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The vedic civilization and evolution of society in India

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posted on Oct, 19 2011 @ 10:31 AM
Vaastu Shashtra - the science of building a house

Many people want to know how a house should be built. House building is considered an important duty of an Arya. People of ancient India were as keen about building a house as people of modern India.

The basic design principles as per Vaastu are as follows:

1. The house should be open on all four sides. An offset should be kept on both sides, in addition to front and rear. The house should have windows on all four sides so that wind of any direction can enter the house.

2. The preferred layout of house is a square. There should be one or two large rooms in the center, around which smaller rooms should be built in such a way that the large rooms in the center can get adequate sunlight and wind.

3. A room should be designed as a kitchen, and another one as bathroom. A toilet is separate from bathroom and is normally built as an outhouse. If it is to be built within the main house itself, it should be kept in the back of the house, and away from the kitchen.

4. There is no concept of attached bathroom in Vedic system. There is typically one bathroom in the house to be shared by all members of a family.

5. The entrance of the house should be in the central large room.

6. If the house has more than one level, a smaller room in the front can be designed as a staircase.

7. The floor to ceiling height should be twice of the tallest male member, or head of the family. The best height is 11-12 feet.

8. Natural stone like marble/granite is considered best for floor. Vitrified tiles / cement floor are good too. People did not use footwear inside homes. So a stone floor gives a good feel to bare feet. If bricks are used for floor, or pebbles etc., it should be levelled with a mix of loamy soil and cow-dung.

9. White colour is preferred for walls. Plastered walls were white-washed with lime. Palace walls were clad with white marble. White is considered calm and pleasing. Light colours should be used if white is not preferable. Ceiling should be kept white if possible.

10. There is no dining room in Vastu system. The central large room serves as a sitting room as well as a dining room. The traditional way of eating is while sitting on the floor in 'sukhasan'. A low height table can be used for keeping food, or separate mats are used for sitting and serving.

11. If windows are small, build ventilators touching the ceiling, so that sunlight can enter the room as early as possible in the morning.

12. The bedroom should be built in such a way that it has east facing window on the side. It is considered very healthy if the first light of sun shines on the body. The best sleeping orientation is north-south (head towards north).

13. Normally kitchen is built large enough that it can store foodgrains, or an attached store is built.

14. It is considered auspicious to have a fruit tree in front of the house. You can plant as many fruit trees (specially mango) as available land allows. Other preferable plants are herbs which can be used for common ailments. Fuelwood trees can also be planted if available land is large. Cow is an asset in an Arya family, as milk and ghee are in high demand throughout the year. If possible, a cow-shed should be built on the side or back of the house.

15. A bed of flowers is considered good touching the bedroom window.

posted on Oct, 19 2011 @ 10:29 PM
Valmiki Ramayan AyodhyaKaand Chaper 70, verse 52

"Kach-chitte safala vedah kach-chitte safala kriya|
Kach-chitte safala darah kach-chitte safalam shrutam||"

This verse is the most important verse of entire Ramayan, as it is the essence of the Vedic thought.

Do you make knowledge of Veda successful? It is done by performing agnihotra and yagna.
Do you make knowledge of profession (shashtra) successful? It is done by performing the job well - in this case the duties of the king in case of Bharat.
Do you make your woman (wife) successful? It is done by producing children who are strong and capable of learning Veda and Shastra.
Do you make 'shruti' - listening to Veda successful? It is done by living life as per the instructions of God (please see yama and niyam).

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 12:00 AM
Valmiki Ramayan AyodhyaKaand Chapter 74 – Rama consoles Bharat

8. Humans are not free to change the occurrences of good and bad events in life. Man is under the power of God (Ishwar) who makes a man dance like a doll attached to strings, to give results of previous deeds.

9. All collected objects are destroyed, even the progressive human sees the end. The joined (relations) ends in parting (either by death or separation), and life always end in death.

10. Like a ripe fruit always fears its end in a fall, a man always fears his end in death.

11. Like a palace falls when its strong columns give way to age, a man gets destroyed due to old age and death.

12. The night spent does not come back, as the water of Yamuna that fell into the sea does not come back.

13. The days and nights reduce the life of a man just as sun dries a body of water in the summer.

14. O Bharat! You worry about your spiritual progress, why worry about others? Whether plants, or animals, (or man), time is reducing the age of everybody.

