of factual indication that shows your interpretation of what Pye is saying is wrong and you willingness to lie to support your case, I'm starting to think you're a troll.


I dunno man I'm reading about genetic innoculation.
en.wikipedia.org...



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 02:34 PM
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reply to post by iterationzero
 





Given that you think everyone who believes in evolution is gullible, there are two and half times as many people gullible people who living in the United States right now who believe in evolution as there are people who have bought von Däniken's books worldwide in over 30 years. So your own logic puts the lie to your incredulity.
I doubt seriously if 1/2 the population believes in evolution. On the other hand Obama did win the election. I would just like to see this source or if you pulled it out of your rectum.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 02:55 PM
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reply to post by iterationzero
 





So we have to revise our view of the technology they possessed. It still doesn't mean aliens did it. It just means mankind was more advanced earlier than we had originally understood.
Oh come on Itera. Now YOUR sayng we de-evolved which is what I have been saying.




Yes, you are. You take every single event that's currently unexplained and invoke aliens as the cause. It's no different than creationist doing the same thing with God.
Your not making an obvious connection here. We know aliens have always been ahead in the technology game. As an example they have advanced space travel and we don't. It's kind of a no brainer.
Now I haven't counted them, but there are about 80 reference points in charriots of the gods that basically prove a plethora of intelligent being here at various times. I know you claim to have the book but I'm actually wondering if you even read it, or if your just in deniel.




Because it wouldn't be taking them at their word, it would be taking you at your interpretation of their word. Unless you've actually spoken to these people from ~10kya and confirmed that these are eyewitness accounts of alien contact and not just allegorical stories. Have you?
Why does it seem more like your misinterpretation, than ours. We are taking it at straight face value, and your the one twisting it.



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 03:12 PM
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reply to post by itsthetooth
 


You're making assumptions again, and are still avoiding the thread topic. Explain diversity without evolution or invoking a magical creator. It has to be a process. What is it?



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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reply to post by MrXYZ
 





I already explained why your math is seriously flawed, it assumes that every single species alive today evolved after eachother instead of in parallel. Mathematically, your entire timeline calculation is garbage.
OH I see what your saying now. Cats were spawning dogs and other species at the same time. Did you ever stop to think that if this did happen how come we can't find one iota of it still happening now?




We have thousands of such bones and DNA evidence that backs it up. It's beyond me why you keep on ignoring this FACT!

You are almost like a religious believer who ignores every single fact that goes against his belief. You created your own irrational new age religion...well done, kudos
Thats a really good picture, take a good hard look at it. We don't look anything like them. The only thing we share with them is that they are in part humanoid. Our hair doesn't even match theres.




Scientists haven't completely figured out how life started yet...but that doesn't mean you can just fill that gap in knowledge with magic (aliens, god, etc.) without presenting objective evidence. And you posted ZERO objective evidence that would support your claims.
On the flip side when evidence has been left behind and documentation has been made back from biblical times you choose to ignore them.




We do have enough time, you can't do simple calculations
The only time frame I could pull off the wiki site was 10,000 generations to cause speciation.




I really don't know what to say apart from: PLEASE read the wiki article on evolution, you clearly have no clue and every single one of your posts makes you look silly in front of people who had basic biology. We've witnessed speciation both in the lab and in nature as I've told you at least a dozen times...and funny enough, you keep on ignoring it because it destroys your fantasy world

Humans are still evolving. For example, the average female is now shorter than just 100 years ago. And who exactly claims only humans evolved????? Scientists say every single thing around you evolved, not just humans...really not sure where you got your garbage statement, probably from that crook Pye

Your confusing allowed variances within her species as evolving.
Look at it this way, if we all were identicle in every aspect, then you could say this odd sized woman has something going on. But being shorter over periods of time is just because more short people were passing on there genes. It's normal, shes still human if you missed the big picture here. Now if she slowly started turning into say a horse, well then there is evolution.


You have nothing to say, wow.
I'll tell you something. Evolution defies logic in so many areas that it CANT be real.
It goes against the idea of reproduction by no longer allowing its own species to mate. You have to keep in mind that every living thing has the ability to reproduce, and this step squashes that normal ability.
It defies the controll of a balanced eco system. There is no way that species would be allowed to speciate into something else and still have a natural fit on this planet.
It defies logic in history. We have yet to find that missing ancestor (because he isn't there) and we are never having any other proof in the form of sub species.
It defies our understanding in reproduction. We know that a cat can't mate with a dog, it's utter BS that you could think that they could birth one.





No, they didn't all evolve from eachother, they evolved from ancestors, in parallel...which is why your math calculation is off and simply pointless.

Please do yourself a favor and read the following links to fill your obvious gaps in knowledge

LINK 1
LINK 2
LINK 3

I am not trying to be mean, but you are trying to argue about something you clearly don't have a clue about.
So now your trying to say we all branced out from one another. Which is totally understandable. This whole thing is starting to look like one giant orgy. How in the world can there be so much speciation going on whilst not bones are being left behind of those ancestors?

Our mtDNA has revealed that our population never dipped below tens of thousands. Now I'm not even talking about the bones from the other 5 million that evolved and branced out in multiple direction exponentially, yet leaving no bones. just humans. WHERE ARE THE BONES? I would settle for bone at this point.

We can sure find alien bones but cant find a single evolution bone.


edit on 11-12-2011 by itsthetooth because: (no reason given)



posted on Dec, 11 2011 @ 03:32 PM
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Originally posted by colin42
reply to post by vasaga
 

Hi again Truth. Truth, really when you say its the last thing you are going to share? Oh well.

Once again you are off topic. If explaining diversity is not in your bag I suggest you post in the 'I want to argue in an endless cycle thread'. Bye.


edit on 11-12-2011 by colin42 because: truth, who would have guessed
Liar. I never said the truth is the last thing I'm going to share. See, that's the issue with you people. You are dishonest in your arguments. Using strawmans and red herrings all the time, and then you even dare to claim that you possess the truth, while everything is a bunch of fallacies woven together. Believe whatever you want to believe, but I don't have to go about by your imaginary authoritarian rules.



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