15. Death always stays with man throughout life. Then it goes far away (after death), and returns with man. (man here is soul. The death or ‘yama’ is another name of God. The power of God called ‘Vayu’ takes the soul out of the body, and establishes it back into another body)

16. When skin has sagged, hair has become white, and the body has become weak due to age, then how can a man lord over others?

17. A man feels happy at sunrise and sunset, but he does not know that his life is reducing every moment.

18. A man displays happiness at change of seasons, but does not know these are reducing his life.

19,20. As a wood-plank joins with another due to waves in a large sea, and then separates again, similarly a man is joined with woman, son, brother, relatives, wealth as per given time, and then separates, as separation is definite.

21. O Bharat! No man in this world can become immortal. So even when grieving for a dead, a man is unable to avoid own demise.

22,23. As a person sitting on a roadside gets up and starts when he sees a large group of travelers, saying I also come with you, similarly every man has to follows his ancestors to death. So what is the benefit of grieving death when it cannot be avoided?

24. As a river always goes ahead, and never returns, similarly a man should spend time in good deeds daily seeing that life is wasting away.

25. King Dashrath has passed away after performing many ‘yagna’ and doing good deeds, and enjoying health and wealth and a long life.

26. The person like you and me who are Learned people should never grieve for King Dashrath.

27. O Bharat! You recover and get back to Ayodhya, and carry out your duties as father instructed you.

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 08:06 PM
Who protects people living in the forests

Central India lied outside Arya kingdoms in Ramayan time. The area was mostly hilly and forested. These forests were home to a number of Rishi, Tapasvi and Vanprasthi.

The 'Tapasvi' and 'Vanprasthi' are people who have taken a vow to live away from settled places, and in the middle of forests. This is to focus mind on God only, unaffected by attachments of the family. The protection of these people is an object of long discussion between Sita and Shri Rama in Aranya Kaand. Sita advises Shri Rama to refrain from violence while in the forests, as Vanprasthi takes a vow of non-violence having left the responsibilities of householder behind (Kshatriya is also householder). Shri Rama explains to her that he had to protect forest-dwellers as a. He has taken a vow to protect them from Rakshas, b. He is in forest just to fulfill his father's commitment. Means he has only taken to a lifestyle of forest-dweller, but not taken a vow of Vanprastha. He was very much a householder and a warrior.

Valmiki Ramayan AranyaKaand chapter 21 - Shri Rama criticizes Khar

Who is Khar? Khar is a brother of Ravann, and ruler of a Rakshas kingdom of 'Janasthan' in current central India, near the river Godavari. He is described as commanding an army of 14,000 soldiers (which is equal to a division in modern army). Such a large army means a fairly large population of Janasthan, maybe in millions. So we have a significant kingdom of Rakshas outside Lanka, which sees a battle with Shri Rama, much before Lanka war.

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 09:36 PM
Rakshas poeple have different belief systems (different religion) than Arya people. They are meat eaters and described as eaters of human flesh. They are also described as violent and vile people. Despite that they have significant civilization that includes many countrries and cities.

The war between Khar's army and Shri Rama clearly describes Rakshas as acting against tenets of 'dharm-yuddha'. It is a war between one warrior Shri Rama against an army. This is a very serious violation. If Khar was an Arya, he would fight alone with Shri Rama (like the fight between Sugriv and Bali later), as like warriors fight. As Shri Rama is a foot-soldier, Khar should have offered him a duel (involving personal weapons like sword and mace).

Rakshas kill defenceless 'Tapasvi' which is against 'dharm'. The war is between kings and armies. Killimg innocent people in isolated habitations is against 'dharm'. Rakshas might have justified that thinking that these 'Tapasvi' are encroaching on their area of supremacy. But the 'Tapasvi' bear no arms, and do not fight. So even if they live in Rakshas kingdom, Rakshas king has no right to kill a 'Tapasvi'. This is the basic reason non-believing preachers were merely expelled from Arya kingdoms but not killed by Arya kings. Veda allows a person to be a non-believer. A crime is only if a non-believer starts preaching others - then he is expelled. The Tapasvi commit a crime only if they enter a Rakshas settlement and preach 'dharm'. Rakshas writ does not run in forests.

Rakshas have committed many crimes by killing Tapasvi, so Shri Rama, as an Arya prince, had every right to kill them as punishment.

In this case, it is Rakshas who attack Shri Rama. Any Kshatriya can kill in self-defence. But Shri Rama had a right to kill Khar even if Khar did not attack.

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 10:18 PM
1.Shri Rama spoke to Khar these just and meaningful words, after seeing him alone (after he has lost all of his army), and coming towards him with a mace.

2. O Brave! despite becoming the owner of a large army of chariots, horsemen, and elephants, you have committed hateful and dreadful acts (sins) all over Earth. (A king's army is for protection of innocents, not for killing)

3. Do you not know that even if a person who kills innocents, is unkind and is a sinner, becomes a king of 'Trilok' (earth, sun, and space), he cannot live long.

4. The person who acts against good of earth-dwellers should be killed just as a poisonous snake is killed by a family if it enters their house.

5. The person who does not repent after commiting sins under the influence of greed, or desires, that person meets his end like the insect 'brahmani' kills itself after eating hailstones.

6. Did you not know that you will have to bear the consequences of killing innocent Tapasvi, who lived in Dandak forest engaged in worship of God.

7. The person who sins, uses violence against innocents, and is thus criticized by civil society, cannot live long like a tree with rotten roots.

8. Like trees flower automatically on the arrival of spring, a sinner gets the results of his sins automatically at the appointed time.

9. As a man dies soon after eating poisoned food, so a sinner does not live long after committing grave sins.

10. O 'Nishachar' (a person who is active in night - eats, and roams in night)! The king has sent me to the forests to kill grave sinners like you who are against the good of earth-dwellers.

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 10:41 PM
There is a correction. The above verses are from chapter 20 of AranyaKaand.

posted on Oct, 20 2011 @ 11:38 PM
Aranya Kaand chapter 21 verse 18 - Ravann goes to Marich

Ravann goes to Marich in a chariot pulled by 'khar' (mules).

This is surprising why Ravann uses mules in place of horses.

I think it is to do with weather. The geography of Indian sub-continent was dramatically different in Ramayan time.

The Himalayas were no so tall, and not so wide as in the modern world. So colder air from Asia should have caused snowfall over most of northern India.

The tall mountains in the central part of India would have had the same function of blocking cold air, that Himalayas have today. So southern part of the country, including Lanka would have been considerably warmer - probably having a tropical climate.

The mule is more suited to hotter climate then horse.

A verse earlier has Laxman saying how Bharat takes an early bath in ice-cold water of Saryu river. There are indicators of fog and hail in fall season in central India. The picture that develops is sea reaching close to Aryavrata (north India), coast to coast high mountains of central India, and rolling hills of southern India.

The Kailas mountain must be very prominent then, may be the highest peak. Now it is dwarfed by so many other peaks.

posted on Oct, 21 2011 @ 01:09 AM
The movement of continents - plate tectonics and India

The Indian geography has changed constantly over time due to collision of South Asia land-mass with main-land Asia landmass. However the way it has happened does not agree with the accepted plate tectonics theory.

The theory in vogue is that South Asia is subducting under Asia. I believe that is incorrect.

The oceanic plate that lied between Asia and South Asia has folded like an accordian under the immense pressure. The Tibet, central Asia etc have risen due to compression force acting on mainland Asia. The Himalayas are the folded oceanic plate. The compression on south Asian plate has raised low lying coastal areas of the island, forming the indo-gangetic plain and Punjab plain. The erosion of Himalayas has given a gentle slope to these plains by depositing silt.

There are other forces acting on Asia like Africa also pushing on Asia, thus creating two vectors which have created mountains of central Asia.

I believe mountains are created by compressive forces which fold earth's plates like accordian. This process creates new mountain ridges as well as raises older mountain ridges. The power of wind, snow and rain shapes the mountains creating river valleys and other features.

The Kailas mountain existed before South Asia joined with Asia, and exists to this date.

Lakes like Mansarovar, Rakshas etc. in West Tibet are important to Vedic people because this area of Tibet is the origin of Vedic civilization. The entire Tibet, Kashmir, central Asia, Afganistan, and north-west Iran were populated by Arya communities in the Ramayan time. There was a sea to the West of this land, and a sea to the south.

posted on Oct, 21 2011 @ 09:09 PM
reply to post by vedatruth

Himalayas - the source of minerals

Ramayan mentions Himalaya mountains as the land of minerals. We know about rock salt that is mined in northern Pakistan. Gold, silver, copper, iron, tin, precious stones, etc were mined in the Himalaya in the Ramayan time.

There has been a lot of speculation about oil in Himalaya but none has been found so far. Oil must have escaped due to immense fracturing and transformation of the Himalaya region.

Himalaya would have contained source of marble and granite that was used in Ramayan time palaces. Ramayan describes strong multi-level stone buildings. The houses were made of stone blocks cut to proper size, and then joined by lime plaster. The ceiling was made of stone beams, and set with lime plaster. Limestone and gypsum were mined in the Himalaya region, which were used for making plaster.

The art of stone 'jali' windows, engraving stones to make floral designs, embedding precious stones in marble, Making stone arches, and domed roofs, fountains, and channels of flowing water were decorations employed in palaces.

Ayodhya palaces had pillars of stone. Lanka palaces used metals in columns. One Lanka column is described as having a hundred edges (or ribs) and built of metal of golden colour. Lanka palaces are described as having a lot of metallic architectural elements.

All three major northern cities described in Ramayan (Ayodhya, Janakpur, and Rajgriha) must be very close to Himalaya range, Ayodhya and Janakpur within 100 km, and Rajgriha in the foothills.

posted on Oct, 21 2011 @ 09:49 PM
How old is man on earth?

Vedic tradition has the following calculation for start of time from God's creation of man on earth:

6 manvantar have passed = 1840.32 million years
27 Mahayuga of 7th manvantar have passed = 116.54 million years
3 Yuga of 28the Mahayuga has passed = 3.888 million years
KaliYuga started BC 3009/3010, so 5020 years have passed in current Kaliyuga

The total comes to 1960.85302 million years.

The descendants of original people created on Earth are still there. The people have not disappeared despite a number of catastrophes on earth. The cycles of disasters on earth reduces the population drastically but some people always survive and restart.

The total life of Earth is 14 manvantar after which it be be destroyed. So Earth is less than half-way through its current journey.

posted on Oct, 21 2011 @ 11:27 PM
Hanuman's flight of 100 yojan (800 km) to Lanka

Swami Jagdishwaranand Saraswati has written that small airplanes (monoplane) were in use in Ramayan time.

I assume this to be a single seat plane, in which the person crouched in a lying position. The tail and horizontal stabilizers could have been controlled by feet, while as the speed and altitude would have been controlled by some mechanism in front controlled by hands. The plane would have been capable of flying for a long time limited by endurance of the flier. This seems like a slow flying plane, so it would have taken several hours for Hanuman to reach Lanka (cover 800 kilometers distance).

Ravann's chariot used for abduction of Sita

This reads like a helicopter which has mechanical mules (engines) in front, and a cabin in the back.
The technology used should be mercury plasma engines, three of which would lift the craft like a helicopter, and give it forward motion. Two engines should be in front and one in the back.

The craft would have been built to resemble a horse-drawn chariot either to confuse people, or as an artistic thing, although it could be built to a different shape as well.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 12:16 AM
Some important concepts of Vedic Society

Purohit Purohit is the head of a group of Brahmin advisors to the King. Purohit has the responsibility to appoint the next King if the King dies without naming a successor, or no suitable person is available in the family of the King. A King has to get the successor vetted by the Purohit before the idea is put to other people. Purohit can also be Acharya (main teacher) to the princes as Rishi Vashisht taught Shri Rama and his brothers.

Sometimes Purohit doubles as a King in a city-state (called Raj-rishi), though this is uncommon.

Ritvij Ritvij are Brahmins who officiate in a Yagna. Organizing large Yagna(s) for the benefit of people is an important responsibility of Vedic King. These Brahmin are the most Learned and reputed people in the Kingdom, and specially appointed by the King to organize and conduct Yagna.

Hotar I have taken this in the context of knowledge of matter and sciences which is given in RigVeda and AtharvaVeda - like agriculture, construction, weapons, ammunition, vehicles, medicine etc.

UdgataThe expert of music who knows 'swar', 'taal', and 'laya', can sing SamaVeda verses and play Veena etc.

All the above four positions are needed for a big Yagna like 'Rajasuya' or 'Ashwamedh' yagna. The big 'yagna' are the opportunity for public to benefit from Vedic knowledge, as mantra(s) are explained in vernacular language in such Yagna.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 04:09 AM
Killing of Bali by Shri Rama

Bali criticizes Shri Rama severely for attacking him unannounced and from a hidden position, both against rules of 'dharm-yuddha'.

Shri Rama offers a longish explanation. The summary is offered below:

1. Shri Rama says he has been appointed by Bharat, the king of entire earth, to punish bad people. So he has authority over Kishkindha and Bali.

2. Bali is liable to receive death-sentence for forcibly taking Sugriv's wife Ruma, which is a crime.

(Vedic society has no concept of divorce. A lady can only separate in case of bad behaviour of husband. Remarriage is possible only after death. Sugriv is alive in this case, so Bali has committed a crime by taking Sugriv's wife)

Well a judgement is always given before punishment. So while Shri Rama has the authority no doubt to punish Bali, Shri Rama did go against the rules. God does give punishment unannounced, but God is not human, and the rules for human society do not apply to God.

Bali was a friend of Ravann, so Shri Rama could not have used Kishkindha's resources if Bali was alive.

Bali was killed due to being Ravann's friend, rather than being Sugriv's enemy. Bali knew about Shri Rama's intentions but did not think he will get killed this way. Big lesson of Ramayan - Never under-estimate the power, or trust intentions of an adversary. So many kings have been dumped into dustbin of history for making the same mistake.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 04:45 AM
How Ravann looked - Hanuman's first impression in the court of Ravann

KishkindhaKaand chapter 32 verse 17,18

Hanuman wondered! this king of Rakshas is very handsome, patient, pleasing, and strong. He seems to have all the qualities of a great king.

If this king of Rakshas was not an 'adharmi' (against dharm), he could have easily ruled over Indralok.

Note: Please contrast this with the picture of a dark, unattractive person portrayed in current Indian society. Ravann was fair, well built, and articulate person. He chose to be a king of Rakshas due to his qualities, not due to his looks.

edit on 22-10-2011 by vedatruth because: (no reason given)

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 05:03 AM
The above quotes from Ramayan about looks of Ravann proves how society distorts historical facts according to 'acceptable norms'.

History is a great teacher, if history is viewed in proper context. Society has changed with time. Ramayan must be viewed in the context of the political and social conditions of its time. You cannot transplant story of Shri Rama into modern Indian society. We have had no king in the last 5000 years who was even remotely as capable as Shri Rama. Even Yudhishtir is no way comparable to Shri Rama. Comparing Shri Krishna to Shri Rama is a difficult job, as Shri Krishna was more of a Statesman. Shri Rama is the real emperor who removes enemies of his country with a single-minded devotion, and restores that country to the glory established by his forefathers.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 06:08 AM
Does 'dharm' or God's laws change by changing religion

We have many religions on Earth, that preach various ways of worshipping God through different rituals and dietary restrictions. So how to know which religion is true and which one is false. If different religions preach different views of God and His laws, does it mean laws for me change just be adopting another religion?

It seems illogical that God's laws would change just by changing religion. A man can believe in what he want to believe (illusion) but God always treats every soul in the same way, and justly.

It is not easy to understand God? Why? Because God Himself has made it difficult to understand Him. God works in mysterious ways, and remains hidden while he does so. Nobody has ever proven conclusively the existence of God, as He works through his powers that seem like natural forces, or random acts of man and animals.

God is like an artist who makes his doll dance by pulling the strings, but stays behind the curtain and never shows himself.

The religion is true if it follows the five basic God's laws called 'Yama'. Yama is called so because these are the basis of what we call 'sins' and 'good deeds', used by God in judgement of souls.

The 'yama' are five:

1. Ahinsaa - Non violence
2. Satya - Truthfullness
3. Asteya - No stealing
4. Brahmcharya - No prostitution, respecting woman
5. Aparigrah - Living simple life, not collecting objects in excess of basic needs

Veda has given prime importance to 'brahmcharya' as desire for women leads to other defects. So it is like the root, if rotten, kills the entire tree.

a. Best is Neshtic Brahmchari or who have won over sexual desire.
b. If wants to marry, stick to one woman.
c. Veda allows physical relations when both man and woman desire to have a child. Otherwise it is considered bad for both health and virtue.
d. Forcible marriage, rape, prostitution etc. are grave sins.
e. Marriage with many girls (polygamy) is allowed only in special situation like king who has to produce a legal heir. Any lustful marriage is a sin even for a king.
f. No man is allowed more than 10 children, even a king. Having more than 10 children is a grave sin.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 09:59 AM
The Ramayan bridge or Nal bridge at Rameswaram

Rameswaram is in the wrong place as per Valmiki Ramayan. Hanuman went south, and the same way went the Vanar army with Shri Rama.

The Vanar army stopped at a place where the coast of Lanka ran east-west, so that India was up north, not west. So we must consider crossing point right up the Jaffna coast and look for a point in Tamil Nadu across Jaffna.

The shortest crossing point is north of Jaffna. Rameswaram is an island, and there is no mention of island in Valmiki Ramayan. The island of Rameswaram likely formed much later. People have become confused by unusual sand banks found from Rameswaram to Lanka, most likely formed by water of Indian ocean clashing with Bay of Bengal, and thus depositing sand in this unusual pattern.

The indian peninsula is clearly sinking on the east coast (Tamil Nadu coast). A lot of land has likely disappeared, increasing the distance between Indian coast and Lankan coast.

Valmiki Ramayan does not give the length of the bridge. An assault bridge built in a matter of days cannot be very long - one krosa (2 km) is a good enough length.

Ramayan does not say what vehicle was used by Vibhishan to cross the sea. Since he was expelled by Ravann, he likely used a boat rather than a viman. The way events are described in LankaKaand, it does not seem Vibhishan had any problem crossing the sea.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 08:33 PM
Races inhabiting Earth in the time of Ramayan

Many races are mentioned in LankaKaand - like 'dev', 'danav', 'gandharv', 'pishach', 'patag' and 'nag'. Kishkindha is populated by 'Vanar' and 'Riksh' people.

People are either called by a name that reflects their qualities, or by a name by which they want to call themselves. We cannot argue millions of years later why some race called itself 'dev', while another called itself 'danav'. The forest dwellers of Kishkindha called themselves 'vanar' (a type of monkey is called vanar too), and 'riksh' (a bear). Many native american people name themselves on animals. 'Vanar' and 'Riksh' could be tribal societies living in the dense forests of south-central India.

'danav' is used for a person of very large body. Ramayan describes such people living in deep forests.

'Gandharv' are likely people from Kashmir. 'Gandharv' also mean people who practize 'gandharv vidya' or art of singing and music.

'Nag' is a race that lived in Western Himalayas - today's North-East Afghanistan, north Pakistan, Tajikistan, Uzbekistan, and Kyrgyzstan. 'Nag' means snake, but these people were human.

'Asur' are people of West Asia - people who live in Assyria.

'Sur' were people of central Asia (today's Georgia, Armenia etc.)

'Dev' lived in present-day Tibet. Tibet is the origin of man on Earth, and has seen constant civilization except for a brief intermission in the last ice age.

'Pishach' refers to some tribal society maybe in some island of Indian Ocean. This word means 'uncivilized' or 'beasts' - having behaviour similar to wild animals.

'Patag' is a word that does not come elsewhere. This may also be a race on some Indian Ocean island.

Ravann defeated many races of Earth of his time, and brought immense wealth to Lanka. Lanka's palaces used gold and silver in its columns, so it must be very abundant. Lanka had gold mines as well in Ravann's time.

posted on Oct, 22 2011 @ 08:43 PM
Patal and Rasatal

Patal in Ramayan is continent of America.

Rasatal could be somewhere between Asia and America- maybe Europe.

Indra and Indralok

Indra is king of 'dev', so he must be king of Tibet.

Dev Asur Sangram

War between Tibet and Assyria.

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